Formula 1 2020 - General Discussion Thread (See MOD warning on first post)

Man with broke phone · 15-11-2020 11:35pm

astrofluff wrote: »

Wouldn't it be gas of Merc signed Checo up for next year to replace Lewis who is out of contract.

Big Toto was hugging Checo and Lewis on the podium like they were his crew, Vettel was very left out.

LollipopJimmy · 15-11-2020 11:41pm

vectra wrote: »

lucky the rain held off as his tyres would have destroyed his race if it poured down in the last lap or two.

Getting that car with those tyres on it to the end had nothing to do with luck.

Rain is always the great leveller and we see the cream rise to the top in terms of driving ability. Seb turned the clock back a few years today, his best drive in a long time, Perez was fantastic and Stroll showed that he doesnt belong in an F1 car, that car is clearly capable and whole stroll can be quick hes just too inconsistent.

16-11-2020 12:09am

Meant to say a few days ago that I think Perez's problem is that he's a bit of a dick and he's not top-level enough for that to be a positive. Watching random highlights here and there and he wouldn't let a team mate past in Canada to attack someone else but would have gotten the place back. There's been a few other ones as well. And just now saw Spa 2017 where he twice basically put Ocon in the wall on the run to Eau Rouge. Everyone lost their **** like a murder had been committed when Scuhmacher left Barrichello more space.

SMC92Ian · 16-11-2020 1:27am

Man the rubbish towards Lewis in these comments must be from 13 year old haters. He proved today it's more than "just the car" so cop on. I'm not even a fan of his but he does a lot for the sport and people.

vectra · 16-11-2020 2:37am

Harika wrote: »

Tyres were a little worse than his competition but he had time in hand to swap for new tyres if he needed to

Are you serious?
Do you know how old Lewis's tyres were compared to those behind him?

LollipopJimmy wrote: »

Getting that car with those tyres on it to the end had nothing to do with luck.

Rain is always the great leveller and we see the cream rise to the top in terms of driving ability. Seb turned the clock back a few years today, his best drive in a long time, Perez was fantastic and Stroll showed that he doesnt belong in an F1 car, that car is clearly capable and whole stroll can be quick hes just too inconsistent.

Literally not true as those tyres turn into slicks when they wear down below the threaded stuff.
So yes, a shower of rain would nailed him.
Still though. He won and that's what matters.

Was delighted the way Seb drove today.
I would have loved to see where he would be had he been driving Lance's car.

GarIT · 16-11-2020 4:02am

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Meant to say a few days ago that I think Perez's problem is that he's a bit of a dick and he's not top-level enough for that to be a positive. Watching random highlights here and there and he wouldn't let a team mate past in Canada to attack someone else but would have gotten the place back. There's been a few other ones as well. And just now saw Spa 2017 where he twice basically put Ocon in the wall on the run to Eau Rouge. Everyone lost their **** like a murder had been committed when Scuhmacher left Barrichello more space.

Didn't he deliberately ram into Sirotkin too or was that another driver? Hulk could be a better number 2 for RBR.

Man with broke phone · 16-11-2020 8:51am

GarIT wrote: »

Didn't he deliberately ram into Sirotkin too or was that another driver? Hulk could be a better number 2 for RBR.

The myth of Hulkenberg again.

pjohnson · 16-11-2020 9:11am

GarIT wrote: »

Didn't he deliberately ram into Sirotkin too or was that another driver? Hulk could be a better number 2 for RBR.

In Singapore he couldn't get past Sirotkin so he drove into him which damaged his car.

LollipopJimmy · 16-11-2020 9:34am

vectra wrote: »

Are you serious?
Do you know how old Lewis's tyres were compared to those behind him?

Literally not true as those tyres turn into slicks when they wear down below the threaded stuff.
So yes, a shower of rain would nailed him.
Still though. He won and that's what matters.

Was delighted the way Seb drove today.
I would have loved to see where he would be had he been driving Lance's car.

Literally true.

When they wear beyond the thread they become near impossible to keep temp in. He one stopped, the others had to stop again because they were sliding around the place. And rain at the end would have ruined his race but he made to decision not to stop again and judged ot by looking at the clouds. Thats not luck

El_Duderino 09 · 16-11-2020 9:42am

LollipopJimmy wrote: »

Getting that car with those tyres on it to the end had nothing to do with luck.

Rain is always the great leveller and we see the cream rise to the top in terms of driving ability. Seb turned the clock back a few years today, his best drive in a long time, Perez was fantastic and Stroll showed that he doesnt belong in an F1 car, that car is clearly capable and whole stroll can be quick hes just too inconsistent.

How can you make the argument that the rain is a great leveller based on this weekend’s results? Is Stroll the best driver over one lap? Are both Alfas in the top 10 fastest?

Out of the race finishers, is it just coincidence that the majority of teammates finished next to each other or do you think it’s the car? 14 teammates finished and 8of them finished next to each other.

At the front was a Mercedes and at the back were Russell and Kimi in the worst cars.

Stroll was doing great until the last set of tyres which he couldn’t heat up. Was he cream in the first half and not cream in the second half? Max had a poor race. Is he not amongst the cream of the crop?

I think it’s much easier to just say the rain is a leveller than to form an argument based on this weekend’s quali and race. The cars were the most influential factor again and tgh best car seemed to change as the race progressed and the track dried. On the wetter track the RPs looked the best. On the dryer track their advantage was diminished.

It was an extraordinary set of conditions which none of the cars were specifically build to deal with. There was some randomness around which car was most suited to conditions as the conditions changed.

ZiabR · 16-11-2020 9:45am

Great race, rain gave us some of the most exciting racing this season. I am a Red Bull man and I really think Verstappen is something special but again, an unforced error on his part cost him the podium. His youth is still his biggest enemy. He was getting so impatient behind Checo that he made the mistake of being too close in a high speed corner.

He seems to have made a few mistakes this year. He looked amazing in Practice but again it didn't translate in the race. If he just took his time I am sure he would have finished 2nd or maybe even won? As for Albon, I thought it was one of his stronger drives, he completed some decent overtaking and the team leaving him out on Slick Inters caused the spin. I still think Red Bull need to grow some balls and make the change the team need. They need a proper number 2 so that they can gather the points to challenge for the constructors next year. Surely signing Checo for 2 years is the right call at this stage.

Still makes me laugh when I see Lance keeping his seat over Checo because Daddy owns the team... Its such a bad thing for the sport. Checo is by far the better driver. Keeping weaker drivers for the wrong reasons... but F1 will never learn.

As for Hamilton, he drove an immense race. I don't particularly like him outside of the sport but what he does on the track still has me in awe. The experience to just play the race safe, not taking any unnecessary chances and let the race come to him. He deserves his 7th title and now holds just about every record there is in F1. I see him signing with Merc for another 2 seasons.

Other drivers that stood out for me, Vettel. Drove an amazing race and it was like watching the Vettel of old. Delighted to see him on the podium and thought it was a really nice touch to see him at Hamilton's car for a few minutes congratulating him. Great maturity and professionalism. Leclerc drove a very strong race aswell.

cadaliac · 16-11-2020 10:14am

ZiabR wrote: »

Great race, rain gave us some of the most exciting racing this season. I am a Red Bull man and I really think Verstappen is something special but again, an unforced error on his part cost him the podium. His youth is still his biggest enemy. He was getting so impatient behind Checo that he made the mistake of being too close in a high speed corner.

He seems to have made a few mistakes this year. He looked amazing in Practice but again it didn't translate in the race. If he just took his time I am sure he would have finished 2nd or maybe even won? As for Albon, I thought it was one of his stronger drives, he completed some decent overtaking and the team leaving him out on Slick Inters caused the spin. I still think Red Bull need to grow some balls and make the change the team need. They need a proper number 2 so that they can gather the points to challenge for the constructors next year. Surely signing Checo for 2 years is the right call at this stage.

Still makes me laugh when I see Lance keeping his seat over Checo because Daddy owns the team... Its such a bad thing for the sport. Checo is by far the better driver. Keeping weaker drivers for the wrong reasons... but F1 will never learn.

As for Hamilton, he drove an immense race. I don't particularly like him outside of the sport but what he does on the track still has me in awe. The experience to just play the race safe, not taking any unnecessary chances and let the race come to him. He deserves his 7th title and now holds just about every record there is in F1. I see him signing with Merc for another 2 seasons.

Other drivers that stood out for me, Vettel. Drove an amazing race and it was like watching the Vettel of old. Delighted to see him on the podium and thought it was a really nice touch to see him at Hamilton's car for a few minutes congratulating him. Great maturity and professionalism. Leclerc drove a very strong race aswell.

Agree and have to echo your Hamilton point. While I too wouldn't be his biggest fan (off track) - credit where credit is due.
He drove and waited for the track conditions to change, took no unnecessary risks and showed why he is a champion again. His on track - in race decision making is unrivaled.
I really wanted to be happy for him but ended up turning off the channel when he started the single fist in the air bullsh1t and I just couldn't be listening to him.
I really hope the Merc's aren't as dominant next year and Ferrari get it together. LeClerc and Max will hopefully be a lot closer. Well, here's hoping.

ZiabR · 16-11-2020 10:44am

cadaliac wrote: »

Agree and have to echo your Hamilton point. While I too wouldn't be his biggest fan (off track) - credit where credit is due.
He drove and waited for the track conditions to change, took no unnecessary risks and showed why he is a champion again. His on track - in race decision making is unrivaled.
I really wanted to be happy for him but ended up turning off the channel when he started the single fist in the air bullsh1t and I just couldn't be listening to him.
I really hope the Merc's aren't as dominant next year and Ferrari get it together. LeClerc and Max will hopefully be a lot closer. Well, here's hoping.

We know Ferrari and Honda have new engines for next year so lets hope they can push Merc.

El_Duderino 09 · 16-11-2020 10:49am

cadaliac wrote: »

Agree and have to echo your Hamilton point. While I too wouldn't be his biggest fan (off track) - credit where credit is due.
He drove and waited for the track conditions to change, took no unnecessary risks and showed why he is a champion again. His on track - in race decision making is unrivaled.
I really wanted to be happy for him but ended up turning off the channel when he started the single fist in the air bullsh1t and I just couldn't be listening to him.
I really hope the Merc's aren't as dominant next year and Ferrari get it together. LeClerc and Max will hopefully be a lot closer. Well, here's hoping.

Yeah I’d agree with that. I don’t like Hamilton but he’s an excellent driver.

Best we can hope for next year is the battle for second being closer. A battle between max, LeClerc, Bottas and Ric would be good to watch. Bottas is an excellent qualifier though, so I’d expect him to start in front of the challengers the majority of the time.

But we’re really just biding our time until the 2022 regulation changes.

Joeface · 16-11-2020 1:49pm

After a dismal season with a crap car , All of a sudden Ferrari could still end up third in the Constructors .

now its out side chance , But if they can secure 4th and 6th place for the last 3 races that would grab 60 constructors points leaving them on 190 for the season . Its asking a lot , more a lot of Vettel to turn up in full ( a bit like yesterday where he was I think one of 2 drivers not to go off the track at any point ) . I do think Charles could pull off the 4th places as he is better in the current Ferrari .

what a difference on set of race results make , Before yesterday they were in danger of been over taken by Alpha Tauri , now on the heals of Renault and Mclaren with an outside of Racing point .

AMKC · 16-11-2020 4:01pm

So what is the next race then? It's in two weeks time I take it.

Jordan 199 · 16-11-2020 4:05pm

AMKC wrote: »

So what is the next race then? It's in two weeks time I take it.

Bahrain in two weeks time. Two back to back races there this year.

LollipopJimmy · 16-11-2020 4:12pm

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

How can you make the argument that the rain is a great leveller based on this weekend’s results? Is Stroll the best driver over one lap? Are both Alfas in the top 10 fastest?

Out of the race finishers, is it just coincidence that the majority of teammates finished next to each other or do you think it’s the car? 14 teammates finished and 8of them finished next to each other.

At the front was a Mercedes and at the back were Russell and Kimi in the worst cars.

Stroll was doing great until the last set of tyres which he couldn’t heat up. Was he cream in the first half and not cream in the second half? Max had a poor race. Is he not amongst the cream of the crop?

I think it’s much easier to just say the rain is a leveller than to form an argument based on this weekend’s quali and race. The cars were the most influential factor again and tgh best car seemed to change as the race progressed and the track dried. On the wetter track the RPs looked the best. On the dryer track their advantage was diminished.

It was an extraordinary set of conditions which none of the cars were specifically build to deal with. There was some randomness around which car was most suited to conditions as the conditions changed.

I was referring to the race, in changeable conditions qualifying isnt an equal playing field, it depends when on track and how dry it is, minutes can make a huge difference whereas in a race they're all out at the same time.

Hamilton, cruised his way through with little drama, couple of wide entries and exits but calm and in control.

Lance fell down the field, managing tyres is part of being a driver and he simply couldn't do it and then lost his cool. Dropping from 1st to finish just inside the points is laughable.

Max's biggest weakness was shown up and magnified, his impatience cost him big time. He finished 6th, I would have said that the top 6 yesterday are (in no particular order) are arguably the best 6 drivers on the grid.

Maybe Danny Ric could edge one of them out

The two Ferrari drivers are known to be top drivers but in substandard machinery and finished higher than they have all season.

I'm on my phone and the screen is cracked apologies for typos

El_Duderino 09 · 16-11-2020 4:28pm

LollipopJimmy wrote: »

I was referring to the race, in changeable conditions qualifying isnt an equal playing field, it depends when on track and how dry it is, minutes can make a huge difference whereas in a race they're all out at the same time.

Hamilton, cruised his way through with little drama, couple of wide entries and exits but calm and in control.

Lance fell down the field, managing tyres is part of being a driver and he simply couldn't do it and then lost his cool. Dropping from 1st to finish just inside the points is laughable.

Max's biggest weakness was shown up and magnified, his impatience cost him big time. He finished 6th, I would have said that the top 6 yesterday are (in no particular order) are arguably the best 6 drivers on the grid.

Maybe Danny Ric could edge one of them out

The two Ferrari drivers are known to be top drivers but in substandard machinery and finished higher than they have all season.

I'm on my phone and the screen is cracked apologies for typos

How do you explain the majority of teammates qualifying close and finishing the race next to each other if not because of the car's suitability to the extraordinary conditions?

Also, Lance had a very mixed day. On the full wets he was easily the fastest of all and Perez was second or third fastest. As the track dried, the advantage moved away from them both and towards Hamilton. That suggest the car and conditions are the biggest factors to me.

I think driver skill is always important and not making a balls of it in the rain is key (Bottas vs Hamilton), but i think it's very hard to explain the RPs being at the front and Vettel being suddenly as fast as Leclerc, without concluding that the cars were a huge factor and probably the biggest factor.

Man with broke phone · 16-11-2020 4:36pm

Perez was slowly catching Stroll. He was taking a couple of hundreths a second out of him until Stroll fell off a cliff as far as I remember. Then Perez had a 4.7(iirc) pit stop.

El_Duderino 09 · 16-11-2020 4:57pm

Man with broke phone wrote: »

Perez was slowly catching Stroll. He was taking a couple of hundreths a second out of him until Stroll fell off a cliff as far as I remember. Then Perez had a 4.7(iirc) pit stop.

Ok. So Stroll and Perez were out front 10+ seconds ahead of third and within hundredths of a second of each other in full wet conditions. And is the argument that that was the cream rising to the top as they're two of the fastest drivers in the whole field. Or was it the car that gave them an advantage in the full wet conditions and that advantage ebbed away as the track dried? It looks pretty clear to me. I'm pretty sure nobody accuses either of them of being among the fastest few drivers

Frank Bullitt · 16-11-2020 5:40pm

It would be a real tragedy if Perez is not on the grid next year. He clearly still has a lot of skill to give, so Red Bull...hurry up and give him a call.

chicorytip · 16-11-2020 6:15pm

recyclebin wrote: »

I think Perez could have had a seat at Williams, Haas or Alfa if he really wanted but he didn't want to end his F1 career at the back of the grid and he is holding out for that Red Bull seat. If he doesn't get the Red Bull seat then their could be better opportunities in 2022. There could be one or two seats at Mercedes or maybe a seat at Renault.

Have Red Bull ever recruited an established driver from another team outside of their "stable"?

Frank Bullitt · 16-11-2020 6:19pm

chicorytip wrote: »

Have Red Bull ever recruited an established driver from another team outside of their "stable"?

Is Mark Webber the last one? That is all I can think of (and I might be totally wrong on that).

Harika · 16-11-2020 7:03pm

Gintonious wrote: »

Is Mark Webber the last one? That is all I can think of (and I might be totally wrong on that).

Yes, and before they went external they unburied Hartley.
Brundle said on Sunday that red Bull has to look into the mirror why they are burning through talent so quickly.
Also verstappen spun twice if I am not mistaken

Cork Trucker · 16-11-2020 8:47pm

David Coulthard in their maiden campaign in 2005 and Mark Webber in 2007 are the only external recruitments I think

El_Duderino 09 · 16-11-2020 9:33pm

Cork Trucker wrote: »

David Coulthard in their maiden campaign in 2005 and Mark Webber in 2007 are the only external recruitments I think

They’ve brought through a lot of drivers in that time. They haven’t all been quality but they’ve had Vettel, Ric and Max. They what also had a lot of lads who didn’t make it. Once they’re dropped they have lost their only real sponsor so they’re fcuked.

donspeekinglesh · 16-11-2020 10:23pm

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

Once they’re dropped they have lost their only real sponsor so they’re fcuked.

They don't drop them all, at least not straight away. Buemi and Hartley are both still active Red Bull athletes. As is Neel Jani, who only made it as far as STR test driver in F1.

16-11-2020 11:36pm

GarIT wrote: »

Didn't he deliberately ram into Sirotkin too or was that another driver? Hulk could be a better number 2 for RBR.

Bingo!
Singapore 2018 popped up in my suggestions, he put Ocon (team mate) into the wall at turn 3 then later on rammed Sirotkin for no reason.

Man with broke phone · 17-11-2020 12:52am

Red Bull need an experienced driver if new car under new rules needs to be built.

Very few available with that experience still in their prime.

Faugheen · 17-11-2020 1:05am

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

They’ve brought through a lot of drivers in that time. They haven’t all been quality but they’ve had Vettel, Ric and Max. They what also had a lot of lads who didn’t make it. Once they’re dropped they have lost their only real sponsor so they’re fcuked.

They’ve also let some go way too early. Sainz, Vergne, Buemi to name a few, no doubt Gasly will be another one.

jv2000 · 17-11-2020 10:03am

Faugheen wrote: »

They’ve also let some go way too early. Sainz, Vergne, Buemi to name a few, no doubt Gasly will be another one.

Agreed. With Sainz it was somewhat out of their hands though. He was having comparable results to Verstappen in the Torro Roso when they decided to promote Max. With Daniel Ric already in RB then Sainz probably saw no future at RB. And of course the bumper contract and favoritism shown to Max ultimately led to Daniel leaving RB..... So their treatment of Max actually lost them the 2 best drivers they had that could actually compete with Max.

El_Duderino 09 · 17-11-2020 10:05am

Faugheen wrote: »

They’ve also let some go way too early. Sainz, Vergne, Buemi to name a few, no doubt Gasly will be another one.

And they’ve held on to Kvyat for way too long. Considering they’re probably going to get rid of Gasley in fewer years than Kvyat, their selection process seems random. It’s probably influenced by the drivers coming behind and Lvyat must have hit on a period when they didn’t have much coming behind him. Kvyat is a lucky boy.

On the topic of RB going outside the family, Kvyat was Ferrari reserve and simulator driver for a while (maybe 2018). Then they got him back afterwards. I wonder if he was Ferrari’s Red Bull man or Red Bull’s man at Ferrari.

LollipopJimmy · 17-11-2020 11:10am

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

Ok. So Stroll and Perez were out front 10+ seconds ahead of third and within hundredths of a second of each other in full wet conditions. And is the argument that that was the cream rising to the top as they're two of the fastest drivers in the whole field. Or was it the car that gave them an advantage in the full wet conditions and that advantage ebbed away as the track dried? It looks pretty clear to me. I'm pretty sure nobody accuses either of them of being among the fastest few drivers

I dont know if you're taking me up wrong or what, you're going on about stroll, I'm not, he fell off. Let's take the top 6. That top 6 after a mental race is quite possibly the best 6 there are in F1 at the moment, 5 of them definitely.

The phrase 'the cream rises to the top' is meant as when all is said and done the best still come out on top at the end. Youre using Stroll to counter my point, a lad that finished 9th iirc.

El_Duderino 09 · 17-11-2020 12:55pm

LollipopJimmy wrote: »

I dont know if you're taking me up wrong or what, you're going on about stroll, I'm not, he fell off. Let's take the top 6. That top 6 after a mental race is quite possibly the best 6 there are in F1 at the moment, 5 of them definitely.

The phrase 'the cream rises to the top' is meant as when all is said and done the best still come out on top at the end. Youre using Stroll to counter my point, a lad that finished 9th iirc.

The lad qualified on poll in wet conditions, lead the race comfortably in full wet conditions and fell away when he couldn’t switch on his tyres in the last stint. If not for that he would probably have won. To ignore the events of the race is silly. So too is ignoring the recent form and using one topsy-turvy race to fudge who the best drivers are.

Some of those top 6 are marginal. Is Perez top 6 on the grid? Is Ric not top 6? And there’s no way you’re going to form an argument that Vettel is top 6 based on the last 2 years of performance (Vettel had a very good race however).

You’re ignoring the fact that the majority of teammates finished quali near each other and finished the race next to each other. They can’t simply be brushed over.

It was a crazy race. None of the cars were designed with those conditions in mind and some cars worked better than others and it changed as the conditions changed. Very little to be learned from it. Entertaining race though.

Roger the cabin boy · 17-11-2020 3:01pm

Hamilton ran a magnificent race as he usually does. A very worthy winner. His tyre management is fantastic.

I'd like to see him do a season with Ferrari. If not next year as #1, then the year after as perhaps a #2 and mentor to Le clerc.

El_Duderino 09 · 17-11-2020 3:28pm

Roger the cabin boy wrote: »

Hamilton ran a magnificent race as he usually does. A very worthy winner. His tyre management is fantastic.

I'd like to see him do a season with Ferrari. If not next year as #1, then the year after as perhaps a #2 and mentor to Le clerc.

Yeah this was one of the rare occasions where his car didn't seem suited to the conditions and he really had to earn he win.

Zero change of him moving to Ferrari to mentor another driver. That's just not how it works. Would be great to see him in a car that isn't the best though. We've all seen what he can o in the best car - win almost every race and championship

Faugheen · 17-11-2020 3:51pm

I feel like Hamilton’s best chance at cementing his legacy was going to Ferrari next year to win #8.

If Ferrari’s performance hadn’t dropped off a cliff from last year, you have to wonder was there a possibility.

Jordan 199 · 17-11-2020 4:04pm

Faugheen wrote: »

I feel like Hamilton’s best chance at cementing his legacy was going to Ferrari next year to win #8.

If Ferrari’s performance hadn’t dropped off a cliff from last year, you have to wonder was there a possibility.

I would have liked to have seen him at Ferrari in a race winning/championship winning car. I would be happy to see him there just to see him win races.

H3llR4iser · 17-11-2020 5:10pm

LollipopJimmy wrote: »

Max's biggest weakness was shown up and magnified, his impatience cost him big time. He finished 6th, I would have said that the top 6 yesterday are (in no particular order) are arguably the best 6 drivers on the grid.

Max's impatience is an issue that had never surfaced this season because he's practically been racing in a void in 3rd place all the time. He's in his 6th season, so the argument of "inexperience" can't really be applied anymore.

Sometimes I wonder if the whole media banging the drum of the "wonderkid", "once in 30 years talent" and so on isn't playing a part into this. The fact he was gonna spin or put it in the wall, yesterday, was apparent in the way he placed the car on track since the moment he was stuck behind Vettel.

Hamilton on the other hand, put in a masterclass - damage limitation when the car wouldn't work the tires well, and as soon as he got some grip, he disappeared into the distance.

Ferrari, they could've taken the risk of slicks, especially with Seb, it might have won them the race; Yet in hindsight, 3rd and 4th is a super result considering the season...

kksaints · 17-11-2020 5:32pm

Verstappen is undoubtedly the quickest driver in wet conditions but he takes very risky lines and it was clear enough on Sunday to see that he was taking some big chances on grip levels at the start of the race and the risks didn't pay off.

Infoanon · 17-11-2020 5:47pm

kksaints wrote: »

Verstappen is undoubtedly the quickest driver in wet conditions .

Lewis has proved himself to be the quickest time and time again - Max is up there but is not as quick or in as much control as Lewis.

kksaints · 17-11-2020 5:59pm

Infoanon wrote: »

Lewis has proved himself to be the quickest time and time again - Max is up there but is not as quick or in as much control as Lewis.

I'd say on a single lap Verstappen is the quickest but as you correctly pointed out Hamilton has better control and is more consistent than Verstappen in wet weather.

Frank Bullitt · 17-11-2020 6:09pm

Roger the cabin boy wrote: »

Hamilton ran a magnificent race as he usually does. A very worthy winner. His tyre management is fantastic.

I'd like to see him do a season with Ferrari. If not next year as #1, then the year after as perhaps a #2 and mentor to Le clerc.

That made me giggle. Fair play.

GarIT · 17-11-2020 6:30pm

kksaints wrote: »

Verstappen is undoubtedly the quickest driver in wet conditions but he takes very risky lines and it was clear enough on Sunday to see that he was taking some big chances on grip levels at the start of the race and the risks didn't pay off.

Not in a million years. He was handily beaten by drivers like Perez and Vettel.

AMKC · 18-11-2020 11:14am

Well it looks like Mercedes is planning a gradual pull out of F1.

https://www.autocar.co.uk/car-news/motorsport/aston-martin-provide-f1-safety-cars-2021

Still that will be a nice change to the safety car. It's boring seeing the same car the whole time and it will give them drivers a bit of variety for a while at least.
Have to start somewhere so these first and then the F1 team maybe in 2 year or 5 years time?

Infoanon · 18-11-2020 11:28am

AMKC wrote: »

Well it looks like Mercedes is planning a gradual pull out of F1.

https://www.autocar.co.uk/car-news/motorsport/aston-martin-provide-f1-safety-cars-2021

Bit of a leap to put it mildly - the safety cars have nothing to do with the F1 team and are a marketing tool for Mercedes.

Mercedes part ownership of the car manufacturer Aston Martin is allowing the Astons some publicity.

Mercedes were the safety car supplier long before their entry into F1

El_Duderino 09 · 18-11-2020 12:34pm

AMKC wrote: »

Well it looks like Mercedes is planning a gradual pull out of F1.

https://www.autocar.co.uk/car-news/motorsport/aston-martin-provide-f1-safety-cars-2021

Still that will be a nice change to the safety car. It's boring seeing the same car the whole time and it will give them drivers a bit of variety for a while at least.
Have to start somewhere so these first and then the F1 team maybe in 2 year or 5 years time?

Never occurred to me that he safety car was part of the entertainment.

The physical safety car is only a marketing tradition at this stage. It could be done more effectively by setting mandatory lap times. The idea of using a slow car to set the pace, is quaint. They could balance the need to bunch the cars and slow them down to give marshals time to do whatever they need to do. But they could manage the speed so the tyres and brakes don’t get too cold.

Going at the speed of whatever sports car that bid the most sponsorship, is a terrible way to set the speed for safety
car periods.

18-11-2020 2:14pm

Came across this, claims F1 is more competitive than ever, load of nonsense. :pac:
One stat I thought of in my head without checking anything, number of different drivers champions in each decade;
2010s: 3
2000s: 5
1990s: 6

This one I have to check, different constructors champions;
2010s: 2 (4 in a row then 6 in a row)
2000s: 3
1990s: 4

Again the thing that is easy to overlook especially when you're in the time is just how Goddamn long it's been going on. Seeing that someone like Ricciardo is already 31 is pretty depressing to me. It's easy to think about how popular he is among fans and the press and forget just how good he actually is. To have one team dominate for 8 years is half a generation of drivers never having a shot at the title.
For a while we had the most champions on the grid I think (Hamilton, Button, Vettel, Alonso, Kimi, Schumacher) whereas it's not hard very hard to imagine in 2022 there could be none.
Unfortunately this is what happens when you allow the teams to have too much power. The only comparable period of domination (Ferrari in 2000s) had the FIA changing rules and plenty of attempts to break that dominance. Right now despite the teams talking a good game they mostly seem happy to just follow the leader.

H3llR4iser · 18-11-2020 6:40pm

Deleted User wrote: »

Unfortunately this is what happens when you allow the teams to have too much power. The only comparable period of domination (Ferrari in 2000s) had the FIA changing rules and plenty of attempts to break that dominance. Right now despite the teams talking a good game they mostly seem happy to just follow the leader.

Further supporting the statement - Ferrari's early 2000s domination was actually the direct result of the FIA giving them too much consideration in the definition of the rules from the mid-90s onwards (e.g. refueling being introduced to reduce the disadvantage V12s were suffering compared to V10s and V8s, banning active suspension...banning basically anything McLaren came up with in 1998/99

).

I reality what we're seeing ain't that different - when the Hybrid rules were approved, Mercedes was already halfway down the line developing their powertrain. Then they added a very effective chassis to the mix.

Formula 1 2020 - General Discussion Thread (See MOD warning on first post)

Comments