Changes in the GAA - super thread

Jaden wrote: »

doc_17 wrote: »

Dublin has about 1.6 million people?

1.35 Million

doc_17 wrote: »

It’s the money and, as important, the home advantage that sets Dublin apart. The players are obviously working hard but then again so would a Cavan footballer who, if they were winning AIs, could command €6000 appearance fees.

If you can name the Player and the appearance, I'll be impressed. If you can tell me how this contributes to all Ireland success, I'd be even more impressed.

doc_17 wrote: »

Take Dublin out of CP except for Leinster final and AI Final. Make Dublin travel to Castlebar, Killarney, Ballybofey for an AI semi. Make them do what everyone else has to do. Then all of this will stop.

Totally good with this idea. But the Democratic processes of the GAA will probably decide otherwise.

That said, I think the last All Ireland Semi to be played outside of Croker was in Cork in 1983...

Limerick in 2014 actually.

How does the money help that player? Incentivises him. Who is it? Ask Tomas O Sé but if he’s saying it then I doubt he’s picking it from the sky. Look at their twitter accounts...mostly advertising.

Leinster Council. Headed up until a year or so ago by John Horan. Take Dublin out of Croke Park and the counties were told they’d get less money.

Then, when they did make them play an odd game outside of CP they played in neutral venues. The whole thing is a joke in Leinster at the minute and a large part of the problem lies with the other counties not having the balls to stand up to the GAA

Jaden wrote: »

doc_17 wrote: »

Leinster Council. Headed up until a year or so ago by John Horan. Take Dublin out of Croke Park and the counties were told they’d get less money.

Then, when they did make them play an odd game outside of CP they played in neutral venues. The whole thing is a joke in Leinster at the minute and a large part of the problem lies with the other counties not having the balls to stand up to the GAA

Horan was Chairman from 11-14, not last year, but it's a minor point.

So the Leinster council hold a gun to the Leinster council's head, and demand that the Leinster council do as the Leinster council says, as regards where Dublin (and other Leinster counties) play in the LFC. And if they don't, the Leinster council will give members of the Leinster council less money?

Are you sure that's how it works?

Who says it works like that? I certainly didn’t. The Leinster counties vote to keep Dublin in Croke Park to generate funding. The Leinster council and the Leinster counties aren’t the same thing.

Laois got to play their home game against Dublin in Nolan Park. Then Louth had to play Dublin in Laois! That was the attempt that was made to level the playing field. And those were QFs. SFs should be neutral too.

This would be my idea of what to do with the Liam McCarthy structure

Think we need to make this championship more of an All Ireland one than Provincial imo

My idea run off the Munster and Leinster championships in a knockout style (ramdon draw im doing here)
Munster-
Qf- Cork vs Clare (Clare win)
SF- Limerick vs Waterford (LIM)
SF- Clare vs Tipp (Tipp)
F- Limerick vs Tipp (LIM)

Leinster
Qf- Wexford vs Carlow (Wexford win)
Sf- Kilkenny vs Dublin (Kil)
Sf- Wexford vs Galway (Wex)
F- Kilkenny vs Wexford (Wex)

then after that have 2x groups of 5 and each team plays 4 games each

Group 1
Leinster champs
Munster Runners up
one of the Leinster semi finalists
one of the munster semi finalists
Munster losing Quarter finalist

Group 2
Munster champs
Leinster Runners up
One of the Munster semi finalists
One of the Leinster semi finalists
Leinster losing Quarter finalist

No All Ireland Quarter finals
Top 2 in each group go through to the All Ireland Semi finals
1st Grp 1 vs 2nd Grp 2
1st Grp 2 vs 2nd Grp 1

Relagation Playoff- 5th Grp 1 vs 5th Grp 2
Joe Mcdonagh winner Promoted in losers place for the following year

I knw this system would seem a nightmare on the calender but it can be done and ill do it in a 2020 calender

Weekend of
9th/10th May- Munster and Leinster QFS
16th/17th May- Munster and Leinster SFs
31st May- Munster and Leinster finals
13th/14th June- Grp Matchday 1 (Prov champs week off)
20th/21st June- Grp Matchday 2 (Random draw for who gets week off)
27th/28th June- Grp Matchday 3 (Random draw for who gets week off)
4th/5th July- Grp Matchday 4 (Random draw for who gets week off)
11th/12th July- Grp Matchday 5 (Random draw for who gets week off)
18th/19th July- Relagation match
25th/26th July- All Ireland semi finals
16th Aug- All Ireland final

RoyalCelt wrote: »

Even Dublin fans now say Dublin should play less in Croker. Only the Leinster final should be in Croker. The super 8 should be one at home, 1 away and the 3rd neutral in a venue between the two competing counties.

Realistically Dublin should only play league final, Leinster final, all Ireland semi and final in Croker. That would be 4 trips a year assuming they are getting to all major finals. It wouldn't completely over saturate the experience and their players wouldn't feel like it's their proper home. It might also encourage the Dublin County board to get their finger out and build a stadium suitable for their needs.

Whilst I don’t really care about the games out of Croke park what size stadium do you think Dublin should build? A 30,000 on the spawell site was talked about and that would be great but it would seem like a massive waste of money to build a stadium that’s only needed 5 or 6 times a year. The hurlers don’t need much more than Parnell park can hold so it’s only needed for 3 or 4 home league games for the footballers and maybe 2 or 3 championship games between the footballers and hurlers. Obviously the hurlers would move in but it wouldn’t be needed. This would cost millions and it would only be built to stop people moaning about the dubs in Croke park. That just seems a waste to me.

Know it's not strictly what this threads about but the helmets need to be redesigned.

Ive seen so many dental injuries over the years caused by malficience. Think 4 extra bars on the lower half of the helmet would put a stop to this without hampering vision.

Alternatively, I wonder is it possible to make a clear Perspex type cover for the face mask to protect the eyes.

Don't think these measures are necessary in most cases but there's a rump of scumbags who commit these assaults and the costs/ recuperation are shocking.

kilns wrote: »

I am saying for the current team the funding was not a factor, the funding has helped clubs attract more children and for new clubs and areas where no children have previously been reached to be able now to be reached and brought into the game

If the funding is to have an impact it will be long term and you will see I would estimate in 5 to 10 years, however, if you look at under age success as a barometer than so far you could argue that funding is not directly related to success

Delusion stuff.

kilns wrote: »

If Dublin did not receive a penny of funding would we still have had Cluxton, Cooper, McCarthy, OSullivan, McCaffrey, Fenton, Brogan, Costello, Flynn, Connolly, Kilkenny, Mannion - yes we would

Has it not occurred to you that without that elite coaching, paid for by the rest of the country, throughout their developmental years, that these lads might not actually be as good as they are today?
Furthermore, would they all be playing football without all this extra funding invested? Or would for example, mannion have stuck with the soccer?
People talking about a golden generation of dublin players cant see the wood from the trees. For a start, they are from several different generations. Secondly, all mentioned bar brogan and cluxton, would have utilised these coaches. Its not a golden generation, it is in fact undeniable proof that the money is making a difference to the quality of players that dublin are able to produce..

Question to the dubliners on this thread

Do you realise the anger and frustration among rest of the gaa public over the financial doping?

Do you realise a big proportion of the gaa public have little or no respect for Dublin’s achievements over the last few years due to the financial doping?

I think Dublin are in serious denial about it all.

ToBeFrank123 wrote: »

The "Newbridge or Nowhere" saga revealed that a county like Kildare if given home advantage can give a good performance. Now it mightn't be enough to beat Dublin but they still should have the option to play Dublin in the championship in their home ground if they want.

Most Mayo fans couldn't make that game and yes it probably cost the GAA a few bob, as would any Leinster championship game outside Croke Park, although less so in recent years.

The issue is though, Leinster counties should not be threatened with a reduction in funds if they don't play Dublin in Croke Pak. There needs to be better ring fencing of monies, or better redistribution of money.

Dublin having all their games in Croke Park or at worst a neutral venue is inherently unfair to other Leinster teams.

Your issue here is with who decided where games are played. It was years of get Dublin out of Croke park. Now it’s out of neutral venues (which I assume are due to capacity issues but open to correction) along with neutral game shouldn’t be in Croke park despite it specifically stated as it is in Croke park. Dublin don’t have more votes than anyone else on this matter.

blanch152 wrote: »

Apart from a few journalists on a crusade and a handful of people on these threads, I have to say that it never comes up when I am talking to ordinary GAA people. Even when talking to mentors and parents at Feile, or other club trips, the talk is never about financial doping

Going by your responses on here, it is not really any surprise that they dont speak to you about dublin...

As for this thing about a 'handful of journalists on a crusade', i would say that every single journalist, outside of the vinnie murphy crew, have addressed this point at some stage in the last few years. The only guys i seen who were not stating it is a problem is a couple of kerry lads who are just trying run with the horse and the hound. It is the most talked about topic in the gaa today.

ToBeFrank123 wrote: »

:rolleyes:

On practically every major forum in Ireland there is at least one thread on financial doping in Dublin.

Every significant news outlet has covered the story, and where comments are allowed, there are usually countless comments about it.

That's not to mention wider social media such as twitter and facebook.

So how you can say "its only a relatively small number of people" or words to that effect is beyond me. Its just more of the usual denial of the truth and facts Dublin supporters are becoming famous for.

Agreed. They are just barefaced attempts to control the narrative. It is probably one of the most concerning and talked about topics ever in the gaa.

MayoAreMagic wrote: »

Agreed. They are just barefaced attempts to control the narrative. It is probably one of the most concerning and talked about topics ever in the gaa.

Control the narrative? Have a look back over this thread and see how many ‘typical Dub’ replies you see. Dubs are constantly shouted down and people say things like we already dealt with that or I knocked that out of the park, people keep declaring victory in the debate and pipe in when someone gives a view they don’t agree with and the amount of people claiming opinions as fact is astonishing. The only people here controlling the narrative are the people who use the term financial doping, it’s only because it’s a catchy phrase that it took off.

salmocab wrote: »

Control the narrative? Have a look back over this thread and see how many ‘typical Dub’ replies you see. Dubs are constantly shouted down and people say things like we already dealt with that or I knocked that out of the park, people keep declaring victory in the debate and pipe in when someone gives a view they don’t agree with and the amount of people claiming opinions as fact is astonishing. The only people here controlling the narrative are the people who use the term financial doping, it’s only because it’s a catchy phrase that it took off.

A perfect example of trying to control the narrative...

Financial doping is a bona fida term and is perfectly apt for the situation at hand.
The reason they are 'shouted down' is because their counter arguments are already disproven. The posters know this but post them anyway. Their mates like the posts, even though they all know its garbage. My personal favourite is 'why arent people shouting for kerry and kilkenny to be split?!' I dont believe anyone genuinely considers those things comparable, but it is a nice soundbite for people who want to avoid genuine discussion.

ToBeFrank123 wrote: »

Speaking of controlling the narrative, probably the worst offender is John Horan, current president of the GAA. Everyone sees some of the inherent imbalances in the championship and how and why they should be fixed. Horan just pretends they don't exist and always comes out batting for Dublin.

The President of the GAA is supposed to be impartial and take off the county jersey once they assume the role.

I'll stop short of saying its yet one more advantage Dublin have gained in recent years, but it would be nice to see the guy act fairly and impartially the odd time.

Agreed. He got badly exposed on the gaa hour this week. He gave a painful response recently about basically not knowing how the gaa financial system works. They then played an interview he did a while back where he describes the system and states how he himself was part of setting it up...
It was trump-esque

ToBeFrank123 wrote: »

At least you are no longer peddling the lie that only a small number of pundits, journalists and people on social media ever bring up financial doping. Progress I guess.

"Financial Doping" as it is termed, is a fringe issue. I stand by that opinion. Alas, it distracts from actual issues that should be discussed - which I feel is not a good thing. YMMV.

Jaden wrote: »

Outside of a very limited number of forums and threads, literally no-one has ever spoken with me about "financial doping".

I think there is a case to be made for saying that this specific thread is an echo-chamber.

Jaden. Just to say, you and your like are fooling NOBODY in the gaa whether in the hierarchy or grassroots supporters.