Pairc Ui Chaoimh re-development

rebel.ranter · 19-06-2010 9:02pm #1

http://www.hoganstand.com/cork/ArticleForm.aspx?ID=130500

Pairc plans get green light
15 June 2010

Cork county board have been given the go-ahead to redevelop Pairc Ui Chaoimh.

Cork City Council yesterday voted 17-11 in favour of GAA plans to buy six extra acres from City Hall to expand the stadium and attach a centre of excellence, with an all-weather facility, at the venue.

Without the extra land, the GAA would not have pressed ahead with their ambitious plans to transform Pairc Ui Chaoimh into a modern 50,000-seater stadium. The redevelopment is expected to cost in the region of EUR50 million.

Cork chairman Jerry O'Sullivan said negotiations will now begin in earnest over the financial terms of the agreement and is hopeful that the first phase of the development will be completed within two years.

"We're absolutely delighted and I think this a landmark day for GAA in the county," the Cloyne clubman said.

"I'm delighted for sports people in the entire county - and for the GAA people. But this is only the very first step and the real hard work starts now. We'll be negotiating with the City Council now to do a deal for the cost of the land.

"Then the planning phase will take place and certainly I'd hope to have phase one completed within a two-year term."

O'Sullivan admitted that he was concerned that the project might not get the City Council's blessing after City Manager Joe Gavin indicated last week that he would be opposed to giving the GAA all of the land they were seeking because he feared the impact it would have on the wider development of the docklands area.

Pairc Ui Chaoimh will be closed to big matches during reconstruction, but O'Sullivan is hoping it will remain open for local games.

I don't see the logic of spending millions on a stadium that will host 2-3 matches annually at a maximum that will require 50,000 capacity. Especially when you consider that Cork GAA officials in particular would be staunchly opposed to allowing the stadium for use by other sports. Also we have no had any concerts down there that I can remember since Oasis in 1996.

Why oh why do we need such a large stadium that will be on a par with Landsdowne our national Soccer & Rugby venue?
Is it just because we can?

Owen · 19-06-2010 9:18pm

I find it incredible that the GAA can do the likes of this, and not be questioned. Am I right in saying their books aren't inspected by independent bodies annually? Any other organisation spending so much money would be put through the wringer, but the GAA heads can pretty much do what they want.

SeaFields · 19-06-2010 10:01pm

I'm for it lads.

If you attend matches there regularly you would see how poor the stadium is. If your anyway tall your crammed into your seat and the tunnels leading to the stand have the makings of a serious accident someday.

And, its development that will lead to some construction jobs in the short term.

19-06-2010 10:42pm

can't really understand the negativity lads, i have next to f all interest in gaa but see no reason why they should not in ahead with it if they want. So what if its on a par with the aviva. Might lead to a decent concert or two down here in years to come.

Orizio · 19-06-2010 10:45pm

PaintDoctor wrote: »

I find it incredible that the GAA can do the likes of this, and not be questioned. Am I right in saying their books aren't inspected by independent bodies annually? Any other organisation spending so much money would be put through the wringer, but the GAA heads can pretty much do what they want.

Cork GAA's books are published annually. :rolleyes:

I'm sure Cork GAA can spend its money the way it wants.

D-Generate · 19-06-2010 10:47pm

About time it was re-developed. For a stadium of its size it has been kept in a state that should have it almost condemned. When it is re-developed hopefully more matches will be hosted at it and maybe the Cork GAA will be open to the idea of having non-GAA games being played there. The FAI played matches outside of Dublin so don't see any reason why they wouldn't play one there.

Orizio · 19-06-2010 10:47pm

RoverJames wrote: »

can't really understand the negativity lads, i have next to f all interest in gaa but see no reason why they should not in ahead with it if they want. So what if its on a par with the aviva. Might lead to a decent concert or two down here in years to come.

Yeah but the GAA is the most evil organisation created since the SS. Everything they do is automatically wrong, even if its buying land with their own money in a transaction green-lighted by the Cork City Council (who no doubt they all bribed with brown envelopes and incriminating sexual pictures).

Orizio · 19-06-2010 10:51pm

Regarding the development itself, unless they significantly improve the facilities of and access to the stadium its a waste of time and money. On the other hand if they get it right it would be very useful not just for matches but for concerts and possibly for future soccer/rugby world cup bids.

Orizio · 19-06-2010 10:55pm

Especially when you consider that Cork GAA officials in particular would be staunchly opposed to allowing the stadium for use by other sports.

GAA officials have come out and said that soccer and rugby won't be played in the Pairc? Like they did with Croker for example?

Also we have no had any concerts down there that I can remember since Oasis in 1996.

Well thats because its currently a ****hole - the development is intended to help draw in acts.

BUNK1982 · 19-06-2010 11:03pm

This vote was to ratify the council providiing the land - the GAA still have a lengthy planning process to negotiate and a lot of politicians in the opposing camp.

I'm all for the redevelopment of Pairc Ui Chaoimh but this particular plan doesn't sit well with me for a number of reasons.

Why develop a centre of excellence in an area that's already been earmarked for large-scale urban development. Surely they should build this seperate to the Pairc in an area that's more accessible or set it up in conjunction with CIT/ UCC and bring an element of sports science into it?

Also there's no doubt that Pairc Ui Chaoimh needs an upgrade - but a 50,000 seater stadium for 2-3 games a year??

Orizio · 19-06-2010 11:07pm

BUNK1982 wrote: »

This vote was to ratify the council providiing the land - the GAA still have a lengthy planning process to negotiate and a lot of politicians in the opposing camp.

I'm all for the redevelopment of Pairc Ui Chaoimh but this particular plan doesn't sit well with me for a number of reasons.

Why develop a centre of excellence in an area that's already been earmarked for large-scale urban development. Surely they should build this seperate to the Pairc in an area that's more accessible or set it up in conjunction with CIT/ UCC and bring an element of sports science into it?

Also there's no doubt that Pairc Ui Chaoimh needs an upgrade - but a 50,000 seater stadium for 2-3 games a year??

Your point about the capacity is fair enough unless they get other ways to fill the stadium - so basically big 'music' acts, like U2, Westlife etc.

namloc1980 · 19-06-2010 11:12pm

Orizio wrote: »

Regarding the development itself, unless they significantly improve the facilities of and access to the stadium its a waste of time and money. On the other hand if they get it right it would be very useful not just for matches but for concerts and possibly for future soccer/rugby world cup bids.

World Cup bids??

Orizio · 19-06-2010 11:14pm

namloc1980 wrote: »

World Cup bids??

Yes. They have these things called 'world cups' in soccer and rugby that you can apply to host you see, and then...

namloc1980 · 19-06-2010 11:16pm

Orizio wrote: »

Yes. They have these things called 'world cups' in soccer and rugby that you can apply to host you see, and then...

World Cups in Ireland....I think not.

Orizio · 19-06-2010 11:17pm

namloc1980 wrote: »

World Cups in Ireland....I think not.

It could be a joint bid with Scotland and Wales for example in Rugby. Although temporary seating might be a problem.

namloc1980 · 19-06-2010 11:20pm

Orizio wrote: »

It could be a joint bid with Scotland and Wales for example in Rugby. Although temporary seating might be a problem.

Well FIFA have ruled out joint bids ever again after Korea/Japan in 2002 so football is out. As for rugby the infrastructure in Cork is crap and would need significant upgrading and investment to even be considered.

Orizio · 19-06-2010 11:28pm

namloc1980 wrote: »

Well FIFA have ruled out joint bids ever again after Korea/Japan in 2002 so football is out. As for rugby the infrastructure in Cork is crap and would need significant upgrading and investment to even be considered.

The infastructure in Cork City itself? No doubt you are right, but we are talking about a joint bid a couple of decades from now anyway, plenty of time for things to change.

Orizio · 19-06-2010 11:33pm

rebel.ranter wrote: »

Especially when you consider that Cork GAA officials in particular would be staunchly opposed to allowing the stadium for use by other sports.

As an aside this is a big red herring, as I'm not sure what Rugby/Soccer games you expect to be played down here, considering Thomond is just up the road and considering Cork City Forus (or whatever) only get a few thousand per game.

namloc1980 · 19-06-2010 11:33pm

Orizio wrote: »

The infastructure in Cork City itself? No doubt you are right, but we are talking about a joint bid a couple of decades from now anyway, plenty of time for things to change.

Yes the infrastructure in the city and surrounding suburbs is crap and has suffered decades of under-investment and neglect. Hopefully this Páirc Uí Chaoimh redevelopment will kick start the whole docklands thing but I have a feeling it will be many years before anything happens at the Pairc.

namloc1980 · 19-06-2010 11:34pm

Orizio wrote: »

As an aside this is a big red herring, as I'm not sure what Rugby/Soccer games you expect to be played down here, considering Thomond is just up the road and considering Cork City Forus (or whatever) only get a few thousand per game.

+1. The Aviva Stadium is opening later in the summer and the FAI and Rugby are pretty much committed to playing all their games there.

Orizio · 19-06-2010 11:34pm

namloc1980 wrote: »

Yes the infrastructure in the city and surrounding suburbs is crap and has suffered decades of under-investment and neglect. Hopefully this Páirc Uí Chaoimh redevelopment will kick start the whole docklands thing but I have a feeling it will be many years before anything happens at the Pairc.

Can't disagree really, lets hope that we are both being too cynical however.

Orizio · 19-06-2010 11:36pm

namloc1980 wrote: »

+1. The Aviva Stadium is opening later in the summer and the FAI and Rugby are pretty much committed to playing all their games there.

Possibly some of the early Magner's League matches could be played down here, but then again they probably won't get enough of a crowd into to make it financially viable.

Buceph · 19-06-2010 11:37pm

Completely ridiculous behaviour. The council hand land over to the GAA, when they oppose the re-development of Musgrave park.

I have no problem with the GAA wanting to expand, but the council should treat all sports the same. The Munster redevelopment wouldn't have been as big, and was only based on the rezoning of land that Munster already had, so far less hassle for the city, and they blackballed it.

What's even worse is the response I got from over 25 councilors. I e-mailed a load of them a few days before the meeting, outlining why I wanted them to support the motion, and what the advantages of it were. I got a response from a grand total of one of them.

There are three viable big stadium sports in Cork, football, hurling and rugby (and lets hope soccer soon too.) All of them bring in money for the city, the council should be supporting all of them.

Orizio · 19-06-2010 11:40pm

Buceph wrote: »

Completely ridiculous behaviour. The council hand land over to the GAA, when they oppose the re-development of Musgrave park.

I have no problem with the GAA wanting to expand, but the council should treat all sports the same. The Munster redevelopment wouldn't have been as big, and was only based on the rezoning of land that Munster already had, so far less hassle for the city, and they blackballed it.

What's even worse is the response I got from over 25 councilors. I e-mailed a load of them a few days before the meeting, outlining why I wanted them to support the motion, and what the advantages of it were. I got a response from a grand total of one of them.

There are three viable big stadium sports in Cork, football, hurling and rugby (and lets hope soccer soon too.) All of them bring in money for the city, the council should be supporting all of them.

Link? According to wikipedia it is being re-developed:

In March 2010 it was announced that a major redevelopment was to take place at the ground. A new all seated West Stand would be built in the first phase of a development to bring capacity to over 18,000[3]. Construction is to start in January 2011 and planning permission will be sought for another similar sized East Stand.

Buceph · 20-06-2010 12:05am

Orizio wrote: »

Link? According to wikipedia it is being re-developed:

Best I can find is from January 16th here http://www.danboyle.ie/index.php?pageID=1374

The council separated the permission for rezoning and planning application in two pieces. Munster Rugby wanted to put some houses and private facilities on a derelict piece of land they owned next to Musgrave park. Part to fund it, and in part to add support facilities for the team and the two clubs that are there already. The council refused the whole plan, and saying that the two parts should be separate. Then they refused the support facilities and houses outright, saying there would be no rezoning from industrial ground because of future plans. That put an end to that redevelopment plan, as Munster Rugby couldn't afford it without the houses, and there wouldn't be the neccesary ancillary facilities.

Dan Boyle and the greens were the strongest opponent, as they had votes from residents near there, and they had some whacked out notion that the land could be used for a park, even though it was derelict industrial ground.

Munster got the funds elsewhere though, and put in the plan again without the rezoning needed for the derelict land. That was partly refused, again at the insistence of the greens and Dan Boyle. Again because he was canvassing for votes there. And a smaller redevelopment of only one side of the pitch was allowed. Which is a far cry from the total redevelopment initially planned. They have to apply for the other side of the pitch now and that's not guaranteed.

I've asked the greens when they came campaigning around me a number of times, and they all say it would be a blight on the land, pure rubbish as the architects had it developed in a way that the profile would be no bigger than what was already there.

It just pisses me off that the greens and council, as was shown by their refusal to even acknowledge the e-mails that were sent to them (I know a number of people who were ignored) refuse to even contemplate the idea that Munster Rugby could bring in 20,000+ people to Cork, a large portion of them visitors from other countries who'd have to stay in Cork. And they ignore the fact that Munster Rugby is a big international team, one of the few in Ireland, that succeed on all levels and have done for years.

Musgrave Park is a pitiful stadium, barely even a stadium at all. It holds only 8,000 or so. This means no Heineken cup matches could be played there. The next time the distribution of matches between Cork and Limerick comes up is in either two or three years. And Limerick, with a stadium that pulls in 20,000 people at least for every match looks a lot more attractive than losing 12,000 paying customers for a match in Cork. If the council had approved the plans we'd be in contention for a lot more prestigious matches, including internationals. Now it's going to be sub-par compared to what it could have been.

Orizio · 20-06-2010 12:10am

So basically it seems to be a very local problem with the Greens? Why did others in the council reject the re-development or do you simply not know?

I'd be interested in knowing who rejected and approved the re-development btw.

Dob74 · 20-06-2010 1:59am

Personally I think its a waste of money. Why should the GAA have two stadia within a mile of each other. The GAA should put there own money into Pairc ui Rinn. The council should take over Pairc Ui Caoimh and build a stadium for big matches. Cork v Tipp, Munster v Leinster, Cork City if they get back to europe.
A 35000 seater would be prefectly adequate, cork and tipp wasnt even sold out, they got 34000. Cork v Kerry only 25000. A 35k all seater with comfortable seating good for concerts etc.
Look at Limerick Thomond and the gaelic grounds up the road from each other. Both are empty most of the year.

Orizio · 20-06-2010 2:11am

Dob74 wrote: »

Personally I think its a waste of money. Why should the GAA have two stadia within a mile of each other. The GAA should put there own money into Pairc ui Rinn. The council should take over Pairc Ui Caoimh and build a stadium for big matches. Cork v Tipp, Munster v Leinster, Cork City if they get back to europe.
A 35000 seater would be prefectly adequate, cork and tipp wasnt even sold out, they got 34000. Cork v Kerry only 25000. A 35k all seater with comfortable seating good for concerts etc.
Look at Limerick Thomond and the gaelic grounds up the road from each other. Both are empty most of the year.

They can't significantly upgrade Pairc ui Rinn, there isn't any room, its surrounded by Cork Con's grounds and residential areas. Its also in an even worse position regarding access for large scale matches. Besides both stadiums serve different purposes, Pairc ui Rinn can only have club matches, Pairc ui Chaoimh has inter-county.

run_Forrest_run · 20-06-2010 7:49am

PaintDoctor wrote: »

I find it incredible that the GAA can do the likes of this, and not be questioned. Am I right in saying their books aren't inspected by independent bodies annually? Any other organisation spending so much money would be put through the wringer, but the GAA heads can pretty much do what they want.

what sort of nonsense is this?? Were you dropped from the U-12 panel all those years ago??

Owen · 20-06-2010 9:48am

It was a question! The 'Am I right' bit gives that away. It was something I'd heard from several people and obviously incorrectly assumed there was something to it.

On another note, will they be providing parking to cater for these 60k people in the new stadium? Blackrock/Ballintemple can barely handle the chaos from a normal match let alone a super stadium.

Cape Clear · 20-06-2010 10:07am

It will be interesting to see how much public funding will be made available to the sectarian grab all asses. Croke park is a perfect example of where not to build a stadium ie. peoples back gardens. if any other sporting organisation had a kip like pairc ui caoimh it would have been shut long ago by health & safety. Rule 42 mentality is alive and well.

namloc1980 · 20-06-2010 10:35am

PaintDoctor wrote: »

It was a question! The 'Am I right' bit gives that away. It was something I'd heard from several people and obviously incorrectly assumed there was something to it.

On another note, will they be providing parking to cater for these 60k people in the new stadium? Blackrock/Ballintemple can barely handle the chaos from a normal match let alone a super stadium.

I believe there was provision for a small carpark (400-500 hundred spaces) and that's about it. The re-development of Páirc Uí Chaoimh should be done hand in hand with a high capacity public transport corridor from Mahon Point into the city centre connecting to Kent and the bus station. Failure to do so will mean more decades of chaos in Ballintemple on big match days. Even for the Cork-Kerry game which had only 23k the traffic chaos was mental. In any other country a 60k seater stadium would never be considered without a plan to get that many people into and out of the area on public transport. But this is Ireland and the ' ah sur it'll be grand' attitude rules the day again.

Owen · 20-06-2010 10:40am

I live in a private walled housing estate. The Gardaí put barriers up at the entrance, and no parking cones around it too, but the match attendees just pull the barriers aside and force their way in. Its frustrating as anything, and the residents - not me - are considering calling the clampers over it.

But as the previous poster said, I would think that having a large capacity stadium would go hand in hand with a large capacity multistorey/underground car park and the infrastructure to disperse the traffic build up quickly.

rebel.ranter · 20-06-2010 3:07pm

I have no objection to Cork GAA spending their money on their stadium. Thrle problem lies with the inevitable tax payer funding that Cork GAA will seek to bridge the gap. That money would be better spent elsewhere. Why not go for a more modest redevelopment that meets the real needs. I understand the current problem with the seating arrangement at the moment. I still have the marks on my shins from the Cork-Tipp & Cork-Kerry replay.
My point relates to its size versus current & potential use.
I know for certain that while any of the current county board members are still alive there will be no other sports played here. My point being that this just re-enfroces the fact that the stadium will get little use.
If we take the example if Croke Park & its size. The ground has to reach a miminmum occupancy in order to just break even, would we be in the same dilemma with a 50k seater in Cork?

I was initially all for its redevelopment, the pride in having a decent stadium in the city would be nice, but it would really only come into its own 3 days a year.
As for the facilities, it's all very well having state of the art facilities for inter county teams, however inter county players are based all over the county & their needs are better met by the current system where they are enrolled in heir local gym. If th facity was tied to one of the colleges then it might add something to the debate. UCC have their own facility in the Mardyke though.
Let's see what the Cork-Limerick attendance is like today to see if the new stadium would be even half full.

namloc1980 · 20-06-2010 3:47pm

rebel.ranter wrote: »

Let's see what the Cork-Limerick attendance is like today to see if the new stadium would be even half full.

Down the pairc now. 15 mins to throw in and there's about 10k here. So 3 big games in the pairc this year and not one has even come close to the existing capacity not to mention 60k.

EDIT: official attendance 13,638.

rebel.ranter · 20-06-2010 5:02pm

So that is it for Pairc Ui Chaoimh this year. Is finished for another summer. Any back door games could easily be handled in Pairc Ui Rinn.
It reverts to a training ground for either the footballers or hurlers for the rest of the season.
OK we'll have some club championship matches but they would struggle to get a 15k attendance.

BUNK1982 · 21-06-2010 10:45am

It's also worth remembering that the Opera House may have to shut it's door for 3 months of the year to break even. This should put paid to any suggestions that the stadium would pay for itself via concerts etc.

Scalability is the key and there's no way that Cork can expect to maintain a 60,000 all seater stadium.

An ideal scenario as I can see it is that Pairc Ui Chaoimh is handed over to the city and redeveloped as a Municipal stadium with a 40,000 capacity (not a 40,000 all seater). The uncovered stand and and both terraces could be knocked and rebuilt at modest cost and the covered stand redeveloped to include the dressing rooms and other required facilities.

The GAA could spend their money on developing coaching facilities/ a school of excellence and use Pairc Ui Rinn as their de facto HQ.

The Pairc Ui Chaoimh stadium would easily manage the 2-3 big intercounty games a year and county finals as well as other sports and events.

21-06-2010 10:55am

BUNK1982 wrote: »

An ideal scenario as I can see it is that Pairc Ui Chaoimh is handed over to the city

Handed over ? Why would the GAA hand over a stadium ?

BUNK1982 · 21-06-2010 12:03pm

RoverJames wrote: »

Handed over ? Why would the GAA hand over a stadium ?

The GAA would hand over the stadium, or be force to hand over the stadium so that it could be run properly as a commercial entity that will break even at the very least and we wouldn't have to put up with endless debates over what can and cannot be played at the Pairc. The scheme would benefit the city/ county as a whole rather than a single sporting organisation - a municipal stadium.

It's not unreasonable considering the GAA are expecting the council to hand over land.

In many ways it's preferable for them as it leaves them with more funding to develop this school of excellence

21-06-2010 12:40pm

BUNK1982 wrote: »

The GAA would hand over the stadium, or be force to hand over the stadium so that it could be run properly as a commercial entity that will break even at the very least and we wouldn't have to put up with endless debates over what can and cannot be played at the Pairc. The scheme would benefit the city/ county as a whole rather than a single sporting organisation - a municipal stadium.

It's not unreasonable considering the GAA are expecting the council to hand over land.

In many ways it's preferable for them as it leaves them with more funding to develop this school of excellence

The GAA plan to BUY the land from the council, you reckon forcing the GAA to hand over a stadium to the council is not unreasonably. Oh my, new levels of madness being reached in here

And the council would then run it properly as a commercial entity, oh my God, those <mod snip> guys can't arrange the rubbish collection properly.

castie · 21-06-2010 1:06pm

Keep this civil please and less of the filter avoidance to abuse the council

BUNK1982 · 21-06-2010 1:38pm

RoverJames wrote: »

The GAA plan to BUY the land from the council, you reckon forcing the GAA to hand over a stadium to the council is not unreasonably. Oh my, new levels of madness being reached in here

And the council would then run it properly as a commercial entity, oh my God, those <mod snip> guys can't arrange the rubbish collection properly.

So the GAA buy the land from the council - my apologies.

What would usually with stadium owned by the city is that the contract to run the stadium is awarded to a private company. Pairc Ui Chaoimh as it stands is hardly ringing endorsement for the GAA's capabilities given the state it is in now.

Madness would be spending €50m on a 60,000 all seater stadium that can only hope for 2-3 capacity events a year, isn't allowed host other sports and already has 2-3 well established competitors in Thurles, Limerick and Dublin.

castie · 21-06-2010 2:04pm

The unique thing here would be that its all seater.

We currently have no major stadium operating that is all seater.

Aviva will be the first when it opens.

castie · 21-06-2010 2:06pm

BUNK1982 wrote: »

So the GAA buy the land from the council - my apologies.

What would usually with stadium owned by the city is that the contract to run the stadium is awarded to a private company. Pairc Ui Chaoimh as it stands is hardly ringing endorsement for the GAA's capabilities given the state it is in now.

Madness would be spending €50m on a 60,000 all seater stadium that can only hope for 2-3 capacity events a year, isn't allowed host other sports and already has 2-3 well established competitors in Thurles, Limerick and Dublin.

Also as many people have pointed out the stadiums entrances are a death trap waiting to happen. So it isnt just upgrading for the sake of upgrading. The safety increase will be huge Id think. Unless you think that since its only 2-3 games a year that the death trap should be fine.

namloc1980 · 21-06-2010 2:23pm

BUNK1982 wrote: »

So the GAA buy the land from the council - my apologies.

What would usually with stadium owned by the city is that the contract to run the stadium is awarded to a private company. Pairc Ui Chaoimh as it stands is hardly ringing endorsement for the GAA's capabilities given the state it is in now.

Madness would be spending €50m on a 60,000 all seater stadium that can only hope for 2-3 capacity events a year, isn't allowed host other sports and already has 2-3 well established competitors in Thurles, Limerick and Dublin.

Exactly. There were 3 big games in the pairc this year that drew 34k, 23k and 14k. There is no need for a 60k stadium in Cork. It would never draw a full capacity. A 35k all-seater with decent facilites and open to all sports would be a better investment but the GAA will never open up the pairc.

BUNK1982 · 21-06-2010 2:29pm

castie wrote: »

Also as many people have pointed out the stadiums entrances are a death trap waiting to happen. So it isnt just upgrading for the sake of upgrading. The safety increase will be huge Id think. Unless you think that since its only 2-3 games a year that the death trap should be fine.

There's no argument here, the Pairc Ui Chaoimh stadium needs to be upgraded for health and safety reasons amongst others. But it's not the most complex structure and shouldn't cost €50m. How much did the Semple Stadium revamp cost?

Also, where's the benefit in having an all seater stadium? The only reason that the Aviva is all seater is because of a FIFA ruling. I don't think it would work in GAA because you'll have higher ticket prices, less of an atmosphere etc.

The GAA are proposing a 60,000 all-seater - that's the same size as the Emirates and bigger than Lansdowne Road!

All I'm saying is that a better use of resources would be for the GAA to develop Pairc Ui Rinn to cater for all inter-county league games and club games up to quarter final/ semi final stage, invest in this Centre of Excellence scheme somewhere and leave the Pairc Ui Chaoimh site as a mutli purpose stadium that would host big GAA games as well as other sports/ concerts & events. It would be used all year round and could really kick start the docklands scheme.

21-06-2010 2:34pm

BUNK1982 wrote: »

leave the Pairc Ui Chaoimh site as a mutli purpose stadium that would host big GAA games as well as other sports/ concerts & events. It would be used all year round and could really kick start the docklands scheme.

Can you clarify the following please
- by leave, do you mean sell it to the Council or donate it ?
- as well as investing in Pairc Ui Rinn do you expect the GAA to also invest in Pairc Ui Chaoimh.

?

BUNK1982 · 21-06-2010 3:02pm

RoverJames wrote: »

Can you clarify the following please
- by leave, do you mean sell it to the Council or donate it ?
- as well as investing in Pairc Ui Rinn do you expect the GAA to also invest in Pairc Ui Chaoimh.

?

Depends on what kind of agreement they can come to.

The GAA will obviously push for a selling fee but the council could argue that the Pairc Ui Chaoimh is a public safety hazard and needs to be shut down, then slap them with a compulsary purchase order. If it were condemed then the Pairc wouldn't be worth much to the GAA at all...

So there are a number of options worth considering...

- The GAA could either receive a fee and then rent the stadium for big games.
- Hand the stadium over on the provision of them paying a reduced rent and having first call on it's use
- donate it in exchange for a site for the Hurling School of Excellence

an so on.......

MunsterCycling · 21-06-2010 4:39pm

TBH they should set the price for the land @ €15m - €18m an acre and if they can't come up with the money slap the grab all association with multiple H&S violations, pollution fines and a dereliction order, sick of an organisation that is built on discrimination having a hold on this country.

castie · 21-06-2010 4:42pm

BUNK1982 wrote: »

Depends on what kind of agreement they can come to.

The GAA will obviously push for a selling fee but the council could argue that the Pairc Ui Chaoimh is a public safety hazard and needs to be shut down, then slap them with a compulsary purchase order. If it were condemed then the Pairc wouldn't be worth much to the GAA at all...

So there are a number of options worth considering...

- The GAA could either receive a fee and then rent the stadium for big games.
- Hand the stadium over on the provision of them paying a reduced rent and having first call on it's use
- donate it in exchange for a site for the Hurling School of Excellence

an so on.......

Its almost impossible to upgrade Pairc Ui Rinn because of its position.

People seem to be very short sighted when it comes to the capacity also.

Rugby agreed on the Aviva Total and it looked slightly tight with demand.
Now that it is complete it is so under the demand level that it could be filled twice over!

MunsterCycling · 21-06-2010 4:51pm

castie wrote: »

Its almost impossible to upgrade Pairc Ui Rinn because of its position.

People seem to be very short sighted when it comes to the capacity also.

Rugby agreed on the Aviva Total and it looked slightly tight with demand.
Now that it is complete it is so under the demand level that it could be filled twice over!

What could be filled twice over?

Pairc Ui Chaoimh re-development

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