Foreign-sounding names and discrimination MERGED

SWL

Dudess wrote: »

I thought you thought they were taking all our jobs SWL...

Yet AGAIN you thought or in fact presumed wrong(seems like a Cork thing), but hey that not the first time, also as an employer I have employed plenty of non nationals how many have you employed? Oh liberal one.

Basq

Foreign sounding names me arse!

My surname is my username.. it originates from Mayo for fecks sake... how metropolitan! :cool:

_Nuno_

asdasd wrote: »

And discrimination is normal in job interviews. nobody is going to hire an unqualified person for a job, and if native English speaking is desired, then the applicant is unqalified.

And assuming there are no spelling mistakes are in the CV with the foreign name, how can they judge the English speaking skills from the CV, if they don't even allow him/her to go to an interview?

WindSock

Is labelling all inhabitants of a whole country as racist, racist? :pac:

Maybe employers are inclined to hire a person whose name can pronounce. Gealgoirs beware!!!!

Funny theres no mention of Polish names on that article, they have mad names altogether.

connundrum

basquille wrote: »

it originates from Mayo for fecks sake... how metropolitan! :cool:

Well then maybe you should go back to bleedin Mayo, wherever that is, and leave the jobs to the natives!

Monsieur Basquille indeed!

:P

asdasd

how can they judge the English speaking skills from the CV, if they don't even allow him/her to go to an interview?

Because in general a person not brought up with the language is not as good.

And who knows, there may be other reasons. The employer may think that German's may not fit in with the slagging in an Irish workplace, a German employer may not like the Irish informality, a Chinese employer might not want anybody but Chinese people for his restaurant, a Dublin 4 manager may not automatically go for the northside address ( that is common), a Northsider may apply reverse discriminationon the Southsider who may not "fit in" ; a Dubliner may not want a culchie, a culchie employer may not want a Dub, an Irish hotel owner may only employ Polish not lazy Irish ( I know of one situation like that).

And all of this is not even "networks" or "people you know". So it goes.

I would ask why the race-baiters of the race industries are not examining why certain addresses have less chance of success than others, for the better jobs. Surely that is more common.

Dudess

SWL wrote: »

Yet AGAIN you thought or in fact presumed wrong(seems like a Cork thing), but hey that not the first time

"Not the first time"? How? And "presumed wrong"? Actually no, I was simply going by what you yourself post.

also as an employer I have employed plenty of non nationals

Never said you didn't.

how many have you employed?

None, because I don't and never have run a business. Guess that means I discriminate against foreign nationals... or... something.

Oh liberal one.

:eek: Oh noez, he called me "liberal"!

Basq

connundrum wrote: »

Well then maybe you should go back to bleedin Mayo, wherever that is, and leave the jobs to the natives!

Monsieur Basquille indeed!

:P

Mayo is a small region in the west of France actually! :pac:

Capt'n Midnight

IIMII wrote: »

Think ye mean if they have Irish surnames, they are likely to speak fluent English. We fail the native English test on the basis that we aren't English natives, and that we have a different dialect of English called Hiberno-English

:rolleyes:
yes we use more homophones
but we are closer to standard english than many in the UK , the main problem with interintelligibilty is that we talk faster than they do.

did the survey contain any England names to see if the bias was due to country or language ?

techdiver

Lets get real here..... Do any of you think this is any different in other countries. Of course bias will be shown to natives. That's a fact of life. Natives are less likely to be footloose or just travelling, they are more likely a better fit socially within the office. That's just the way it is.

RaverRo808

Is it just me?,but Im glad employers are more willing to recruit Irish natives over foreign nationals,the huge influx of immigrants,asylum seekers,foreign jobseekers etc was destined to be a diaster for Ireland,because now we are in extremely hard times,our own are the ones on the bread line and are desperate for work,and unfortunately so our the massive amount of foreign nationals who came here to exploit our so called 'Celtic Tiger',of course Irish people are going to want preference over those who have been here 2 or 3 years,for whatever reason,its only natural,wouldnt call it racism,yeah Im sure times are tough for immigrants,asylum seekers and the like,but they have an option,the boat back to their home country,which can in turn look after them,we have no room for deadwood here at the moment

asdasd

Yet AGAIN you thought or in fact presumed wrong(seems like a Cork thing)

Anti-racist but very regionalist.

did the survey contain any England names to see if the bias was due to country or language ?

No. I mentioned that. Our "racism and xenophobia" extends to the Germans and not the English . Of course an Irish name can be English too. Maybe thats the reason. We are about 10% English surnames - sure mine is.

AnonoBoy

basquille wrote: »

Mayo is a small region in the west of France actually! :pac:

That's Le Mayo you philistine!

Them Mayo Basquilles are trouble alright. Trouble I tells ya!

wes

I have a foreign sounding name, but was born and lived here all my life. I always put down my nationality on my CV to indicate that I am from here. Its an easy way to get around the association that having a foreign sounding name means you can't speak fluent English.

To be fair, I would be pissed if I wasn't considered for a job soley due to my name. I think I should have the same oppurtunities as the next guy and that my name shouldn't be the criteria on which I am judged, but rather whether I am qualified for the job or not.

biko

There is a guy IRL by the name of Hilter Yew.
If he can get work, anyone can.

Acacia

asdasd wrote: »

The report proves nothing about "racism" because the vast majority of the applicants with foreign sounding names would indeed be foreign - and thus not English speaking natively. Which is probably not what the emplyers would want.

Aye, but not everybody who a foreign name can't speak English natively (though it's hard for employers to tell, I guess.) My bf has a foreign name, people always assume he can't speak English where he works and talk reeaaally slooowly and LOUDLY to him...cause , y'know, shouting slowly at someone in a foreign language will make them understand it. It's always amusing to see them look embarrassed when he responds to them in perfect English (often a lot better than some Irish people's ''wat's da starry, bud'' English.)

Basically, I'm saying that you can be foreign and speak English as well as a native speaker, or indeed, be bi-lingual. I mean, if the CV or application is written in good English they must have some grasp of the language. :pac:

Basq

AnonoBoy wrote: »

That's Le Mayo you philistine!

Them Mayo Basquilles are trouble alright. Trouble I tells ya!

Nonsense.. we're harmless...















.. of course, only if you considering rape and pillage harmless!

wes

RaverRo808 wrote: »

Is it just me?,but Im glad employers are more willing to recruit Irish natives over foreign nationals,the huge influx of immigrants,asylum seekers,foreign jobseekers etc was destined to be a diaster for Ireland,because now we are in extremely hard times,our own are the ones on the bread line and are desperate for work,and unfortunately so our the massive amount of foreign nationals who came here to exploit our so called 'Celtic Tiger',of course Irish people are going to want preference over those who have been here 2 or 3 years,for whatever reason,its only natural,wouldnt call it racism,yeah Im sure times are tough for immigrants,asylum seekers and the like,but they have an option,the boat back to their home country,which can in turn look after them,we have no room for deadwood here at the moment

What about Irish citizens with foreign sound names? Doesn't seem right that they should get screwed.

Acacia

RaverRo808 wrote: »

Is it just me?,but Im glad employers are more willing to recruit Irish natives over foreign nationals,the huge influx of immigrants,asylum seekers,foreign jobseekers etc was destined to be a diaster for Ireland,because now we are in extremely hard times,our own are the ones on the bread line and are desperate for work,and unfortunately so our the massive amount of foreign nationals who came here to exploit our so called 'Celtic Tiger',of course Irish people are going to want preference over those who have been here 2 or 3 years,for whatever reason,its only natural,wouldnt call it racism,yeah Im sure times are tough for immigrants,asylum seekers and the like,but they have an option,the boat back to their home country,which can in turn look after them,we have no room for deadwood here at the moment

Not everybody here with a foreign name has only been for a few years. Some may have been born here.

So they can just hop on the boat now that times are tough? Charming.

And by having no room for 'deadwood', I assume you're also taking into account the Irish dole-spongers who never worked a day in their lies even when the going was good?

SWL

Dudess wrote: »

"Not the first time"? How? And "presumed wrong"? Actually no, I was simply going by what you yourself post.

Never said you didn't.

None, because I don't and never have run a business. Guess that means I discriminate against foreign nationals... or... something.

:eek: Oh noez, he called me "liberal"!

Comical, You then thank post #41, which is the same point I made, you're from Cork alright.

SWL

wes wrote: »

What about Irish citizens with foreign sound names? Doesn't seem right that they should get screwed.

I have a very foreign name, never stopped me from getting on, there appears to be a ever growing numbers of victims in society just get on with it.

Siga

Dudess

SWL, just because I "thanked" the other person and not you (it wasn't a conscious thing) doesn't mean I disagree with you - I fully agree with your point. But I found it ironic that you were saying "It's just the way it goes - a country will look after its own" while last week or the week before you were a member of the "they're takin' all our jobs" brigade. And going through this thread, you're not the only one by any means.

I mean, which is it? Is the country looking after its own in light of this report, or is it letting all the fardiners take our jobs? (90% was the figure quoted in the thread about the queue for Londis recently).

It doesn't do you any favours either to bring where I'm from into it - how on earth does being born in a random piece of land define my character?

SWL

techdiver wrote: »

Lets get real here..... Do any of you think this is any different in other countries. Of course bias will be shown to natives. That's a fact of life. Natives are less likely to be footloose or just travelling, they are more likely a better fit socially within the office. That's just the way it is.

Lived in Australia, went fro an interview and the guy said if an Australian has what they are looking for, they get the job because they are Australian, I didn't cry racist, I knew exactly where he was coming from and accepted it. So Man the **** up you lot, and stop with the racist crap

RaverRo808

Acacia wrote: »

Not everybody here with a foreign name has only been for a few years. Some may have been born here.

So they can just hop on the boat now that times are tough? Charming.

And by having no room for 'deadwood', I assume you're also taking into account the Irish dole-spongers who never worked a day in their lies even when the going was good?

I wasnt saying that someone with a foreign sounding name should be overlooked for a job,I seriously doubt employers look at someones name and throw the C.V in the bin,obvisiously they have a glance over it in its entirity,but what I meant was,employers especially in a recession are going to give preference to natives,mainly because they want to look after their ow n,its not racist its just human nature,and I agree with you,dole spongers of any race should all be put on the boat out of here,but most people on the dole I know are definatley in need of it,and I find this attitude 'most people on the dole are spongers' is a new form of discrimination

wes

SWL wrote: »

I have a very foreign name, never stopped me from getting on, there appears to be a ever growing numbers of victims in society just get on with it.

Siga

Well I do have a job, but I have every right to be treated the same as everyone else. I also think it pretty stupid to judge people based on there name alone. I am Irish and I damn well have every right to be treated the same as everyone else.

_Nuno_

RaverRo808 wrote: »

Is it just me?,but Im glad employers are more willing to recruit Irish natives over foreign nationals

No, it's not just you. It's you and all the other xenophobes that think that the geographical location where you were born automatically gives you an entitlement to things like jobs, welfare,, and makes you a first class citizen, and all the other ones a second class citizen.

Don't worry, you're not alone. Far from it.

IIMII

Capt'n Midnight wrote: »

:rolleyes:
yes we use more homophones
but we are closer to standard english than many in the UK , the main problem with interintelligibilty is that we talk faster than they do.

did the survey contain any England names to see if the bias was due to country or language ?

Still doesn't make us native English speakers

az2wp0sye65487

Dudess wrote: »

I find this a strange one:

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/ireland/2009/0507/1224246058800.html

I'd have thought it was simply because there are likely to be less applicants with "foreign-sounding" names...

Aren't the results based on this:

"Between March and October last year, researchers sent out pairs of matched CVs in response to 240 job adverts in administration, lower-level accountancy or in retail. The two fictitious applicants had equivalent qualifications, skills and expertise – all gained in Ireland – but while one candidate had an Irish name, the other was Asian, African or German.

Both candidates were invited for interview on 23 occasions. In 55 cases, the Irish names were called for interview and the foreign-named applicants were rejected, while in just 15 cases, the minority names were called and the Irish-named were ignored."

From the same article...

upmeath

KTRIC wrote: »

Hitler was Austrian, different country. The name isn't even common, wasn't at the time and definitely isn't now.

Goebbels, then? :cool:

greendom

RaverRo808 wrote: »

Is it just me?,but Im glad employers are more willing to recruit Irish natives over foreign nationals,the huge influx of immigrants,asylum seekers,foreign jobseekers etc was destined to be a diaster for Ireland,because now we are in extremely hard times,our own are the ones on the bread line and are desperate for work,and unfortunately so our the massive amount of foreign nationals who came here to exploit our so called 'Celtic Tiger',of course Irish people are going to want preference over those who have been here 2 or 3 years,for whatever reason,its only natural,wouldnt call it racism,yeah Im sure times are tough for immigrants,asylum seekers and the like,but they have an option,the boat back to their home country,which can in turn look after them,we have no room for deadwood here at the moment

I hope it is just you - sadly though I think not