United Ireland Poll

dlofnep

Deleted User wrote: »

Please define "west britons" ...
they live in Ireland, they work in Ireland, they hold Irish passports, they pay tax in Ireland, are they "west britons" because they don't support your republican views!!!

I'm sure you're aware of what a typical West Brit attitude is. The average person who is not a Republican does not fall under this category. It is those Those who are sympathic to British rule over a movement for independence. It goes above and beyond pacifism in Irish politics, but more into a field of spiteful behaviour, where they would show support to the civilian slaying soldiers over the civilians themselves who cried for freedom from British rule.

You're a good guy dolanbaker. I think you know who they are referring to.

Border-Rat

Heres an analogy:

Two gypoes smash their way into your seven year olds bedroom, they squat there and declare the room theirs. As they beat your seven year old in the room, you recognise their right to stay there, and disown the child because of the noise coming out of the room.

Now, here are some words:

Total. Utter. Shameless. Spineless.

kreuzberger

Deleted User wrote: »

Please define "west britons" ...
they live in Ireland, they work in Ireland, they hold Irish passports, they pay tax in Ireland, are they "west britons" because they don't support your republican views!!!

not in tony oreillys case .

What is commonly known , and indeed commonly despised , as a west briton is omeone who generally , and indeed instinctively , takes Britians side in any dispute involving his own country and looks up to Britian generally in all matters . Taking social political and cultural cues from accross the Irish sea whenever they can . And without fail trying to inflict them on us all , and generally displaying a childish anger when his/her fawning is derided as childish and embarasssing in mentality by their fellow citizens . They in turn deride their fellow citizens for their backwardness , give out about " Gah" etc and all the rest . But their ilk and equivalent has long been in our society and theres nothing remotely modern in their approach , old as the proverbial hills . We used to call them castle catholics , shoneens etc. The west Briton honestly believes this is all modern , mature etc . However its not at all , its an example of cultural cringe common to may post colonial societies and ben a feature of our society for centuries . At one time their equivalent may for example have worn a top hat and monacle with a picture of um big queen on their grass hut wall despite living in the jungle and appearing ridiculous , . A prime example of ridiculous west Briton behaviour was former Taoiseach John Brutons nauseating fawning over Charles Windosr during his vist to Dublin during the 90s . I remember Bruton announced to him in front of he media quite unashamedly that he , charles windsor , was the personification of what we Irish people strive to be during a bash in Dublin castle , during which Bruton had moist eyes Personally Ive never striven to be a big eared, inbred , adulterous , granny snatching , wife assassinating commander of the parachute regiment who needs another man to wipe my bottom . But then again im not John Bruton thankfully .

He still describes the moment as the proudest in his life , which Im sure makes his wife and kids , their marriage , births etc very happy .

Generally their opinion is we should apologise to Britian for our aggression and various treacherous stabs in the back . Refusal to adopt this position leads to cries of anti British obsession etc , despite coming from an obviously obssessed individual with a mission and agenda.

Hrududu

Do the WB's on here see the people of the six counties not worthy of
being called Irish, and not being entitled to be a part of an Irish Republic?

The majority of people living in the six counties do not want to be called Irish, and do not want to be part of an Irish republic.

O'Coonassa

Deleted User wrote: »

Perhaps the "indoctrination" by republican history teachers at school didn't work!

Perhaps that'll be because over 90% of our schools are run by the Holy Roman Church, world famous anti-Republican counter-revolutionaries since the time that the French left the clerics dangling from the lamposts

Cockney Rebel

Hrududu wrote: »

The majority of people living in the six counties do not want to be called Irish, and do not want to be part of an Irish republic.

Ah come on now, even the Reverend Doctor No calls himself Irish these
days!

Cunny-Funt

Hrududu wrote: »

The majority of people living in the six counties do not want to be called Irish, and do not want to be part of an Irish republic.

Irony of that is, is that most of the British consider them Irish.

Seriously though, no wonder it took us so long to get the republic with the attitude of people on here.

kreuzberger

Hrududu wrote: »

I love that this post comes from someone called Cockney Rebel. So what exactly makes someone a West Brit? I'd love to know. Is it someone that doesn't cheer on the Ra? Someone who would rather want a peaceful island as opposed to a big step backwards into violence?

A lot of people seem very eager to claim those counties back. But really the only people that should have any say in this is the people that live there. You know, the ones that actually have to deal with the reality of the situation. Not some people living in the south that have the whole thing romanticised.

what your advocating is the principle that a foreign power can cordon of whatever section of the country it feels like with a border providing it can persuade people by virtue of its largesse , profection of military power and fomenting division to disrupt the unity of the nation . This means total abandonment of the nations right to self determination , total disregard of the Irish peoples right as a unit to determine their own futures without foreign interference . Total disregard for the rprinciple of democracy ,our right to exist as a nation and even tenets of international law .

And the reality of continued partition means a definite resumption of conflcit at some stage . I think its yourself thats taking a romanticised view of the north as hunky dory by portraying it otherwise.

Riddle101

Yes i would love to see a United Ireland, we'd be a whole coutry again and then those Americans won't keep mixing us up with being British. Also it would be great to see Irelandas a whole, the wonders it could do, 4 million boosted up to 6 million people means a bigger population and also Belfast is rich in industry so we'd be gettin a lot of gains

kreuzberger

Cunny-Funt wrote: »

Irony of that is, is that most of the British consider them Irish.

Seriously though, no wonder it took us so long to get the republic with the attitude of people on here.

they are however a small minority of the islands population as a whole and without British backing would without doubt adapt themselves wholehertedly to the relaity of living in Ireland without being propped up . Just as their cousins in country Monaghan , Cavan and Donegal have done as model and respected Irish citizens .

kreuzberger

Riddle101 wrote: »

Yes i would love to see a United Ireland, we'd be a whole coutry again and then those Americans won't keep mixing us up with being British. Also it would be great to see Irelandas a whole, the wonders it could do, 4 million boosted up to 6 million people means a bigger population and also Belfast is rich in industry so we'd be gettin a lot of gains

you must be jokin . your way behind the times on that one .

Cockney Rebel

Cockney Rebel wrote: »

Ah come on now, even the Reverend Doctor No calls himself Irish these
days!

Yes! but not the same flavour as those from the south (& next door).

Cunny-Funt wrote: »

Irony of that is, is that most of the British consider them Irish.

Simple from an Englishmans viewpoint; if you're from west of the Irish sea you're Irish, don't matter whether you're from the north or south you sound Irish therefore you are Irish.

Cunny-Funt

kreuzberger wrote: »

they are however a small minority of the islands population as a whole and without British backing would without doubt adapt themselves wholehertedly to the relaity of living in Ireland without being propped up . Just as their cousins in country Monaghan , Cavan and Donegal have done as model and respected Irish citizens .

totally agree

KERPAL

England would have handed Norn Iron back a long time ago if it wernt for the likes of Carson. The Home Rule Bill was ready to be put in place until the war and countless other obstacles.
The issues of International law was not one centuries ago, whats happened is a multitude of complications brought on by a blood feuled society ready to explode, which they did in in the 1960s.
A united Ireland is only around the corner and has been waiting to be introduced for decades.

dlofnep

Hrududu wrote: »

The majority of people living in the six counties do not want to be called Irish, and do not want to be part of an Irish republic.

The people of Ireland didn't want to be ruled by Britain. The people of Ireland didn't want to be divided in two.

We were never given the choice. We have every right to voice our opinion. What about cities like Derry which are overwhelmingly nationalist. Is it fair they live under British rule? Oh right, they don't count - because they don't suit your argument.

Dudess

beautiation wrote: »

I'm quite surprised at that dudess. I remember reading the "What makes you proud to be Irish?" thread and reading your posts about how there is no logic in feeling that you have anything in common with people who just happened to be born in the same country as you 100 years ago. If you still believe that there is no common ingredient that makes Irish people different to British people, then why should we get passionate about changing things in the north. Would it not just be change for the sake of change?

It's nothing to do with the fact that I'm Irish - it's an unjust situation and I have a big problem with injustice, whether it's Palestine, South Africa or Northern Ireland.

Border-Rat

dlofnep wrote: »

The people of Ireland didn't want to be ruled by Britain. The people of Ireland didn't want to be divided in two.

We were never given the choice. We have every right to voice our opinion. What about cities like Derry which are overwhelmingly nationalist. Is it fair they live under British rule? Oh right, they don't count - because they don't suit your argument.

Its fine to talk about Derry, where its predominantly Nationalist. What about Ardoyne, where it isn't? Where 8 year old girls are spat on?

Oh wait, they somehow brought that on themselves. Just a ploy in their class to embarass west-brits in the South.

bleg

don't care.

greatgoal

as long as there is a majority vote in the north to remain part of britain,thats the way it will be,democrasy and all that..people will decide and its not our decision anyway..majority rules:cool:

Border-Rat

greatgoal wrote: »

as long as there is a majority vote in the north to remain part of britain,thats the way it will be,democrasy and all that..people will decide and its not our decision anyway..majority rules:cool:

Democracy? Since when was democracy a regional thing? A partial thing? Hey, you can have democracy, but only in one area - the one where we have heaviest influence. And not all of you are allowed to vote.

What next, the U.S. Presidential elections based on Texas votes alone?

Dudess

"Majority rules" led to a really wonderful society to live in if you were catholic in Northern Ireland between 1922 and 1968.

Dudess

Border-Rat wrote: »

Its fine to talk about Derry, where its predominantly Nationalist. What about Ardoyne, where it isn't? Where 8 year old girls are spat on?

Ugh, just thinking about that boils my blood. It slipped under the radar because of 9/11 but it continued on for a long time...

Border-Rat

Dudess wrote: »

Ugh, just thinking about that boils my blood. It slipped under the radar because of 9/11 but it continued on for a long time...

Its still happening under the radar, Catholics are being forced out of their homes in 2008. Such is the problem even the BBC NI had to address in in April with a documentary.

Those Catholics have some gaul, embarrassing the free-state like that.

kreuzberger

KERPAL wrote: »

England would have handed Norn Iron back a long time ago if it wernt for the likes of Carson. The Home Rule Bill was ready to be put in place until the war and countless other obstacles.
The issues of International law was not one centuries ago, whats happened is a multitude of complications brought on by a blood feuled society ready to explode, which they did in in the 1960s.
A united Ireland is only around the corner and has been waiting to be introduced for decades.

people have been saying that for decades . It beggars belief that poor old england has been stuck here all this time , too stupid to find a way out of the mess . Im afraid thats all nonsense . every last treaty Britain has introduced to this country absolutely refuses to accept that the Irish people have any right to sovereignty over their own nation .
Every loyalist threat was backed up politically and militarily by Britian . Why was a country that wanted no trouble importing hundreds of assault rifles , grenades and rocket launchers from places like south africa and handing them out to paramilitaries if they wanted to leave ? Its a nonsense . And whats worse is blaming their presnce on Irish people , even if they are unionists . Britian alone is responsible for the damge theyve caused here and their continued presence here .
If a united Ireland was imminent they wouldnt have diverted so much resources to this monstrosity in co down .

http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2008/feb/24/uksecurity.northernireland

http://www.sluggerotoole.com/index.php/satellite-views-of-new-mi5s-new-northern-irish-base/

Cockney Rebel

greatgoal wrote: »

as long as there is a majority vote in the north to remain part of britain,thats the way it will be,democrasy and all that..people will decide and its not our decision anyway..majority rules:cool:

How can it be democratic that 80 odd years ago a border was drawn round
a part of Ireland purely on religious grounds? A sectarian designed state.
How can something that was plainly undemocratic now be democratic?

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

fingal hoop wrote: »

Irish peoples freedom in british occupied ireland?

Id love a united Ireland & think we are on course to it but id only want it if the unioinsts played a part in it too

There's your problem: They're also entitled to a vote and a viewpoint and lot a decent amount of them don't. Then either the idea falls apart or you have to take the American view and force them to be free.

Cockeny Gob****e wrote:

What? So not accepting British occupation is ROMANTICISM?

Nooooo idea what you mean here. I'm guessing you don't either: it just sounds nice! A bit like "West Brit" (which, I notice, you STILL haven't defined), "We shall not settle for scraps from the Brittish table" and the deliciously oxymoronic "No free speech for traitors"

kreuzberger

greatgoal wrote: »

as long as there is a majority vote in the north to remain part of britain,thats the way it will be,democrasy and all that..people will decide and its not our decision anyway..majority rules:cool:

thats rubbish . The majority voted for independence from Britian . Britian didnt accept that vote s selected a minority and turned them into an artificial majority in one corner of Ireland . Its called gerrymandering , undemocratic . Britian never has and never will acept the choice of the majority . By that logic a load of poles in any corner of the island could secede and declare allegiance to poland . Same goes for Nigerians . It would be just as unnaceptable for the Irish people caught within the territory annexed and occupied by foreigners and for those without seeing their country dismembered and carved up because a " majority" said so .

AlmightyCushion

Ikky Poo2 wrote: »

There's your problem: They're also entitled to a vote and a viewpoint and lot a decent amount of them don't. Then either the idea falls apart or you have to take the American view and force them to be free.



Nooooo idea what you mean here. I'm guessing you don't either: it just sounds nice! A bit like "West Brit" (which, I notice, you STILL haven't defined), "We shall not settle for scraps from the Brittish table" and the deliciously oxymoronic "No free speech for traitors"

That Cockney Gob****e jibe is abuse. Don't do it again.

Border-Rat

Ikky Poo2 wrote: »

There's your problem: They're also entitled to a vote and a viewpoint and lot a decent amount of them don't. Then either the idea falls apart or you have to take the American view and force them to be free.

What is your opinion on Catholics/Nationalists/Republicans in the North being brutalised - then required to fend for themselves under such brutality, over the past few decades?

TerrorFirmer

Cut it off and let it float off to sea. Or drag it across to England and dock it on their west coast.

Or do to it what they did in Doomsday.