Kerry GAA Discussion Thread Mod Warning Post #4167

Orizio

Disgraceful and extremely dangerous, apparently he had him in the headlock for more than a little while. Hopefully will be dealt with by Croker.

Kerryfootball

Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »

June 14th you mean ?

No I mean the Munster final.

Kerryfootball

Orizio wrote: »

Disgraceful and extremely dangerous, apparently he had him in the headlock for more than a little while. Hopefully will be dealt with by Croker.

Stop looking for retrospective punishment it's pathetic.
There is no context to that picture so stop looking for controversy.

Kerryfootball

Orizio wrote: »

Disgraceful and extremely dangerous, apparently he had him in the headlock for more than a little while. Hopefully will be dealt with by Croker.

Stop looking for retrospective punishment it's pathetic.
There is no context to that picture so stop looking for controversy.

D'Agger

DDC1990 wrote: »

Need a wash after that. We were absolutely shìt.

Let Cork stroll through us time and time again.

Cork should have won by more.

Sherwood, Fitzgerald and Sheehan we're especially poor and had to overtaken off before they caused more damage.

BJK really laid down a marker in terms of starting team.

Cowardly strike on Tommy Walsh from behind at one of the melees. Hopefully will be punished in retrospect. Missed the number but things like that cannot go unpunished.

Everything Cork kicked seemed to go over. They were very fit, strong and totally outpaced us all over.

Pretty much this - Cork were stronger, came out of defence with ease and their forwards were in great form, I haven't seen the wides tally but I'd imagine they kicked roughly 6 wides in the full match. O'Connor coming on and kicking 4 scores from 4 attempts was something to behold - kicked some lovely scores, as did O'Neill and Hurley - who showed just how much acceleration he has by burning past Fionn a few times.

ciarriaithuaidh wrote: »

Result aside, there were a few hard lessons dished out today. Sherwood had been doing ok prior to this but was way off the pace today. Lyne got cleaned out, Fionn Fitz needs to take the finger out, Griffin was again hung out to dry by management a bit..which I don't understand. I also don't understand what exactly Mikey Geaney brings to the table, but won't go into it again. Good few lads way off the level of fitness required, understandably enough in fairness. Moran for example wasn't even able to solo the ball before being withdrawn.

One of the few positives was the form of BJK, who was outstanding and has been in good form since the start of the league.

Not going to read a whole lot into it either way, never nice to get beaten like that but was fairly obvious that Cork were showing their hand a lot more than we were...I hope! That being said Cork were impressive and 3-17 is serious scoring any day of the week. Colm O'Neill is a class act. As good a forward as any in the game right now.

Kerry will be looking to win the 2 upcoming home games I imagine and 8 points will probably do for a semi final spot.

Who did Lyne get cleared out by? Because it wasn't O'Driscoll causing him issues from what I saw. I'd be more concerned with Murphy, who, combined with Johnny Buckley, conspired to allow Jamie O'Sullivan absolutely rip us to shreds over a ten minute period in the first half.

Lyne was far from fantastic, but he was solid in comparison to some of our other defenders. Crowley coming in added some solidity.

Geaney did nothing of note - I'd wager his point was an attempted ball into Donnaghy nearly - so poor was his distribution all day.

Tommy Walsh came on, did well, came out for the 2nd half and was absolutely pathetic. He looked worse that a guy off the pace, he also looked windy. I don't know if he was carrying a knock in the 2nd half but I couldn't get over how poor he was.

Sheehan should have to beg for the 11 jersey back tbh, he was miles off the pace and looked disinterested completely....maybe it's his lazy gait but you'd be forgiven for wanting to literally give him a boot up the hole and tell him to start working.

*Edit* Forgot to mention, and to echo what everyone else is saying - BJK had a stormer and worked his hole off, delighted for him

Orizio wrote: »

Disgraceful and extremely dangerous, apparently he had him in the headlock for more than a little while. Hopefully will be dealt with by Croker.

Absolutely, but if all you're contributing is pictures then I don't suppose you have any pics of Gould drawing a boot on a man on the ground during the melee per chance? Because I'd love to see that dealt with also.

Fr Tod Umptious

Kerryfootball wrote: »

No I mean the Munster final.

Not that I think Tipp/Waterford would beat Kerry any way.
But surely looking beyond that game is a pure example of complancy you wish to avoid.

Kerryfootball

Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »

Not that I think Tipp/Waterford would beat Kerry any way.
But surely looking beyond that game is a pure example of complancy you wish to avoid.

Look call a spade a spade here we are preparing for Cork in Killarney in July.
Sorry no cute stuff here, we are the all Ireland Champions.

Kerrydude1981

Interesting piece by Micheal Quirke about players injuries and retirement

http://www.irishexaminer.com/sport/gaa/micheal-quirke-lets-help-broken-gaa-stars-ease-their-bodies-into-retirement-316404.html

davegrohl48

I mentioned it after the Dublin game regarding Tommy Walsh looking slow and uncomfortable in his running when he broke up the right right wing in that game. Maybe it is due to the injuries he had but he looks to have totally lost his pace and agility. Took his goal well. His passing was well off the mark but that should improve with time.
But there looks to be a serious issue with his pace. Which would make you think he can only play in around the full forward line. But with Donaghy available does that make any sense?
Another question is whether to accomodate Bryan Sheehan for his free taking. With the game still not gone two kickable 45's were missed yesterday.

slingerz

D'Agger wrote: »

Pretty much this - Cork were stronger, came out of defence with ease and their forwards were in great form, I haven't seen the wides tally but I'd imagine they kicked roughly 6 wides in the full match. O'Connor coming on and kicking 4 scores from 4 attempts was something to behold - kicked some lovely scores, as did O'Neill and Hurley - who showed just how much acceleration he has by burning past Fionn a few times.



Who did Lyne get cleared out by? Because it wasn't O'Driscoll causing him issues from what I saw. I'd be more concerned with Murphy, who, combined with Johnny Buckley, conspired to allow Jamie O'Sullivan absolutely rip us to shreds over a ten minute period in the first half.

Lyne was far from fantastic, but he was solid in comparison to some of our other defenders. Crowley coming in added some solidity.

Geaney did nothing of note - I'd wager his point was an attempted ball into Donnaghy nearly - so poor was his distribution all day.

Tommy Walsh came on, did well, came out for the 2nd half and was absolutely pathetic. He looked worse that a guy off the pace, he also looked windy. I don't know if he was carrying a knock in the 2nd half but I couldn't get over how poor he was.

Sheehan should have to beg for the 11 jersey back tbh, he was miles off the pace and looked disinterested completely....maybe it's his lazy gait but you'd be forgiven for wanting to literally give him a boot up the hole and tell him to start working.

*Edit* Forgot to mention, and to echo what everyone else is saying - BJK had a stormer and worked his hole off, delighted for him



Absolutely, but if all you're contributing is pictures then I don't suppose you have any pics of Gould drawing a boot on a man on the ground during the melee per chance? Because I'd love to see that dealt with also.

Fintan Gould kicked something? Even if it was a player that would be an improvement on recent seasons cos he hasnt kicked a thing in them. Photographic evidence will be necessary because noone is going to believe you that he kicked anything let alone hit it!

Boom__Boom

Orizio wrote: »

Disgraceful and extremely dangerous, apparently he had him in the headlock for more than a little while. Hopefully will be dealt with by Croker.

If there are any retroactive punishments (which given both players got yellow, isn't going to happen) it will be extremely likely that O'Driscoll would be the player in trouble as he was 100% the one who started it and should by rights have gotten a straight red.

The photo definitely doesn't reflect accurately what happened and Crowley did very little out of the way wrong apart from possibly keeping O'Driscoll in the headlock a tad too long and I wouldn't judge Crowley too harshly on that given it was pretty much completely defensive behavior from him and O'Driscoll had instigated the whole thing by striking him.

O'Driscoll was lucky in a way he made such a balls of starting on Crowley in that he enabled Crowley to catch hold of him and put him in a headlock as otherwise he would have gotten a straight red. I thought the ref was going to go against tradition and actually issue O'Driscoll a red and Crowley a yellow and maybe if he had seen how it started he might have. As it is you could almost make the case that Crowley was harshly punished to even pick up the yellow given pretty much all he did was defend himself and he didn't throw any digs at O'Driscoll when he had him in the headlock.

Crowley was almost bursting his ass laughing after as it was one of the most embarrassing efforts ever of one player trying to start on an opposition player and just completely getting his ass handed to him.

keane2097

Anywhere to watch the game back online yet?

D'Agger

slingerz wrote: »

Fintan Gould kicked something? Even if it was a player that would be an improvement on recent seasons cos he hasnt kicked a thing in them. Photographic evidence will be necessary because noone is going to believe you that he kicked anything let alone hit it!

Hit the post in the first half before one of Corks goals, apart from that I don't recall him doing much - I thought Moran and Maher were dominant enough in either half, pity Maher went off, where we lost the game for me was the breaks into our half back line, Cork mopped up there

DDC1990

keane2097 wrote: »

Anywhere to watch the game back online yet?

Pornhub- under Masochism.

davegrohl48

D'Agger wrote: »

Hit the post in the first half before one of Corks goals, apart from that I don't recall him doing much - I thought Moran and Maher were dominant enough in either half, pity Maher went off, where we lost the game for me was the breaks into our half back line, Cork mopped up there

I thought Eoin Cadogen was the most effective midfielder overall.
There is that vulnerability in Kerrys numbers 8 - 12, they're not overly blessed with speed. Eoin Cadogen was just far too quick on intercepts and counters throughout the game.
When Walsh moved out to midfield that made things even slower.
Alan Fitzgerald looked a very useful player. For a new player he looked totally relaxed and assured. Had some very good passes.
Thought it was unfair on Bryan Sheehan to haul him off after 20 minutes. Bryan Sheehan is not physically capable of chasing fast wing backs, we've known that for several years. But he's the best free taker in the country beyond 40 yards. Kerry do not have sufficent cover for him on frees. If Kerry face a well organised blanket they're going to need Bryan Sheehan on the pitch to make every free count.
If Kerry had sufficient free taking cover there is no case, but they plainly don't. BTW yes Sheehan scuffed his one free yesterday, but his free taking has never been in doubt.

D'Agger

davegrohl48 wrote: »

I thought Eoin Cadogen was the most effective midfielder overall.
There is that vulnerability in Kerrys numbers 8 - 12, they're not overly blessed with speed. Eoin Cadogen was just far too quick on intercepts and counters throughout the game.
When Walsh moved out to midfield that made things even slower.
Alan Fitzgerald looked a very useful player. For a new player he looked totally relaxed and assured. Had some very good passes.
Thought it was unfair on Bryan Sheehan to haul him off after 20 minutes. Bryan Sheehan is not physically capable of chasing fast wing backs, we've known that for several years. But he's the best free taker in the country beyond 40 yards. Kerry do not have sufficent cover for him on frees. If Kerry face a well organised blanket they're going to need Bryan Sheehan on the pitch to make every free count.
If Kerry had sufficient free taking cover there is no case, but they plainly don't. BTW yes Sheehan scuffed his one free yesterday, but his free taking has never been in doubt.

As much as I hate Cadogen he deserves credit for his performance in the 2nd half - given that he was playing the role of chief WUM in the first half I was fully expecting him to get some treatment off Tommy when he went to midfield - it never came, Cadogen started playing ball and Cork benefited from it.

Sheehan - deservedly pulled off, he wasn't at the races at all, while realistically, Buckley & Geaney could have been pulled also given how dominant Corks HB line was

davegrohl48

D'Agger wrote: »

As much as I hate Cadogen he deserves credit for his performance in the 2nd half - given that he was playing the role of chief WUM in the first half I was fully expecting him to get some treatment off Tommy when he went to midfield - it never came, Cadogen started playing ball and Cork benefited from it.

Sheehan - deservedly pulled off, he wasn't at the races at all, while realistically, Buckley & Geaney could have been pulled also given how dominant Corks HB line was

Would you agree peoples opinions would be different if Sheehan had stayed on the pitch and nailed those two 45's?
The conversation would at least be along the lines of "Can we accomodate Sheehan at corner forward maybe?". In a strong blanket game, the probable winning scoreline would dictate you should accomodate the best long distance free taker in the game at corner forward if you don't have sufficient cover. Kerry do not have sufficient free taking cover. David Morans percentage is well below Sheehans from long frees. BJ Keane is only dependable to 35 yards.
Against a blanket defence if Sheehan can nail two more frees than his alternatives I don't believe it is made up for by workrate and tackling. If Sheehan is on the pitch the blanket team knows it can't foul Kerry within 60 yards of goal. Freeing up Kerrys counter attacks to not encounter the same level of pressure crossing the 45.
If Tommy Walsh hadn't got that goal (laid on a plate by Donaghy) there would now be debate about selecting Walsh:
- Kicking was well off in passing/shooting for points
- Had Zero pace to close down or turnover ball.
With Donaghy fit, he's probably his backup on the bench or a dual threat option in the air close to goal when Donaghy moves out. He has no business being anywhere but the full forward line. He's not quick enough or a good enough passer to be out around midfield/half forwards.

keane2097

Tommy has just played in, what, his third game in five years? The pronouncements on what he is or isn't able for are a bit premature.

wackokid

3-17 to 2-9 and only 2 points in the second half.
I heard that Kerry were doing heavy training in Ovens on the way to P.Ui Rinn.
There's no other explanation for a 2nd half close out ...is there?
Maher will be needed for Donegal next Sunday and the Star will need his wits about him if them two Magee lads start.
Away to Tyrone after that won't be funny either...........but should beat Monaghan. Then again we thought they SHOUD beat Cork. Tis a funny old league.

davegrohl48

keane2097 wrote: »

Tommy has just played in, what, his third game in five years? The pronouncements on what he is or isn't able for are a bit premature.

Tommy Walshs kick passing and shooting will for sure improve with training/games.
He still with his size and strength can contribute in the full forward line. I'v no doubts about those two things.
I'll safely make the call right now that he cannot improve his pace enough to play well out at midfield or half forward. If he was slightly off pace, no problem.
But he was noticeably the slowest player on the pitch. He's not carrying any weight and has just come back from a professional environment where his running mechanics and leg strength/flexibility would have been improved as far as possible. It's the gap in speed that is too much. At best he can get slightly quicker and I think it still leaves him well short.
If he had an injury hampering him then he would be unlikely to be playing.

ciarriaithuaidh

D'Agger wrote: »

Who did Lyne get cleared out by? Because it wasn't O'Driscoll causing him issues from what I saw. I'd be more concerned with Murphy, who, combined with Johnny Buckley, conspired to allow Jamie O'Sullivan absolutely rip us to shreds over a ten minute period in the first half.

Lyne was far from fantastic, but he was solid in comparison to some of our other defenders. Crowley coming in added some solidity.

Geaney did nothing of note - I'd wager his point was an attempted ball into Donnaghy nearly - so poor was his distribution all day.

Tommy Walsh came on, did well, came out for the 2nd half and was absolutely pathetic. He looked worse that a guy off the pace, he also looked windy. I don't know if he was carrying a knock in the 2nd half but I couldn't get over how poor he was.

Sheehan should have to beg for the 11 jersey back tbh, he was miles off the pace and looked disinterested completely....maybe it's his lazy gait but you'd be forgiven for wanting to literally give him a boot up the hole and tell him to start working.

*Edit* Forgot to mention, and to echo what everyone else is saying - BJK had a stormer and worked his hole off, delighted for him



Absolutely, but if all you're contributing is pictures then I don't suppose you have any pics of Gould drawing a boot on a man on the ground during the melee per chance? Because I'd love to see that dealt with also.

Having watched the game back there, you have a point. Lyne wasn't as bad as I initially thought. Did well in the early exchanges actually. Should have been tighter on O'Driscoll who did get 0-3 in the 1st half but as you say, a lot of the issues stemmed from Jamie O'Sullivan, Mark Collins and others being allowed free reign to do as they pleased out the field. He faded in the second half and was guilty of at least 1 poor turnover, but by then most of them had given up the ghost.

Agree on Sheehan, just way off the pace right now. Agree on Geaney, sick of saying it, but he brings nothing to the table.

You're being way too harsh on Tommy IMO. Was at the Derry league game in 2009 when Kennelly came on and kicked the ball out over the line 4 or 5 times..he's just getting into the swing of things. He may not even be a starter at any stage this year, but he will get a lot better before long I'd be fairly confident of that.

If this game serves to tighten a few things up (Buckley tracking a half-back, defenders tightening up etc.) and focus a few minds it will have been a valuable lesson, but regardless of "not targetting this game" or whatever, some of stuff we saw yesterday shouldn't be acceptable.

As for the "photo evidence"..it was one of a number of needless, silly incidents that occurred. It was Kevin O'Driscoll who caused it by body-checking Crowley when he passed a ball over his head. Bear in mind the game was well over as a contest at this stage. He and Crowley then squared up and shoved each other a bit at which point O'Driscoll threw a punch at Crowley. It was probably a smart reaction by Crowley. If he threw punches back, you could be looking at a straight red and a month off, so without backing down he reacted in a way that was unlikely to result in more than a yellow. Total needless stuff though, given the game was well gone. I could try to find some "counter-evidence" of Shields putting a choke-hold on Walsh in the first half, but what would be the point..

D'Agger

ciarriaithuaidh wrote: »

Having watched the game back there, you have a point. Lyne wasn't as bad as I initially thought. Did well in the early exchanges actually. Should have been tighter on O'Driscoll who did get 0-3 in the 1st half but as you say, a lot of the issues stemmed from Jamie O'Sullivan, Mark Collins and others being allowed free reign to do as they pleased out the field. He faded in the second half and was guilty of at least 1 poor turnover, but by then most of them had given up the ghost.

Agree on Sheehan, just way off the pace right now. Agree on Geaney, sick of saying it, but he brings nothing to the table.

You're being way too harsh on Tommy IMO. Was at the Derry league game in 2009 when Kennelly came on and kicked the ball out over the line 4 or 5 times..he's just getting into the swing of things. He may not even be a starter at any stage this year, but he will get a lot better before long I'd be fairly confident of that.

If this game serves to tighten a few things up (Buckley tracking a half-back, defenders tightening up etc.) and focus a few minds it will have been a valuable lesson, but regardless of "not targetting this game" or whatever, some of stuff we saw yesterday shouldn't be acceptable.

Yeah, he hesitated in the second half going for a ball and got cleaned - like I said, did some good things and some bad things, would like to have seen Murphy stay on for the full match in order to have a good player to compare to. I have to say that Killian Young when he came on looked very good, he's a classy footballer to watch.

The thing that bothers me with Tommy is this - he's just back, so why is he coming on in the league, considering, as Keano said, he's been out of GAA for 5 years? Is it asking too much to expect a guy to come back and fit straight into the reigning AI champions panel? Because from what I saw on Sunday it looks like that is too big of an ask (at the moment).

What I expected the other day was athleticism around the middle of the field but that wasn't entirely evident either. The thing is - yes he's finding his feet and yes it will take time - but should he be getting minutes for Kerry in the league? I'd be more inclined to give Alan Fitz a go before him the next day tbqh and have Tommy get his touch back in training & matches until he's up to speed and able to contribute more than what he's offering right now.

davegrohl48

Alan Fitzgerald first game I'v seen him. But looked a great option as a wing forward or as a runner/provider beside David Moran.
Anthony Maher is a workhorse and effective at breaking up counter attacks.
But one way to counter the blanket is to have a midfielder with the ability to release quickly and catchable into the forwards. I noticed Alan Fitzgerald has that ability to kick through the ball accurately while on the run. Maher would be much more a player who has to settle up and loft the ball. Tis fine when there is plenty space, but against a blanket defence that extra second the ball hangs in the air the defender(s) are much closer to the receiver and his nearby support.
If you have a midfielder who can drill the ball quick and long into the likes of Donaghy/James ODonoghue/Paul Geaney that would be very useful.
Fitzgerald has plenty height to him, looks like can fill out a bit and has that ability to keep his head up and be fast while soloing. Fitzgerald certainly seemed to be operating around the midfield area when he came on. Looked like himself and Tommy Walsh once David Moran went inside to the full forward line.

Radio5

Scoring goal must be the mantra for Cork football this week with their u21's getting 5 against Limerick last night.

Hopefully they won't be a similar tally in Pairc ui Rinn next Wednesday.

homerjay2005

Paul Geaney back in for Sunday as is Crowley and Killian.

M Geaney, Fionn and Sherwood drop to the bench. The Donegal team is seriously strong....was confident of a win when I saw the Kerry team, then lost that confidence when I saw the Donegal one.

ciarriaithuaidh

homerjay2005 wrote: »

Paul Geaney back in for Sunday as is Crowley and Killian.

M Geaney, Fionn and Sherwood drop to the bench. The Donegal team is seriously strong....was confident of a win when I saw the Kerry team, then lost that confidence when I saw the Donegal one.

Actually Mikey Geaney isn't even on the bench, interestingly and Daithi Casey comes into the squad. Geaney was left on for the entire game last week and now doesn't make the squad..at all? Strange, but it's not the first time this has happened. Last year for the last 3 games in the league he was either an unused sub or didn't make the 26 man squad at all..yet he then started the 1st championship game against Clare.
To say "I don't get it",would be an understatement!

Anyway, Sherwood and Fionn Fitz get "rested" as I thought they would. Fionn needs to up it big time with Enright, Marc and Aidan yet to come into the reckoning or he might find himself on the bench again come Summer days..He has the stuff to do it anyway, so hopefully gets back his top form.

Sheehan is a lucky boy that we're playing Donegal or his ar5e would be sat on the bench behind them also! Free-taking could be the winning of this game though, so he holds on.

Kealy getting a big run of games in goals, not sure if that's indicative of a change of no.1 or just giving him game time. Funnily enough, Kealy was excellent under a couple of high balls last week, which had been his major weakness. He has always been a good shot-stopper. If his kickout game is on the money, it'll be an interesting battle for the gold jersey!

Boom__Boom

ciarriaithuaidh wrote: »

Actually Mikey Geaney isn't even on the bench, interestingly and Daithi Casey comes into the squad. Geaney was left on for the entire game last week and now doesn't make the squad..at all? Strange, but it's not the first time this has happened. Last year for the last 3 games in the league he was either an unused sub or didn't make the 26 man squad at all..yet he then started the 1st championship game against Clare.
To say "I don't get it",would be an understatement!

On Mickey Geaney

Up front, Paul Geaney comes back into the side after injury in place of his cousin Michael Geaney who loses out due to a back strain.

http://www.kerrygaa.ie/news/354743/Kerry_Senior_Football_Team_V_Donegal

keane2097

Finally got a chance to watch the Cork game this morning. My impressions for what they're worth:

The back line in the first half was like a Benny Hill sketch. Just all over the place, no shape, no plan, no leadership. None of them were good but particularly worried about Fitzgerald who has been taken to the cleaners in every game so far, absolutely roasted by Hurley and wasn't within yards of him several times.

Didn't notice Sherwood being particularly bad at first but Collins was very good for about 20 minutes and became conspicuously quiet once Crowley came on.

Thought Lyne was very much at sea throughout. Seemed to be getting turned around a lot and just looked lost.

Young is looking better than I've seen in a long time and Crowley is an absolute Rolls Royce.

Midfield was grand until about 20 minutes to go when the whole team seemed to gas very badly.

Alan Fitzgerald kicked two nice points but mixed good with bad otherwise. Looks quite good on the ball and looks pacy. Look forward to seeing a bit more.

M Geaney I thought had a reasonable first half, played a good bit of ball between the 45s. Poor in the second half though. Other way round for Buckley who was very good for a period after the break.

Stephen O'Brien was very, very quiet and was poor with most ball he got. A disappointing league for him so far, I think he has another level but hoped to see it a bit by now.

You nearly forget to say it, but Donaghy is flying. He makes so much out of every ball that goes in.

Barry John was good in fairness.

Looking forward to today's game now.

keane2097

A couple of other things - Kealy has been good so far and Kelly got away with little or no criticism last year for stuff that Kealy would have been pilloried for, most notably the criminal goal in the second half of the Mayo replay.

The other big thing was kick outs, we had no variation whatsoever last year so found it very interesting to see a good mixture of short restarts from Kealy. Kelly had what could kindly be called a lack of imagination in the first Mayo game when we struggled badly to win kick outs. Kealy is the better option at this point IMO, his jersey to lose.

A half forward line with both Buckley and Sheehan I don't think is viable, as several people pointed out we're being badly undone by runners from the HB line this year. Actually it might just be that Sheehan isn't viable as CHF.

DDC1990

Jaysus, Marc with the knockout blow! Funny stuff.

EDIT: Pictures not showing up. Just go the the link

http://balls.ie/gaa/marc-ose-takes-no-crap-brother-darran-osullivan/