Ireland Team Talk XI: Team of nervoUS MOD warning Post 1

salmocab · 24-01-2020 5:50pm

Clegg wrote: »

If we're doing teams. Going for a pack that offers the most grunt but has footballing ability. Gone with Kelleher because I don't think Herring or Scannell are good enough to be test players and we may as well go with the young prospect. Was very tempted to go have Toner in the squad, but he's a starter only. He's an excellent ball player but we need to give the Henderson/Ryan pairing more of a chance to develop. Dillane is more impactful off the bench. Same story with POM. If he doesn't start then he isn't in the squad at all. And he's not playing well enough to merit a start. I'd go for Larmour at 15 but he's injured. However, if he recovers then slot him to 15 and Addison to the bench.

Healy
Kelleher
Furlong
Henderson
Ryan
Stander
VDF
Doris
Cooney
Sexton
Stockdale
Aki
Ringrose
Conway
Addison

Kilcoyne
Herring
Porter
Dillane
Deegan
Murray
Byrne
Henshaw

I’d say this is very close, I’d suspect Deegan ahead of Doris, don’t think Kelliher will start purely because he’s been out.

Shefwedfan · 24-01-2020 6:19pm

lawrencesummers wrote: »

Killer
Herring
Furlong
Toner
Ryan
POM
VDF
CJ
Murray
Sexton
Earls
Bundee
Henshaw
Conway
Larmer

If this is the line up I think a huge question mark will be put over Farrell without the ball even getting kicked

car_radio19834 · 24-01-2020 6:48pm

Has there even been any indication from Farrell on the style of rugby he's going to play?

He hasn't been a head coach for a long time and if it goes bad he won't get the chance again.

Think of it this way. You're Andy Farrell, part of Joe Schmidts boring style but you're seen as very successful.

Would you stick with what you know? Or risk more expansive and potentially embarrass yourself? Andy Farrell personally would jump at the chance to replicate the last 6 years even though world cups are disappointing.

I think it'll be the same old boring rugby and then against Italy and the likes we'll throw it around and people will claim he's doing great and playing more expansive despite us doing that under Joe anyways.

Neil3030 · 24-01-2020 7:13pm

I wonder how much of Farrell's decision process will be skewed by how well players fit his defensive system over everything else. It's fairly unavoidable that he might have some slight bias in this regard.

So wouldn't at all surprise me to see lads in the starting XV who aren't setting the world on fire in attack, set piece, etc.

24-01-2020 7:43pm

Neil3030 wrote: »

I wonder how much of Farrell's decision process will be skewed by how well players fit his defensive system over everything else. It's fairly unavoidable that he might have some slight bias in this regard.

So wouldn't at all surprise me to see lads in the starting XV who aren't setting the world on fire in attack, set piece, etc.

Our defence has been rubbish for 12 months so hopefully it's not what he's picking anyone on.

prawnsambo · 24-01-2020 7:52pm

Malakai Some Revolution wrote: »

Our defence has been rubbish for 12 months so hopefully it's not what he's picking anyone on.

It was excellent after he took over as defence coach though.

The Rape of Lucretia · 24-01-2020 8:01pm

car_radio19834 wrote: »

Has there even been any indication from Farrell on the style of rugby he's going to play?

Will surely have learned from Uncle Joe's mistake of reducing our use of the kick which brough him so much success, and showed England the way to success. He needs to prove himself as a head coach so will be going for wins rather than pandering to the masses with flashy but losing play style. Kick downfield from your own half. Kick chase as much as possible. Kick for the touchline if in the opposition half. Crossfield kicks as a main feature rather an a rogue variation. And pick you team to do that. Byrne could be more than a factor than people assume. Dave and Conway the prime targets.

Neil3030 · 24-01-2020 8:03pm

Malakai Some Revolution wrote: »

Our defence has been rubbish for 12 months so hopefully it's not what he's picking anyone on.

Well that speaks to a wider problem, i.e., that the specialist area of our new head coach is now either obsolete or couldn't be implemented.

stephen_n · 24-01-2020 8:24pm

Easterby is defence coach now.

lawrencesummers · 24-01-2020 8:57pm

daddy pig wrote: »

Why don't you stick O'Gara at 10 and Hayes at 3 when you're at it.

They retired a long time ago.

lawrencesummers · 24-01-2020 8:59pm

Shefwedfan wrote: »

If this is the line up I think a huge question mark will be put over Farrell without the ball even getting kicked

Bar one or two that is goiNg to be the team. The hardest part of Farrell’s job will be keeping the fans off his back if results or performances are not good. A lot of fans and the media will give him nowhere near the easy ride that joe got.

lawrencesummers · 24-01-2020 9:05pm

salmocab wrote: »

I’d say this is very close, I’d suspect Deegan ahead of Doris, don’t think Kelliher will start purely because he’s been out.

What planet are people on that they think the most consistent player that Ireland have had for the last 2 years is going to get dropped for a young fella with no international experience that has done well in a few handy league games. Bar injury CJ will be starting.

Take off the blue tinted glasses. Deegan or Doris will be doing well to make the bench.

Clegg · 24-01-2020 9:12pm

lawrencesummers wrote: »

What planet are people on that they think the most consistent player that Ireland have had for the last 2 years is going to get dropped for a young fella with no international experience that has done well in a few handy league games. Bar injury CJ will be starting.

Take off the blue tinted glasses. Deegan or Doris will be doing well to make the bench.

You actually can't read. Things are finally coming together.

Ryan has been better than Stander performance wise. So there's that too y'know.

Shefwedfan · 24-01-2020 9:38pm

lawrencesummers wrote: »

Bar one or two that is goiNg to be the team. The hardest part of Farrell’s job will be keeping the fans off his back if results or performances are not good. A lot of fans and the media will give him nowhere near the easy ride that joe got.

Since before the WC I have been saying we need to move CJ to 6.

You have Henshaw and Aki in centre? Ringrose has been incredible during and after the WC. I would swap out Henshaw in place of him

Healy has been in great form, yes I would have started Kilcoyne in WC but he is coming back from injury and he isn't bad to the preWC form. So Healy starts

Starting Murray? why? it is at home against Scotland. Apart from the Italy match this is one of the easiest. If Sexton is out then Murray starts with Byrne.

Majority of fans have said they will give time if he bring in players. Your team is just the WC team warmed up and he will get hammered. He needs to show transition. Unfortunately the likes of POM and Murray on current form do not deserve a start for ireland. Neither does Henshaw by the way in case I get accused of blue glasses

salmocab · 24-01-2020 9:41pm

lawrencesummers wrote: »

What planet are people on that they think the most consistent player that Ireland have had for the last 2 years is going to get dropped for a young fella with no international experience that has done well in a few handy league games. Bar injury CJ will be starting.

Take off the blue tinted glasses. Deegan or Doris will be doing well to make the bench.

I think you may want to have a read of my post and the one I quoted. Then you can take some deep breaths. You love accusing people of having blue tinted glasses but apparently your glasses are all smudged

24-01-2020 11:42pm

lawrencesummers wrote: »

What planet are people on that they think the most consistent player that Ireland have had for the last 2 years is going to get dropped for a young fella with no international experience that has done well in a few handy league games. Bar injury CJ will be starting.

Take off the blue tinted glasses. Deegan or Doris will be doing well to make the bench.

You have as many Munster players in your team as Leinster. Leinster are vastly better than Munster. And somehow you still are whinging about other people being biased.

Maybe tell us all about some made up stats again?

Edit, I didn't even notice you don't have Ringrose in your team. Dear me.

lawrencesummers · 25-01-2020 12:03am

Henshaw is a far better 13 than ringrust.

Burkie1203 · 25-01-2020 12:20am

shootermacg wrote: »

For my money, you need CJ in the team at six.

He's a leader on the field, constantly screaming encouragement and slapping backs. And his actions speak loud.

If he has a good pack around him with some decent ball carrying threats, you're probably going to see the best six in Irish rugby do his thing.

I remember when PoM was injured at Munster and CJ took over as captain, there was talk of renaming the MotM award the CJ Stander award, because he was literally MotM every game he played.

I'd also love to see him take the captains armband at Munster.

If leadership and arse slapping are reasons to pick a guy then sorry. He shouldn't be picked.

lawrencesummers · 25-01-2020 12:31am

Burkie1203 wrote: »

If leadership and arse slapping are reasons to pick a guy then sorry. He shouldn't be picked.

Not sure about the second one, but leadership is actually a good reason to pick someone.

Burkie1203 · 25-01-2020 12:37am

lawrencesummers wrote: »

Not sure about the second one, but leadership is actually a good reason to pick someone.

No. We are not short of players who provide leadership. All that leadership meant jacksh1t in RWC when we lost to Japan and got hosed by NZ.

thomond2006 · 25-01-2020 1:12am

daddy pig wrote: »

Why don't you stick O'Gara at 10 and Hayes at 3 when you're at it.

Are you suggesting that Hayes at 3 isn't a good idea?

Dubinusa · 25-01-2020 6:51am

lawrencesummers wrote: »

Henshaw is a far better 13 than ringrust.

Riiiight! Henshaw is not even close, except if you want to have a slower less skilled 13. Ringrose is the best 13 we have! It's not even close.

Shefwedfan · 25-01-2020 7:19am

thomond2006 wrote: »

Are you suggesting that Hayes at 3 isn't a good idea?

Hayes is always a good idea....

fitz · 25-01-2020 8:34am

lawrencesummers wrote: »

Henshaw is a far better 13 than ringrust.

giphy.gif?cid=19f5b51a14e526f8b5013a3972a527965e6d01c5e0408f66&rid=giphy.gif

Ringrose is the best 13 we have by a country mile, and probably the second best 13 the country has ever produced.

Buer · 25-01-2020 9:00am

thomond2006 wrote: »

Are you suggesting that Hayes at 3 isn't a good idea?

This...this... is going to be awkward.

lawrencesummers · 25-01-2020 10:10am

Burkie1203 wrote: »

No. We are not short of players who provide leadership. All that leadership meant jacksh1t in RWC when we lost to Japan and got hosed by NZ.

I witnessed a complete lack of leadership both on the sideline and the pitch against japan.

Clegg · 25-01-2020 10:33am

lawrencesummers wrote: »

I witnessed a complete lack of leadership both on the sideline and the pitch against japan.

Yep.

So let's try new players seeing as the incumbents failed. Which is entirely what you've been arguing against.

lawrencesummers · 25-01-2020 10:35am

Clegg wrote: »

Yep.

So let's try new players seeing as the incumbents failed. Which is entirely what you've been arguing against.

Fair point.
Start McCloskey at 12.

Clegg · 25-01-2020 10:52am

lawrencesummers wrote: »

Fair point.
Start McCloskey at 12.

He's been the best 12 this last year so great.

Then let's go to other positions that need refreshing. There are some where the incumbents are so much better than anyone else that they stay in situ. But Stander at 6 and Doris at 8 and Cooney at 9 would all be prudent choices.

lawrencesummers · 25-01-2020 10:57am

Clegg wrote: »

He's been the best 12 this last year so great.

Then let's go to other positions that need refreshing. There are some where the incumbents are so much better than anyone else that they stay in situ. But Stander at 6 and Doris at 8 and Cooney at 9 would all be prudent choices.

That wouldn’t be prudent, that would be risky.

mfceiling · 25-01-2020 11:40am

fitz wrote: »

Ringrose is the best 13 we have by a country mile, and probably the second best 13 the country has ever produced.

Darren Cave likes this post.

Clegg · 25-01-2020 12:06pm

I was always a fan of Cave. Excellent defender and could put his outside backs into space. But it's an unfortunate fact that he never had any pace whatsoever. I'll never forget a 34 year old BOD making an outside break against him in the 2012 European Cup Final and Cave struggling to make the recovery tackle. He was 25 at the time.

Ringrose can probably improve on his ability to out players into space. But in terms of all round ability he laps Cave.

25-01-2020 12:35pm

Anyone know when the team is set to be named? Thursday?

Kevski · 25-01-2020 12:40pm

Malakai Some Revolution wrote: »

Anyone know when the team is set to be named? Thursday?

Gerry Thornley was on Second Captains recently and mentioned that Farrell was going to name his teams on Tuesdays.

thebaz · 25-01-2020 12:41pm

lawrencesummers wrote: »

Killer
Herring
Furlong
Toner
Ryan
POM
VDF
CJ
Murray
Sexton
Earls
Bundee
Henshaw
Conway
Larmer

great team, but you left kleyn out, much better than ryan , and that VDf isnt up to much, ther has to be someone better than another blue tinted selection.

25-01-2020 12:42pm

Kevski wrote: »

Gerry Thornley was on Second Captains recently and mentioned that Farrell was going to name his teams on Tuesdays.

Nice and early, I like it.

lawrencesummers · 25-01-2020 12:45pm

thebaz wrote: »

great team, but you left kleyn out, much better than ryan , and that VDf isnt up to much, ther has to be someone better than another blue tinted selection.

Kleyn is injured

Clegg · 25-01-2020 1:07pm

He's also a bit rubbish.

thomond2006 · 25-01-2020 2:26pm

Buer wrote: »

This...this... is going to be awkward.

Now I mean it this time.

Shut up Buer.

jacothelad · 25-01-2020 2:28pm

thomond2006 wrote: »

Now I mean it this time.

Shut up Buer.

It's even worse. Apparently Hayes has given up pajamas and now uses a .....nightshirt.

thomond2006 · 25-01-2020 2:29pm

jacothelad wrote: »

It's even worse. Apparently Hayes has given up pajamas and now uses a .....nightshirt.

Don't make me tell you as well.

Clegg · 25-01-2020 8:33pm

The 42 have done another article ranking Ireland's potential starters. This time it's the centres. The things that stood out are Ringrose's incredible attacking stats and Ali's excellent work in defence.

Ringrose has made a stunning 20 clean line breaks so far this season, more than double the next best centre – Henshaw on nine. Ringrose has beaten 36 defenders in total, well clear of Henshaw and McCloskey on 25 each.

We have also seen Ringrose provide opportunities for others with two try assists and a further eight passes that resulted in team-mates making line breaks. In short, the Leinster 13 is on fire in attack.

Defensively, Ringrose is intelligent and makes good reads. An 81.7% tackle success rate doesn’t quite underline his defensive quality – some of his missed tackles prevent the opposition from getting into more dangerous positions – but there is definitely real scope for Ringrose to be a more dominant tackler. His reading of the game gets him into great positions in defence, where he can be more consistent in finishing the job.

Aki is an explosive athlete and his tackling is a strength, the Connacht man having a midfield-leading 91.2% tackle success so far this season, while also earning two turnovers in tackles.

The 29-year-old also offers a breakdown threat that none of the other centres aside from McCloskey can provide. Aki has won a whopping 10 jackal turnovers this season, more than any other player in Ireland’s squad. It’s a handy skill to have in midfield.

https://www.the42.ie/ireland-six-nations-centres-4977335-Jan2020/

prawnsambo · 25-01-2020 8:46pm

Clegg wrote: »

I was always a fan of Cave. Excellent defender and could put his outside backs into space. But it's an unfortunate fact that he never had any pace whatsoever. I'll never forget a 34 year old BOD making an outside break against him in the 2012 European Cup Final and Cave struggling to make the recovery tackle. He was 25 at the time.

Ringrose can probably improve on his ability to out players into space. But in terms of all round ability he laps Cave.

Is this a rugby trait or something else?

The Rape of Lucretia · 25-01-2020 10:35pm

prawnsambo wrote: »

Is this a rugby trait or something else?

Ringrose does a lot of behind the scenes work to help gay astronauts.

typhoony · 26-01-2020 10:54pm

Clegg wrote: »

The 42 have done another article ranking Ireland's potential starters. This time it's the centres. The things that stood out are Ringrose's incredible attacking stats and Ali's excellent work in defence.

Agreed, Ali's float like a butterfly stings like a bee defence for Ireland has been a big positive.

27-01-2020 1:26pm

Ireland (possible): J Larmour; A Conway, G Ringrose, R Henshaw, J Stockdale; J Sexton (capt), J Cooney; D Kilcoyne, R Kelleher, T Furlong; I Henderson, J Ryan; CJ Stander, J van der Flier, C Doris. Replacements: D Heffernan, C Healy, A Porter, U Dillane, P O’Mahony, C Murray, R Byrne, W Addison.

From the IT.

Clegg · 27-01-2020 1:29pm

While I don't agree with Kilcoyne starting as Healy is in brilliant form, that's generally a very progressive line up. POM would be a waste of a bench spot though. Offers no impact as a sub other than in the lineout and goes against the other bench spits where the potential impact is huge.

sydthebeat · 27-01-2020 1:37pm

Malakai Some Revolution wrote: »

From the IT.

i hope thats the team thats named

if its correct, its a real challenge for Kelleher... an in turn Henderson, if hes calling the line out.

Shefwedfan · 27-01-2020 1:38pm

Clegg wrote: »

While I don't agree with Kilcoyne starting as Healy is in brilliant form, that's generally a very progressive line up. POM would be a waste of a bench spot though. Offers no impact as a sub other than in the lineout and goes against the other bench spits where the potential impact is huge.

Healy won’t play every game so giving kilcoyne a start v Scotland makes sense. I think we should expect to win the game

I haven’t seen a huge amount of kilcoyne since the WC due to his injury but the bits I seen he was playing well.....

I don’t understand the POM on bench either, I suppose dropping him out of the entire match day squad would be a huge deal

sydthebeat · 27-01-2020 1:41pm

Theres just over a year between Healy and Killer, so i can see them sharing time pretty equally through the competition... but the incumbent will be whoever lines away in twickenham, assuming everyone is fit

Ireland Team Talk XI: Team of nervoUS MOD warning Post 1

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