Car ploughs through crowd in Germany

suicide_circus · 01-12-2020 6:14pm

.anon. wrote: »

racists

Not a race

.anon. · 01-12-2020 6:15pm

Deleted User wrote: »

It was hardly racist and certainly not unreasonable or unfounded to assume something like this is an islamic terrorist attack

The assumption isn't racist. The rush to post it is.

ChikiChiki · 01-12-2020 6:17pm

Incidents like this are not shocking anymore and you can see why people jump to conclusions that a person from a certain religious grouping is likely the prime culprit.

It may not be the case in this instance but this certain grouping have radical sections and have form for this kind of thing.

Doctors room ghost · 01-12-2020 6:17pm

silverharp wrote: »

most reports are just saying 2 dead and a 51 year old man arrested, I wouldnt jump to terror attack on that one

If you were one of the two people dead or their families,you wouldn’t be “just saying”.

PokeHerKing · 01-12-2020 6:21pm

7 have died now according to Sky. Definitely not an accident as the German reporter saying the mans motive is unknown. 51yo German national. Scumbag regardless of motive.

banie01 · 01-12-2020 6:21pm

[Deleted User] wrote: »

It was hardly racist and certainly not unreasonable or unfounded to assume something like this is an islamic terrorist attack

Sectarian then?
Yes, I agree that it is always a thought to the foremost of my mind when I here about an attack of this type.
I do have issue with people racing to label attacks such as this immediately.
It's always a race to blame Islam or be the 1st to post "religion of peace".

I get it, I really do but for the sake of a little time and of gathering more detail it does save people outing themselves fairly immediately as islamophobic or in the case of those referring to brown Germans, overtly racist.

01-12-2020 6:23pm

Oddly enough, none of the rush-to-judgers had "radical, white, right-winger" on their bigoted bingo card.

01-12-2020 6:24pm

.anon. wrote: »

The assumption isn't racist. The rush to post it is.

Assuming its an islamic attack is ok, but saying that you assume it is an islamic attack is "racist".

Ok

Gruffalux · 01-12-2020 6:25pm

When I heard about it first I was told it was a 51 year old from a nearby village. It does not seem possible to be an accident from the description of the route taken and the car emerging into the square. And surely regardless of who the person is it is a terrorist attack (as long as it was not an accident, which I doubt very much) as it is designed to inspire terror. It is a terrible thing that happened.

silverharp · 01-12-2020 6:25pm

Doctors room ghost wrote: »

If you were one of the two people dead ….,you wouldn’t be “just saying”.

I cant fault your logic

01-12-2020 6:28pm

Deleted User wrote: »

Oddly enough, none of the rush-to-judgers had "radical, white, right-winger" on their bigoted bingo card.

And for good reason.

Thelonious Monk · 01-12-2020 6:31pm

Some posters will be so disappointed if this isn't a Muslim

biko · 01-12-2020 6:33pm

Crap, that's terrible. RIP.
We'll see what the police has to say.

Das Reich · 01-12-2020 6:37pm

greendom wrote: »

Fair play on the speed of your conclusion jump there. And on not deleting the post in embarrassment.

I wonder what's the age of those posters, if they have just a bad memory or if they do that intentionaly. We all saw what happened on the other cases, not long time ago, all the same modus operandi by the media.

TomTomTim · 01-12-2020 6:37pm

Deleted User wrote: »

Oddly enough, none of the rush-to-judgers had "radical, white, right-winger" on their bigoted bingo card.

It's almost like right wing terror attacks aren't anywhere near as common in Europe as Islamic ones. People who rush to assume Islamic involvement are simply using their pattern recognition.

01-12-2020 6:38pm

Thelonious Monk wrote: »

Some posters will be so disappointed if this isn't a Muslim

In much the same way some people will revel in the fact that it's not a Muslim

More point scoring bollocks from both sides who don't seem to give a **** about the incident but just care about furthering their bull**** fight against each other.

01-12-2020 6:39pm

Deleted User wrote: »

In much the same way some people will revel in the fact that it's not a Muslim

More point scoring bollocks from both sides who don't seem to give a **** about the incident but just care about furthering their bull**** fight against each other.

Rebuking someone who incites hatred is not point-scoring.

01-12-2020 6:41pm

Deleted User wrote: »

Rebuking someone who incites hatred is not point-scoring.

Oh ffs. It's hatred to recognise that this horrendous attack had all the hallmarks of an Islamic attack and state that?

Inciting hatred?

Jesus wept.

biko · 01-12-2020 6:41pm

Thelonious Monk wrote: »

Some posters will be so disappointed if this isn't a Muslim

Considering vehicle rampages in Stockholm, Nice, Berlin, Barcelona, London Bridge and Westminster Bridge the last few years it's not a surprise that a Islamist is the go-to assumption, don't you think?

I am old enough to remember when it wasn't the go-to assumption.
That was 20 years ago...

01-12-2020 6:44pm

Deleted User wrote: »

Oh ffs. It's hatred to recognise that this horrendous attack had all the hallmarks of an Islamic attack and state that?

Inciting hatred?

Jesus wept.

Inciting hatred online carries a penalty of up to 2 years in prison in Germany.

Thelonious Monk · 01-12-2020 6:45pm

biko wrote: »

Considering vehicle rampages in Stockholm, Nice, Berlin, Barcelona, London Bridge and Westminster Bridge the last few years it's not a surprise that a Islamist is the go-to assumption, don't you think?

I am old enough to remember when it wasn't the go-to assumption.
That was 20 years ago...

Yes I know, I assumed it was too, I still think people will be disappointed it wasn't a muslim though.

biko · 01-12-2020 6:46pm

Unfortunately there will be a real Islamist attack soon somewhere in Europe.
They will never stop.

Kaybaykwah · 01-12-2020 6:54pm

Thelonious Monk wrote: »

Some posters will be so disappointed if this isn't a Muslim

I didn’t jump to conclusions. I remember too well that guy in Toronto who rented a van a coupla years ago and rammed it into a bunch of people. His gripe was that he couldn’t find a girlfriend.

Well, guess what, he probably has a lot of mail in prison from prospects. That is the sad state of humanity.

I don’t fault gervais for thinking this was the case of someone on the terror trail, what with Christmas markets happening in German and Alsatian towns, but there are plenty of kooks out there.

01-12-2020 6:55pm

Deleted User wrote: »

Inciting hatred online carries a penalty of up to 2 years in prison in Germany.

Nobody on here has come close to inciting hatred.

01-12-2020 6:57pm

Deleted User wrote: »

Nobody on here has come close to inciting hatred.

That re-reg poster has had their posts deleted and a few other posts were deleted from the thread.

01-12-2020 6:59pm

TomTomTim wrote: »

It's almost like right wing terror attacks aren't anywhere near as common in Europe as Islamic ones. People who rush to assume Islamic involvement are simply using their pattern recognition.

There have been ten terror attacks in Germany in the last two years.

6 were right-wingers.
2 were Islamists.

Liamo57 · 01-12-2020 7:02pm

Hopefully it is not terrorist related.

McHardcore · 01-12-2020 7:04pm

Deleted User wrote: »

In much the same way some people will revel in the fact that it's not a Muslim

More point scoring bollocks from both sides who don't seem to give a **** about the incident but just care about furthering their bull**** fight against each other.

Oh stop with the sanctimonious preaching. You were posting "point scoring bollocks" daily in the Paris incident thread:

Deleted User wrote: »

Isnt it mad that the people who oppose the unfettered influx of Islam are usually branded far right too?

When its beginning to look like it was a German national from a nearby village that caused the deaths, and not some "illegal muslim immigrant" you are suddenly asking for people to refrain themselves. :rolleyes:

01-12-2020 7:04pm

Deleted User wrote: »

That re-reg poster has had their posts deleted and a few other posts were deleted from the thread.

If that is the case, mea culpa, but I have not seen anything on this thread that comes close.

Das Reich · 01-12-2020 7:06pm

Deleted User wrote: »

There have been ten terror attacks in Germany in the last two years.

6 were right-wingers.
2 were Islamists.

Where you got those numbers from?

01-12-2020 7:12pm

McHardcore wrote: »

Oh stop with the sanctimonious preaching. You were posting "point scoring bollocks" daily in the Paris incident thread:

When its beginning to look like it was a German national from a nearby village that caused the deaths, and not some "illegal muslim immigrant" you are suddenly asking for people to refrain themselves. :rolleyes:

Sanctimonious preaching?

I never once said people should refrain. It's a horrible horrible incident regardless of what ethnicity, religion, sex or gender the perpetrator was. People can discuss however they see fit.

My point was simply, when someone says "oooh those right wingers are gonna be raging it's not a Muslim", they are just as bad as those who say "all those Muslim sympathisers will be out clutching their pearls". They both come across as dicks, especially when not seeming to care about or wanting to discuss the topic.

Also, that quote is not point scoring. It was saying that it's ridiculous that people who oppose illegal and unchecked immigration of people from Islamic countries (and any country I may add) are branded far right.

V8 Interceptor · 01-12-2020 7:13pm

.anon. wrote: »

The assumption isn't racist. The rush to post it is.

V8 Interceptor · 01-12-2020 7:23pm

Deleted User wrote: »

Rebuking someone who incites hatred is not point-scoring.

Deleted User wrote: »

Inciting hatred online carries a penalty of up to 2 years in prison in Germany.

These are the dangerous kinds of people that need to be kept out of power in this Country. They're the type who are behind the so-called hate speech laws they're trying to foist upon us.

A dedicated Irish thought-Gestapo is their wet dream.

thomil · 01-12-2020 7:26pm

Das Reich wrote: »

Where you got those numbers from?

I can name three right wing attacks off the top of my head.

June 2nd, 2019 - Assassination of Walter Lübke, former president of the government district of Kassel. Assassinated by an attacker with close ties to the neo-nazi NPD party and a British Neo-nazi terrorist group.

October 9th, 2019 - An attempted terrorist attack on the synagogue in Halle in Eastern Germany results in two fatalities and numerous casualties. The attacker had laid out his „manifesto“ online before the attack and had attempted to enter the synagogue to kill worshippers who had gathered on occasion of the Yom Kippur holiday.

February 19th, 2020 - An attacker kills ten people at multiple locations in the city of Hanau, including his own mother, before committing suicide. The attacker had laid out his motivations for the attack in both a recorded video and a pamphlet.

Those are just the ones I remember. I‘ll have to dig a little deeper, but given the rise of neo-fascist movements in Germany over the last couple of years, as well as the events earlier this fall when right-wing agitators tried to storm the German parliament, I‘d say that the number of far right attacks as such is probably even higher than that.

mcmoustache · 01-12-2020 7:36pm

Deleted User wrote: »

There have been ten terror attacks in Germany in the last two years.

6 were right-wingers.
2 were Islamists.

According to Wikipedia, if you count all terror attacks in Germany, there were:

10 Attacks

2 were lefties
6 were right-wingers
2 were islamists

Just adding sourcing to your comment as it was being questioned later in the thread. Some people find it difficult to believe that Germany could have a right-winger problem.

Beasty · 01-12-2020 7:36pm

Thread title amended - nothing at this stage to indicate it was a terror attack

.anon. · 01-12-2020 8:14pm

Deleted User wrote: »

In much the same way some people will revel in the fact that it's not a Muslim

It's absolutely not the same. 'Revelling' is the wrong word, but I'll be happier or relieved if it turns out not to have been carried out by someone with a wider agenda - be that Islamic extremism, far-right extremism or whatever.

km991148 · 01-12-2020 8:22pm

biko wrote: »

Unfortunately there will be a real Islamist attack soon somewhere in Europe.
They will never stop.

There will be at some point.

Dies that mean every accident or attack should be treated as one?
Should we continue to Stoke the flames with generalisations about older religious types grooming terrorists or allude about the tanning of skin?

Gervais08 · 01-12-2020 8:25pm

km991148 wrote: »

There will be at some point.

Dies that mean every accident or attack should be treated as one?
Should we continue to Stoke the flames with generalisations about older religious types grooming terrorists or allude about the tanning of skin?

You say “at some point” like there haven’t been any! Ffs.

km991148 · 01-12-2020 8:35pm

Gervais08 wrote: »

You say “at some point” like there haven’t been any! Ffs.

Not really, I'm just agreeing that sure as sh!t there will be an Islamic terrorist attack. I don't know where you took it to mean that I am somehow pretending there wasn't one. I'm not looking for an argument here.. just challenging the acceptable level of xenophobia or religious discrimination.

Also why live in fear? Why keep the stereotypes going?

Any answer to what I asked?

01-12-2020 8:38pm

V8 Interceptor wrote: »

These are the dangerous kinds of people that need to be kept out of power in this Country. They're the type who are behind the so-called hate speech laws they're trying to foist upon us.

A dedicated Irish thought-Gestapo is their wet dream.

And a situation where people can incite hatred(as is an everyday occurrence around these parts) allowing them to insinuate themselves in to power by democratic means then exterminate 6 million people is the history we don't want to repeat.
Free speech is protected in the German Constitution of 1949 but certainly not as a carte blanche for hate speech, hetze.
https://www.gesetze-im-internet.de/gg/art_5.html

Your Nirvana would be some poor unfortunate's Hell. The Germans learnt a hard lesson that you haven't learnt but isn't it cool to be a liberal like yerself.

CalamariFritti · 01-12-2020 8:47pm

The driver of the car 'Bernd' had not been in his apartment in days but had stayed in the car. He had 1400 mg alcohol in his blood after arrest. So far nothing hints at a terror attack according to district state attorney. A psychiatric assessment will be made.

weisses · 01-12-2020 8:58pm

biko wrote: »

Considering vehicle rampages in Stockholm, Nice, Berlin, Barcelona, London Bridge and Westminster Bridge the last few years it's not a surprise that a Islamist is the go-to assumption, don't you think?

I am old enough to remember when it wasn't the go-to assumption.
That was 20 years ago...

Im old enough to have this thought in the back of my head but still save judgement for when facts are known.

weisses · 01-12-2020 8:59pm

biko wrote: »

Unfortunately there will be a real Islamist attack soon somewhere in Europe.
They will never stop.

You are correct

Just wait until they manage to go to a little Island and kill everyone on it ... That will be soooo bad

01-12-2020 9:26pm

Its the rinse and repeat

Incident?
Two factions form;
Those looking to make political hay and those hoping said hay won't be made at their expense.
Truth comes out; queue gloating by hay makers.

What ever about Germany, interesting stats for Europe 2019:

https://www.europarl.europa.eu/news/en/headlines/security/20180703STO07125/terrorism-in-the-eu-terror-attacks-deaths-and-arrests-in-2019

119 terrorist recorded (includes successful and those that failed or were foiled)

Of those:
21 are attributed to jihadist terrorism.
57 are attributed to ethno-nationalist and separatist
(56 of them in N.Ireland)
6 attributed to Far Right
26 attributed to Far Lett
9 single isdue/non specified.

But
Although they represent only a sixth of all attacks in the EU, jihadist terrorists were responsible for all 10 deaths and 26 out 27 people who got injured.

So you're terrorist in in Europe in 2019, most likely you were in Northern Irish, and not very good, but if you're were njured/killed in a 2019 terrorist incident, a jihad did it.

Right wing terrorists need to get those numbers up, left wing terrorists giving them a rinsing.

01-12-2020 10:25pm

CalamariFritti wrote: »

A psychiatric assessment will be made.

A clear cut example of how in some cases the death penalty should be enforced.

No excuses. No rehabilitation.

This prick deserves to die.

I see sheep · 01-12-2020 10:28pm

Gervais08 wrote: »

It’ll be a terror attack.
It’ll be a recently arrived Muslim refugee
People will make excuses

We know the pattern by now.

This aged well.

V8 Interceptor · 01-12-2020 10:44pm

km991148 wrote: »

There will be at some point. Dies that mean every accident or attack should be treated as one?
Should we continue to Stoke the flames with generalisations about older religious types grooming terrorists or allude about the tanning of skin?

At least that's an admittance (albeit somewhat timorous) that the importation of Islam into Europe has been a bad mistake (who'd have thunk it!).

V8 Interceptor · 01-12-2020 10:48pm

Deleted User wrote: »

And a situation where people can incite hatred(as is an everyday occurrence around these parts) allowing them to insinuate themselves in to power by democratic means then exterminate 6 million people is the history we don't want to repeat.
Free speech is protected in the German Constitution of 1949 but certainly not as a carte blanche for hate speech, hetze.
https://www.gesetze-im-internet.de/gg/art_5.html

Your Nirvana would be some poor unfortunate's Hell. The Germans learnt a hard lesson that you haven't learnt but isn't it cool to be a liberal like yerself.

Christ

Like I said you guys are dangerous, very dangerous.

km991148 · 01-12-2020 10:52pm

V8 Interceptor wrote: »

At least that's an admittance (albeit somewhat timorous) that the importation of Islam into Europe has been a bad mistake (who'd have thunk it!).

If that's what you take from that post - fair enough. Or do you mean another religion being 'imported' is too much due to people too keen to make ignorant comments and generalisations?

(If you actually want to know my views - all religion is nonsense tbh.

Islam appears to me no different to Catholicism not so long ago, but I have no direct experience of either - that's my view of an outsider looking in.

Out of the Muslims I have met tho - they seem a lot more caring than the Catholics* I have met - but we are talking about a sample size of half a dozen families or so. Probably getting away from the thread topic tho since its not about terrorism or religion.

*(practising, not the Irish wedding and funeral average)
)

Car ploughs through crowd in Germany

Comments