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Donald Trump is the President Mark IV (Read Mod Warning in OP)

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    #9032
    amandstu
    Registered Users Posts: 3,405 ✭✭✭amandstu


    PropJoe10 wrote: »
    40% of Americans approve of the job he's doing. It's worth stopping to think about how ludicrous that is for a second.
    ludicrous,yes but still needs to be understood.

    Anyone got a suggestion-or a link to a serious analysis?
    Could it really just be "he is a nutjob but he is our nutjob"?

    Have standards fallen so low?


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    #9033
    TRS30
    Registered Users Posts: 6,865 ✭✭✭TRS30


    PropJoe10 wrote: »
    40% of Americans approve of the job he's doing. It's worth stopping to think about how ludicrous that is for a second.

    Not that ludicrous when you have a two party system. A certain percentage will vote/approve a for R/D person purely because they are not a R/D person (interchange as required). The person themselves playing no baring whatsoever.


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    #9034
    Manic Moran
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 16,246 Mod ✭✭✭✭Manic Moran


    Hurrache wrote: »
    I'd listen to the Pasadena Firefighters Association and their correction of the statement from the Whitehouse.

    https://twitter.com/PFA809/status/1061307981638193152

    Again, I would point to the distinction between forest management and wild land manement. The former, agreed, does not apply to Pasadena. The latter certainly does, as well as the other issues mentioned and all fall under the same prevention/limitation umbrella. https://www.sfchronicle.com/california-wildfires/article/California-s-year-round-wildfire-threat-Why-13379734.php

    In a peripheral way, Trump’s criticism has some relevance, because there is a lot more that California would be doing. Moritz said that communities like Paradise, or Santa Rosa, were not prepared for the kind of devastation they were to face... Instead, it has been business as usual despite the fact that California is seeing larger, more frequent and more destructive fires... Moritz said that the biggest obstacle is the lack of political will to change things.... The stakes are high, said Tom Bonnicksen, a retired forestry and wildfire expert who spent years researching fires in California. “There are millions of dollars going into fighting fires, but there are not millions going into preventing the fires. “ One problem that Trump kind of got right, Bonnicksen said, is that a century of fire suppression has left California’s forests too thick. Recent fires have burned faster and hotter, he said, because of the high density of trees and abundant wood debris on the forest floor

    Second, California’s forestry management problems exist and are responsible for a large amount of the destruction we have seen in CA, including the largest fire of the season. The Governor says it, the California media says it, CalFire says it, and reports commissioned by the CA government says it.
    There is a reason why the Chronicle’s headline I linked to earlier is “Trump’s claim of Poor California forest management rings true, to a degree”. Or are you going to refute that a large number of the deaths we have seen the last few years have been caused by inadequate fire limitation measures?

    Now, you can take one of two takeaways from this. Either the Chronicle and other articles I have linked to so far are supporters of Trump and reinterpreting his statements, or they are doing exactly what I have done, stated that the Trump statements are idiotic, but using the opportunity of the talking point to bring to light a very real and lethal problem to the discussion table. There isn’t a hell of a lot California or even the US can do about climate change, especially in the near term, but there is a lot more which can be done by California and USFS for fire prevention and damage limitation, and which is not being done.

    So, perhaps for future framing of my posts.... Is this a thread about Trump himself, or is this a thread about the US insofar as it relates to Trump? Maybe because I live here, I have a different perspective on this thread than you do.


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    #9035
    Quin_Dub
    Moderators, Politics Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 15,079 Mod ✭✭✭✭Quin_Dub


    CNN asks for emergency hearing after Trump threatens to revoke Acosta's press pass again


    Not petty or vindictive at all..
    Last Friday CNN won a temporary restraining order, forcing the White House to restore Acosta's press access to the White House for 14 days. Judge Timothy J. Kelly ruled on Fifth Amendment grounds, saying Acosta's right to due process had been violated. He did not rule on CNN's argument about First Amendment violations.

    Later that same day, the White House sent Acosta a formal letter outlining a "preliminary decision" to suspend his pass again once the restraining order expires. The letter cited his conduct at President Trump's November 7 press conference.


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    #9036
    ct5amr2ig1nfhp
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,019 ✭✭✭ct5amr2ig1nfhp


    There are multiple lawsuits (over 200) against PG&E from Aug 2017 fires. A new lawsuit from Camp Fire residents was filed last wed allegeding gross negligence, with many more to follow. The company has already admitted it may have been responsible for the latest fires.

    All this talk of raking forest floors, yet I see little mention of any action by the administration against PG&E.


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    #9037
    FrostyJack
    Registered Users Posts: 1,731 ✭✭✭FrostyJack


    Manic Moran wrote: »
    So, perhaps for future framing of my posts.... Is this a thread about Trump himself, or is this a thread about the US insofar as it relates to Trump? Maybe because I live here, I have a different perspective on this thread than you do.

    I don't think anyone has a problem with better management or prevention rather than cure (fire fighting) is the best policy, it is that is not what Trump said, he lashed out like a child and then doubled down. Comparing forests in Norway to California and raking etc. He did not say we need to come together and help solve this problem, he just went on his usual rant, the same with every single thing he deals with. He has no clue what to do in any adult situation except lie, deflect or attack. I think most peoples problem is you don't join in the attacks on Trump for his daily f ups and scandals, which I don't think is necessary as enough people here do that. The issue is you only point out where things people say about Trump are wrong or how he is right. I cannot fathom how anyone could be bothered to defend him in anyway as it looks like you are just whitewashing over all the bad and nit picking small things where he is right or half right.
    In just about every area, except the economy, which he lucked into, he has to be the worst president ever, and when that tanks thanks to his shortsighted policies what can you grasp onto?


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    #9038
    eire4
    Registered Users Posts: 6,640 ✭✭✭eire4


    TRS30 wrote: »
    Not that ludicrous when you have a two party system. A certain percentage will vote/approve a for R/D person purely because they are not a R/D person (interchange as required). The person themselves playing no baring whatsoever.

    Your absolutely correct there with that statement sadly in terms of how some Americans vote/approve based only on the letter after the name. I will take it a step further though and say that America as a country is pretty right wing in general. The so called left in American politics the Democratic party are at best a centrist party and that is mostly due to its leanings on social issues. Economically it is center right no question. They are not even in favour of a national health care system. So the reality is there is no true left wing in American politics at all.


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    #9039
    Leroy42
    Registered Users Posts: 15,495 ✭✭✭✭Leroy42


    So there is an argument that these wildfires have, at least in part, been exacerbated by poor planning and management by the local authorities.

    But instead of a thought out response showing that proper management of our environs is good for both us and the planet, Trump ends up messing up the message by getting confused and talking about raking the forests and Finland.

    Its only a pity that the US is so totally failed by the one person they wanted to lead them.


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    #9040
    amandstu
    Registered Users Posts: 3,405 ✭✭✭amandstu


    Manic Moran wrote: »
    There isn’t a hell of a lot California or even the US can do about climate change, especially in the near term,.

    They can choose not to vote for parties that support a president that calls "climate change" a "Chinese hoax"
    and attempts to make political capital out of the coal lobby.


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    #9041
    Penn
    Registered Users Posts: 33,291 ✭✭✭✭Penn


    Three Democratic Senators have filed a lawsuit over Whitaker's appointment as Acting Attorney General

    https://edition.cnn.com/2018/11/19/politics/democrats-lawsuit-whitaker-appointment/index.html


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    #9042
    Leroy42
    Registered Users Posts: 15,495 ✭✭✭✭Leroy42


    US can do little about climate change?

    The most powerful country the world has ever known suddenly totally at the whims of the rest if the world.

    MAGA seems to be going well!


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    #9043
    everlast75
    Registered Users Posts: 19,067 ✭✭✭✭everlast75


    Another embarassing climb down for the WH...



    https://twitter.com/CNNPR/status/1064618544921526273?s=19


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    #9044
    dr.fuzzenstein
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 16,635 ✭✭✭✭dr.fuzzenstein


    Wonder will Trump ever answer one of his questions ever again..


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    #9045
    Nody
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 18,266 CMod ✭✭✭✭Nody


    dr.fuzzenstein wrote: »
    Wonder will Trump ever answer one of his questions ever again..
    Well the new policy is to only allow one question per journalist and president can answer follow up question "at his discretion". Hence expect rambling without answering and simply moving on in normal Trump style.


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    #9046
    everlast75
    Registered Users Posts: 19,067 ✭✭✭✭everlast75


    dr.fuzzenstein wrote: »
    Wonder will Trump ever answer one of his questions ever again..

    Imagine if all the other press corp donated their time to Acosta...


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    #9047
    everlast75
    Registered Users Posts: 19,067 ✭✭✭✭everlast75


    everlast75 wrote: »
    And we still haven't talked about his interview with Fox in which he showed even more disrespect for the Armed Forces..

    President Donald Trump derided retired Adm. William H. McRaven as a "Hillary Clinton fan" and an "Obama backer" and suggested that the former head of U.S. Special Operations Command should have apprehended Osama bin Laden faster.
    The comments, which the president made in an interview with Chris Wallace on "Fox News Sunday," represent the latest point of tension between Trump and a group of retired general officers who have criticized the commander-in-chief publicly for his handling of national security and military matters.

    McRaven, a retired Navy SEAL, oversaw the 2011 operation that killed bin Laden at a compound in Abbottabad, Pakistan. After Trump revoked former CIA director John Brennan's security clearance in the summer, McRaven wrote an article in The Washington Post defending Brennan as a man of unparalleled integrity and asked the president to revoke his clearance, as well, in solidarity. McRaven also criticized Trump more broadly.

    "Like most Americans, I had hoped that when you became president, you would rise to the occasion and become the leader this great nation needs," McRaven wrote. "A good leader tries to embody the best qualities of his or her organization. A good leader sets the example for others to follow. A good leader always puts the welfare of others before himself or herself."

    "Your leadership, however, has shown little of these qualities," McRaven added. "Through your actions, you have embarrassed us in the eyes of our children, humiliated us on the world stage and, worst of all, divided us as a nation."

    The commentary amounted to a rare public rebuke by a former flag officer, most of whom tend to stay quiet on political matters after retiring, and escalated calls for McRaven to run for public office.

    On Sunday, about three months later, Trump fired back at the retired admiral when Wallace brought him up in the interview.

    "Bill McRaven, retired admiral, Navy SEAL, 37 years, former head of U.S. Special Operations, who led the operations, commanded the operations that took down Saddam Hussein and that killed Osama bin Laden, says that your sentiment is the greatest threat to democracy in his lifetime," Wallace said, as Trump interrupted him to call the former top commander a "Hillary Clinton fan."


    Trump then accused McRaven of not finding bin Laden fast enough.

    "Wouldn't it have been nice if we got Osama bin Laden a lot sooner than that, wouldn't it have been nice?" the president said. "You know, living - think of this - living in Pakistan, beautifully in Pakistan, in what I guess they considered a nice mansion, I don't know, I've seen nicer. But living in Pakistan right next to the military academy, everybody in Pakistan knew he was there."

    This is the GOP rowing in behind Trump, attacking the man behind the OBL killing....

    https://twitter.com/GOP/status/1064568870613200896?s=19


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    #9048
    Den14
    Registered Users Posts: 136 ✭✭Den14


    Manic Moran wrote: »
    Again, I would point to the distinction between forest management and wild land manement. The former, agreed, does not apply to Pasadena. The latter certainly does, as well as the other issues mentioned and all fall under the same prevention/limitation umbrella. https://www.sfchronicle.com/california-wildfires/article/California-s-year-round-wildfire-threat-Why-13379734.php

    In a peripheral way, Trump’s criticism has some relevance, because there is a lot more that California would be doing. Moritz said that communities like Paradise, or Santa Rosa, were not prepared for the kind of devastation they were to face... Instead, it has been business as usual despite the fact that California is seeing larger, more frequent and more destructive fires... Moritz said that the biggest obstacle is the lack of political will to change things.... The stakes are high, said Tom Bonnicksen, a retired forestry and wildfire expert who spent years researching fires in California. “There are millions of dollars going into fighting fires, but there are not millions going into preventing the fires. “ One problem that Trump kind of got right, Bonnicksen said, is that a century of fire suppression has left California’s forests too thick. Recent fires have burned faster and hotter, he said, because of the high density of trees and abundant wood debris on the forest floor

    Second, California’s forestry management problems exist and are responsible for a large amount of the destruction we have seen in CA, including the largest fire of the season. The Governor says it, the California media says it, CalFire says it, and reports commissioned by the CA government says it.
    There is a reason why the Chronicle’s headline I linked to earlier is “Trump’s claim of Poor California forest management rings true, to a degree”. Or are you going to refute that a large number of the deaths we have seen the last few years have been caused by inadequate fire limitation measures?

    Now, you can take one of two takeaways from this. Either the Chronicle and other articles I have linked to so far are supporters of Trump and reinterpreting his statements, or they are doing exactly what I have done, stated that the Trump statements are idiotic, but using the opportunity of the talking point to bring to light a very real and lethal problem to the discussion table. There isn’t a hell of a lot California or even the US can do about climate change, especially in the near term, but there is a lot more which can be done by California and USFS for fire prevention and damage limitation, and which is not being done.

    So, perhaps for future framing of my posts.... Is this a thread about Trump himself, or is this a thread about the US insofar as it relates to Trump? Maybe because I live here, I have a different perspective on this thread than you do.
    It's a breath of fresh air to see some perspective in here rather than the usual anti Trump mud slinging echo chamber ranting.


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    #9049
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Den14 wrote: »
    It's a breath of fresh air to see some perspective in here rather than the usual anti Trump mud slinging echo chamber ranting.

    In fairness to Manic, his posts are always well structured and argued. The same cannot be said for most of the Trump fans drive by troll posts.


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    #9050
    Thargor
    Registered Users Posts: 17,881 ✭✭✭✭Thargor


    Den14 wrote: »
    It's a breath of fresh air to see some perspective in here rather than the usual anti Trump mud slinging echo chamber ranting.
    FFS its not an echo chamber when the guy is a complete moron and utter embarrassment, do you ever read the transcripts of what he says? Finnish people raking the forests that cover 90% of their country to prevent forest fires etc? You expect to see people in here praising him?


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    #9051
    Leroy42
    Registered Users Posts: 15,495 ✭✭✭✭Leroy42


    But Manics posts, while well structured and informative, are simply his reinterpretation of what he thinks Trump was probably trying to say.

    There is no evidence that Trump has thought about any matter as deeply as Manic.

    What Manic attempts to do is to shadow some degree of thought and nuance onto the ramblings and lies that Trump continuously spews forth.

    He never seems to take anything other than the purest version of what Trump could have meant, everything is painted on the biased view that Democrats are bad and Trump is good and thus within every utterance, no matter how inane, must be a grain of truth that therefore proves that Trump is right.


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    #9052
    Water John
    Registered Users Posts: 21,144 ✭✭✭✭Water John


    The Finns are taking the p**s out of him. Very funny, mocking Trump, really is the answer to him.


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    #9053
    pixelburp
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 35,941 CMod ✭✭✭✭pixelburp


    Den14 wrote: »
    It's a breath of fresh air to see some perspective in here rather than the usual anti Trump mud slinging echo chamber ranting.

    If you think the thread is one-sided, then feel free to contribute and challenge the posts of users - instead of taking potshots at contributors. Hurling on the ditch n' all that.

    To be honest, many posts simply print the actual opinions, tweets or evidence of Trumps own words; IMO the man is not particularly eloquent or intelligent yet is quite vocal to boot - so I'd be curious as to how you construe an under-educated man as contrary wise.

    Or separate to Trump: do you feel Secretary DeVos costing the taxpayer $20 million for 24 hour Marshals protection is a good indicator of proof towards the promise to 'drain the swamp' ?


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    #9054
    everlast75
    Registered Users Posts: 19,067 ✭✭✭✭everlast75


    Lock her up... Lock her... ah what's the point..



    https://twitter.com/kylegriffin1/status/1064664626259001345?s=19


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    #9055
    Frank Bullitt
    Registered Users Posts: 11,301 ✭✭✭✭Frank Bullitt


    everlast75 wrote: »
    This is the GOP rowing in behind Trump, attacking the man behind the OBL killing....

    https://twitter.com/GOP/status/1064568870613200896?s=19

    Yikes, backing someone who dodged the draft over a former Navy SEAL and Admiral...new lows being reached.

    Trumps response, again, is utter garbage.
    "OK, he's a Hilary Clinton backer and an Obama-backer, and frankly ... wouldn't it have been nice if we got Osama bin Laden a lot sooner than that? Wouldn't it have been nice? You know, living -- think of this -- living in Pakistan, beautifully in Pakistan."


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    #9056
    joe40
    Registered Users Posts: 3,811 ✭✭✭joe40


    I just saw the clip where trump visited the town of Paradise, and refered to it as Pleasure, twice before been corrected.
    It reminded me of someone suffering from early stages of dementia.
    That was a genuine thought and I'm conscious that dementia is a terrible disease and I'm not making light of it.
    But to visit a town in those circumstances and then forget the name is not normal cognitive behaviour for me.


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    #9057
    aloyisious
    Registered Users Posts: 11,554 ✭✭✭✭aloyisious


    Quin_Dub wrote: »
    CNN asks for emergency hearing after Trump threatens to revoke Acosta's press pass again


    Not petty or vindictive at all..

    It's petty in the least as the temporary [restraining] order is only in existence until the judge makes his final ruling on the CNN [restore the pass] application. It remains to be seen what the judge decides his full judgement is to be and if he thinks the presidents statement is an attempt to supplant his authority before that or just the presidents usual bluster. Don's made his opinion on judges plain in the past where it comes to decisions affecting what he sees to be his position and status in society. Blame his subservient lawyers for boosting his opinion of his own superiority.


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    #9058
    amandstu
    Registered Users Posts: 3,405 ✭✭✭amandstu


    joe40 wrote: »
    I just saw the clip where trump visited the town of Paradise, and refered to it as Pleasure, twice before been corrected.
    It reminded me of someone suffering from early stages of dementia.
    That was a genuine thought and I'm conscious that dementia is a terrible disease and I'm not making light of it.
    But to visit a town in those circumstances and then forget the name is not normal cognitive behaviour for me.

    A full physical and mental medical for any US president should surely be mandatory.Has Trump had one since he became president?

    We know how he wrote his own medical report in the run up to the election.Has anything changed since?


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    #9059
    Penn
    Registered Users Posts: 33,291 ✭✭✭✭Penn


    So far this week, we've had Trump denigrating the guy responsible for helping take down Bin Laden, Trump claiming that past governments should have listened to his pre-9/11 warnings about Bin Laden (basically implying 9/11 may not have happened if the US Government had read his book), Ivanka caught using personal email account for federal business, and Trump now pulling the troops he sent to the border to stop the 'caravan of immigrants' back at a cost of approx. $200m even though the troops wouldn't have been able to interact with the migrants but simply help support the actual border patrol agents and it was obviously just an election stunt, again, at a cost of $200m.

    But at least he's giving middle America what they want!


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    #9060
    duploelabs
    Registered Users Posts: 11,160 ✭✭✭✭duploelabs


    amandstu wrote: »
    A full physical and mental medical for any US president should surely be mandatory.Has Trump had one since he became president?

    We know how he wrote his own medical report in the run up to the election.Has anything changed since?
    He had one
    https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-43970908


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    #9061
    Quin_Dub
    Moderators, Politics Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 15,079 Mod ✭✭✭✭Quin_Dub


    joe40 wrote: »
    I just saw the clip where trump visited the town of Paradise, and refered to it as Pleasure, twice before been corrected.
    It reminded me of someone suffering from early stages of dementia.
    That was a genuine thought and I'm conscious that dementia is a terrible disease and I'm not making light of it.
    But to visit a town in those circumstances and then forget the name is not normal cognitive behaviour for me.

    To be honest , whilst I do think his general health is a real concern I'm not convinced of there being mental issues (dementia or whatever).

    Stuff like the above , forgetting the name of a town devastated by fire isn't for me a sign of mental impairment from illness or age.

    It's just another example of his utter lack of empathy for anyone or anything that doesn't directly impact him.

    He forgot the name because it simply doesn't matter to him , he just doesn't care and is incapable of even pretending to make it look like he cares.


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