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Navan Rail Line

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    #92
    roadmaster
    Registered Users Posts: 3,618 ✭✭✭roadmaster


    gibgodsman wrote: »
    Navan will never get a rail line, there is far too much money for the Government to make with the use of the tolls on the M3 and money they get from Bus Eireann. Its by far the largest town in Ireland without any sort of rail line and its a disgrace, it makes working in Dublin impossible or a completely different lifestyle.

    The problem with bus eireann is it takes an hour to get blanch from busarus in the evening


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    #93
    roadmaster
    Registered Users Posts: 3,618 ✭✭✭roadmaster


    Pete_Cavan wrote: »
    That is the Navan - Drogheda line which takes Tara Mines trains, it's not the same as extending from M3 Parkway as was suggested earlier.

    An problem with the tara trains is they are apparently not wanted on dublin port anymore so they might end up using trucks again to go to an alternative port so you could see the line close


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    #94
    Happy4all
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,089 ✭✭✭Happy4all


    At a business meeting a couple of years ago attended by local councilors it was stated that it would never happen because of costs and no viable profit from operating.

    So I've been resigned to that outcome for a while. Don't go getting your hopes up.


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    #95
    Victor
    Registered Users Posts: 78,282 ✭✭✭✭Victor


    Last Stop wrote: »
    So €65m to upgrade this line or roughly €220m for the Rolls Royce upgrade to Pace - Navan (could be done as single track for €130m).
    I've seen the Irish Rail documentation and their estimate around 2010 was about €450 million all-in for Dunboyne-Navan-Navan North. Single track (with passing loops and with space for double tracking) is only marginally cheaper than double track. It's the same clanance, same structures, same boundaries, same drainage, same stations, similar crossovers, similar signalling, just a saving on track.
    roadmaster wrote: »
    An problem with the tara trains is they are apparently not wanted on dublin port anymore so they might end up using trucks again to go to an alternative port so you could see the line close
    It's a planning condition for the mine that the lead ore goes by train.


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    #96
    AngryLips
    Registered Users Posts: 2,681 ✭✭✭AngryLips


    Couldn't a potential Navan line from Dunboyne join up with the Navan-Drogheda line and continue on to Drogheda?


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    #97
    L1011
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 67,845 Mod ✭✭✭✭L1011


    AngryLips wrote: »
    Couldn't a potential Navan line from Dunboyne join up with the Navan-Drogheda line and continue on to Drogheda?

    Well yes, but why?


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    #98
    Victor
    Registered Users Posts: 78,282 ✭✭✭✭Victor


    AngryLips wrote: »
    Couldn't a potential Navan line from Dunboyne join up with the Navan-Drogheda line and continue on to Drogheda?
    At what point would it join up with the Navan-Drogheda line? Do you mean something like between the two red lines here?

    498104.png

    Note my earlier suggestion (between the blue lines) that would at least allow a reasonably direct route from Dublin to both Navan and Drogheda and would take pressure off the Northern Line.

    The reality is that TII, Fingal County Council and Meath County Council have messed up a large part of the lives of 500,000 people on a profound level.


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    #99
    Last Stop
    Registered Users Posts: 920 ✭✭✭Last Stop


    Victor wrote: »
    I've seen the Irish Rail documentation and their estimate around 2010 was about €450 million all-in for Dunboyne-Navan-Navan North. Single track (with passing loops and with space for double tracking) is only marginally cheaper than double track. It's the same clanance, same structures, same boundaries, same drainage, same stations, similar crossovers, similar signalling, just a saving on track.

    You’re assuming that if they built single track that they would make future provision for double tracking on all lands and structures. That mightn’t be the case. Of course it would make sense to do so in terms of CPOing land but a number of structures could be widening if and when required at a future date. This would be particularly the case on the bridge over the Boyne where a single track could use the existing bridge but double track might require a new structure. That along would save millions!!

    It’s 30km from Pace to Navan. With 3 new stations there would be roughly 10km between then which would mean that passing loops wouldn’t be require between stations.


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    #100
    Last Stop
    Registered Users Posts: 920 ✭✭✭Last Stop


    Victor wrote: »
    At what point would it join up with the Navan-Drogheda line? Do you mean something like between the two red lines here?

    Note my earlier suggestion (between the blue lines) that would at least allow a reasonably direct route from Dublin to both Navan and Drogheda and would take pressure off the Northern Line.

    The blue route is certainly not a direct route to either Navan or Drogheda. The blue route also required tunnelling from Broomsbridge to the M50 which make the costs astronomical.

    Surely it would more sense to run via the old line to Navan and then join the Navan - Drogheda line. This would offer commuters 2 options taking the pressure off the northern line? Not the most direct connect but if you were commuting from say Drogheda to Maynooth it would make much more sense.

    The reality is that TII, Fingal County Council and Meath County Council have messed up a large part of the lives of 500,000 people on a profound level.

    How do you come to that conclusion??
    1) the numbers served by the Navan line would be less than 100,000 not half a million!
    2) why are any of the organisations to blame? People chose to live there knew about the lack of a railway when they moved.
    3) the journey time savings between bus and rail (based on timetables) is quite small. Therefore if you are currently taking the bus it would change too much. If you’re currently taking the car you could take the bus or park and ride from Pace. The benefits are not profound so the lack of a railway line is not having the impact you suggest.


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    #101
    CrabRevolution
    Registered Users Posts: 2,809 ✭✭✭CrabRevolution


    gibgodsman wrote: »
    Navan will never get a rail line, there is far too much money for the Government to make with the use of the tolls on the M3 and money they get from Bus Eireann. Its by far the largest town in Ireland without any sort of rail line and its a disgrace, it makes working in Dublin impossible or a completely different lifestyle.


    I'd support an M3-Navan rail line but find this argument a bit ridiculous and not really a justification for the line. There's always going to be some largest town unconnected to the rail network. Building the M3-Navan line would just mean somewhere like Letterkenny or Cavan will be the largest town without a rail line.


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    #102
    CatInABox
    Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 10,255 Mod ✭✭✭✭CatInABox


    CrabRevolution wrote: »
    I'd support an M3-Navan rail line but find this argument a bit ridiculous and not really a justification for the line. There's always going to be some largest town unconnected to the rail network. Building the M3-Navan line would just mean somewhere like Letterkenny or Cavan will be the largest town without a rail line.

    It's not even accurate, Swords is the largest town without a rail line, hence the plan for Metrolink. Navan should get a rail line too though, and it should be comparatively easy compared to a brand new alignment.


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    #103
    Lord Glentoran
    Closed Accounts Posts: 876 ✭✭✭Lord Glentoran


    CrabRevolution wrote: »
    I'd support an M3-Navan rail line but find this argument a bit ridiculous and not really a justification for the line. There's always going to be some largest town unconnected to the rail network. Building the M3-Navan line would just mean somewhere like Letterkenny or Cavan will be the largest town without a rail line.


    Oh Christ the squeaking there would be on boards if Letterkenny or even Cavan was seriously suggested for rail connections


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    #104
    Marcusm
    Registered Users Posts: 10,217 ✭✭✭✭Marcusm


    Lord Glentoran wrote: »
    Oh Christ the squeaking there would be on boards if Letterkenny or even Cavan was seriously suggested for rail connections

    Maybe a Letterkenny-Cavan-Ballybrophy line?


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    #105
    Lord Glentoran
    Closed Accounts Posts: 876 ✭✭✭Lord Glentoran


    Marcusm wrote: »
    Maybe a Letterkenny-Cavan-Ballybrophy line?

    The campaign starts here!!!


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    #106
    Carawaystick
    Registered Users Posts: 8,779 ✭✭✭Carawaystick


    gibgodsman wrote: »
    Navan will never get a rail line, there is far too much money for the Government to make with the use of the tolls on the M3 and money they get from Bus Eireann. Its by far the largest town in Ireland without any sort of rail line and its a disgrace, it makes working in Dublin impossible or a completely different lifestyle.

    Navan has a working rail line, connecting the mine to Dublin Port...
    Lots of people working in Dublin, live in Navan, so it's not impossible.

    Swords, Dunshauglin, Ashbourne, Rathoth, Naas, are nearer to Dublin and have no rail line to Dublin.


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    #107
    AngryLips
    Registered Users Posts: 2,681 ✭✭✭AngryLips


    Carawaystick wrote: »
    Navan has a working rail line, connecting the mine to Dublin Port...
    Lots of people working in Dublin, live in Navan, so it's not impossible.

    Swords, Dunshauglin, Ashbourne, Rathoth, Naas, are nearer to Dublin and have no rail line to Dublin.


    Last I checked, Naas was served by the Dublin-Cork line.


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    #108
    veryangryman
    Registered Users Posts: 5,541 ✭✭✭veryangryman


    AngryLips wrote: »
    Last I checked, Naas was served by the Dublin-Cork line.

    Sallins aint Naas


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    #109
    loyatemu
    Registered Users Posts: 14,790 ✭✭✭✭loyatemu


    veryangryman wrote: »
    Sallins aint Naas

    Sallins and Naas


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    #110
    ncounties
    Registered Users Posts: 270 ✭✭ncounties


    loyatemu wrote: »
    Sallins and Naas

    Sallins Railway Station is located 3km from Naas Town Centre. On that logic, why don't we rename Harcourt Luas Stop, Harcourt and East Wall Luas Stop? Then it could be my local Luas Stop.


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    #111
    MayoSalmon
    Registered Users Posts: 2,240 ✭✭✭MayoSalmon


    ncounties wrote: »
    Sallins Railway Station is located 3km from Naas Town Centre. On that logic, why don't we rename Harcourt Luas Stop, Harcourt and East Wall Luas Stop? Then it could be my local Luas Stop.

    Celbridge Station is 2.4km away from the town center


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    #112
    ncounties
    Registered Users Posts: 270 ✭✭ncounties


    MayoSalmon wrote: »
    Celbridge Station is 2.4km away from the town center

    Don't you mean "Hazelhatch and Celbridge Station" - another joke of a name. I'm sure it's nonsense like this that led to airports like "Paris" Beauvais.


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    #113
    MayoSalmon
    Registered Users Posts: 2,240 ✭✭✭MayoSalmon


    ncounties wrote: »
    Don't you mean "Hazelhatch and Celbridge Station" - another joke of a name. I'm sure it's nonsense like this that led to airports like "Paris" Beauvais.

    "London" Southend is worse:pac::pac:


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    #114
    Zebra3
    Registered Users Posts: 13,856 ✭✭✭✭Zebra3


    MayoSalmon wrote: »
    "London" Southend is worse:pac::pac:

    What about "London" Derry airport?

    Even landing on a different island!!!


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    #115
    AngryLips
    Registered Users Posts: 2,681 ✭✭✭AngryLips


    There loads of towns with a train service that doesn't bring you to the centre of town, that doesn't mean those towns are not in the catchment area of the station. Saying that Sallins doesn't serve Naas is ridiculous.


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    #116
    LXFlyer
    Registered Users Posts: 17,559 ✭✭✭✭LXFlyer


    ncounties wrote: »
    Sallins Railway Station is located 3km from Naas Town Centre. On that logic, why don't we rename Harcourt Luas Stop, Harcourt and East Wall Luas Stop? Then it could be my local Luas Stop.
    ncounties wrote: »
    Don't you mean "Hazelhatch and Celbridge Station" - another joke of a name. I'm sure it's nonsense like this that led to airports like "Paris" Beauvais.

    What a lot of bunkum.

    Those two stations’ principal catchment areas are the second towns in the station names.

    It’s perfectly acceptable to name them as such.


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    #117
    Lord Glentoran
    Closed Accounts Posts: 876 ✭✭✭Lord Glentoran


    LXFlyer wrote: »
    What a lot of bunkum.

    Those two stations’ principal catchment areas are the second towns in the station names.

    It’s perfectly acceptable to name them as such.

    Indeed. It must have been my pure imagination that I used Hazelhatch and Celbridge as my Station for the twenty years I lived in Celbridge. Whenever I read nonsense like that about Sallins and the Hatch, I reckon that Boards.ie should be renamed dicks.ie


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    #118
    Carawaystick
    Registered Users Posts: 8,779 ✭✭✭Carawaystick


    Lord Glentoran wrote: »
    Indeed. It must have been my pure imagination that I used Hazelhatch and Celbridge as my Station for the twenty years I lived in Celbridge. Whenever I read nonsense like that about Sallins and the Hatch, I reckon that Boards.ie should be renamed dicks.ie

    Parts of Celbridge are closer to Louisa Bridge station, than Hazelhatch.


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    #119
    Zebra3
    Registered Users Posts: 13,856 ✭✭✭✭Zebra3


    Celbridge is now built up very close to Hazelhatch & Celbridge station.


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    #120
    roadmaster
    Registered Users Posts: 3,618 ✭✭✭roadmaster


    I am not sure if this has been posted before but there appears to be a group called Meath on track in place who are holding a public meeting at the end of the month in January . There link to the Facebook page is below, the only thing is looking through it seams to be more a political party running it then just the average joe soap.

    https://m.facebook.com/MeathOnTrack/


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    #121
    IE 222
    Registered Users Posts: 1,670 ✭✭✭IE 222


    Is the Drogheda route apart of this review at all. That line is in fairly good condition and wouldn't require too much investment to bring it up to a better standard. The savings could be used to upgrade the Northern line with passing loops and some quad tracking. The low speed limit on it is just to save on the maintenance. As far as I know the most part of it is ex cwr from the cork line. A journey time of 60mins should be achievable. It doesn't need to run all stops between Dublin and Drogheada.


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