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Iran Did Do It..............says Trump

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,299 ✭✭✭✭BloodBath


    notobtuse wrote: »
    Nobody and no nation is perfect, but for a little over 240 years the United States has been a beacon for the world.

    You have to be trolling at this stage.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,116 ✭✭✭archer22


    notobtuse wrote: »
    Nobody and no nation is perfect, but for a little over 240 years the United States has been a beacon for the world.

    A "beacon" for whom though?...certainly not for the native Americans who were the subjects of the worst genocide in world history.

    Or the millions of Africans dragged across the Atlantic to the slave markets of America.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,291 ✭✭✭✭Gatling


    Gringo180 wrote: »
    It doesnt say alot for humanity, when the richest country on the planet cant even afford there citizens universal healthcare, some beacon to the world alright!
    archer22 wrote: »
    A "beacon" for whom though?...certainly not for the native Americans who were the subjects of the worst genocide in world history.

    Or the millions of Africans dragged across the Atlantic to the slave markets of America.



    Unfortunately not all true sure it's not but hey let's just make crap up


  • Registered Users Posts: 8,136 ✭✭✭Odhinn


    archer22 wrote: »
    A "beacon" for whom though?...certainly not for the native Americans who were the subjects of the worst genocide in world history.

    Or the millions of Africans dragged across the Atlantic to the slave markets of America.


    Or the hundreds of thousands of people killed in their South East Asian excursion, the Iraq war and sponsorship of criminal regimes in latin america.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,291 ✭✭✭✭Gatling


    So Iran admitted they have the missing tanker MH RIAH after suffering some kind of technical difficulty it was towed to an Iranian facility ,
    The odd part is the owners have had zero contact with the ships crew and it's maritime transponder was deliberately switched off ,

    Which suggests that the ship was actually sized by Iranian forces who shut down/ disabled the tracking transponder.
    Add the fact that zero communications with the crew or vessel before , during and after suffering technical issues near Iran


    https://news.yahoo.com/latest-iran-confirms-arrested-french-083917423.html


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,291 ✭✭✭✭Gatling


    Odhinn wrote: »
    Or the hundreds of thousands of people killed in their South East Asian excursion,

    Were they the only ones involved in the south east Asia ,


  • Registered Users Posts: 8,136 ✭✭✭Odhinn


    Gatling wrote: »
    Were they the only ones involved in the south east Asia ,


    . The point, however, is that the USA has been less than a "beacon" on a number of occassions through out its recent history. Nobody is holding up China, Russia etc as such.


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,424 ✭✭✭notobtuse


    archer22 wrote: »
    A "beacon" for whom though?...certainly not for the native Americans who were the subjects of the worst genocide in world history.

    Or the millions of Africans dragged across the Atlantic to the slave markets of America.
    Again... Nobody and no nation is perfect. But if there was no US, what would the world look like? I think life on this planet earth would likely be pretty grim at this point. No country has given so much to so many so often, while asking for so little in return, for so little gratitude than the US. The fact is the US is the envy of the world… and rightfully so.

    You can ignorantly accuse me of "whataboutism," but what it really is involves identifying similar scenarios in order to see if it holds up when the shoe is on the other foot!



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,553 ✭✭✭Fiery mutant


    Odhinn wrote: »
    . Nobody is holding up China, Russia etc as such.

    That's because there is no possible way to hold either China or Russia up as beacons of anything, bar being world leaders in human rights violations.

    We should defend our way of life to an extent that any attempt on it is crushed, so that any adversary will never make such an attempt in the future.



  • Registered Users Posts: 582 ✭✭✭Hobosan


    archer22 wrote: »
    A "beacon" for whom though?...certainly not for the native Americans who were the subjects of the worst genocide in world history.

    Or the millions of Africans dragged across the Atlantic to the slave markets of America.

    Native American genocide... The modern equivalent to 'Blood Libel'.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 5,424 ✭✭✭notobtuse


    Hobosan wrote: »
    Native American genocide... The modern equivalent to 'Blood Libel'.
    You do realize that was all started and became set standards before independence... when Europe controlled what is now the US? It was America who set out to right the wrongs, although it did take far too long... even took a civil war costing 2 percent of the population... and some bumps in the road to justice were experienced.

    You can ignorantly accuse me of "whataboutism," but what it really is involves identifying similar scenarios in order to see if it holds up when the shoe is on the other foot!



  • Registered Users Posts: 582 ✭✭✭Hobosan


    notobtuse wrote: »
    You do realize that was all started and became set standards before independence... when Europe controlled what is now the US? It was America who set out to right the wrongs, although it did take far too long... even took a civil war costing 2 percent of the population... and some bumps in the road to justice were experienced.

    Well yes, but I'm going further than that by comparing it to Blood Libel, which was a myth to smear Jews, which proclaimed they abducted children for satanic human sacrifice rituals.

    The population of Native North Americans is estimated to be at most 3 million before Europeans arrived. This dropped to around 500,000 around 4 centuries later when census records began.

    There are many factors which led to this decline, including some massacres by certain factions which happens when people fight eachother. It was not a systematic genocide, never mind "the worst genocide in the history of the world".

    The 3 million figure is arrived at by calculating population densities and carrying capacity of all other hunter gatherer populations around the world and mapping it onto North America.

    Before this, idiots would pull figures like 20 million out of their asses and shout genocide.

    It's a complete myth.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,291 ✭✭✭✭Gatling


    Don't know if it's the MH RIAH which disappeared over the weekend or they (Iran) have siezed another tanker claiming it was smuggling oil

    http://news.sky.com/story/iran-seizes-foreign-tanker-with-12-crew-accused-of-smuggling-oil-11765614


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,291 ✭✭✭✭Gatling


    Gatling wrote: »
    Don't know if it's the MH RIAH which disappeared over the weekend or they (Iran) have siezed another tanker claiming it was smuggling oil

    http://news.sky.com/story/iran-seizes-foreign-tanker-with-12-crew-accused-of-smuggling-oil-11765614


    Same vessel iran claimed suffered technical issues and had to be towed,
    Now confirmed that they siezed the tanker MH RIAH


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,705 ✭✭✭Cheerful Spring2


    Gatling wrote: »
    Same vessel iran claimed suffered technical issues and had to be towed,
    Now confirmed that they siezed the tanker MH RIAH

    Confusion right now if this even happened. Iran claiming different things. I wait for proper confirmation from the owners of the ship.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,291 ✭✭✭✭Gatling


    Confusion right now if this even happened. Iran claiming different things. I wait for proper confirmation from the owners of the ship.

    Iran has confirmed it Iranian revolutionary guard siezed the vessel and said an Iranian court issued a warrant saying the tanker was smuggling oil .


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,705 ✭✭✭Cheerful Spring2


    Gatling wrote: »
    Iran has confirmed it Iranian revolutionary guard siezed the vessel and said an Iranian court issued a warrant saying the tanker was smuggling oil .

    Nobody wants to claim ownership for this ship i find that suspicious. Surely if belongs to some country there be claim made already. UAE, Saudis, UK and United States are not sayng anything. There a possibility the ship was spying in Iranian waters. I just find it strange nobody yet wants to claim the ship.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,705 ✭✭✭Cheerful Spring2


    Gatling wrote: »
    Same vessel iran claimed suffered technical issues and had to be towed,
    Now confirmed that they siezed the tanker MH RIAH

    It seems to be a large ship and not a huge oil tanker. It can carry oil, but not a tanker the size we have seen recently.


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,424 ✭✭✭notobtuse


    Nobody wants to claim ownership for this ship i find that suspicious. Surely if belongs to some country there be claim made already. UAE, Saudis, UK and United States are not sayng anything. There a possibility the ship was spying in Iranian waters. I just find it strange nobody yet wants to claim the ship.
    I've found little is said in these type of matters until the safety of the crew is obtained.

    You can ignorantly accuse me of "whataboutism," but what it really is involves identifying similar scenarios in order to see if it holds up when the shoe is on the other foot!



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,552 ✭✭✭✭Varik


    Iran hasn't said what ship it is people think it's the UAE ship. Ships disappeared right around that time.

    showphoto.aspx?photoid=756504

    Where it disappeared just on the iran side of the strait, ship was moving at a steady pace and it's not like it was very far into Iranian waters to make it any easier to spy.

    485605.JPG


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,705 ✭✭✭Cheerful Spring2


    Iran released footage of the tanker. I love to know who was onboard the ship, any foreign nationals?

    https://twitter.com/PressTV/status/1151879355863392256


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,291 ✭✭✭✭Gatling


    It seems to be a large ship and not a huge oil tanker. It can carry oil, but not a tanker the size we have seen recently.

    It's a tanker carrying over a million barrels of oil ,
    Not all tankers are super sized ,
    Iran Said it was smuggling said oil to foreign countries ,

    For all you know the UAE are keeping quiet working diplomatic relations to get the tanker released

    The above post define foreigners most ships crews are usually mixed nationalities

    But add the claims of they towed the ship due to it suffering technical issues


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,705 ✭✭✭Cheerful Spring2


    Gatling wrote: »
    It's a tanker carrying over a million barrels of oil ,
    Not all tankers are super sized ,
    Iran Said it was smuggling said oil to foreign countries ,

    For all you know the UAE are keeping quiet working diplomatic relations to get the tanker released

    The above post define foreigners most ships crews are usually mixed nationalities

    Looks too small to carry a million barrels, likely be lower then that.

    Smuggling oil from where?

    Its possible UAE is keeping quiet for diplomatic reasons.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,291 ✭✭✭✭Gatling


    Looks too small to carry a million barrels, likely be lower then that.

    Smuggling oil from where?

    No idea where or why they were smuggling oil from states that export oil ,or why Iranian courts believe they have jurisdiction .

    Dangerous game they are playing - sooner or later they will get a reaction they won't like


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,912 ✭✭✭ArchXStanton


    Gatling wrote: »
    No idea where or why they were smuggling oil from states that export oil ,or why Iranian courts believe they have jurisdiction .

    Dangerous game they are playing - sooner or later they will get a reaction they won't like

    Maybe its a reaction to...ya know...the Brits hijacking their ship,or is that OK when the US and its poodle do that?


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,705 ✭✭✭Cheerful Spring2


    Early reports coming in a US warship- USS Boxer, near the Strait of Hormuz last known position has destroyed or shot down an Iranian drone. Trump ordered it.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,705 ✭✭✭Cheerful Spring2




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,116 ✭✭✭archer22


    The warmongers can take their jerking hands off their mickeys now!

    It appears to be only an internal Iranian matter...seems the tanker was buying oil from unauthorised Iranian sellers.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,291 ✭✭✭✭Gatling



    So trump didn't order it , thought he will claim credit

    Ships Captain did .

    Scores are now tied at 1-1


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,705 ✭✭✭Cheerful Spring2


    Gatling wrote: »
    So trump didn't order it ,

    Ships Captain did .

    Scores are now tied at 1-1

    Trump may have ordered it. Reckless if the Captain did on his own. You can start a war doing this.

    It interesting development and Iran reaction to this we have to watch. US claiming they ordered theoperators of the drone to stand down, but i bet Iran will have a different account of events.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,291 ✭✭✭✭Gatling


    Trump may have ordered it. Reckless if the Captain did on his own. You can start a war doing this.

    Yes it's called doing his or her duty likely the ships operating in the are have no go protective zone around them at all times


    And of course iran will have a different claim of what happened but it will be different stories from the government, military and religious leaders


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,116 ✭✭✭archer22


    If it was only 1000 yards away...then it must have been only a little one they had bought on Aliexpress.

    Iran has lost a $150 drone.

    It has probably cost America tens of thousands of Dollars to shoot it down :pac:


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,705 ✭✭✭Cheerful Spring2


    Gatling wrote: »
    Yes it's called doing his or her duty likely the ships operating in the are have no go protective zone around them at all times

    USS BOXER is operationing in Iranian border waters. It has every right to fly drones in the sky.

    Trump announcing the shot down the drone. Bolton hoping Iran reacts!

    https://twitter.com/NBCNews/status/1151936090586177536


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,291 ✭✭✭✭Gatling


    On the same day this gets posted .



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,552 ✭✭✭✭Varik


    USS BOXER is operationing in Iranian border waters. It has every right to fly drones in the sky.

    Trump announcing the shot down the drone. Bolton hoping Iran reacts!

    https://twitter.com/NBCNews/status/1151936090586177536

    Are you reading that somewhere else.

    The entire strait isn't Irans.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,291 ✭✭✭✭Gatling


    Varik wrote: »
    Are you reading that somewhere else.

    The entire strait isn't Irans.

    International waters by all accounts .


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,116 ✭✭✭archer22


    Iran is running rings around them...America is looking more and more stupid and pathetic by the minute.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,705 ✭✭✭Cheerful Spring2


    Varik wrote: »
    Are you reading that somewhere else.

    The entire strait isn't Irans.

    It not east coast of America the drone was flying. It was flying over waters off the coast of Iran. US hostile sea deployments is causing the tension in the region. We have seen enough of this to know Trump and cronies are trying to box in Iran. The nuclear deal was scrapped by Trump and nobody else, all these moves are hostile acts.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,665 ✭✭✭jackboy


    archer22 wrote: »
    Iran is running rings around them...America is looking more and more stupid and pathetic by the minute.

    How is this a win for Iran?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,116 ✭✭✭archer22


    jackboy wrote: »
    How is this a win for Iran?

    Because if the drone had to fly that near the ship then it was little more than a toy


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,291 ✭✭✭✭Gatling


    It not east coast of America the drone was flying. It was flying over waters off the coast of Iran.

    Flying towards a heavily armed vessel in international waters ,
    Maybe they should have sent their revolutionary airforce instead might have scared off the American ship


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,912 ✭✭✭ArchXStanton


    Gatling wrote: »
    So trump didn't order it , thought he will claim credit

    Ships Captain did .

    Scores are now tied at 1-1

    The Dead Kennedys were writing songs about fellas like you back in the early 80s....scarily accurate



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,034 ✭✭✭mad muffin


    archer22 wrote: »
    Iran is running rings around them...America is looking more and more stupid and pathetic by the minute.

    That’s an interesting statement. Interesting indeed…


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,205 ✭✭✭Gringo180


    Funnily enough all this aggression from the U.S will make the Iranian people all the more determined. Pulling out of this nuclear deal has been a disaster and sends out a message for the future that you cannot trust the Americans.

    What makes it even worse is the economic terror campaign brought onto every single citizen of Iran by the Americans, its just so counter productive.


  • Users Awaiting Email Confirmation Posts: 1,105 ✭✭✭Limpy


    If you rewind the news every few years its always America and the lap dogs trying to change the government of countries, or to install puppets. Ordinary yanks don't care unless soldiers are Coming home in body bags. Nowadays they can just arm 'good' rebels and let them do the fighting which reduces the body bags going back home.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,291 ✭✭✭✭Gatling


    Gringo180 wrote: »
    Funnily enough all this aggression from the U.S will make the Iranian people all the more determined.

    What makes it even worse is the economic terror campaign brought onto every single citizen of Iran by the Americans, its just so counter productive.

    The Iranian people or their supreme religious leaders and the revolutionary guard.


    Because the people of Iran have no say in this zero . cleric's and old generals who support the same ideology the people of Iran don't support either ,do you forget the student protesters who were met with tanks and bullets when they asked for change .

    The Iranian leadership Have being exporting terror for numbers of decades do you think the people of Iran want that either


  • Registered Users Posts: 8,136 ✭✭✭Odhinn


    Gatling wrote: »
    The Iranian people or their supreme religious leaders and the revolutionary guard.


    Because the people of Iran have no say in this zero . cleric's and old generals who support the same ideology the people of Iran don't support either ,do you forget the student protesters who were met with tanks and bullets when they asked for change .

    The Iranian leadership Have being exporting terror for numbers of decades do you think the people of Iran want that either


    Who was sponsoring the assasination program targeting Iranian nuclear scientists?


  • Users Awaiting Email Confirmation Posts: 1,105 ✭✭✭Limpy


    Gatling wrote: »
    The Iranian people or their supreme religious leaders and the revolutionary guard.


    Because the people of Iran have no say in this zero . cleric's and old generals who support the same ideology the people of Iran don't support either ,do you forget the student protesters who were met with tanks and bullets when they asked for change .

    The Iranian leadership Have being exporting terror for numbers of decades do you think the people of Iran want that either

    Will you stop. The golden Boys of Saudi Arabia are responsible for more destruction in the west then any other country in the world.

    But that's OK because the are our allies and buy our weapons.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,912 ✭✭✭ArchXStanton


    Gatling wrote: »
    The Iranian people or their supreme religious leaders and the revolutionary guard.


    Because the people of Iran have no say in this zero . cleric's and old generals who support the same ideology the people of Iran don't support either ,do you forget the student protesters who were met with tanks and bullets when they asked for change .

    The Iranian leadership Have being exporting terror for numbers of decades do you think the people of Iran want that either

    Care to explain more about this exporting terror? I know another country with a long long list of regime changes/meddling,dubious reasons for starting wars with death tolls in the millions and is just an all round bully....and of course their people have no say in it


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,291 ✭✭✭✭Gatling


    Odhinn wrote: »
    Who was sponsoring the assasination program targeting Iranian nuclear scientists?

    Isreal supposedly.

    Who's being killing their own population for wanting change....

    Let's worry about the poor nuclear scientists helping weaponising nuclear energy


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