Season 2, Episode 20: "Lay Down Your Burdens, Part 2"

The Corinthian

Maybe it's p2p memory?

Rev Hellfire

Scruff wrote:

If what the priest cylon was saying about humanity and cylon going their seperate ways was true why have the cylons come back?
You're assuming that all the Cylons chose to agree with this.

Brother Cavil said they had been offered a reprieve. Therefore it could be assumed they would be back at some point.

sprinkles

MarkR wrote:

Hmmm. System checkpoints or a manual backup. Would you like to restore your consciousness to an earlier time? Y/N?

LOL

savemejebus

sprinkles wrote:

Yeah I wondered about that, she can remember things that galacitca boomer did while on galactica even before she was killed. Strange. So the cylons memory is constantly being downloaded and shared to the other cylons of the same model!? If this is the case then why was it that the other 6 models didn't realise caprica 6's discontent with the "grand plan"?

don't forget the original galactica boomers corpse was still transmitting after death (remember what she said to adama on kobol), i think there is a lot we don't know about what the writers have in mind with regards cylon downloading

sprinkles

The main problem I had was;

Galactica boomer and caprica boomer (aka mother of child) where around at the same time.

Galactica Boomer dies.

Gets transferred to new body, memory intact.

Caprica Boomer somehow recalls scoring the chief and other galactica events...leading one to believe that the memories where also downloaded to her.

If this is the case then there are a number of holes in the whole downloading thing.

But then again............it's just a tv show

jor el

Way back when the whole Caprice Helo/Sharon sub-polt was starting, that Sharon had memoried of being on Galactica with Helo. She used their friendship to get closer to him, even though this particular model was never on Galactica, and the one on Galactica was still alive.

The big difference between Galactica Sharon and Carpica Sharon and say the various number six models, is that Galactica Sharon didn't know she was a Cylon. She was a sleeper agent. Perhaps the Cylons can read the memories of their sleeper agents in order to keep track of their progress, and perhaps also to upload new info and missions.

The show hasn't revealed much about the download process yet, so there are any number of possibilities open to the writers to explain how Sharon's memories got shared before her death. The simplest would probably be what I just said above regarding sleeper agents.

sprinkles

interesting theory.....

Ivan

Firstly, there would of be a civil war with the cylons. So that would explain where they had been for the last year. My reasoning for this is that those cannot be Caprica Six and Shot_Adama Boomer. Simply because (as we know from stockwells character and from the Downloaded episode) they wanted nothing more to do with humans. So why come to investigate a radioactive signature? Furthermore, why land on the planet, or look for their surrender or bring in a huge mass of troops.

This is clearly the faction that didnt agree about peace with humans.

The six on new caprica has to be the one that set off the nuke. While she doesnt agree with wiping out humans, she has joined them for whatever reason (couldnt get to the other cylon faction/doesnt completely agree with their point of view/or is simply afraid of harming baltar so wont lead the cylons to them/him). Its plaing to see its her as opposed to caprica six. Caprica six would be delighted to see the man she loves, almost regardless of circumstance. Where as nuke six would be incredibly pained that her last act wrought more pain and suffering, especially to baltar.

My biggest problem with all this, is how could the whole human race not believe that the nuke set off by nuke six proves that the cylons knew where they were and so they should leave.

Though as for the adama's believing that the cylons wouldnt find them, I dont think this is true. In fairness, this episode (and a multitude besides) prove that Admirial Adama (especially) follows the will of the people, even when he thinks they are wrong. So he would allow people to settle on New caprica. You can be sure he would do his damndest to protect the place and be ever vigilant but the fact of the matter is, after they were there for so long why should he believe they would find them?

Anyway, I highly enjoyed this episode a frakking brilliant ending to a brilliant season. I also, especially liked how each of the characters seemingly paired off and devolved into their tragic forms of themselves. I mean, alot of the characters (starbuck and colonel tigh especially) do not really belong in the military and to see how they would live without the constant threat of cylon attack is just a further note on how great the show is.

On a final note, I reserve the right to say that this was all a dream, should the time come...

Johnny Storm

sprinkles wrote:

But then again............it's just a tv show

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOoooooooooooooooooooo ! :eek:

Stark

Ivan wrote:

The six on new caprica has to be the one that set off the nuke. While she doesnt agree with wiping out humans, she has joined them for whatever reason (couldnt get to the other cylon faction/doesnt completely agree with their point of view/or is simply afraid of harming baltar so wont lead the cylons to them/him). Its plaing to see its her as opposed to caprica six. Caprica six would be delighted to see the man she loves, almost regardless of circumstance. Where as nuke six would be incredibly pained that her last act wrought more pain and suffering, especially to baltar.

Well I still believe that Nuke Six is gone, never to be seen again. She would have been nowhere near a resurrection ship at the time the nuke went off.

I don't need any convincing that it was Caprica Six/Galactica who walked into Baltar's office. Motivations? Well Six always was a bit of a flake so who knows her motivations. It's very likely that she thinks she's doing the right thing by conquering humanity and converting them to the ways of their god. As for Galactica Boomer, last time we saw her, her memories of being a human were still raw. Since then she's had a year to live as a cylon with people who are like her and don't judge her for being a machine. She still feels some compassion towards the humans, not wanting to see them harmed but she's also more cylon now.

stevenmu

Ok, here's what I think. No way was this all a dream, it fits into the last few episodes too well. Caprica 6 and Sharon 8 lead the cyclons away from destroying humanity, but they still can't find a way to reproduce. Also just as Baltar has a 6 in his head, Caprica 6 also has a Baltar in her head. It's a bit of a leap but I think that 6's 'Head Baltar' is leading her to take over the cyclons, find humanity, be reunited with real Baltar to raise the other Sharon and Helo's baby. Just as Baltar's 'head 6' has led him to become president and settle on New Caprica to sit and wait for the Cyclons. Caprica 6 has led the Cyclons to New Caprica with the promise that they could use the humans to reproduce. When this becomes clear Roslin, or pehaps her aide will reveal the existence of the baby , which the cyclons will be able to use to learn how to reproduce withouth human help. Caprica 6 and Baltar will take the baby back to the Cyclon homeworld and raise it there.

The real questions are about 'head' 6 and 'head' Baltar. Who are they ? Who's pulling their strings ? How do they know what's going to happen and manuipulate things exactly the way they want to ? Who's God ?

Barry Aldwell

I can't wait for a scene with Baltar and Caprica Six, and their respective head Six and Baltar

DeVore

What makes people think that 6 has a head Baltar??

I took the sex scene to be a prior event that was cut into a chronologically later scene. I just watched the episode again and before she undresses Baltar says "my ability to see you will be restricted when we land on New Caprica" (paraphrased).

I think he had sex with her, left and then she blew up the nuke. Why do people think 6 has a Baltar in her head??

DeV.

stevenmu

It's not the 6 that's in the fleet, it's the 6 that remained on Caprica. Two or three episodes back they had an episode from the perspective of the cylons and it showed her talking to a Baltar in her head just like Baltar talks to his imaginary 6. The bit that really surprised me most was that Caprica 6 obviously didn't know anything about Baltar seeing visions of her, in fact I think she believes Baltar to be dead.

ButcherOfNog

My own view is that Baltar is a cylon, probably #1. When they both died in the explosion, the "download" got a bit corrupt, thus bits of both in each others heads. So I think anyways

DeVore

Ah I havent seen that episode (what what?!?!)... must watch it immediately

DeV.

Haruspex

DeVore wrote:

Ah I havent seen that episode (what what?!?!)... must watch it immediately

"Downloaded" (2x18) aired last night on Sky One, so you should be able to catch the repeats on Sky Two on Thursday at 22:00 and next Monday at 21:00.

sprinkles

DeVore wrote:

Ah I havent seen that episode (what what?!?!)... must watch it immediately

DeV.

Missing an episode......tut tut

ButcherOfNog wrote:

My own view is that Baltar is a cylon, probably #1. When they both died in the explosion, the "download" got a bit corrupt, thus bits of both in each others heads. So I think anyways

Don't know how that would work. how did the "new" baltar get to earth from a resurection ship? and why have the cylons not used him already?

I will admit though, it's an interesting theory to say the least

Vokes

Only just caught the finale - awesome

But back in October? - Balls to that

Anyways, my theory about the population situation - we had, say about 5000 killed in the Cloud 9 explosion. Is it not reasonable to assume that another 5000 or so have died in the 380 days since?

With disease widespread, no meds available and (probably) poor infrastructure with regards to water & plumbing, the mortality rate must be pretty high amongst the old and very young.

Humanity is essentially dying, and the Cylons (well, one faction anyway) have arrived to offer the humans a chance to survive by joining with them to reproduce, etc...

cyrusdvirus

Well, thats the end of season 2 on Sky. What makes people think the whole thing is a dream sequence?

robnubis

Well the whole dream thing does seem to fit together, first of all the wird jump straight back to galatica thing after being on Cparica. Also if you notice (dunno if this has been said) some of the raptors look weird and discloured when Starbuck returns to galatica...

sprinkles

When she returns from Caprica?

Seriously don't think this is a dream as they would risk ruining a very very good show. Also I think the producers have put an end to that chain of thought and afaik

they plan to deal with the resistance on the planet in the early part of the new series, the first 3 - 4 episodes.

(not much of a spoiler but I didn't want people winging at me )

cyrusdvirus

Looking at IMDB the first episode of S3 has been named. Kinda shoots down the dream idea.


And slightly different colour raptors?? Straws and clutching methinks!

Having said that i did find the whole dean stockwell character on caprica and no-one paying a blind bit of notice to him turning up a touch much!!

secret_squirrel

A year passed on New Caprica? Why do I feel like a whole series of BSG has just been stolen from me?

I dont buy the dream idea. Its more likely to set up Season 3 as 50% flashbacks ala Lost. Which is almost as poor an idea as 'it was all a dream' imo.

Only OK from me - I feel robbed. To much of a jump in the time line which reduced the impact of the cliff hanger - we had nothing invested in their situations on New Caprica.

It needed at least another Ep on New Caprica before the cylons turned up.

One flaw in the Baltar is a Cylon theory because of Head Baltar in Downloaded, is that Six wouldnt have had to shag him in the miniseries to shut off the colonial defense grid. He could have done it himself.

Sooner or Later

Did anyone else pick up on that moment between Apollo and Dee when they first spotted the cylon fleet? Apollo said something along the lines of what amazingly good eyesight she must have to have picked out a ship out of all the static when he couldn't see a thing. A hint that she is a cylon?

On the episode itself I'm in two minds. Brave decision to skip an entire year but it made the episode feel a bit disjointed. Really don't want to see Season 3 consisting of heroic resistance episodes intercut with endless flashbacks.

Get back on those ships!

sprinkles

Sooner or Later wrote:

Did anyone else pick up on that moment between Apollo and Dee when they first spotted the cylon fleet? Apollo said something along the lines of what amazingly good eyesight she must have to have picked out a ship out of all the static when he couldn't see a thing. A hint that she is a cylon?

He said "I'm amazed you could spot anything in that soup" as the "radar" was all static, then the ship reappeared and he saw it too. Don't think she's a cylon.

Haruspex

secret_squirrel wrote:

A year passed on New Caprica? Why do I feel like a whole series of BSG has just been stolen from me?

I dont buy the dream idea. Its more likely to set up Season 3 as 50% flashbacks ala Lost. Which is almost as poor an idea as 'it was all a dream' imo.

Only OK from me - I feel robbed. To much of a jump in the time line which reduced the impact of the cliff hanger - we had nothing invested in their situations on New Caprica.

It needed at least another Ep on New Caprica before the cylons turned up.

Don't think we'll be treated to Lost-style weekly flashbacks in Season 3. The excerpt below from a recent David Eick interview demonstrates this, while acknowledging that some elements such as the Lee/Kara estrangement will need to be dealt with.

iF: How much will be left unsaid from season two?

EICK: We have an episode in the first leg of season three, which is more or less devoted to at least a couple of the major issues that arose during the time on the planet. There’s going to be a lot answered. The flip side of that is that there are a lot of things that will fuel upcoming storylines that we may not have fleshed out yet. I certainly knew, as did Ron, that the risk in leaping forward a year [besides people thinking it was a dream] was that people would feel jerked around. We didn’t want people to think we were pulling a TWIN PEAKS move that wouldn’t pay off. I think that they’ll find in fairly short order that we won’t leave anything hanging. For example, Adama and Sharon [Grace Park] have a subversive relationship, and you don’t need to see a whole year to know things have changed between them. I don’t want anyone to feel that they have missed things, but it might be a chance for new viewers who check in to the show to start fresh with these new explanations of character relationships. The people, who’ve been watching for two years, will hopefully see these changes as a legitimate outgrowth that has its own storytelling value. In a couple of cases where we’ve said Kara [ Katee Sackhoff] is married to Anders [Michael Trucco],

Lee [Jamie Bamber] is married to Dualla [Kandyse McClure];

* there is an episode being put together that will specifically deal with what happened.

Here's the interview in full but avoid for some major Season 3 spoilers. You have been warned...

*Didn't get that revelation from the season finale at all. Was a surprise to me anyway.

todd10k

Loved the ending, cant wait for s3.

DeVore

Ok, I watched that episode I missed.... WOW.... er, yeah that explains a few things and explains how I missed it because its so extracted from the main storyline. Great episode though. Now I've no idea whats going on with six and Baltar but I think Galatica Baltar is real and possibly someone or something is screwing around with both the humans *and* the cylons....??


DeV.