Institutional abuse was "endemic".. - MERGED

arybvtcw0eolkf

Mods, sorry if this is the wrong forum.

And other's, I apologise that this won't be the most articulate post - but I'm livid.

Driving home this evening, and some here know me, I'm not that emotional. But listening to the details of todays new report from The Commission to Inquire into Child Abuse on RTE radio one and the tears were streaming down my face.

Listening to some of the victims, and for the sweet love of god you'd have to be one heartless bastard not to be moved.

Its worth down loading from RTE and listening to this, its fvcking horrific - its disgusting. Holy Jesus I'm lost for words, sorry.


PDF summary of the report.
Full report.

---

Mod edit:
I've decided to leave this here for the time being.

I've already deleted 2 posts and I will be handing out bans quite liberally on this thread.
Terry.

orestes

Thousands of lives completely and utterly ruined, words can't begin to express this kind of thing, absolutely horrifying. Those responsible should be held accountable and punished severely

Latchy

At least all people in ireland (and there are some will will have being in denial ) have to face the fact that yes ,there was systematic physical and sexual abuse of children in these places .I listened myself today on the radio to the report and people expierences ,and it was shocking .

This is only the beginning ....

Carlow52

How Boards deals with this issue will be a defining event.

AH is not an appropriate forum.

Sulmac

And these "orders" still control almost all primary and secondary schools, amazing.

1966

and their only "crimes" - poverty or mitching from school ?????????

an utter disgrace !!

arybvtcw0eolkf

Carlow52 wrote: »

How Boards deals with this issue will be a defining event.

AH is not an appropriate forum.

And before someone accuses you of back seat moderating, I agree whole heartedly, but 1. I hadn't a clue where to post it, 2. I literally walked in, seen my children and my emotions were bursting out.

I don't show this side of me to many people, and didn't want them picking up on it and me having to go into detail. So instead I off loaded here.

Mods, once again I apologise if this isn't the appropriate forum and to the member's I'd ask you to please, please keep your replies respectful - I know the urge is always to post something here to sound like a smart arse, or highly witty, but remember your parents, brothers/sisters, grandparents who have remained silent on this may have done so because they were also victims.

.

PirateShampoo

You should read the report, its sickening.

My name is URL

The worst thing is that there's to be no accountability. That's a kick in the teeth to anyone that suffered at these peoples hands during the abuse, and again when their trauma had to be dug up for the purpose of the inquiry

PirateShampoo

Victim John Walsh, of leading campaign group Irish Survivors of Child Abuse said:

"The little comfort we have is the knowledge that it vindicated the victims who were raped and sexually abused."

"I'm very angry, very bitter, and feel cheated and deceived. I would have never opened my wounds if I'd known this was going to be the end result.
"It has devastated me and will devastate most victims because there is no criminal proceedings and no accountability whatsoever."

Hundreds of men and women recalled being beaten on every part of their body with a list of weapons, including leather straps, sticks, farm implements, and even hurling sticks. Others were sexually abused, some described being gang raped.

Children were so badly neglected, survivors spoke of scavenging for food from waste bins and animal feed. And unsupervised bullying in boys' schools often left smaller, weaker children without food.

TequilaMockingBird

My lovely, lovely Mum was one of those children. She is now 66, and still can't talk about it. Her mother died when she was 8, and she was sent to the orphanage in Harolds Cross, to a life of sheer hell.

If there is a God, or Karma, these people are damned.

Wagon

The report is absolutely depressing. I've only flicked through it so far cos im waiting to update Adobe on my PC but already i can see the sheer amount of abuse that went on is just unbelievable. And the worst part is that virtually none of it seemed to reported by the schools and when students did come forward, nobody believed them.

I can understand why many people have a hatred of the church. I know it seems like a very overused comment to make but read the report for a bit and it's not hard to see why.

galwayrush

Horrific, what a terrible time. Swept under the carper for so long, now it's out, and nothing going to be done about it. That this could happen for so long just shows what a pathetic little country this was. Thankfully the shocking sheer scale of the abuse will never happen again.

admiralofthefleet

anyone have a link to the report?

galwayrush

admiralofthefleet wrote: »

anyone have a link to the report?

I doubt if it's on line yet, looks like quite a large report.

Disease Ridden

I'm filled with a mixture of both rage and sadness thinking about all those poor children whose lives were ruined by these vicious, lecherous, perverted bastards. I hate them so much.
It really sickens me that they wont be held accountable. It's a pity theres no hell for them to rot in.

Mr. Presentable

I know one, and know of two, who falsified statements to the RIRB about their time in institutions so as to get a big payday.

All the above is horrendous, but many "victims" are lying.

Wagon

admiralofthefleet wrote: »

anyone have a link to the report?

Here you go dude.

http://www.rte.ie/news/2009/0520/abuse.html

The PDF is a few lines down on the report.

Terry

I've decided to leave this here for the time being.

I've already deleted 2 posts and I will be handing out bans quite liberally on this thread.

OP (I'm not arsed scrolling up to see how to spell your new name ), I'm editing your post to include this warning.

ArthurDent

nipplenuts wrote: »

I know one, and know of two, who falsified statements to the RIRB about their time in institutions so as to get a big payday.

All the above is horrendous, but many "victims" are lying.

so on the basis of your supposed knowledge of n=3 out of the thousands who testified you can categorically say many victims are lying ?

Dennis the Stone

****ing horrific sh*t. Wonder how many suicides there were over the years by people who couldn't live with it.

Xiney

It's shocking.

This is a worldwide issue. Residential schools in Canada for aboriginal children, and the Duplessis Orphans.

Not at all trying to minimize the horrors here - quite the contrary. It's bigger and affected more poor unfortunate children than any of us can imagine. Than any of us would want to.

TequilaMockingBird

It leaves such a legacy.

My Mum had four kids. We all have "issues". My Aunts/Uncles kids - not one of them without problems.

I like to think (hope) it's diluted with every generation, but how long does it take to get that sh*t out of your blood?

Xiney

It does leave a legacy.

Ireland's genetics have enough pre-disposition towards mental illness already without outrageous abuse making sure it occurs.

deadhead13

The way the survivors who turned up to the press release were refused entery and the police called was an utter disgrace - the State once again treating them like second-class citizens.

chickenhawk

It's awful what happened. And the church covering it up is a disgrace. They should be made name and shame everyone involved. I'd even support a boycott of the church until they at least try and repair some of the damage. It would never happen though.

Terry

Reuters: http://www.reuters.com/article/topNews/idUSTRE54J4GV20090520?feedType=RSS&feedName=topNews

DUBLIN (Reuters) - Priests beat and raped children during decades of abuse in Catholic-run institutions in Ireland, an official report said on Wednesday, but it stopped short of naming the perpetrators.

Orphanages and industrial schools in 20th century Ireland were places of fear, neglect and endemic sexual abuse, the Commission to Inquire into Child Abuse said in a harrowing five-volume report that took nine years to compile.

The Commission, chaired by a High Court judge, blasted successive generations of priests, nuns and Christian Brothers -- a Catholic religious order -- for beating, starving and, in some cases raping, children in Ireland's now defunct network of industrial and reformatory schools from the 1930s onwards.

"When confronted with evidence of sexual abuse, the response of the religious authorities was to transfer the offender to another location where, in many instances, he was free to abuse again," the report said.

"Children lived with the daily terror of not knowing where the next beating was coming from."

The report slammed the Department of Education for its failure to stop the crimes. In rare cases when it was informed of sexual abuse, "it colluded in the silence," the report said.

Successful legal action by the Christian Brothers, the largest provider of residential care for boys in the country, led the Commission to drop its original intention to name the people against whom the allegations were made.

No abusers will be prosecuted as a result of the inquiry.

John Kelly, coordinator of the Survivors of Child Abuse (SOCA) group, said there could be no closure without accountability.

"I have been getting phone calls all day from former residents, they feel their wounds have been reopened for nothing," he told Reuters. "They were promised justice by the Taoiseach (Prime Minister) in 1999 and they feel cheated. They expected that the abusers would face prosecution."

UNDERWEAR INSPECTIONS

The Christian Brothers said they were appalled at the revelations but denied that their lawsuit had obstructed the report. "We are deeply sorry, deeply regretful for what has been put before us today," Brother Edmund Garvey said.

Many of the children were sent into church care because of school truancy, petty crime or because they were unmarried mothers or their offspring. Some were used as laborers, churning out rosary beads or set to work on farms.

Sexual abuse was endemic in boys' institutions and girls were preyed on by sexual predators who were able to operate unhindered.

The Commission interviewed 1,090 men and women who were housed in 216 institutions including children's homes, hospitals and schools. They told of scavenging for food from waste bins and animal feed, of floggings, scaldings and being held under water. There were underwear inspections and in one case, a boy was forced to lick excrement from a priest's shoe. [url=javascript:goToPage(2);]Continued[/url]...

Quality

Its absolutely disgusting

another failing of our government to hold the criminals accountable...

galwayrush

It made the headlines on BBC News at 10, at least the NI version.

My name is URL

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&client=firefox-a&rls=org.mozilla%3Aen-US%3Aofficial&hs=TRt&as_q=sex+abuse&as_epq=&as_oq=&as_eq=&num=10&lr=&as_filetype=&ft=i&as_sitesearch=&as_qdr=d&as_rights=&as_occt=any&cr=&as_nlo=&as_nhi=&safe=images

Earthhorse

The Christian Brothers said they were appalled at the revelations but denied that their lawsuit had obstructed the report. "We are deeply sorry, deeply regretful for what has been put before us today," Brother Edmund Garvey said.

Just not sorry enough to let the perpetrators meet with justice. Sick.

galwayrush

My name is URL wrote: »

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&client=firefox-a&rls=org.mozilla%3Aen-US%3Aofficial&hs=TRt&as_q=sex+abuse&as_epq=&as_oq=&as_eq=&num=10&lr=&as_filetype=&ft=i&as_sitesearch=&as_qdr=d&as_rights=&as_occt=any&cr=&as_nlo=&as_nhi=&safe=images

FFS:eek:Not even the search in Ireland only option. Shocking reading.

Aidric

There were underwear inspections and in one case, a boy was forced to lick excrement from a priest's shoe.

:eek::eek:

Uncle Arthur

why cant some of these sick fcuks be put to justice? surely some of them are still alive. makes the blood boil, really does.

RealEstateKing

stuff, that nobody ever talks about WHY such an enormous amount of abuse happens/happened within the Catholic Church.

It is obvious to anyone who knows how human beings work, that if you ask a human being to suppress their most natural human desire (sex) for their entire life, that in many of them this will come out in other ways, either through violence or through twiseted sexual means, or alcohol/drug abuse.

These people were not born violent peadophilic child abusers, they were made this way by being forced to take a vow of celibacy. Granted some preists managed to remain decent human beings while following this law, but even the most basic psychology tells us that human beings can never really repress desires, merely divert them.

hopalong85

RealEstateKing wrote: »

stuff, that nobody ever talks about WHY such an enormous amount of abuse happens/happened within the Catholic Church.

It is obvious to anyone who knows how human beings work, that if you ask a human being to suppress their most natural human desire (sex) for their entire life, that in many of them this will come out in other ways, either through violence or through twiseted sexual means, or alcohol/drug abuse.

These people were not born violent peadophilic child abusers, they were made this way by being forced to take a vow of celibacy. Granted some preists managed to remain decent human beings while following this law, but even the most basic psychology tells us that human beings can never really repress desires, merely divert them.

Sorry but no. Sure it isn't natural to remain celibate but these people knew what that vow entailed when they joined the priesthood. It's fcuking boll1x. Nobody had a gun to their head, there's no excuse for the beatings and sexual abuse they doled out. It's an absolute disgrace that the ones who still live won't be named or charged.:mad:

Aidric

galwayrush wrote: »

It made the headlines on BBC News at 10, at least the NI version.

Ya it's picking up a fair bit of international attention. It's the lead piece on the BBC's website at the moment.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/

gollyitsolly

What do the Christian brothers in Ireland do these days? Do they still teach? Is there a future for them here now or should they be dissolved,banished? Their name will go down in history for all the wrong reasons.

Latchy

Was the main headline on the BBC / ITN news this evening .Of course the goverment and institutions involved an Irish problem . But that would be letting them away with it again .Guilty should be brought to account ,just like former Nazis still are .

Latchy

gollyitsolly wrote: »

What do the Christian brothers in Ireland do these days? Do they still teach? Is there a future for them here now or should they be dissolved,banished? Their name will go down in history for all the wrong reasons.

Dont you mean for the right reasons ? Like whatever their mantra was at their formation , like the catholic church ,it's image of a caring ,christian organisation has being torn to shreads .

civis_liberalis

Due mostly to pure outrage of the OP, I decided to read the summary of the report.

Words can't describe how appalled I am, so I won't try.

The mere notion that someone might describe the abuse as "endemic" is perverted in itself, as it implies that the was abuse confined to a single location or area.

gollyitsolly

Latchy wrote: »

Dont you mean for the right reasons ? Like whatever their mantra was at their formation , like the catholic church ,it's image of a caring ,christian organisation has being torn to shreads .

Well of course I meant that all it portrayed and preached was a caring teaching profession . Its reputation is in shreds. I feel the name,the organization, its whole ethos should be done away with. Dissolved, banned ,banished,whatever the word is. It has no use or meaning in this country anymore. It should be remembered like the plague. And the cardinals and bishops and government ilk who were all members of this secret society? What of them? No accountability? It reeks of cover ups all round.

Latchy

gollyitsolly wrote: »

Well of course I meant that all it portrayed and preached was a caring teaching profession . Its reputation is in shreds. I feel the name,the organization, its whole ethos should be done away with. Dissolved, banned ,banished,whatever the word is. It has no use or meaning in this country anymore. It should be remembered like the plague. And the cardinals and bishops and government ilk who were all members of this secret society? What of them? No accountability? It reeks of cover ups all round.

A-1 .I couldn't agree more

Xiney

civis_liberalis wrote: »

The mere notion that someone might describe the abuse as "endemic" is perverted in itself, as it implies that the was abuse confined to a single location or area.

(Actually, the use of the word in this case means that it was all pervasive throughout the system.)


The Duplessis Orphans in Quebec were the last nail in the coffin for the Catholic Church there. They are converting churches into condominiums.

civis_liberalis

civis_liberalis wrote: »

Due mostly to pure outrage of the OP, I decided to read the summary of the report.

Words can't describe how appalled I am, so I won't try.

The mere notion that someone might describe the abuse as "endemic" is perverted in itself, as it implies that the was abuse confined to a single location or area.

i only read it for the same reason.. and i feel sick after reading through half the summary. castrate every last one of them and only then is there a start to justice.

markopantelic

just underlining my severe hatred for religion.


*btw i'm not actually religous contrary to my sig*

P_1

I feel so happy that the Church's influence in this country has diminished so much over the last two decades.

To think that you could be locked up in one of those hell holes for something as insignificant as mitching off school sickens me.

This could go much deeper than the church, from what I can tell there was significant collusion between the Church and the State in this. Also in many cases if not all cases this was essentially imprisonment without trial.

Fúck this was a bloody backwards country.

S.I.R

orestes wrote: »

words can't begin to express this kind of thing,

i can think of quite a few... my old lad was brought up by them... scars to prove. :rolleyes:

gollyitsolly

Its even on cbsnews in america as I type. Shame on Ireland.

Latchy

pithater1 wrote: »

I feel so happy that the Church's influence in this country has diminished so much over the last two decades.

To think that you could be locked up in one of those hell holes for something as insignificant as mitching off school sickens me.

This could go much deeper than the church, from what I can tell there was significant collusion between the Church and the State in this. Also in many cases if not all cases this was essentially imprisonment without trial.

Fúck this was a bloody backwards country.

Archbishop McQuaid had his spys all over ireland reporting back to him .They were in every corner of irish society , schools , hospitals, gardai , army , entertainment, industry, and he even had control over how reporters ( it wasn't the papparazzi media back then ) reported on the church , making sure that anything ,even slightly not in touch with catholic teachings, was deleted from newspaper articles .Censorship on anything resembling truth was surpressed .That is suppression and form of control that Stalin would have being proud of .

seanybiker

sick sick sick people. Nothing I can say will ever express how sick I feel to hear about what went on.