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Stolen Tesla Model S (found post 168 )

135

Comments

  • #102
    tjhook
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 748 ✭✭✭tjhook


    sk8board wrote: »
    Always terrible to hear. We have keyless cars and use a €5 Bewleys tea caddy for the keys, which works like a charm as a faraday cage (and you get forty cups of tea into the deal!):

    We leave it here on the microwave:


    I've heard about using a tin, but then I saw "a random guy on the Internet" test it, and it didn't work for him. Maybe it depends on the frequency/amplitude used by the fob, or maybe some tins are better than others. Either way, I invested in one of those faraday boxes, and tested that it works.


    I wish all kinds of evil on the scum who steal cars.


  • #103
    cadaliac
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,903 ✭✭✭cadaliac


    Please excuse my ignorance on this.
    Is the thief using a listening device to "listen" for the keyfob?
    How often is a keyfob broadcasting? It looks like every couple of seconds according to the video.

    If the thief was listening to the keyfob then surely the Faraday cage/ box is the best solution ??

    Another option should be available to stop the key broadcasting, upon request.


  • #104
    bk
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 22,992 Mod ✭✭✭✭bk


    BTW for those asking about other ways to protect your car, some home alarm systems support external sensors suitable for outside use. Point to point detectors and external motion detectors can be potentially used. If someone enters your drive way/garden at night, it triggers your home alarm system.

    Might not work for everyone, can depend on how your driveway/garden is set up, but might be suitable for some people.


  • #105
    AndyBoBandy
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,728 ✭✭✭✭AndyBoBandy


    bk wrote: »
    BTW for those asking about other ways to protect your car, some home alarm systems support external sensors suitable for outside use. Point to point detectors and external motion detectors can be potentially used. If someone enters your drive way/garden at night, it triggers your home alarm system.

    Might not work for everyone, can depend on how your driveway/garden is set up, but might be suitable for some people.

    Good point. My entire house is fitted with Philips Hue Colour (smart) bulbs, so I could add one of their outdoor sensors, and could set it to turn on various combinations of house lights if it defected motion outside.

    Deterrent more than anything - someone walks up your driveway and suddenly the porch, landing, hallway and kitchen lights all come on it might just be enough to spook them away.


  • #106
    copeyhagen
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,528 ✭✭✭copeyhagen


    _dof_ wrote: »
    The signal boosting attack makes the car think the key (keyfob or phone or whatever) is present beside the car to unlock the door and inside the car to allow it to drive. Once the thieves have driven away a short distance the car will no longer detect the key, so I don't see why the car can't just slow down to a stop when it detects no key inside the car.

    A lot (maybe all) keyless entry cars will just beep at the driver to indicate there's no key detected, but they don't stop you driving the car as far as I know.

    just a note around this, i have been in the car driving before when i got a pop up on screen saying "keyfob not detected, car will shut down soon"

    so im not sure if they would have had the same result after a few mins. maybe their software on the laptop actually acts as a mobile key, im not sure.

    or maybe they had a flatbed 2 mins up the road and loaded it on.

    we dont have garden walls, so a bollard wouldnt work.
    steering locks i thought could be opped in seconds, wasnt there a car thief on reddit that had a thread where he showed himself opening tonnes of them.
    the idea of having one of the most technologically advanced cars on the market, that can be stolen in a matter of minutes is insane.

    i think theres a bigger question t be asked of Tesla now. i did tweet Elon afterwards but he never replied :p


  • #107
    Peatys
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,881 ✭✭✭Peatys


    sk8board wrote: »
    Always terrible to hear. We have keyless cars and use a €5 Bewleys tea caddy for the keys, which works like a charm as a faraday cage (and you get forty cups of tea into the deal!):

    We leave it here on the microwave:

    No harm to put a sticker on that saying car keys.. wouldn't want the scummers in the house any longer than they have to be, nevermind them coming upstairs looking for keys


  • #108
    KCross
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,136 ✭✭✭✭KCross


    copeyhagen wrote: »
    i think theres a bigger question t be asked of Tesla now. i did tweet Elon afterwards but he never replied :p

    Hasnt he already replied to such tweets and as a consequence added PIN to drive?

    Ultimately any car with keyless entry has this problem and the PIN to drive was added retrospectively to Tesla's via over the air software update to specifically stop it. I dont think other manufacturers have (or even can) retrospectively do anything.

    Another alternative, I think, is not to use the key fobs and/or disable keyless entry.

    I think some new key fobs now also stop emitting their signal once they have a set period of inactivity and only start pinging again once they sense motion (i.e. when you pickup your keys). That also stops the problem.


  • #109
    bk
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 22,992 Mod ✭✭✭✭bk


    Peatys wrote: »
    No harm to put a sticker on that saying car keys.. wouldn't want the scummers in the house any longer than they have to be, nevermind them coming upstairs looking for keys

    Do people who can afford a Tesla, really not have a home security system?!

    some of them are very cheap these days.


  • #110
    zg3409
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,883 ✭✭✭zg3409


    cadaliac wrote: »
    Please excuse my ignorance on this.
    Is the thief using a listening device to "listen" for the keyfob?
    How often is a keyfob broadcasting? It looks like every couple of seconds according to the video.

    If the thief was listening to the keyfob then surely the Faraday cage/ box is the best solution ??

    Another option should be available to stop the key broadcasting, upon request.

    The car constantly broadcasts a wake up signal from door handles etc. When key hears wake up signal it responds with a one time encrypted code. The tool the thief's use listen to the cars wake up signal and amplify it and broadcast it stronger from a different device typically held up to the door of the house. When the key hears this it responds, typically this is not boosted, but it could be and then doors will unlock and engine will start. They then drive away. Ford introduced a motion sensor in the newer keys so if they don't move for a minute or 2 they go to sleep. Another fix can be updating the car to only respond if the response time is very short, as the key being further away it will be slightly late at responding. Its the speed of radio waves so the timing needs to be very critical but it may prevent responses when keys are say 4 metres away, even if boosted.

    News story
    https://www.which.co.uk/news/2019/01/how-easy-is-your-car-to-steal/

    List of cars tested
    https://dwkujuq9vpuly.cloudfront.net/news/wp-content/uploads/2019/01/Cars-tested-by-ADAC.pdf

    Tesla S and x on list. Model 3 was probably not available to test.

    This has been a known issue for a number of years. On some cars you can turn off the option in the cars menu (example the leaf) but on other cars (example Hyundai) you cannot. There was a Hyundai ioniq EV stolen recently in Ireland. The tin box can work, but best to test it standing next to the car. Some of the blocking pouches work better than others (again stand next to the car) . I keep my spare key in a pouch, but I should probably not keep my main key in the bedroom.


  • #111
    Sabre Man
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,029 ✭✭✭Sabre Man


    tjhook wrote: »
    I invested in one of those faraday boxes, and tested that it works.

    How did you test it?


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  • #112
    copeyhagen
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,528 ✭✭✭copeyhagen


    KCross wrote: »
    Hasnt he already replied to such tweets and as a consequence added PIN to drive?

    Ultimately any car with keyless entry has this problem and the PIN to drive was added retrospectively to Tesla's via over the air software update to specifically stop it. I dont think other manufacturers have (or even can) retrospectively do anything.

    Another alternative, I think, is not to use the key fobs and/or disable keyless entry.

    I think some new key fobs now also stop emitting their signal once they have a set period of inactivity and only start pinging again once they sense motion (i.e. when you pickup your keys). That also stops the problem.

    i dont want to give out too much info around others that are using the pin to drive, but that can also be disabled in minutes of entry.


  • #113
    galwaytt
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,794 ✭✭✭✭galwaytt


    copeyhagen wrote: »
    i bought a twin pack of the rfid blocker wallets from amazon yesterday, think it was a tenner delivered.

    pin to drive can possibly be disabled, the rfid with the pin to drive would hopefully be enough to deter them.

    shes talking aout getting garden walls and everything now!

    as said, at the end of the day, it was only a car, it was my dream car that took me ages to find, ages to wait for, family trip over to pick it up and these scrotes take it, but thats what insurance is for :(

    So sorry for your trouble OP, but, and looking at the pic you posted: irrespective of the car tech, I wouldn't buy any car (like that) without a garage to put it in to, let alone walls. This would have been on my list long before the car tbh.

    Assuming the battery packs are the expensive component here, don't they too have an i.d., which the computer system talks to for charging and analysis purposes - so they could be disabled remotely, no ??

    Ode To The Motorist

    “And my existence, while grotesque and incomprehensible to you, generates funds to the exchequer. You don't want to acknowledge that as truth because, deep down in places you don't talk about at the Green Party, you want me on that road, you need me on that road. We use words like freedom, enjoyment, sport and community. We use these words as the backbone of a life spent instilling those values in our families and loved ones. You use them as a punch line. I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the tax revenue and the very freedom to spend it that I provide, and then questions the manner in which I provide it. I would rather you just said "thank you" and went on your way. Otherwise I suggest you pick up a bus pass and get the ********* ********* off the road” 



  • #114
    Cuddlesworth
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,998 ✭✭✭✭Cuddlesworth


    Lumen wrote: »
    I dunno, there comes a point with security that it's so intrusive that it can ruin your enjoyment of the thing.

    And our houses have these annoying easy access holes in them called windows.


  • #115
    SOPHIE THE DOG
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 161 ✭✭SOPHIE THE DOG


    Sabre Man wrote: »
    How did you test it?

    1. Sit in car

    2. Put key in Faraday Box

    2. Try to start car

    3. If car starts, the Faraday box is not working

    (At least that's how I tested the cheapo "Faraday Box" key holder I bought in Aldi (in my cheapo car) and I'm glad to say the Faraday Box does its job)


  • #116
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 21,179 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Cuddlesworth wrote: »
    And our houses have these annoying easy access holes in them called windows.

    Should see how easy it is to remove the glass from PVC windows! :D


  • #117
    sk8board
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,402 ✭✭✭sk8board


    tjhook wrote: »
    I've heard about using a tin, but then I saw "a random guy on the Internet" test it, and it didn't work for him. Maybe it depends on the frequency/amplitude used by the fob, or maybe some tins are better than others. Either way, I invested in one of those faraday boxes, and tested that it

    I had faraday cases too, but we moved to the tin so we can both just toss them in there easily all day (we both drive both cars, so it saves constantly asking and searching).
    I tested it by holding it literally against the car door handle, even with the lid off etc etc, for sure it’s a metal case and no signal gets out!


  • #118
    digiman
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,237 ✭✭✭digiman


    Talking about alarms, do people think that a monitored alarm from phone watch or similar is worth it?

    I've got a house alarm that will send me a notification when it goes on/off. Also have Nest security cameras at front and rear of house. These in general go off way more than I would wish so a lot of the time I don't pay too much attention to them unless the doorbell camera is triggered.


  • #119
    SDKev
    Registered Users Posts: 83 ✭✭SDKev


    You should look into the new AI cameras available on the market, they are reported to eliminate 98% of false alarms.

    The cameras come with a built in speaker & LED

    When you fit the camera you can draw rules to trigger the camera / app / siren.

    Example.

    Rule 1
    Tripwire - draw a line across the front boundary of your house, if someone crosses the boundary, the camera can play a message "You're under surveillance"

    Rule 2
    Intrusion - draw a box around your car, if someone enters the box, it can trigger the siren / lights / app.

    They can be set only to work at different times / days etc.

    Loads of manufacturers have this functionality now but I've only used Dahua / Hik, loads of videos on YouTube showing how it works.

    *They're called Active Deterrent Cameras


  • #120
    tjhook
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 748 ✭✭✭tjhook


    Sabre Man wrote: »
    How did you test it?
    I put the fob into the box, approached the car holding the closed box with the fob in it, and tried to open the car door. It didn't open.

    Then I opened the box, and was able to open the door.

    Finally, I closed the box again, and attempted to start the car. It wouldn't start until I opened the box.


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  • #121
    CabanSail
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 9,047 CMod ✭✭✭✭CabanSail


    Those Teslas are so quiet it makes it easier for theives

    Maybe some external speakers which play the sound of an unmuffled V8 with a lumpy cam. You would hear that start up.

    Seriously it's nasty when these things happen.

    I had my old Diesel Rover stolen. Some members of a Minority Community knocked at the door and asked twice if it were for sale. The answer was No. Then a Transit with a Trailer pulled up and loaded it. The neighbor thought I must have sold it but took the number. False plates.


  • #122
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 17,728 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    LeBash wrote: »
    High end cars are a big target. If someone robs a bank they might get 20-30k and if they get caught its 10-12 years.............


    10 to 12 years would be the higher end, that'd be for a tiger kidnapping or if you threatened to shoot a AGS member or something rather then a standard ish armed bank job.

    A lad I know got 5/6 years for armed robbery on a bank, he was out after 3 or 4 iirc.


  • #123
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 21,179 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    No one really robs banks any more, crime is mostly going digital, it's far easier.

    In all fairness, I'd rather someone steal a car than be in a bank during an armed robbery with the potential of being killed.


  • #124
    Lumen
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 31,141 ✭✭✭✭Lumen


    Deleted User wrote: »
    No one really robs banks any more, crime is mostly going digital, it's far easier.
    I know someone who did an armed robbery of a post office. I don't think he had first-rate hacking skills. :D


  • #125
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 21,179 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Lumen wrote: »
    I know someone who did an armed robbery of a post office. I don't think he had first-rate hacking skills. :D

    Haha Really ? did he get away with it ?

    I don't think it would be worth robbing a PO or bank these days, you might get some cash in the tills but by the time they delay opening the vault the cops will be waiting and stalling time until the armed unit arrives, it's too risky.

    It's too easy to call people up and tell them they have a "virus" on their computer that the only way to get rid of it is to pay 200 Euro over the phone lol.

    Cash machines are a pain in the ass to get out then the chances of the notes getting sprayed with dye are too high. Not worth the effort.

    I suppose if someone's IQ is low enough these days and they are desperate they might try rob a PO or bank.


  • #126
    Mickeroo
    Administrators, Computer Games Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 32,400 Admin ✭✭✭✭✭Mickeroo


    Lumen wrote: »
    I know someone who did an armed robbery of a post office. I don't think he had first-rate hacking skills. :D

    It was his money, he just didn't want to fill out the forms.


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  • #127
    Lumen
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 31,141 ✭✭✭✭Lumen


    Deleted User wrote: »
    Haha Really ? did he get away with it ?
    Nope! He lost the game of getaway top trumps as the Gardai had a helicopter.

    Now, if he'd only stolen the helicopter first....


  • #128
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 17,728 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Deleted User wrote: »
    ........

    Cash machines are a pain in the ass to get out then the chances of the notes getting sprayed with dye are too high. Not worth the effort. ............

    €140k isn't a bad haul .......... I was working nearby at the time.....

    https://www.irishexaminer.com/ireland/icrime/140k-taken-in-cork-security-van-raid-179884.html
    Deleted User wrote: »
    Haha Really ? did he get away with it ?......

    I don't think the culprits were ever caught.


  • #129
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 21,179 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    140k ? ah might have been worth it then, hard to store/launder that cash though, maybe they know the right people.


  • #130
    copeyhagen
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,528 ✭✭✭copeyhagen


    RFID blocker wallets arrived from amazon this morning, tested it on another car with keyless entry/driving and couldnt pick up the fob, so that works.

    my dads idea of putting keys in tinfoil and leaving in fridge wont be required so :P


  • #131
    Gadgetman496
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,408 ✭✭✭Gadgetman496


    copeyhagen wrote: »
    RFID blocker wallets arrived from amazon this morning, tested it on another car with keyless entry/driving and couldnt pick up the fob, so that works.

    my dads idea of putting keys in tinfoil and leaving in fridge wont be required so :P

    Have you a link to the ones you bought from Amazon?

    How did your insurance react when you contacted them, and how hard will this terrible ordeal be on your next insurance premium?

    "Everybody is a genius. But if you judge a fish by its ability to climb a tree, it will live its whole life believing that it is stupid."



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  • #132
    unkel
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 65,724 ✭✭✭✭unkel
    Chauffe, Marcel, chauffe!


    Gadgetman496 wrote: »
    how hard will this terrible ordeal be on your next insurance premium?

    A theft is a no-fault claim. It should have no impact on either your no claims bonus or your renewal premium. Unless you have your insurance with a shower of clowns like 123.ie or liberty. Like one of the forum regulars found out when his car was written off because of flooding (also a no-fault claim) :(

    My ads on adverts.ie

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  • #133
    tjhook
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 748 ✭✭✭tjhook


    unkel wrote: »
    A theft is a no-fault claim. It should have no impact on either your no claims bonus or your renewal premium. Unless you have your insurance with a shower of clowns like 123.ie or liberty. Like one of the forum regulars found out when his car was written off because of flooding (also a no-fault claim) :(


    Ooh, do you have any more detail on the story above (searching "123" and "flood" didn't give me much)? I was with 123 for years, and recently changed to its4women. But I found 123 easier to deal with, although I never actually had a claim with them. I was intending to return to 123 next renewal...


  • #134
    Gadgetman496
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,408 ✭✭✭Gadgetman496


    unkel wrote: »
    A theft is a no-fault claim. It should have no impact on either your no claims bonus or your renewal premium. Unless you have your insurance with a shower of clowns like 123.ie or liberty. Like one of the forum regulars found out when his car was written off because of flooding (also a no-fault claim) :(

    I doubt that to be the case with any car insurer.

    "Everybody is a genius. But if you judge a fish by its ability to climb a tree, it will live its whole life believing that it is stupid."



  • #135
    wexfordman2
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,555 ✭✭✭wexfordman2


    zg3409 wrote: »
    Firstly they can lift/tow the car old school, secondly they can rip out the GPS and phone based equipment, they could put foil over the GPS antenna, how is it to know with no location if it is in a tunnel or underground car park?

    As for non manufacturer installed tracking, beware they may disconnect the 12v battery within minutes and put it on a tow truck or hidden in the back of a rigid lorry. Most half decent trackers need a sim card and typically need to be topped up at least every 6 months. A jammer will block these while jammer is on and near. There is cases of cars ringing home from Africa but from a lawless area. There are other really expensive trackers that use non sim card systems but these are normally reserved for high value targets such as supercars and often targeted company alarms such as white goods electrical shops.

    Some of these groups have been arrested and prosecuted, but while there is quick money to be made they will find a way.

    There is talk that the model 3 is less vulnerable to the signal relay attack but I would like to see that proven before I believe it.

    I would have though some basic logic in the car could easily alert that the car was in the process of being stolen.

    So, an owner registers his location, say home or work. The Tesla measures gps and mobile network and seta, as a benchmark..



    If during the theft process, both gps and mobile network is lost, set off the car alarm and cut the engine.

    In fact, any scenario where the vehicle looses both gps and network coverage while static should set off the car alarm and disable the engine


  • #136
    wcooba
    Registered Users Posts: 109 ✭✭wcooba


    wexfordman2 wrote: »

    In fact, any scenario where the vehicle looses both gps and network coverage while static should set off the car alarm and disable the engine

    Driving through tunnel traffic jams would be great fun then :)

    @OP - sorry to hear about your car. Now when it's gone - would you rather get another S or pick up new model 3?


  • #137
    wexfordman2
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,555 ✭✭✭wexfordman2


    wcooba wrote: »
    Driving through tunnel traffic jams would be great fun then :)

    @OP - sorry to hear about your car. Now when it's gone - would you rather get another S or pick up new model 3?

    Your didnt read my post then did you, try again.

    Edit :- Oops, sorry, didn't realise you were being pedantic, so just for you, I will re iterate.

    "In fact, when the car is not in use, and situation where there is a sudden loss of gps and network connectivity, should trigger the alarm and disable the vehicle ".

    Is that better ?


  • #138
    unkel
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 65,724 ✭✭✭✭unkel
    Chauffe, Marcel, chauffe!


    Gadgetman496 wrote: »
    I doubt that to be the case with any car insurer.

    With every proper insurer, a no fault claim like a theft will not affect your NCB nor your premium. Zurich / Axa etc. Check your small print

    Paying a low premium like with 123.ie and liberty might look attractive come renewal time, but if you claim it might not be so attractive any more

    Search the forum for the flooded Ioniq. I think he might have been with liberty

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  • #139
    sk8board
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,402 ✭✭✭sk8board


    unkel wrote: »
    With every proper insurer, a no fault claim like a theft will not affect your NCB nor your premium. Zurich / Axa etc. Check your small print

    Paying a low premium like with 123.ie and liberty might look attractive come renewal time, but if you claim it might not be so attractive any more

    Search the forum for the flooded Ioniq. I think he might have been with liberty

    Above is off topic, but I’ve got 7 premiums for houses and cars with Royal & Sun alliance (who trade as 123.ie) for over a decade, and I’ve found them excellent to deal with, prices are competitive, terms are clear, and the guys on the phones v knowledgable. All the policies means I’m dealing with them every 6-8 weeks :(

    Everything is fully comprehensive, €300 excess, and I get one ‘free’ claim in a 3 year period on each policy with no affect on NCD, however you lose any additional NCD discount for one year after the claim (I already have the max anyway) and lose the option to buy NCD protection for 3 years.


  • #140
    Kramer
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,227 ✭✭✭Kramer


    tjhook wrote: »
    Ooh, do you have any more detail on the story above (searching "123" and "flood" didn't give me much)? I was with 123 for years, and recently changed to its4women. But I found 123 easier to deal with, although I never actually had a claim with them. I was intending to return to 123 next renewal...

    For balance, several happy 123.ie customers posted here, with first hand experience.
    Do your research but I certainly wouldn't class 123.ie as "cowboys".


  • #141
    copeyhagen
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,528 ✭✭✭copeyhagen


    Gadgetman496 wrote: »
    Have you a link to the ones you bought from Amazon?

    How did your insurance react when you contacted them, and how hard will this terrible ordeal be on your next insurance premium?

    https://www.amazon.co.uk/Faraday-Lanpard-Blocker-Blocking-Security/dp/B07PP1X4MJ/ref=sr_1_3?crid=1JAJKEM5PPAMJ&keywords=rfid+key+pouch&qid=1582707916&sprefix=rfid%2Caps%2C393&sr=8-3

    we have insurance through a work broker so theyre pretty good, wont affect NCB or NCB discount.

    grand. forms sent in so now just play the waiting game id say. hopefully not as bad as when my toyota chaser was stolen, took the assessor months to come up with a fair price.


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  • #142
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 17,728 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    unkel wrote: »
    With every proper insurer........

    Paying a low premium like with ..........

    A case of you get what you pay for, it doesn't mean they aren't a "proper insurer".


  • #143
    AndyBoBandy
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,728 ✭✭✭✭AndyBoBandy


    copeyhagen wrote: »
    https://www.amazon.co.uk/Faraday-Lanpard-Blocker-Blocking-Security/dp/B07PP1X4MJ/ref=sr_1_3?crid=1JAJKEM5PPAMJ&keywords=rfid+key+pouch&qid=1582707916&sprefix=rfid%2Caps%2C393&sr=8-3

    Could these signal boosters that they used to steal your car also pull the signal from the RFID card that you'd get with the Model 3? and use it to unlock & start the car? (even if it's just to drive it 100 metres onto a loader).

    I'm collecting a Model 3 in 2 weeks, and am suddenly very nervous about the prospect of of the car being stolen, simply because of it's 'advanced' features!! (I'm also in Fingal like you).

    I've already come to the conclusion that we won't use the bluetooth/phone unlock feature (certainly at home anyway), and will just use the RFID card method (which seems sad that on a brand new car, we'll have to even do that to lock/unlock it, given we had a fob from our 14 year old BMW).


  • #144
    Peatys
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,881 ✭✭✭Peatys


    I'm sure it's nfc, and not Bluetooth used to unlock the car


  • #145
    AndyBoBandy
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,728 ✭✭✭✭AndyBoBandy


    Peatys wrote: »
    I'm sure it's nfc, and not Bluetooth used to unlock the car

    Either way, it can still be signal boosted and used to unlock the car right?


  • #146
    KCross
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,136 ✭✭✭✭KCross


    AndyBoBandy wrote: »
    Could these signal boosters that they used to steal your car also pull the signal from the RFID card that you'd get with the Model 3? and use it to unlock & start the car? (even if it's just to drive it 100 metres onto a loader).

    If its passive RFID then I dont think the booster method would work. I dont know for certain though, just thinking about how the boosters work and how RFID works it just doesnt seem like the same attack would work.

    Active RFID (like toll tags) have a battery, that can receive/send signals longer distance, would be a different story but I doubt the Model 3 has a battery in its RFID card.

    Think contactless bank cards.... have you heard of attacks where they can be used from a distance. I dont think you can.


  • #147
    AndyBoBandy
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,728 ✭✭✭✭AndyBoBandy


    I was thinking along those lines alright, but in this day and age, whatever the general thought is, there are I'm sure folks who are a few steps ahead.

    Also, if Pin to Drive can be disabled quite simply (as was mentioned somewhere else), that's fairly shocking....


  • #148
    KCross
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,136 ✭✭✭✭KCross


    AndyBoBandy wrote: »
    Also, if Pin to Drive can be disabled quite simply (as was mentioned somewhere else), that's fairly shocking....

    Was that confirmed though? I heard someone say disconnecting the 12V does it but Im sure Tesla would (or at least could) have addressed that, if it were true.


  • #149
    kev22185
    Registered Users Posts: 132 ✭✭kev22185


    AndyBoBandy wrote: »
    Either way, it can still be signal boosted and used to unlock the car right?

    I thought this was a much bigger issue for the Model S as you use passive key fobs for entry. Model 3 key cards and the phone-as-key are far more secure (is my understanding). No-one cracked the phone-as-key at the hackathon Tesla runs every year. They offered 100k if some one could.

    The model 3 fob itself requires a button press to open the door to make it more secure than the Model S fob.


  • #150
    AndyBoBandy
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,728 ✭✭✭✭AndyBoBandy


    kev22185 wrote: »
    The model 3 fob itself requires a button press to open the door to make it more secure than the Model S fob.

    It also goes inactive after a while if it senses no movement.


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  • #151
    copeyhagen
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,528 ✭✭✭copeyhagen


    didnt really want to go into that on a forum but apparently someone tried it last week and it did indeed disable it


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