The left this, the right that..

Yer Da sells Avon · 07-10-2018 12:28am

the_pen_turner wrote: »

open your eyes.

Yeah, open your eyes, sheeple.

CinemaGuy45 · 07-10-2018 12:29am

the_pen_turner wrote: »

its not negative. its just the sad reality we have allowed to happen

I was agreeing with you turn on your sarcasm detector.

the_pen_turner · 07-10-2018 12:30am

meeeeh wrote: »

You and OP can fight this one out. It will be a perfect example of what is wrong about modern politics.

i have no interest in getting into a debate on politics. i hate politics. all hot air and BS buzz words and nothing to back it up

Gimme A Pound · 07-10-2018 12:31am

Deleted User wrote: »

I just wish someone would show me the attraction to the right...

You're depicting the right as just extremists. There are views right of the middle that i agree with and views left of the middle ditto.

07-10-2018 12:31am

the_pen_turner wrote: »

open your eyes. there are huge problems growing everywhere.

we have younger generations that cannot work cook, look after themselves
modern femanism poluting the minds with their anti male nonscense.
generations growing up showing no respect for anyone or anything including the law
scumbags breading like rabbits
honest hardworking people cannot afford to live and would be better off scounging from the state

I'd say modern grammar is being ruined first

(Sorry, cheap dig!)

Point by point:
1: Cooking, looking after themselves: do you know any young people? They're by far the fittest generation we've had due to gyms and working out not being niche things anymore. They know what nutrition is. They cannot work because you now need 3 years experience to be a waiter.
2: Modern feminism is something I've already slightly gone in to. How about dudes just stop being dicks to women? It would solve a lot of problems.
3: The government would do well by showing some respect to the law. Pay them properly and hire some more gardai.
4: Breeding like rabbits? It was generations past that were churning out 9, 12, 16 kids regularly.
5: Hardly the left's fault, they're the ones that want to build social housing and not pass on the current crisis to private landlords.

the_pen_turner · 07-10-2018 12:38am

Deleted User wrote: »

I'd say modern grammar is being ruined first

(Sorry, cheap dig!)

Point by point:
1: cooking, looking after themselves: do you know any young people? They're by far the fittest generation we've had due to gyms and working out not being niche things anymore. Tjey know what nutrition is. They cannot work because you now need 3 years experience to be a waiter. i know lots of young people that cant boil an egg, cook a basic dinner , change a tyre, put fuel in the car, light a fire, use a screwdriver.
2: modern feminism is something I've already slightly gone in to. How about dudes just stop being dicks to women? It would solve a lot of problems.how about modern femanism stops blaming men for all the problems and realises that men and women can be just as good and bad as each other
3: The government would do well by showing some respect to the law. Pay them properly and hire some more gardai.
4: Breeding like rabbits? It was generations past that were churning out 9, 12, 16 kids regularly.i agree there , but years ago every one of them went out and earned a living and supported themselves
5: Hardly the lefts fault, they're the ones that want to build social housing and not pass on the current crisis to private landlords.

s

CinemaGuy45 · 07-10-2018 12:38am

Deleted User wrote: »

I'd say modern grammar is being ruined first

(Sorry, cheap dig!)

07-10-2018 12:39am

Jaxson Fresh Silver wrote: »

But there are people who question hardline feminism yet do not want to keep women down.

"Hardline feminism" is a classic example of the reality distortion effect of the echo chambers that are tiny, minuscule nether regions of the www like After Hours threads. After a while, people believe all that rubbish about it being a major issue, when in reality it's a bullshít recently invented non-issue which will never impact upon the daily life of the vast, vast majority of men.

Still, always better for the plebs to be fighting about cost-free liberal "rights" than seeking more taxes- indeed, any taxes - on the rich to fund social services.

07-10-2018 12:41am

CinemaGuy45 wrote: »

I knew that was gonna happen

hate when I end typing long messages on a phone

Actually, it was only a misspelling of "Tjey", and an apostrophe missing from "left's" the others are grammatically sound :P

Rjd2 · 07-10-2018 12:44am

meeeeh wrote: »

But it's not about society becoming more inclusive, it's two sides hurling insults at each other without even wanting to hear other sides argument. When insults like feminazi are thrown around, when anyone in anyway critical of liberal all accepting viewpoint tries to be silenced you know the world is going to hell. And those on left are just as responsible as those on the right.

In a perfect world,,,I'd ban the following expressions

Feminazi
Snowflake
SJW
white privilege
mansplaining

I know not everyone who uses the above terms are bad people, but vast majority of time they are used to shut down and taunt those with opposing views rather than engage in meaningful discussion.

CinemaGuy45 · 07-10-2018 12:44am

Deleted User wrote: »

I knew that was gonna happen hate when I end typing long messages on a phone

Nothing personal it was just too good to pass on.:D

Mind you doing a screen capture and going to tinypic to host the image was a lot of effort.:o

the_pen_turner · 07-10-2018 12:47am

Deleted User wrote: »

"Hardline feminism" is a classic example of the reality distortion effect of the echo chambers that are tiny, minuscule nether regions of the www like After Hours threads. After a while, people believe all that rubbish about it being a major issue, when in reality it's a bullshít recently invented non-issue which will never impact upon the daily life of the vast, vast majority of men.

Still, always better for the plebs to be fighting about cost-free liberal "rights" than seeking more taxes- indeed, any taxes - on the rich to fund social services.

i dont agree. the reality is that that sort of stuff like me too and feminism has made its way into the heads of lots of people and you see stories regularly that show that mens rights are being eroded .
look at that case of a father and daughter in a hotel where the cops were called
that airline that wont let a child sit beside a man

look at the gender pay gap nonscense . you hear that mentioned regularly by everyday people but it isnt based on any kind of facts and is mostly the ideas of screwed up femanists

Creative83 · 07-10-2018 12:51am

I would consider myself slightly right of centre... All of this bull**** about genders and trans... these are sick people who need medical help... the left are trying to normalise this rubbish. These people need help

Mod-Banned

Afro Turner · 07-10-2018 12:51am

Leftists are now offended by clapping. I'll go with the right.

CinemaGuy45 · 07-10-2018 12:53am

Afro Turner wrote: »

Leftists are now offended by clapping. I'll go with the right.

And they are correct getting the clap is not very nice.:p

dotsman · 07-10-2018 1:04am

Deleted User wrote: »

Left:
Equality among sexes
Recognising different genders exist
Social healthcare
Separating religion from government
Treating people equally
Environmental concerns

Right:
Business, markets, capitalism are most important
Money, if you don't have it, tough.
Conserving the status quo eg, no expansion for different genders, against gay marriage
Insularism (putting borders up, "looking after our own first")
Private healthcare, if you can afford it, you can have healthcare, its business.
No environmental concerns (it's all baloney - there's money to be made, now)
Keeping religion central to education, health, the system.

Boards has become frighteningly right wing these days. I dunno when that happened, but most of the time I can't be bothered to reply on a thread as I'll be drowned out.

I know for a fact that boards is not reflective of society as a whole (thank God!) but its a good time as any, to say, why are you freaked out by the left?

From my perspective, the left (while not perfect by any means) want society to become more inclusive, and try and focus on the individual being able to be an individual, while the right tends to generally care about money and possessions first, not wanting other people to recognise their own individuality, whether that be not recognising gender spectrum, or gay marriage for instance. They want to keep women down (the lambasting the #metoo movement is especially bizarre, as we all know women who've been harassed at one time or another)

So, what's the attraction to the right? What do you get out of it? What am I missing?

Boards is right wing???
First I heard of it.

Also, your description of the left and right are extremely messed up and the wording is very biased. One or two mistakes, fine, but when it's that screwed up and biased, I can only assume there is no point discussing it with you...

Rechuchote · 07-10-2018 1:05am

The left: the rich have too much money
The right: the poor have too much money

GLaDOS · 07-10-2018 1:08am

Rechuchote wrote: »

The left: the rich have too much money
The right: the poor have too much money

Either way, if you're earning an average wage you're screwed

Pero_Bueno · 07-10-2018 1:09am

Jaxson Fresh Silver wrote: »

But there are people who question hardline feminism yet do not want to keep women down.

There are feminists who hate trans people.

There are people with right-wing views who are atheists.

You are just presenting two polarised boxes whereas the reality is of a huge amount of cross fertilisation.

In general I am more to the right economically (but that doesn't mean I disagree with state supports - I completely agree with them) and more to the left socially - but I don't accept there are more than two genders, and while I loathe misogyny and adore feminists of old, I detest today's feminism.

I'm not anti immigration but it has to be limited.

I think there is too much abdication of personal responsibility and people need to look mostly to themselves for help (mostly; nothing wrong with asking for a helping hand).

I think this sums it up perfectly really .
But back to OP

Deleted User wrote: »

Left:
Equality among sexes

Agreed but not this 3rd wave man hating feminism ...

Recognising different genders exist 2 genders exist, sometimes we have people that feel they are the other sex, but still 2 TWO !!!
Social healthcare

Agreed

Separating religion from government

100% Agreed!!

Treating people equally

Agreed - but modern left wants special privilege to "oppressed" people, god knows what the definition of oppressed is , it changes daily...

Environmental concerns

Agree!!!

Right:
Business, markets, capitalism are most important

Don't agree

Money, if you don't have it, tough.

Don't agree

Conserving the status quo eg, no expansion for different genders

Agree ... no problem with sex change between the binary genders, but this 69 genderqueer bollix.... nah it's a fashionable neurosis ..

against gay marriage

definetely do not agree here !! 100% behind gay marriage

Insularism (putting borders up, "looking after our own first")

Agree, its a tough world and 7 Billion people is enough in the world, look after your own -
but im for immigration for TRUE refugees and when needed (has proper skillset etc...)

Private healthcare, if you can afford it, you can have healthcare, its business.

Don't agree...

No environmental concerns (it's all baloney - there's money to be made, now)

100% disagree!!!

Keeping religion central to education, health, the system.

100% disagree

Boards has become frighteningly right wing these days. I dunno when that happened, but most of the time I can't be bothered to reply on a thread as I'll be drowned out.

Not really in fairness, the mods do a good job...

I know for a fact that boards is not reflective of society as a whole (thank God!) but its a good time as any, to say, why are you freaked out by the left?

(Just using US politics as an example here...)The left has failed, this is why Trump won, I was delighted when Trump won as a REACTION to all this nonsense - I say this as someone who was very disappointed when Bush won 2000+2004 and delighted when Obama won his 2 terms ...... the democrats need to up their game rather then whine and whine about russian bots and the rise of far right fascism ... yeah sure ... fascism ... :rolleyes:

From my perspective, the left (while not perfect by any means) want society to become more inclusive, and try and focus on the individual being able to be an individual,

The classical left do yes, not these bunch of dangerous anti free speech whiners ....

while the right tends to generally care about money and possessions first, not wanting other people to recognise their own individuality,
whether that be not recognising gender spectrum,

Gender SPECTRUM ??? there is XX and XY chromosomes ! what "Spectrum" are you talking about ?? so in computer science can we introduce the spectrum of boolean values between true and false ??? or 0 and 1 ...

or gay marriage for instance. They want to keep women down (the lambasting the #metoo movement is especially bizarre, as we all know women who've been harassed at one time or another)

The meToo movement is a joke, they are privileged whiners and don't give a **** about actual real sexual assault, show me any metoo people that gave a **** about the Rotherham rape gangs ? no ... they didn't wrong type of perp....hypocrites ..

So, what's the attraction to the right? What do you get out of it? What am I missing?

I don't think there is an attraction to the right, it's just people are looking for sense in this crazy PC world - look at my views above, it's a mix of both, but I'm just branded as a far right bigot because I don't like this 3rd wave feminism and don't accept a gender spectrum.
I am also not a fan of Islam , it's a dangerous ideology.
So yeah, I guess I must be a nazi ...

gw80 · 07-10-2018 1:42am

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Left:
Equality among sexes
Recognising different genders exist
Social healthcare
Separating religion from government
Treating people equally
Environmental concerns

Right:
Business, markets, capitalism are most important
Money, if you don't have it, tough.
Conserving the status quo eg, no expansion for different genders, against gay marriage
Insularism (putting borders up, "looking after our own first")
Private healthcare, if you can afford it, you can have healthcare, its business.
No environmental concerns (it's all baloney - there's money to be made, now)
Keeping religion central to education, health, the system.

Boards has become frighteningly right wing these days. I dunno when that happened, but most of the time I can't be bothered to reply on a thread as I'll be drowned out.

I know for a fact that boards is not reflective of society as a whole (thank God!) but its a good time as any, to say, why are you freaked out by the left?

From my perspective, the left (while not perfect by any means) want society to become more inclusive, and try and focus on the individual being able to be an individual, while the right tends to generally care about money and possessions first, not wanting other people to recognise their own individuality, whether that be not recognising gender spectrum, or gay marriage for instance. They want to keep women down (the lambasting the #metoo movement is especially bizarre, as we all know women who've been harassed at one time or another)

So, what's the attraction to the right? What do you get out of it? What am I missing?

What is is it about the individual that is so sacred? Or more precisely, what is it about BEING an individual that is so important, where is it supposed to lead us.
Our greatest achievements have been through working together, where would we be as a society if everyone insisted on being different to everyone else, "look at me, I'm not like you, I do my own thing.with increasing degrees of segmentation. There would be no society.
By all means be an individual amongst your family and friends, but don't let that be the defining aspect of your life, or use your individualism to benefit the greater good of the community.
And men and women are not equal,but one is not better than the other, both have particular strengths and weaknesses, both deserve equal opportunities, if a woman can out perform a man in a field that is normally seen as male dominated than by all means fill your boots, which kinda ties in with what I said about being an individual that benefits the greater community.

I detest religion, I think too much wealth is in the hands of too few people.
I would consider myself a nationalist.
I believe everyone able bodied should work.
I believe those less fortunate and not so able bodied should be lifted up or carried by the strenght of the collective group.
Where does all this put me on your right, left spectrum?.

Vincent Vega · 07-10-2018 1:47am

I've often wondered how much infiltration exists within these ideologies.

I mean honestly, I'd say one of the best or most effective ways to push people towards right wing mindset or make them go further with their right wing leanings is to make the left seem so fúcking intolerable that people want nothing to do with it and want to distance themselves completely.

So you could say, go hire some clever folk, who pose as left wing and go out of there way to capture the utmost irritating aspects of leftwing thought in order to sway those who are more centred.

Anybody know of this sort of thing existing?

CinemaGuy45 · 07-10-2018 1:50am

Vincent Vega wrote: »

I've often wondered how much infiltration exists within these ideologies.

I mean honestly, I'd say one of the best or most effective ways to push people towards right wing mindset or make them go further with their right wing leanings is to make the left seem so fúcking intolerable that people want nothing to do with it and want to distance themselves completely.

So you could say, go hire some clever folk, who pose as left wing and go out of there way to capture the utmost irritating aspects of leftwing thought in order to sway those who are more centred.

Anybody know of this sort of thing existing?

Not really but I am aware of this nonsense.

markodaly · 07-10-2018 2:04am

Deleted User wrote: »

Right:
Business, markets, capitalism are most important
Money, if you don't have it, tough.
Conserving the status quo eg, no expansion for different genders, against gay marriage
Insularism (putting borders up, "looking after our own first")
Private healthcare, if you can afford it, you can have healthcare, its business.
No environmental concerns (it's all baloney - there's money to be made, now)
Keeping religion central to education, health, the system.

LOL, this is a typical misrepresentation of what it means to be a right-winger. You might as well just call all right-wingers 'a basket of deplorables' ala Clinton if will make you feel better.

In your world, left = good, right =bad.

Boards has become frighteningly right wing these days. I dunno when that happened, but most of the time I can't be bothered to reply on a thread as I'll be drowned out.

Examples, please?

From my perspective, the left (while not perfect by any means) want society to become more inclusive, and try and focus on the individual being able to be an individual, while the right tends to generally care about money and possessions first, not wanting other people to recognise their own individuality, whether that be not recognising gender spectrum, or gay marriage for instance. They want to keep women down (the lambasting the #metoo movement is especially bizarre, as we all know women who've been harassed at one time or another)

Your perspective is wrong and misguided. 'Keeping women down', for **** sake! You are the reason why 'the right' is more popular now.

So, what's the attraction to the right? What do you get out of it? What am I missing?

If you think being of 'the right' is just being a mean racist or something-something ism, then there is no point trying to debate anything with you to be honest.

Kermit.de.frog · 07-10-2018 4:06am

Mine is hanging just to the right.

BeerWolf · 07-10-2018 4:32am

CinemaGuy45 wrote: »

Right Wing we have money and we don't want to share.

The left we have nothing and we want to share.

BeerWolf · 07-10-2018 4:36am

meeeeh wrote: »

But it's not about society becoming more inclusive, it's two sides hurling insults at each other without even wanting to hear other sides argument. When insults like feminazi are thrown around, when anyone in anyway critical of liberal all accepting viewpoint tries to be silenced you know the world is going to hell. And those on left are just as responsible as those on the right.

Everyone's a Nazi/alt-right if they don't agree with a hardline leftie apparently.

Brian? · 07-10-2018 9:12am

Franz Von Peppercorn wrote: »

Why should anybody accept something they believe to be nonsense. It wouldn’t affect me to accept that 2+2=5 but I know it’s not so I don’t.

It would be a deeply sinister society that expected people to believe that 2+2=5 or face social or professional ostracisation but here we are.

It’s libertarian or liberal to allow people to declare gender, it’s totalitarian to expect everybody to accept it.

I actually agree with you here. I don’t care what anyone believes as long as they don’t use it to discriminate.

I’ll never understand why there are more threads on boards about transgender issues started by people who don’t believe you can change gender, than by transgender people.

Brian? · 07-10-2018 9:13am

BeerWolf wrote: »

Everyone's a Nazi/alt-right if they don't agree with a hardline leftie apparently.

That’s a straw man that’s constantly parroted about people on the left. It has no basis in reality though.

Danzy · 07-10-2018 9:18am

The modern Left are too like the Catholic Church of old in manner.

Deeply intolerant of others, righteous and demanding conformity.

I'd say I am left of most people.

ELM327 · 07-10-2018 9:22am

These definitions in the OP do not cover everyone.
I am right wing.
Yet I am pro marriage equality, pro-choice (voted yes for SSM and for repeal), and I am atheist. Staunchly so.

You need to make a distinction between right wing and right wing extremists, the same way as you make a distinction between left wing, and loony lefts like AAAPBP, SF, etc.

BeerWolf · 07-10-2018 9:23am

Brian? wrote: »

That’s a straw man that’s constantly parroted about people on the left. It has no basis in reality though.

Strawman?

Have you ever tried having any discussions with such people? You'd swear they were trolls, but they're just delusional.

Everything is either black or white to them, with a "with us or against us" mentality.

super_furry · 07-10-2018 9:30am

Afro Turner wrote: »

Leftists are now offended by clapping. I'll go with the right.

That's true in the same way that saying right wing people want to reintroduce slavery in. Sure there's a handful of mental impotent people that go after stuff like that but they're not representative of anyone but themselves and their looper friends.

suicide_circus · 07-10-2018 9:42am

I think we should all be asking questions all the time. no topic off limits and no orthodoxy left unchallenged.

zmgakt7uw2dvfs · 07-10-2018 9:48am

Deleted User wrote: »

No there isn't equality here.

We don't have equal amount of
Female/male electricians
Female/male nurses
Female/male teachers
Female/male members of boards
Female/male carers
Female/male stay at home parents
Female/male TD's

Do you think it's desirable to have a 50-50 male:female split across everything?

Do you think it's a problem that the split isn't 50-50 across everything?

I think you're seeing problems where there aren't really problems to be honest. Good luck in getting the girls to line up to become electricians and JCB drivers and bin collectors though.

meeeeh · 07-10-2018 9:48am

BeerWolf wrote: »

Everyone's a Nazi/alt-right if they don't agree with a hardline leftie apparently.

You know what, your post illustrates perfectly the point I was trying to make. And I think a lot of us are sick of this type of nonsense on both sides. I think your and the other side deserve each other.

NIMAN · 07-10-2018 9:59am

How do you achieve 50/50 male/female electricians though?

By its nature, it will be very hard to do, unless you force a certain number of girls to study to become electricians.

But can you force people to do something to achieve equality?

TheValeyard · 07-10-2018 10:35am

Leftists to the right of me
Rightists to the left of me
Here I am stuck in the centre with no one.

Afro Turner · 07-10-2018 10:38am

Danzy wrote: »

The modern Left are too like the Catholic Church of old in manner.

Deeply intolerant of others, righteous and demanding conformity.

I'd say I am left of most people.

The also have this weird obsession with punishing those who stray from the righteous path of 'tolerance.

Rechuchote · 07-10-2018 10:40am

ELM327 wrote: »

These definitions in the OP do not cover everyone.
I am right wing.
Yet I am pro marriage equality, pro-choice (voted yes for SSM and for repeal), and I am atheist. Staunchly so.

You need to make a distinction between right wing and right wing extremists, the same way as you make a distinction between left wing, and loony lefts like AAAPBP, SF, etc.

You're socially left wing, economically right wing, then.

Your belief in a god or otherwise has absolutely nothing to do with politics but is your private business.

Danzy · 07-10-2018 3:21pm

NIMAN wrote: »

How do you achieve 50/50 male/female electricians though?

By its nature, it will be very hard to do, unless you force a certain number of girls to study to become electricians.

But can you force people to do something to achieve equality?

Remove free will seems to be the answer from a growing clique of the left.

That is not flippant remark.

suicide_circus · 07-10-2018 4:08pm

Afro Turner wrote: »

The also have this weird obsession with punishing those who stray from the righteous path of 'tolerance.

"It seems to me that what we're doing...is producing a tyrannous new morality that is every bit as oppressive as the old.” Professor David Starkey

suicide_circus · 07-10-2018 4:16pm

NIMAN wrote: »

How do you achieve 50/50 male/female electricians though?

By its nature, it will be very hard to do, unless you force a certain number of girls to study to become electricians.

But can you force people to do something to achieve equality?

Thou shalt achieve equality
Thou shalt forsake the evidence of thy'n senses
Let Diversity be thy'n graven image

1800_Ladladlad · 07-10-2018 4:24pm

More dribble from an OP leftie arguing the rise of the facist right, oh the anarchy. How has all this murican bolloxogy made its way to country. :mad:

Yer Da sells Avon · 07-10-2018 4:38pm

Philosophy Zombie wrote: »

Boards/Afterhours is a walk in the park compared to loads of other places I find.

Yeah, I think most of the right-wing stuff that gets posted on here is borne out of personal frustration, rather than the sort of ideological nastiness that you might see elsewhere. More often that not, I suspect they lack the intelligence to realise that they should maybe consider directing that frustration upwards, rather than constantly seeking groups of people whom they believe they are 'better than', in the hope of giving themselves a temporary boost.

One eyed Jack · 07-10-2018 4:45pm

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Boards has become frighteningly right wing these days.

It really hasn’t.

From my perspective...

Ahh, I think I see the actual problem there. The problem is with your perspective, not with Boards.

So, what's the attraction to the right? What do you get out of it? What am I missing?

You’re missing the fact that from your perspective, anyone who agrees with you are lovely. Anyone who disagrees with your opinion are malevolent fcukwits unfit for the kind of society you wish existed.

fullstop · 07-10-2018 4:56pm

Deleted User wrote: »

No there isn't equality here.

We don't have equal amount of
Female/male electricians
Female/male nurses
Female/male teachers
Female/male members of boards
Female/male carers
Female/male stay at home parents
Female/male TD's

So what you're saying is, women and men choose different careers? Hold the press :rolleyes:

Danzy · 07-10-2018 5:48pm

Yer Da sells Avon wrote: »

More often that not, I suspect they lack the intelligence to realise that they should maybe consider directing that frustration upwards, rather than constantly seeking groups of people whom they believe they are 'better than', in the hope of giving themselves a temporary boost.

The mantra of so many on the Left today the people are thick. It used be disguised as a discussion on false consciousness.

That was bad enough because it closed down an examination of what drives people.

Your presuming a lot about people.

Yer Da sells Avon · 07-10-2018 6:16pm

Danzy wrote: »

The mantra of so many on the Left today the people are thick. It used be disguised as a discussion on false consciousness.

That was bad enough because it closed down an examination of what drives people.

Your presuming a lot about people.

Sorry, I probably should have worded it better. I didn't mean to imply that right-wing people are all thick. Some people are thick though, whatever their political inclination, and I think people who don't appear to be in a great position themselves, but feel the constant need to punch downwards - are being especially thick, as they are focusing on people even less powerful than themselves.

07-10-2018 7:08pm

Clowns to the left of me, jokers to the right.

Brian? · 07-10-2018 8:09pm

BeerWolf wrote: »

Strawman?

Have you ever tried having any discussions with such people? You'd swear they were trolls, but they're just delusional.

Everything is either black or white to them, with a "with us or against us" mentality.

How could I have discussions with people I claim don’t exist?

The left this, the right that..

Comments