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Off Topic Chat. (MOD NOTE post# 3949 and post#5279)

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  • Registered Users Posts: 14,943 ✭✭✭✭Grizzly 45


    civdef wrote: »
    Learning the ins and outs of medication administration and recording, consent, how to reassure nervous patients, and probably more importantly, what to do if the person reacts badly takes a lot longer. If you can draw on a sufficient pool of people who already have those skills, it makes sense to use them
    .

    So none of the other professions that break skin for inoculations don't deal with paperwork or assuring patients or you cant teach people a pretty basic procedure, and there wont be any other medical professional there to assist if a patient has a reaction? Usually within 14 hours of the 2nd shot apparently,[if they do] Feck.If you can teach a gobdaw like me to do it...:p

    Sounds like the "Only police and military professionals are the only ones suitably trained and qualified and trustworthy to use handguns and assault rifles" argument.And if you already have a trained pool of people who are doing this on a daily basis in some shape or form. How difficult will it be for them?So they are they nor being utilised?

    "If you want to keep someone away from your house, Just fire the shotgun through the door."

    Vice President [and former lawyer] Joe Biden Field& Stream Magazine interview Feb 2013 "



  • Registered Users Posts: 14,943 ✭✭✭✭Grizzly 45


    It's just like deer hunting,only bigger and in Africa...


    y countrysquiremagazine
    BY JOHN NASH

    The world’s press and social media has recently been awash with a story about Merelize van der Merwe, a South African (SA) lady hunter who shot a giraffe and held up its heart, after a hunt that was a Valentine gift from her hubby. Thank goodness she didn’t hold up the organ on the ground (see picture below).

    Unsurprisingly, The Sun, our much-loved UK bastion of balanced reporting and beacon of truth, described her as a “sociopath” and helpfully highlighted a petition to have this villainess banned from Facebook, such was her heinous crime.

    Bizarrely, however, her actions were in accordance with our own dear RSPCA policies. It raises a number of questions about animal welfare and goes to the heart of the conceptual discord between many townies and tweeds over hunting.

    image.png
    The lady in question, rather provocatively, has deposited a suitably robust automatic answering message for the thousands of kind people who send her their variously creative ideas about her demise, her mental state and her abilities as a mother. Admittedly, she clearly loves to wind up the multitudes of anti-hunting tribes that flavour social media platforms with their pseudo-puritanical hysteria. It pays, therefore, to take a brief look at this rare glimpse of an unapologetic huntress and the realities of modern animal management in Africa.

    First, the hunting facts. The giraffe, an old male affectionately known as a “stink bull” in hunting circles due to a certain fragrance they develop in old age, was raised specifically for hunting and meat on a game farm in Limpopo Province, once known as the Northern Transvaal. Merelize, together with her professional guide, stalked the animal successfully and from perhaps the range of 100 yards or so, she shot it with a .30-06 calibre hunting rifle. The single high-neck shot was successful and the giraffe dropped, insensible, into its own shadow. She then quickly followed it up with a coup de grace delivered at very close range with a huge Rigby .450 rifle, capable of knocking an elephant upside down, guaranteeing an instant death. This animal had no idea what happened. One minute it was munching the tree-tops and the next moment it was in that great game reserve in the sky. You may well feel dismayed or even outraged, but those are the facts.

    Now, the giraffe. It was privately owned, raised in a protected natural habitat specifically for hunting and meat, on a large farm, by a game farmer. It was one of the 1% or 2% sustainably harvested every year. A bit like deer in Scotland. It was not galloping freely on the African plains as commonly imagined - the African plains are all owned by somebody these days. It was not one of the animals in the National Game Reserves - they are not hunted, of course. It was also not endangered; although giraffes overall are red-listed as vulnerable and decreasing, there are nine sub-species and this one, the Southern giraffe, is doing very well and of least concern; there are at least 26,000 and the numbers are rising because they are raised for hunting and meat. Farmers can raise as many as the industry requires. They are delicious, if rather chewy when old.

    From the dark colour of his markings, this was an old bull whose fertility would be falling, yet he was still big enough and violent enough to keep younger, more fertile bulls away from the cows. By removing him, the birth rate would go up. He could carry on for a few more years, perhaps, but wouldn’t be worth any more, so why feed him and carry the risk of disease or injury? Thus, he had reached his farm sell-by date, so he was sold to a hunter and the farmer got his income.

    Raising wild animals in their natural habitat is a major industry in dry South Africa, where only 13% of the land is suitable for rain-fed crops. Because farmers can legally own the wildlife on high-fenced farms, it means that wild animals are farm assets and can be bought, sold, auctioned or otherwise harvested like any other farm stock. Over the last thirty years, some forty million acres of game farms filled with wild animals have been established there, all supported by hunting and the meat industry. Those forty million acres give a home to billions of other animals, birds, reptiles, insects, plants and trees that are not hunted, which is why the term conservation farming is preferred.

    Now, policy number 5.10.1 of the UK’s venerated RSPCA states that:

    “The RSPCA believes that ‘sport’ does not justify the causing of suffering to birds and other animals, and therefore the RSPCA is opposed to shooting for sport.”

    However, this hunt demonstrated that shooting, done properly, does not cause suffering, and in any case, sport shooting in Africa invariably means consumption because a ton of low-carbon, free-range, organic meat will never go to waste.

    Policy number 7.1.1. Requires “the upholding of The five freedoms; (1) Freedom from hunger and thirst, (2) Freedom from discomfort, (3) Freedom from pain, injury or disease, (4) Freedom to express normal behaviour and (5) Freedom from fear or distress”. It has to be said that while wild giraffes in the National Reserves, filled with predators and left to nature, do not enjoy all of these things, this wild giraffe did, since it was protected from predators and will have been watered during droughts.

    Policy number 7.9.1 states, “The RSPCA advocates that, because of the serious risk of distress and suffering caused to food animals during transport, all food animals should be slaughtered/killed as near as possible to the point of production”. This giraffe was, and was subsequently eaten.

    Policy number 7.10.2 states, “The RSPCA believes that fear should be kept to minimum levels prior to and during slaughter or killing. Because of their temperament, non-domesticated species are not amenable to transportation or handling within normal licensed slaughterhouse systems”. The hunt fulfilled this policy admirably - stalking involves creeping up unseen.

    Policy number 9.4.1 states, “The RSPCA is concerned with the welfare of all wild animals and it deplores man-made changes in the environment which cause suffering to wild animals''. This farmer has re-wilded a huge area of natural habitat giving home to indigenous animals and plants, far exceeding this policy requirement.

    Policy number 9.5.1 states, “The RSPCA is opposed to the trade in wild-caught animals and products derived from them”. This giraffe was not wild caught. It was “wild” but never caught whilst alive. Like deer in the UK, it was raised with the potential to be sold, hunted and eaten.

    However, few people will have the neck to say it...

    John Nash grew up in West Cornwall and was a £10 pom to Johannesburg in the early 1960’s. He started well in construction project management, mainly high rise buildings but it wasn’t really Africa, so he went bush, prospecting and trading around the murkier bits of the bottom half of the continent. Now retired back in Cornwall among all the other evil old pirates. His interests are still sustainable resources, wildlife management and the utilitarian needs of rural Africa.

    "If you want to keep someone away from your house, Just fire the shotgun through the door."

    Vice President [and former lawyer] Joe Biden Field& Stream Magazine interview Feb 2013 "



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,057 ✭✭✭civdef


    Grizzly 45 wrote: »
    .

    So none of the other professions that break skin for inoculations don't deal with paperwork or assuring patients or you cant teach people a pretty basic procedure, and there wont be any other medical professional there to assist if a patient has a reaction? Usually within 14 hours of the 2nd shot apparently,[if they do]

    I think they've added everyone at this stage who is medically trained to give IM injections to humans - they recently added optometrists after their professional body pointed out they had been overlooked.

    If they do run short I'd say they'll be quick to widen the qualifications net, e.g. qualified Emergency First Responders would have everything bar the IM injection bit done already.

    The adverse reaction that's really getting attention is the severe anaphylactic reactions that happen very occasionally. They are much more likely if the person has a history of previous allergic reactions, and are generally within 30 minutes after the vaccination. Most people have to be observed for 15 minutes after the vaccination, that's increased to 30 if you have a history of severe allergies.

    To be able to respond to anaphylaxis, vaccinators need to be competent in basic life support and the IM administration of epinephrine.


  • Registered Users Posts: 14,943 ✭✭✭✭Grizzly 45


    And busisness returns to normal in the good ol Biden USA.Dems stealing money for their own pet projects...Could give our lot a run for their money...
    https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2021/03/report-nancy-pelosi-tried-put-140-million-funding-rail-project-district-covid-bill/?ff_source=Email&ff_medium=the-gateway-pundit&ff_campaign=dailypm&ff_content=daily

    "If you want to keep someone away from your house, Just fire the shotgun through the door."

    Vice President [and former lawyer] Joe Biden Field& Stream Magazine interview Feb 2013 "



  • Registered Users Posts: 14,943 ✭✭✭✭Grizzly 45


    Somehow I doubt this is the "empowered woman " our Feministas of the chattering classes of D4 imagine when they pen their opinionaries for the Indo and Irish Times...She would be much more empowering if she was no doubt raped and stangled with her own panties...:rolleyes:

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9325019/Israeli-Queen-guns-urges-women-carry-weapon-reveals-raped-twice.html?fbclid=IwAR0cHSSUiufZs2Pv1UWIeg-O5skV_ocFZVd9cVfSle8l2sJ1C0t016hD048

    "If you want to keep someone away from your house, Just fire the shotgun through the door."

    Vice President [and former lawyer] Joe Biden Field& Stream Magazine interview Feb 2013 "



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  • Registered Users Posts: 335 ✭✭yubabill


    Might as well add Botox practitioners to the list of IM-injection-trained vaccinators.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,280 ✭✭✭tudderone


    yubabill wrote: »
    Might as well add Botox practitioners to the list of IM-injection-trained vaccinators.

    Tattoo artists ?


  • Registered Users Posts: 14,943 ✭✭✭✭Grizzly 45


    Body inkers don't break fully into the bloodstream. They only go to a sub epidermal level [?]

    "If you want to keep someone away from your house, Just fire the shotgun through the door."

    Vice President [and former lawyer] Joe Biden Field& Stream Magazine interview Feb 2013 "



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,057 ✭✭✭civdef


    yubabill wrote: »
    Might as well add Botox practitioners to the list of IM-injection-trained vaccinators.

    I understand you have to be a doctor or dentist in Ireland to administer botox, so they’re already on the list.


  • Registered Users Posts: 14,943 ✭✭✭✭Grizzly 45


    Botox ...One step up from the most deadly nerve agent known to man.Botulinum Toxin.:eek: Which is what the abbreviation is Bo[tillium] Tox[in].One to tell the missus if she is pestering you on wasting your money on this ...:D

    "If you want to keep someone away from your house, Just fire the shotgun through the door."

    Vice President [and former lawyer] Joe Biden Field& Stream Magazine interview Feb 2013 "



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  • Registered Users Posts: 2,280 ✭✭✭tudderone


    Grizzly 45 wrote: »
    And busisness returns to normal in the good ol Biden USA.Dems stealing money for their own pet projects...Could give our lot a run for their money...
    https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2021/03/report-nancy-pelosi-tried-put-140-million-funding-rail-project-district-covid-bill/?ff_source=Email&ff_medium=the-gateway-pundit&ff_campaign=dailypm&ff_content=daily

    Bailing out a union pension fund in the covid bill. I am glad its not just Ireland that behaves in this baffling manner.




  • Registered Users Posts: 14,943 ✭✭✭✭Grizzly 45




  • Registered Users Posts: 14,943 ✭✭✭✭Grizzly 45


    Trump had religious nutter Paula White casting out demons...:D:D
    The Dems have nutter Sen Susan Rice burning sage and feathers in the White house to cast out demons in the form of Trump!!!:D:D What will we find next in her office? Vodoo dolls and a personal zombie?oh...no ..sorry ...that's the president!
    And these people are in charge of the worlds hyperpower and largest nuke force on the planet?:rolleyes::rolleyes:

    https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2021/03/photo-biden-advisor-susan-rice-burns-sage-cleanse-trump-white-house-office-stephen-miller/?ff_source=Email&ff_medium=the-gateway-pundit&ff_campaign=dailypm&ff_content=daily

    "If you want to keep someone away from your house, Just fire the shotgun through the door."

    Vice President [and former lawyer] Joe Biden Field& Stream Magazine interview Feb 2013 "



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,280 ✭✭✭tudderone


    Grizzly 45 wrote: »
    Trump had religious nutter Paula White casting out demons...:D:D
    The Dems have nutter Sen Susan Rice burning sage and feathers in the White house to cast out demons in the form of Trump!!!:D:D What will we find next in her office? Vodoo dolls and a personal zombie?oh...no ..sorry ...that's the president!
    And these people are in charge of the worlds hyperpower and largest nuke force on the planet?:rolleyes::rolleyes:

    https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2021/03/photo-biden-advisor-susan-rice-burns-sage-cleanse-trump-white-house-office-stephen-miller/?ff_source=Email&ff_medium=the-gateway-pundit&ff_campaign=dailypm&ff_content=daily

    If we were doing things like that, the world would be laughing up their sleeves and rightly so.


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,608 ✭✭✭Feisar


    tudderone wrote: »
    If we were doing things like that, the world would be laughing up their sleeves and rightly so.

    I doubt they’d bother laughing up their sleeves. More like pointing and laughing.
    How does the witch doctor antics fit in with the Bible Belt?

    First they came for the socialists...



  • Registered Users Posts: 14,943 ✭✭✭✭Grizzly 45


    So now the EUSSR wants MORE information and oversight on what firearms we own.By being able to log into national police forces computers.
    So no doubt if you like or send a mean tweet,the EU Soviet police forces can now declare you are some sort of nasty Right-wing radical and order the locals to deprive you of your firearms.

    Dont be surprised if this one sneaks up and bites us in the ass as well....

    https://www.statewatch.org/media/1982/eu-council-prum-firearms-proposal-5787-21.pdf?fbclid=IwAR1EnXDlaZqQTpyn12qDbsik-UcvmScS8rhVrIMBFjqe8b-6OGBQm07k3Ac



    In order to combat terrorism, violent extremism, serious and organised crime and illicit
    trafficking in firearms, greater control over the movement of firearms, and automated
    consultation of information concerning the location, identification and possession of
    firearms and their owners, is becoming increasingly relevant as it eliminates the need for
    consultation on a point-by-point basis, through the designated contact points.


    m) Although the registration of stolen, missing or misappropriated firearms is already recorded
    in existing INTERPOL, Europol and SIS databases, it is of prime importance to extend the
    possibility to consult the national databases on remaining firearms, and their legitimate
    owners, in a rapid manner.

    n) In the light of increased challenges to internal security, the EU could consider when
    modernising the 'Prüm Decisions' with a view to open up automated exchange to additional
    data categories, which are already available in the Member States criminal or other
    databases for the purpose of criminal investigation, whether the Prüm framework should be
    completed by cross-border access to the data filing systems established in accordance with
    Council Directive 91/477/EEC, amended by Directive (EU) 2017/853.

    "If you want to keep someone away from your house, Just fire the shotgun through the door."

    Vice President [and former lawyer] Joe Biden Field& Stream Magazine interview Feb 2013 "



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,280 ✭✭✭tudderone


    Grizzly 45 wrote: »
    So now the EUSSR wants MORE information and oversight on what firearms we own.By being able to log into national police forces computers.
    So no doubt if you like or send a mean tweet,the EU Soviet police forces can now declare you are some sort of nasty Right-wing radical and order the locals to deprive you of your firearms.

    Dont be surprised if this one sneaks up and bites us in the ass as well....

    https://www.statewatch.org/media/1982/eu-council-prum-firearms-proposal-5787-21.pdf?fbclid=IwAR1EnXDlaZqQTpyn12qDbsik-UcvmScS8rhVrIMBFjqe8b-6OGBQm07k3Ac



    In order to combat terrorism, violent extremism, serious and organised crime and illicit
    trafficking in firearms, greater control over the movement of firearms, and automated
    consultation of information concerning the location, identification and possession of
    firearms and their owners, is becoming increasingly relevant as it eliminates the need for
    consultation on a point-by-point basis, through the designated contact points.


    m) Although the registration of stolen, missing or misappropriated firearms is already recorded
    in existing INTERPOL, Europol and SIS databases, it is of prime importance to extend the
    possibility to consult the national databases on remaining firearms, and their legitimate
    owners, in a rapid manner.

    n) In the light of increased challenges to internal security, the EU could consider when
    modernising the 'Prüm Decisions' with a view to open up automated exchange to additional
    data categories, which are already available in the Member States criminal or other
    databases for the purpose of criminal investigation, whether the Prüm framework should be
    completed by cross-border access to the data filing systems established in accordance with
    Council Directive 91/477/EEC, amended by Directive (EU) 2017/853.

    The Irish government has already given its reponse ; "Yes sir no sir, three bags full sir", "And can i black your boots while you wait" :rolleyes:.


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,608 ✭✭✭Feisar


    MEC's Ways of the Rifle arrived the other day.

    Mother of god the minutia.

    First they came for the socialists...



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,280 ✭✭✭tudderone


    That Sheriff, can you imagine him meeting our keystone cops :eek:




  • Registered Users Posts: 6,608 ✭✭✭Feisar


    I don't like America's attitude towards guns. Or at least the attitude that prevails predominantly. It appears a gun is a weapon first and a beautiful amalgamation of steel and wood a distant second. The bould Joe is right there, a well armed militia would keep a government in check when the musket was the order of the day. But these days the notion is nonsensical.

    First they came for the socialists...



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  • Registered Users Posts: 14,943 ✭✭✭✭Grizzly 45


    Feisar wrote: »
    The bould Joe is right there, a well armed militia would keep a government in check when the musket was the order of the day. But these days the notion is nonsensical.

    Chuckles in Afghani ,Vietnamese,Iraqui,Chechen,and IRA

    "If you want to keep someone away from your house, Just fire the shotgun through the door."

    Vice President [and former lawyer] Joe Biden Field& Stream Magazine interview Feb 2013 "



  • Registered Users Posts: 6,608 ✭✭✭Feisar


    Grizzly 45 wrote: »
    Chuckles in Afghani ,Vietnamese,Iraqui,Chechen,and IRA

    Ah not really, dunno about the rest but the Tans could have dealt with the IRA if they had the stomach to.

    First they came for the socialists...



  • Registered Users Posts: 7,857 ✭✭✭Rows Grower


    Feisar wrote: »
    Ah not really, dunno about the rest but the Tans could have dealt with the IRA if they had the stomach to.

    Leitrim could have won the senior All Ireland Hurling if they only had the stomach.

    "Very soon we are going to Mars. You wouldn't have been going to Mars if my opponent won, that I can tell you. You wouldn't even be thinking about it."

    Donald Trump, March 13th 2018.



  • Registered Users Posts: 14,943 ✭✭✭✭Grizzly 45


    Feisar wrote: »
    Ah not really, dunno about the rest but the Tans could have dealt with the IRA if they had the stomach to.

    Thinking more of the Provos .

    "If you want to keep someone away from your house, Just fire the shotgun through the door."

    Vice President [and former lawyer] Joe Biden Field& Stream Magazine interview Feb 2013 "



  • Registered Users Posts: 6,608 ✭✭✭Feisar


    Grizzly 45 wrote: »
    Thinking more of the Provos .

    Yea me to. Sorry I should have clarified, when I say IRA I'm usually talking about the Provisionals, not the Marxist talking shop the actual IRA became.

    The British never really went to war with the Provos.

    First they came for the socialists...



  • Registered Users Posts: 6,608 ✭✭✭Feisar


    Leitrim could have won the senior All Ireland Hurling if they only had the stomach.

    ???

    I don't get the relevance? How does one of the least populated counties winning at at sporting competition have anything got to do with a war machine crushing a lesser enemy?

    First they came for the socialists...



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 28,448 Mod ✭✭✭✭Cass


    Feisar wrote: »
    But these days the notion is nonsensical.
    I'd immediately agree with you but on thinking about it, and this is pure speculation, how well would it go for the Government though?

    You'd assume the Government are better armed, cos they are. However nukes would never be used (contrary to some congressmen's beliefs) so its conventional armaments. However the soldiers, while much better trained (or even just simply trained), are not immediately on the Government's side. Well i wouldn't think so.

    Then the issue of the optics, especially in this day and age, of troops attacking/arresting/shooting citizens would turn those on the fence to one side or the other. Essentially you'd be looking at ACW take two. It'd go on for years and be a very different country when all is done.

    Of course the other side is shooting at static targets every second Sunday does not make one an operator, plus when you lose your Netflix, lazyboy chair, and takeaways i wonder how long people's resolve would last. :D

    hK7KZN9M.jpg
    Forum Charter - Useful Information - Photo thread: Hardware - Ranges by County - Hunting Laws/Important threads - Upcoming Events - RFDs by County

    If you see a problem post use the report post function. Click on the three dots on the post, select "FLAG" & let a Moderator deal with it.

    Moderators - Cass otmmyboy2 , CatMod - Shamboc , Admins - Beasty , mickeroo



  • Registered Users Posts: 6,608 ✭✭✭Feisar


    Cass wrote: »
    I'd immediately agree with you but on thinking about it, and this is pure speculation, how well would it go for the Government though?

    You'd assume the Government are better armed, cos they are. However nukes would never be used (contrary to some congressmen's beliefs) so its conventional armaments. However the soldiers, while much better trained (or even just simply trained), are not immediately on the Government's side. Well i wouldn't think so.

    Then the issue of the optics, especially in this day and age, of troops attacking/arresting/shooting citizens would turn those on the fence to one side or the other. Essentially you'd be looking at ACW take two. It'd go on for years and be a very different country when all is done.

    Of course the other side is shooting at static targets every second Sunday does not make one an operator, plus when you lose your Netflix, lazyboy chair, and takeaways i wonder how long people's resolve would last. :D

    hK7KZN9M.jpg

    Gorilla warfare depends largely on the support of the general population. Or at least a chunk of it. That’s not going to work if yer clipping the local war hero. Back in the day the local backwoodsman/minuteman/soldier weren’t that different. These days it’s night and day. Mag dumping of a Saturday does not make a soldier much less a cog in a unit.

    First they came for the socialists...



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 28,448 Mod ✭✭✭✭Cass


    Feisar wrote: »
    Gorilla warfare depends largely on the support of the general population. Or at least a chunk of it.
    Not to mention the armed forces. Would all of them follow orders?
    That’s not going to work if yer clipping the local war hero.
    Works both ways too. IO the official army shooting civilians and veterans alike.
    Back in the day the local backwoodsman/minuteman/soldier weren’t that different. These days it’s night and day. Mag dumping of a Saturday does not make a soldier much less a cog in a unit.
    Yeah, hence my comment about people missing life's luxuries.

    I see lots of comments on social media about armed resistance and possible civil war, etc. However when push comes to shove how many would actually do something? If the number were small enough, the 2% rule applies here too, it could easily be put down with little to no loss of life. The larger the number harder it would be.
    Forum Charter - Useful Information - Photo thread: Hardware - Ranges by County - Hunting Laws/Important threads - Upcoming Events - RFDs by County

    If you see a problem post use the report post function. Click on the three dots on the post, select "FLAG" & let a Moderator deal with it.

    Moderators - Cass otmmyboy2 , CatMod - Shamboc , Admins - Beasty , mickeroo



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  • Registered Users Posts: 2,280 ✭✭✭tudderone


    The americans have a different attitude to many things. But one of them is self reliance, which probably stems from the settlers. Something happens to a house holder in the dead of night in Ireland, someone in your house, cower in a wardrobe and pray the intruder does not find you. In America they feel the onus is on them and not someone else to deal with the threat to them. As the Sheriff says, "We can't be everywhere".

    I don't blame them either, as some of members on the American forums have said to me, we've seen whats happened and what is happening in Europe, we don't want that.

    If dozy joe does make an attempt to ban everything over there, there will be serious unrest.


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