Is anyone else starting to become a bit worried? mod note in first post

draiochtanois · 02-02-2018 3:40pm

This post has been deleted.

EagererBeaver · 02-02-2018 3:40pm

mrDerek wrote: »

I think it's a safe bet the market will go up from here so yeah I think it's a for sure call crypto isn't just gonna call it a day

One would hope but "safe bet" isn't a phrase to be used too often in these parts.

Pussyhands · 02-02-2018 3:43pm

Can someone explain how all coins can have a bump at exactly the same time?

makeorbrake · 02-02-2018 3:44pm

mrDerek wrote: »

I think it's a safe bet the market will go up from here so yeah I think it's a for sure call crypto isn't just gonna call it a day

I agree with you on Crypto not calling it a day - it's going to stick around and continue to morph and develop. However, that's detached from price speculation...and on the pricing side of things, there is no 'for sure'.

hots · 02-02-2018 3:47pm

Pussyhands wrote: »

Can someone explain how all coins can have a bump at exactly the same time?

Most often relationship to BTC.

EagererBeaver · 02-02-2018 3:47pm

Pussyhands wrote: »

Can someone explain how all coins can have a bump at exactly the same time?

Because they're all pretty much traded in a pair predominantly with BTC.

lawred2 · 02-02-2018 4:16pm

Tinder Surprise wrote: »

current Top 10 high caps :eek::eek:

still wouldn't stop me filling my boots with $.30c Cardanos if I had the disposal income to do so.

Cardano is vaporware for mugs

Tinder Surprise · 02-02-2018 4:30pm

lawred2 wrote: »

Cardano is vaporware for mugs

Well feck me they sure are pulling a lot of wool over a lot of mugs eyes of those peer-reviewed researchers in the world's foremost universities who are accrediting their work.

what a bizarre statement - think you need to refresh on Cardano and their roadmap.

Dades · 02-02-2018 4:35pm

Squozen wrote: »

Difference is that over time the stock market always recovers. Bubbles don't.

You obviously haven't tried to buy a house in Dublin or Apple shares recently!

lifeandtimes · 02-02-2018 4:44pm

Dades wrote: »

You obviously haven't tried to buy a house in Dublin or Apple shares recently!

Zing

lawred2 · 02-02-2018 4:58pm

Tinder Surprise wrote: »

Well feck me they sure are pulling a lot of wool over a lot of mugs eyes of those peer-reviewed researchers in the world's foremost universities who are accrediting their work.

what a bizarre statement - think you need to refresh on Cardano and their roadmap.

It's a whitepaper with no working products. It's easy to lash out a roadmap. But the positive sentiment behind it's price was largely driven by fomo and a sub dollar price.

I won't be investing anyway but best of luck with it all the same. Truly.

papu · 02-02-2018 5:02pm

Oh hay 9k
$

lifeandtimes · 02-02-2018 5:05pm

papu wrote: »

Oh hay 9k
$

Slowly on the rise again and a couple of coins in the green.

I don't think the worst is over but we are getting near the end of the crash (hopefully)

makeorbrake · 02-02-2018 5:20pm

lawred2 wrote: »

I won't be investing anyway but best of luck with it all the same. Truly.

Another Dragon out TinderSurprise...this isn't going well for you.

Tinder Surprise · 02-02-2018 5:25pm

makeorbrake wrote: »

Another Dragon out TinderSurprise...this isn't going well for you.

chakotha · 02-02-2018 5:40pm

Why did everything bounce massively at 12:50 today. While I was getting a roll. Wtf.

I sold my ETH at $'s 880 and 850 and bought back at 920 and 950. Lol.

papu · 02-02-2018 5:45pm

chakotha wrote: »

Why did everything bounce massively at 12:50 today. While I was getting a roll. Wtf.

I sold my ETH at $'s 880 and 850 and bought back at 920 and 950. Lol.

Folks in the US waking up and buying the dip?

Autochange · 02-02-2018 6:05pm

papu wrote: »

Folks in the US waking up and buying the dip?

Hopefully Zing Zao and his countrymen keep buying later tonight.

lifeandtimes · 02-02-2018 6:10pm

Autochange wrote: »

Hopefully Zing Zao and his countrymen keep buying later tonight.

Best way to stop the crash is to buy buy buy.

Sounds mad but if you want to stop your loss buy more and when everyone else does the value of your coins go up.

Come on lads collective effort here, tell are your Asian mates to keep buying on the morning and then we'll follow suit tomorrow and the yanks there after and we will all leave in blissful harmony.....in our lambos

Autochange · 02-02-2018 6:36pm

lifeandtimes wrote: »

Best way to stop the crash is to buy buy buy.

Sounds mad but if you want to stop your loss buy more and when everyone else does the value of your coins go up.

Come on lads collective effort here, tell are your Asian mates to keep buying on the morning and then we'll follow suit tomorrow and the yanks there after and we will all leave in blissful harmony.....in our lambos

I don't want a lambo. I want my ven to recover before the rebranding so I can sell ath before the inevitable dip. My loyalty is gone. Too many factors at play now

Sleeper12 · 02-02-2018 6:46pm

EagererBeaver wrote:

Forex traders don't use the currency either. They hold it, or they trade it.

I'm just visiting this thread. I'm not trying to sell anything. I'm just pointing out that it is the only unsupported currency in the world. It's the only purely speculative currency in the world.

Starting a thread saying that you might be worried about something totally speculative is only asking for idiots like me to comment.

Sleeper12 · 02-02-2018 6:48pm

lifeandtimes wrote:

Best way to stop the crash is to buy buy buy.

Pyramid sellers say the exact same thing

NIMAN · 02-02-2018 6:53pm

I just hope people haven't invested their life savings or entire livelihoods into these things.

lifeandtimes · 02-02-2018 7:09pm

Sleeper12 wrote: »

Pyramid sellers say the exact same thing

Ha, true.

Look everyone should have invested what in their mind had already been lost.

We will get through this, the market will improve and people will use this time as an educational event and this will help hone people's crypto trading strategies

dubrov · 02-02-2018 7:53pm

Sleeper12 wrote:

I'm just visiting this thread. I'm not trying to sell anything. I'm just pointing out that it is the only unsupported currency in the world. It's the only purely speculative currency in the world.

Most currencies are not supported by anything except belief

In saying that I doubt there is any currency as volatile as even the most stable crypto.

Sleeper12 · 02-02-2018 8:13pm

dubrov wrote:

Most currencies are not supported by anything except belief

Most currencies are backed up by collateral. If there is a run on a currency other currencies will back it up.

Im not knocking what it is. You take your chances and you might make a lot of money but it is purely speculative. It has no grounded value. That in itself is fine so long as you know that it's purely by chance

I get that they say that there is a finite amount of Bitcoin & that in itself might create value but then they create another currency & another. Without regulation someone can create a million different currencies. You can't put a value on that. It's speculation

Autochange · 02-02-2018 8:20pm

dubrov wrote: »

Most currencies are not supported by anything except belief

In saying that I doubt there is any currency as volatile as even the most stable crypto.

Are you knowledgeable in Vechain?

Anthracite · 02-02-2018 8:45pm

lifeandtimes wrote: »

Ha, true.

Look everyone should have invested what in their mind had already been lost.

We will get through this, the market will improve and people will use this time as an educational event and this will help hone people's crypto trading strategies

I beg to differ. Most currencies will die on their arses. The ultimate winner might be one of the thouands out there already, or one yet to be created. The only sure thing is that most currencies are going to zero in the medium term at best.

grindle · 02-02-2018 8:52pm

Sleeper12 wrote: »

Most currencies are backed up by collateral. If there is a run on a currency other currencies will back it up.

What's the US Dollar backed up by? Besides force.
Promises? That's the only collateral the US government offers.
"We promise this dollar will be a dollar tomorrow and a dollar in five years - please ignore inflation, interest rates and please don't question the derivative debt circlejerk we have going on."

Sleeper12 wrote: »

I'm not knocking what it is. You take your chances and you might make a lot of money but it is purely speculative. It has no grounded value. That in itself is fine so long as you know that it's purely by chance

Security. Implicit ownership. Inability to be forged or diluted.

Sleeper12 wrote: »

I get that they say that there is a finite amount of Bitcoin & that in itself might create value but then they create another currency & another. Without regulation someone can create a million different currencies. You can't put a value on that. It's speculation

They? Who are "they" and why would people entrust their money to those people?

If you want to create a shítcoin (or a million) with it's own blockchain your security, cryptography & general purpose software engineers are going to have to compete with the best in the world in order to maintain, update & innovate beyond the competition - but of course, hard work and teams of extremely talented developers solving cryptographic/algorithmic puzzles all day long in an effort to keep code as concise as it needs to be to get implemented while at the same time trying to figure out the economics or game theory behind every single idea presented in a testnet trial for one of their currencies has no inherent value. :rolleyes:
Unless the market could find some way to place a value on the effort... Some method of price discovery maybe. Exchanges could possibly be bui...oh. That's reality.

lifeandtimes · 02-02-2018 8:59pm

grindle wrote: »

What's the US Dollar backed up by? Besides force.
Promises? That's the only collateral the US government offers.
"We promise this dollar will be a dollar tomorrow and a dollar in five years - please ignore inflation, interest rates and please don't question the derivative debt circlejerk we have going on."

Security. Implicit ownership. Inability to be forged or diluted.

They? Who are "they" and why would people entrust their money to those people?

If you want to create a shítcoin (or a million) with it's own blockchain your security, cryptography & general purpose software engineers are going to have to compete with the best in the world in order to maintain, update & innovate beyond the competition - but of course, hard work and teams of extremely talented developers solving cryptographic/algorithmic puzzles all day long in an effort to keep code as concise as it needs to be to get implemented while at the same time trying to figure out the economics or game theory behind every single idea presented in a testnet trial for one of their currencies has no inherent value. :rolleyes:
Unless the market could find some way to place a value on the effort... Some method of price discovery maybe. Exchanges could possibly be bui...oh. That's reality.

"Meow, Saucer of milk,table grindle"

dubrov · 02-02-2018 9:10pm

lifeandtimes wrote:

"Meow, Saucer of milk,table grindle"

Information transferred = 0

grindle · 02-02-2018 9:13pm

dubrov wrote: »

Information transferred = 0

Somebody suggests that an asset has no inherent value, I point out it's value.

Apparently that's nothing, so what do you want?

Edit: nvm, you're probably just pointing out that I'm speaking to a wall.
I have a habit of that.

dubrov · 02-02-2018 9:28pm

grindle wrote:

Somebody suggests that an asset has no inherent value, I point out it's value.

grindle wrote:

Apparently that's nothing, so what do you want?

I agree on all your points.

Then you had to go and blow it

MayoSalmon · 02-02-2018 9:31pm

NIMAN wrote:

I just hope people haven't invested their life savings or entire livelihoods into these things.

Plenty fools about I'd say

grindle · 02-02-2018 9:31pm

dubrov wrote: »

I agree on all your points.

Then you had to go and blow it

I'm sorry. My knickers get fully twisted when a crash happens and the told-you-so brigade pop out with their pyramid fetishism and nothingness-backed arguments.

Yours in debt,

Some guy.

JohnnyFlash · 02-02-2018 11:01pm

When dogecoin has a market cap of 500 million then you know your dealing with a scam market.

makeorbrake · 03-02-2018 12:33am

I'm interested in principal in buying back in to crypto - but with a sane proportion of my savings this time (i.e. no more than 10%). However, I'm not sure I'd be comfortable doing so until the whole tether thing gets dealt with - once and for all. Is that situation likely to get forced at some point? I understand they can ignore the subpoena??

I might think in terms of spreading my crypto risk also. With that, I've never really gone there. I never felt that I knew enough about other coins (apart from the fact that the vast majority of them are pump n' dumps!) to go there. How do you research other coins? i.e. aside from the white paper and promotional blurb, is there any independent review of coins that you recommend as a starting point in researching them?...one that you put 'some' level of faith into?

worded · 03-02-2018 1:04am

Interested in people’s opinions to dabble or not at this late stage

grindle · 03-02-2018 1:20am

makeorbrake wrote: »

I'm not sure I'd be comfortable doing so until the whole tether thing gets dealt with - once and for all. Is that situation likely to get forced at some point?

Hopefully.

makeorbrake wrote: »

How do you research other coins? i.e. aside from the white paper and promotional blurb, is there any independent review of coins that you recommend as a starting point in researching them?...one that you put 'some' level of faith into?

Hmm... Not really any great independent reviewers - you're trusting somebody else's assessment of a situation, so you should be wary.

worded wrote: »

Interested in people’s opinions to dabble or not at this late stage

If you want to take the risk, there is never a bad time. Even when the market itself is peaking, if a good ICO is going on at the time with good prospects and an interesting use-case & it's aiming to push against whatever market it's born from and you feel confident in the names behind it or how it's being run - take whatever chance you think is reasonable.

chakotha wrote: »

Yes good question. At 12:50 and within 10 minutes a 10%ish hike across the board. 7:50 east coast time. So much buying power across the board.

Most bots and a large proportion of humans are trading with and against BTC or ETH's value as benchmarks. CMC reports and charts values in dollars, soooo...

Selik · 03-02-2018 1:30am

Sleeper12 wrote:

Too risky for me. Biggest risk I took washing buying BOI and AIB shares for a few cent & selling them for euros.

Really, what price did you buy at and what price did you sell at and was this before or after the reverse stock splits?

h0neybadger · 03-02-2018 1:41am

worded wrote: »

Interested in people’s opinions to dabble or not at this late stage

For the record, I’ve been around Crypto long enough at this stage, and seen this many times.
Granted maybe not to this scale.

A correction is always good. And needed. And following a large correction, there is always a climb.

It depends on what you’re after really.
If your expecting to turn a 20% gain, then sure. That would be quick.
If you want to turn 1k into 10k, it’ll take a lot longer.

Anthracite · 03-02-2018 9:08am

grindle wrote: »

If you want to take the risk, there is never a bad time. Even when the market itself is peaking, if a good ICO is going on at the time with good prospects and an interesting use-case & it's aiming to push against whatever market it's born from and you feel confident in the names behind it or how it's being run - take whatever chance you think is reasonable.

Again, I think we can all acknowledge that we are dealing with a bubble market at this stage. Is there some gold in their amidst all the dross? Possibly.

Do you like your odds of picking out one of the tiny proportion of coins with a future out of the thousands out there? And paying bubble prices for the privilege?

It's possible prices will go up from here, but there's no way I'd enter the market at this point. I sold a proportion of my coins to the extent that I'm gambling with free money, that's the only reason I'm still in - and I'm looking at the exit.

h0neybadger wrote: »

If you want to turn 1k into 10k, it’ll take a lot longer.

You probably didn't intend to mean it this way, but this suggests it's almost inevitable if you hold a coin long enough. I'd suggest turning 1k into 0k is at hundred times more likely.

grindle · 03-02-2018 11:08am

Anthracite wrote: »

Again, I think we can all acknowledge that we are dealing with a bubble market at this stage. Is there some gold in their amidst all the dross? Possibly.

Do you like your odds of picking out one of the tiny proportion of coins with a future out of the thousands out there? And paying bubble prices for the privilege?

It's possible prices will go up from here, but there's no way I'd enter the market at this point. I sold a proportion of my coins to the extent that I'm gambling with free money, that's the only reason I'm still in - and I'm looking at the exit.

The market as a whole is hugely overvalued, I'd say everybody gets that at this stage. There's certainly gold amidst the dross, even amongst those which are currently overvalued in comparison to their utility.
A long term view has to be taken, that's the point of speculation. A lot of people are making or have made crazy decisions through FOMO, chasing green candles and driving prices to insane levels - but not every project is overvalued & some haven't been affected by bubble pricing at all thanks to everybody ignoring the fundamentals of a project in favour of quick moons.
I prefer to hold my positions in good projects until they've hit my targets - I don't dump low and FOMO into whichever coin is being shilled to the hilt which seems to be the strategy of most - some get lucky, others get burnt.
If the price drops and I still see the project moving forward at a good pace I'll probably buy more and set lower sell targets for those cheaply bought tokens/coins.

I do quite like my odds of picking the right projects - it's not too hard to filter the crap from the whole market. Your perspective seems to be that all cryptos are created equal and have an equal chance of success? The stupidity of the market as a whole is what leads to bad projects becoming overvalued but that doesn't mean to say you have to buy into the bad projects. If you can see work being done on a project with a good USP rather than marketing fluff and pro-shilling going on you should consider that a great pick even if it drops 50% in a market that's up 50% in the same day. Buy more of it with some profit made from a coin that has exceeded your expectations - take advantage of other people's bad trading decisions.

I've got some heavy bags, multiple coins where the devs don't care about marketing at this stage at all because they're working on the project, then closer to launch the marketing starts (like any sane business) and those bets will probably (imo) pay off in time because they're actually being worked on and have a great use-case.

The fundamentals of a product still matter, even in this market. Will betting on fundamentals hypothetically make as much money in as short a time frame as vapourware going 10x-100x?
Probably not, but I prefer my odds of picking out a few good projects with decent returns rather than the roullette wheel of picking the random projects that get shilled to the moon (although sometimes the stars align and the good project gets it's day in the sun).
This idea in the crypto markets that everything has to 100x or that the only good projects are in the top 10 or 20 or 100 is absurd and contradictory to boot - the newer coins that go 10x or 100x came from a place much further down the list. Smarter people were buying at that stage.

lifeandtimes · 03-02-2018 11:43am

Anthracite wrote: »

Again, I think we can all acknowledge that we are dealing with a bubble market at this stage. Is there some gold in their amidst all the dross? Possibly.

Do you like your odds of picking out one of the tiny proportion of coins with a future out of the thousands out there? And paying bubble prices for the privilege?

It's possible prices will go up from here, but there's no way I'd enter the market at this point. I sold a proportion of my coins to the extent that I'm gambling with free money, that's the only reason I'm still in - and I'm looking at the exit.

You probably didn't intend to mean it this way, but this suggests it's almost inevitable if you hold a coin long enough. I'd suggest turning 1k into 0k is at hundred times more likely.

This is the type of FUD that effects people and makes them cash out and take a loss.

No I don't think we can agree with what you're saying

You say a tiny proportion will make it, how do you know that? Do you have a magic crystal ball?

Every coin that enters the market with a strong development team and is backed accordingly has the potential to make it big and it's easy for people to see which coins have the most potentional.

By your pessimistic comment everyone should just cash out and now and keave crypto forever.

Anthracite wrote: »

You probably didn't intend to mean it this way, but this suggests it's almost inevitable if you hold a coin long enough. I'd suggest turning 1k into 0k is at hundred times more likely.

With the right research and patience it can be done, the people who turn 1k into 0 are the ones who dont know what they are doing or took a gamble that didn't pay off

lifeandtimes · 03-02-2018 11:47am

grindle wrote: »

the newer coins that go 10x or 100x came from a place much further down the list. Smarter people were buying at that stage.

As a rule of thumb I kinda stay away from the top 150 and invest in the lower coins that I feel have potential. Low investment can return big gains if as you say "the stars align"

Anthracite · 03-02-2018 2:45pm

grindle wrote: »

I do quite like my odds of picking the right projects - it's not too hard to filter the crap from the whole market. Your perspective seems to be that all cryptos are created equal and have an equal chance of success? The stupidity of the market as a whole is what leads to bad projects becoming overvalued but that doesn't mean to say you have to buy into the bad projects. If you can see work being done on a project with a good USP rather than marketing fluff and pro-shilling going on you should consider that a great pick even if it drops 50% in a market that's up 50% in the same day. Buy more of it with some profit made from a coin that has exceeded your expectations - take advantage of other people's bad trading decisions.

I've got some heavy bags, multiple coins where the devs don't care about marketing at this stage at all because they're working on the project, then closer to launch the marketing starts (like any sane business) and those bets will probably (imo) pay off in time because they're actually being worked on and have a great use-case.

I don't mean to pull the 'old man investor' card here, but that genuinely sounds like something I could have written back in 2000/2001 when I was putting money into Parthus Technologies and Cable and Wireless during the tech bubble - one a solid company with good management and great technology, the other a hugely well-established company with a long history and a great future.

I lost a packet on both. Turns out I couldn't see the future as well as I thought.

Anthracite · 03-02-2018 2:50pm

lifeandtimes wrote: »

This is the type of FUD that effects people and makes them cash out and take a loss.

Applying the label 'FUD' to something you don't like does not constitute an argument.

Let's look at your position: hold whatever you have, and you will get rich. If you don't get rich, it's because you are stupid.

Again, I've heard all this before, with the tech bubble, with the property bubble, and there were countless bubbles before that I could only read about (I trust you have done some reading on finance?).

I'm sure you sincerely believe what you are saying, but sincerity does not guarantee results and does not put money in your bank account.

Can you at least reassure me that you have done some reading into the history of speculative bubbles, and perhaps point out why you feel as you state above that the cryptocurrency market is not a bubble?

lifeandtimes · 03-02-2018 3:49pm

Anthracite wrote: »

Applying the label 'FUD' to something you don't like does not constitute an argument.

Let's look at your position: hold whatever you have, and you will get rich. If you don't get rich, it's because you are stupid.

Again, I've heard all this before, with the tech bubble, with the property bubble, and there were countless bubbles before that I could only read about (I trust you have done some reading on finance?).

I'm sure you sincerely believe what you are saying, but sincerity does not guarantee results and does not put money in your bank account.

Can you at least reassure me that you have done some reading into the history of speculative bubbles, and perhaps point out why you feel as you state above that the cryptocurrency market is not a bubble?

You've been burned before, I understand that and it's made you very apprehensive to this market.

It's not my job to try and convince it's a good market and you should stay investing, that's up to you mate.

But as a young(ish) person myself I see crypto is the way the world is going, just like cards were adopted as a means of payment over cash and tapping your phone to pay has taken over, cryptos with the ease of access to them, simple usage and no fees involving a 3rd party everyone (in my opinion) will adopt to them like everyone has a mobile phone, coincidently your phone will hold your wallet so nobody has to worry about banks etc. Employers will just lodge crypto to employees wallets.

lifeandtimes · 03-02-2018 3:51pm

Anthracite wrote: »

why you feel as you state above that the cryptocurrency market is not a bubble?

Also I did not say that so please don't quote me as saying such

dubrov · 03-02-2018 4:03pm

lifeandtimes wrote:

But as a young(ish) person myself I see crypto is the way the world is going, just like cards were adopted as a means of payment over cash and tapping your phone to pay has taken over, cryptos with the ease of access to them, simple usage and no fees involving a 3rd party everyone (in my opinion) will adopt to them like everyone has a mobile phone, coincidently your phone will hold your wallet so nobody has to worry about banks etc. Employers will just lodge crypto to employees wallets.

That may all be true. That doesn't mean cryptos are a buy at the moment.

I'm pretty convinced this is a bubble but cryptos are here to stay

Is anyone else starting to become a bit worried? mod note in first post

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