Ouija Boards (megathread)

RoundyMooney

Thaedydal wrote:

pff go read your Pratchette :P

I should really, I've heard good things about the guy.

By the way, that request I posted may have looked as if it was directed at you personally, as opposed to the group as a whole. Sorry about that

RoundyMooney

monkeyfudge wrote:

Some of them have sharp corners and can be heavy if dropped on your toe.

I found one online that does away with that risk

stevenmu

6th wrote:

I really dont think for a second stevenmu would be that stupid

Thaedydal wrote:

stevenmu may not be

Don't underestimate my ability to be incredibly stupid

Thaedydal wrote:

I don't believe it can be done unless you have a lot of physic awareness and training, and even then when you get to that stage there are a lot better and safer ways of accomplishing the same thing.

I was under the impression that it would be fairly easy to explain to someone how to protect themselves. I suppose what was meant was that it would be easy for someone experienced. In this case I can see how giving people basic instructions would be giving them a false sense of security, and essentially be encouraging them to do something they shouldn't. A little like telling someone that if they want to learn how to swim they have to dive in the deep end and just do it, and neglecting to tell them to only do it in controlled circumstances with lifegaurds watching.

Zombrex

monkeyfudge wrote:

Some of them have sharp corners and can be heavy if dropped on your toe.

While I have serious doubts over the paranormal aspects of the Ouija board, believe it or not there is some real evidence that Ouija boards can be mentally dangerous to certain impressionable people. Its not so much that the Ouija board causes mental breakdowns, more that it can aggrivate already established mental trama.

The board was invented in 1890 as a simple parlor game. The term Ouija was supposed to mean "Good luck" in Egyptian, even that this was a mistake by the creator. The effects experienced can be explained quite simply by the ideomotor effect. I don't mean to get all skeptical on people, but this can be easily tested by anyone in doubt, blind fold a user or use an alaphabet they don't understand and see if still spell out intelligent messages. To me the Ouija board is in the same vain as the magic 8-ball, ie a commersial product with was marketed as having "supernatural" properties but most likely doesn't.

What is more interesting (in my opinion) about the ouija board is that the effects it has on the sub-conscious of the user. The user, under the ideomotor effect, may not actually be aware of the message they are spelling. Certain studies have found that people will, under certain circumstances, express sub-conscious desires or thoughts through this method. To me this is facinating.

Slightly more dangerous is that a user, because the user most likely doesn't understand the ideomotor effect taking place under the process, can take the results quite seriously, and the effects can be rather dangerous especially if the user is confronted by sub-conscious elements of their mind. There are reports from the 1920 and 30 of users being hospitalised due to panic and insanity, seemingly caused by using the Ouija board.

So if you are using one be careful you don't have too many skeletons in your sub-conscious closet. I would recommend not playing the game with your wife if you are thinking of bonking the baby sitter

GuanYin

Wicknight wrote:

The board was invented in 1890 as a simple parlor game.

Nope, the board was adapted in 1890 from two pre-existing parlour games. One a "ghost writer", the other a pointing device/chart.

The term Ouija was supposed to mean "Good luck" in Egyptian, even that this was a mistake by the creator.

Again no, Charles Kennard, one of the creators of the Ouija board claimed that the board told him that ouija meant good luck in egyption. William Fuld, the man who mass-marketed the board claimed that its name came from Oui (french -for yes) and Ja (German for yes). As it turns out, neither fo these appear to be true and they most likely "just made the name up".

Ok, now you have finished incorrectly rephrasing materials from other sites
In a veiled attempt to post a skeptics piost, we'll move to your on-topic parts.

What is interesting (in my opinion) about the ouija board is that the effects it has on the sub-conscious of the user. The user, under the ideomotor effect, may not actually be aware of the message they are spelling. Certain studies have found that people will, under certain circumstances, express sub-conscious desires or thoughts through this method. To me this is facinating.

So you're straight out debunking the ouija board then seeing as your stating that its definitely not paranormal?


In any case, I believe myself that the dangers of the ouija board all come from within.

Its quite probable that some people are very susceptable to the ideas and myths of the ouija board. Some make a case for the ouija board not and never having been a paranormal device, but a tool for awakening those talents in its users. Slightly more dangerous is that, because the user most likely doesn't understand the ideomotor effect taking place under the process, can take the results quite seriously, and the effects can be rather dangerous especially if the user is confronted sub-conscious elements. There are reports from the 1920 and 30 of users being hospitalised due to panic and insanity, seemingly caused by using the Ouija board.

I've seen it used twice and both times I'm not quite sure how to reconsile the information put forward. I observed a ouija board spell out several sentances in a language I know none of the participants spoke. I was in the room observing and I was the only one in the room with any knowledge in that language.

So if you are using one becareful you don't have too many skeletons in your sub-conscious closet. I would recommend not playing the game with your wife if you are thinking of bonking the baby sitter

Again, its funny you should make a point like this. The other time I saw it used, I did participate and the message referred to the only girl not participating in the room in a very specific way. We would have assumed someone was having a pop at her for not taking part until we read the full message and saw the effect it had on her. Suffice to say, noone in the room knew what was revealed bar her (and when she had calmed down she confirmed that she'd never told anyone).

6th

psi wrote:

So you're straight out debunking the ouija board then seeing as your stating that its definitely not paranormal?

Wicknight wrote:

While I have serious doubts over the paranormal aspects of the Ouija board

In Wicknights defence he only really said he had serious doubts.

I'm a firm believer in the paranormal but i do believe in many cases the effects of the ouija board are not paranormal in nature. If it was case that they could guarantee paranormal results are fight to have the paranormal taken seriously and appreciated would be alot closer to being won.

There is no denying that when these things are used at parties and drunken sit ins that its very possible and likely that there is at least one messer at the table.

Even if people take all the precaustions they can and are comfortable using one, it would still be very unwise to use one with people you cant or dont trust 100%.

Zombrex

*Groan*

I mean .. er .. hi psi, how you been keeping .. :cool:

psi wrote:

Ok, now you have finished incorrectly rephrasing materials from other sites

Er, both things I said are correct. The Ouija board was invented in 1890, and the name was supposed to (according to the creator, obviously) mean Good Luck, which it doesn't.

If you want to give an indepth description of the history of the board go ahead. My only purpose was to demonstrate the Ouija board is a commersial product, whch has been quite successful in marketing. As I said I consider it in the same vain as that other American oddity, the Magic 8-Ball

psi wrote:

So you're straight out debunking the ouija board then seeing as your stating that its definitely not paranormal?

I'm not sure what you mean by "stating ... definitely not paranormal" I definitely don't believe its paranormal. Can I be wrong? Possibly (stranger things have happened).

I'm saying the effect can be explained using the ideomotor effect. Which they can. I'm also saying I don't believe it is paranormal. Which I don't.

psi wrote:

In any case, I believe myself that the dangers of the ouija board all come from within.

So do I, as I said. Unless of course you drop it on your foot, as monkeyfudge says

psi wrote:

I was in the room observing and I was the only one in the room with any knowledge in that language.
...
Suffice to say, noone in the room knew what was revealed bar her (and when she had calmed down she confirmed that she'd never told anyone)

Well having not been there, or having no knowledge of the conditions of these tests or the participants in it, or the nature of the messages, it would be rather presumptious of me to offer any comment about that either way.

I've long given up trying to answer statements along the line of "how do you explain that", since my inability to offer an skeptical explination is often interpretated by some as validating other explinations.

If people wish to believe that it was paranormal in nature, go ahead. I don't.

GuanYin

6th wrote:

In Wicknights defence he only really said he had serious doubts.

I'm a firm believer in the paranormal but i do believe in many cases the effects of the ouija board are not paranormal in nature. If it was case that they could guarantee paranormal results are fight to have the paranormal taken seriously and appreciated would be alot closer to being won.

There is no denying that when these things are used at parties and drunken sit ins that its very possible and likely that there is at least one messer at the table.

Even if people take all the precaustions they can and are comfortable using one, it would still be very unwise to use one with people you cant or dont trust 100%.

Well it was the bit where we were told how they work (and not they might work, but how they work) that concerns me. Just because someone says they arent doing something in a post, doesn't mean they can then go ahead and do it and I won't pick up on it.

Agreed on the biggest issue being messers though.

Nevyn

It has also been my experience that the 'field' of effect for the use of the Ouija board is all those present in the room not just those at the table or those who are actively touching the table or pointer.

It can make cleaning up the mess afterwards a considerible pain in the ass as most people may think themselves not effected when they have been by being in the room observing and adding thier engery to the mix and thier will to the focus.

Zombrex

psi wrote:

Well it was the bit where we were told how they work (and not they might work, but how they work)

Actually I said -

"The effects experienced can be explained quite simply by the ideomotor effect.

Which is true, they can.

If someone doesn't believe that it actually is the ideomotor effect at work, and has some other explination that can explain it thats great. If based on this they believe the Ouija board is paranormal in nature, thats great too.

Being the skeptical little runt if I have two explinations for something, one natural the other super-natural, I tend to go with the natural one first.

That is my personal opinion. And based on my personal opinion, I don't believe the Ouija board is supernatural in nature. If others do, thats great.

The actual point of my post (getting back on topic) was that even if someone doesn't believe in the supernatural properties of the Ouija board (which I'm sure many, even on this forum, don't) there is still evidence it is dangerous in certain circumstances and with certain people.

GuanYin

Wicknight wrote:

Being the skeptical little runt if I have two explinations for something, one natural the other super-natural, I tend to go with the natural one first..

This isn't what this forum is for.

If you want to do this, don't post here. End of discussion. Back on topic.

Zombrex

psi wrote:

This isn't what this forum is for.

If you want to do this, don't post here. End of discussion. Back on topic.

*Groan*

(had a reply, but its rather pointless since you never listen, and despite the fact I haven't broken any charter rules you just want rid of me)

*Groan*

j2u

i`ve heard that ouji boards are dangeous here but not as much about hy there dangerous,and in my opinion there is no point in saying that there dangerous without saying your experiances that proved to you that they were dangerous,now i never did the ouji board which is why i wont say that it is dangerous or not.so please give more details why its dangerous

6th

If you've read this thread you will see plenty of posts from people who have used them and their reason why they wouldnt do it again.

imprezza

Not to mention the number of people who had to get help for mental problems after using ouija boards ( yes I know, they say the same about cannabis, cars can kill etc), but I've had a few weird frightening experiences where other people freaked out while we were playing around with it, experimenting to see could we really contact the dead. Some people don't have the mental balance to cope with, or identify whats happening. and as Wicknight says not all ouija experiences are paranormal. I agree with what you say wicknight. We don't all have the time to read every post you know 6th. ( Please don't give out to me psi I'm an international jet setter too)

6th

imprezza wrote:

We don't all have the time to read every post you know 6th.

Neither do I but even the first post on this thread is very informative. j2u hasnt directed his question at anyone in particular so who should answer his request, the many people who have already posted their experiences in this thread?

IMO if someone wants to get information on the subject of a thread the first port of call should be at least glancing over the posts.

In a way the laziness of how he's gone about asking for information is comicaly similar to the type of laziness which draws people towards Ouija Boards when there are more effective ways to get the information they can provide, the greater the effort put in the greater the rewards would you not agree?

I mean no offence to j2u, its just it would be quicker to read through previous posts than to pretty much ask everyone to re-post.

6th

Just thought I'd share this article from http://www.paranormal.about.com

Portal to evil or harmless game?
THERE’S AN ongoing debate about the powers and realities of the Ouija board. Essentially, there are three basic positions:

* It is inherently dangerous, can open portals to evil entities and should never be used.

* It is only dangerous if used with evil intent, but can be a useful tool for spirit mediumship if used properly and with good intent.

* It is inherently harmless and has no real powers of mediumship for good or evil; its effects, if any, are only psychological in nature.

Which is true? Talk to any group of people and you’ll find strong proponents for each argument. A few years ago, I conducted a survey of readers on this subject. It results showed that 65 percent of those who responded felt the Ouija was dangerous, and 35% felt it was harmless.

There is also a lively discussion on the matter in our Paranormal Forum.

Inherently evil

As expected, most religious leaders are strongly anti-Ouija. More interesting, however, is that many of the top paranormal researchers believe the Ouija to be a dangerous instrument, to be avoided at all cost.

Brad Steiger, one of the most prolific authors on matters supernatural, has consistently stated his opposition to the use or even the ownership of a Ouija board. In his article “Mothers, Don't Let Your Children Grow Up to Play with Ouija Boards,” Steiger recounts his investigation of a 17-year-old girl who began experimenting with the Ouija – with dire consequences. “She thought she had the knowledge to contact spirit entities through the board,” Steiger writes, “but unfortunately she had neglected to assume a prayerful attitude to guard against malignant influences.”

Dale Kaczmarek, founder of the Ghost Research Society, says, “I would strongly advise against the use of the Ouija, automatic writing or séances” in his article “Ouija: Not a Game.” “Most often the spirits whom are contacted through the Ouija are those whom reside on ‘the lower astral plane’.”

One of the most respected paranormal investigators or the past fifty years, Hans Holzer, adds his voice in warning against the Ouija. In the book The Ouija Board: A Doorway to the Occult, author Edmond C. Gruss quotes Holzer as saying, “Those who wish to use the Ouija board as a parlor game I advise to think twice. There is always the possibility – rare, I admit, but conceivable – that one of those playing the board is a genuine trance medium without realizing it. In such a case, the board can become an easy entrance for a disincarnate person… who might next take over the personality of the medium and manifest under conditions where no controls are possible.”

Some readers in the Forum have also had bad experiences. “I'm wondering if anybody else out there knows how dangerous Ouija boards truly are?” says toddybear007. “I had my own experiences a long time ago when I was around 13 years old. To make a long story short, I came face to face with pure evil.”

“I do believe without a doubt that Ouija boards open doors,” adds Deebliss. “The entity that we brought out actually manifested itself to my best friend’s mother….”

The article “Ouija, Using it Without Harm” on the PaganPath website states: “The Ouija is only as dangerous as you and/or your friends make it. The Ouija can be a useful tool for mediumship (spirit contact) but can also be a tool to tap into the subconscious minds of the users. If you begin your Ouija session with the intention of just seeing what will happen, but without letting superstitious fears scare you, you're well on your way to a fun, entertaining, and informative experience.”

Even those who say the Ouija can be used without harm often suggest performing a “cleansing” before any experiments.

According to Crystalinks’ article on the board, “Some people like to say a prayer over the board – or do some other ritual. In this case envision a protective white light of energy surround yourself, the board, those you are working with, and even the room.”

Inherently harmless

Author and ghost hunter Loyd Auerbach is one of few seasoned paranormal investigators who doesn’t put much stock in the Ouija’s powers. In his book, Ghost Hunting: How To Investigate the Paranormal, he writes: “There is nothing inherently evil or demonic about Ouija boards.” The answers come from “unconsciously driven minor muscle movements and not spirits of dead people. Ouija boards have never been shown to tap into spiritual sources. Any danger…is in taking the ‘communications’ literally.”

Many people, like me, who have attempted to use the board get little or no results. Nostro75 in the Forum is another. “I brought one from the Internet and have tried to use it several times, including on my own and with friends and family. The planchette didn’t move an inch, ever. So nothing to fear.”

The “Skeptic’s Dictionary” agrees with Auerbach’s position and may have the most reasonable advice about the Ouija. “The movement of the planchette is not due to paranormal forces but to unnoticeable movements by those controlling the pointer, known as the ideomotor effect,” the website says in its article on the Ouija.

“Observing the powerful effect of messages on impressionable people can be impressive. Yet, as experiences with facilitated communication have shown, decent people often harbor indecent thoughts of which they are unaware. And the fact that a person takes a ‘communication’ seriously enough to have it significantly interfere with the enjoyment of life might be a sufficient reason for avoiding the Ouija board as being more than a ‘harmless bit of entertainment,’ but it is hardly a sufficient reason for concluding that the messages issue from anything but our own minds.”

Aisling&M

I just read the story of the 17 year old this morning. Scary stuff. I strongly advise people not to use a board to communicate with the spirit world.
Would you leave your front door open and hang a sign saying "anyone fancy a chat to a group of unguarded people, please come in"........

Sir Digby Chicken Caesar

http://www.rense.com/general70/ouija.htm

this story? ...
's mucho convincing, I must say

kshiel

Ok, I dont know much about the Quja Board only what was posted here and some info picked up over the years, but I agree they can be dangerous in the wrong hands, but point of interest. When using a board we are told that we can be open to lower energies, now when we enter a haunted location are we not open to recieving the energies within the location wheather they be lower or not?, leaving the protection issue aside, but in certain locations are we just at risk of encountering a lower energy as we would be on a Quja borad.

6th

kshiel wrote:

Ok, I dont know much about the Quja Board only what was posted here and some info picked up over the years, but I agree they can be dangerous in the wrong hands, but point of interest. When using a board we are told that we can be open to lower energies, now when we enter a haunted location are we not open to recieving the energies within the location wheather they be lower or not?, leaving the protection issue aside, but in certain locations are we just at risk of encountering a lower energy as we would be on a Quja borad.

Please first note this is just my opinion!

Anyway, I agree that they can be dangerous/harmfull in the wrong hands. The problem I see with them is that it would be very difficult (if not impossible) to go into using a board without having negative thoughts in your head based on the reputation of the board.

Now the whole "like attracts like" thing comes into play here, aswell as the side of things that if anything happens you will more than likely over react or take something normal as something paranormal.

Of course you can be the type of person who can set themselves aside from the whole negative attachment to the Ouija - then you'd be fine to use one ..... wouldnt you?

Well you then have to look at the fact that you most likely arent going to do it on your own. I personally would think people should do it in at least a group of three. Can you be absolutely certain that the other 2 people are in the same position as you, or in the same positive frame of mind?

Its all about state of mind - there is essentially no difference in a Ouija board and an Angel board yet one is an absolute no-no .... simply because people choose to believe it is inherantly evil.

kshiel

I see what you mean 6th, in fact I think you hit on what I was trying explore better than me, as when I wrote it I was thinking in the one form, one person using the board and the one experience in a location.

I know if I tried a Quja Board, it would be hard not to think of the nasty aspect of it as as far as I can see they have been demoted and not premoted, and even if I could overcome this thought I would have to assume the people using the board with me did to, which could be near impossible to determine. On the other hand entering a haunted location sets something automatic within me to an more open mind state, non negative, so to speak. So it kinda leaves open the question "Is it the people using this board, incorrectly the inherent danger and not the board itself?.

I couldn't answer that question as I would not have enough knowledge and know how of how the board works (in not having used one) but people who have maybe able to answer that question better?.

6th

The board isn't dangerous, in the same way a car isn't dangerous. Sure its capable of doing damage but that depends on the person driving and the situation its being used in.

Still one this to note that I would presume someone would use the board to try make contact with spirits - if thats the case there are much better and more effective ways to do this, though they take commitment and time.

kshiel

Ok, I intend to agree with what you are saying.

This thread was on Quja Boards and so far it seemed to be the answer that to use them is NO. Now I am not telling anyone to use them or get involved in them, but I think to explore this board better, people would need to look at the state of mind they were in before and during using them, what there prior knowledge of the board was (like good, evil, etc etc) and there intention in using using the board in order to give the game a fair chance of been shown in its intended light. Surly there has been sucessful use of it somewhere, that no negitive outcome came about.?

6th

kshiel wrote:

Surly there has been sucessful use of it somewhere, that no negitive outcome came about.?

I'm sure there are but people always give more attention to stories about bad things that happen.

kshiel

Heres a guy who uses a Quija board in the class room. Now before my head is bitten off, I do not support this, but thought it interesting.

http://www.csicop.org//sb/9709/ouija.html

6th

Ah dont be too worried about people thinking you are promoting them or not ... interesting link alright.

upthere

I have never used a ouiji board and i never would. You are inviting trouble really

monkeyfudge

Only $19.95 and suitable for ages 8 and up.

http://www.hasbro.com/default.cfm?page=ps_results&product_id=9470

Now glows in the dark... which is handy.

upthere

Last night I decided with a mate of mine who's into the occult, to use a ouiji board first time. It was the most positive experience I have ever had. At first we got a bad spirit who when asked moved the glass on "bad".
He messed around with us giving us messages we couldn't understand. After it all the bad spirit spelt out "dry" and put the glass on goodbye.
He came back again and this time tried to move the glass to fall off the table, unforutanely we did leave the glass go off the board which reading now is bad.
2) A relative of mine game through on the boards and assured me she was proud of me. I asked her what my dogs name; I expected her to say my present dog but she told me the name of the dog I had when she was alive. She said she was proud and I asked would I ever see her again and she said "yes". It lighened up my night entirely. I said a prayer before using the board.
The above is a 100% true story and I feel a major risk(for the good) on my and my mates part.