Yellow vest movement ireland

Franz Von Peppercorn · 13-12-2018 4:09pm

Ray Palmer wrote: »

It is obviously driving more and not population increase. When I was a child only one car per household and many with none. Many grandparents didn't have cars now they do. Many households now have over 2 cars now. Then they use them for very small journeys because they have paid for them.

we were talking about the recent failures to meet our climate change emissions, agreed I think at Paris. So stories about grandparents aren’t really an answer to that particular question.

It’s a false dichotomy anyway - as both car usage per capita and population increases would have increased emissions.

I’ve yet to see a 3 car family. There are plenty two car families with two people working which is something else we should improve on. Public transport.

Franz Von Peppercorn · 13-12-2018 4:10pm

whisky_galore wrote: »

Why should ordinary people be slapped around without providing any alternatives? Thank fook you're not in charge of anything.

He’s right though. The taxes have to change behaviour. So they have to hurt.

But if they hurt you get the yellow vests

dundalkfc10 · 13-12-2018 4:11pm

sjb25 wrote: »

Exactly..... a protest is it ah no sure ‘‘tis to cold for that and sure match is on the Telly that day and I’m out for a few pints and anyway sure wouldn’t do anything the baxstards wouldn’t listen to us

Why protest?

The same bunch of clowns will be in charge of us for years to come.

Failing Health System, Failing Education, Housing at emergency levels and the Govt have got given the job for another year.

All this talk about McGregor a scumbag etc . LEO is a Scumbag!

Wheeliebin30 · 13-12-2018 4:11pm

There was an ice age 30,000 years ago and ther will be one again soon yet people blame humans for climate change??

Wheeliebin30 · 13-12-2018 4:12pm

dundalkfc10 wrote: »

Why protest?

The same bunch of clowns will be in charge of us for years to come.

Failing Health System, Failing Education, Housing at emergency levels and the Govt have got given the job for another year.

All this talk about McGregor a scumbag etc . LEO is a Scumbag!

Failing education?????

Guy:Incognito · 13-12-2018 4:15pm

John Sacrimoni wrote: »

id never condone that.
In an ideal world none of that would not happen. Even with 99% of protestors with good intentions the 1% of bogeys would still spoil it.

Government buildings would be legitimate targets. Id like to see them try stop 50,000 people heading through them dail gates.

This is all hypothetical anyway, i dont think we are anywhere near a point where any of that would be warranted.

And who pays for government buildings?

whisky_galore · 13-12-2018 4:15pm

Franz Von Peppercorn wrote: »

He’s right though. The taxes have to change behaviour. So they have to hurt.

Bit of they hurt you get the yellow vests

So we all have to walk to work now, because there's no public transport and driving has become something only the rich can afford?
It's a bit Irish.

Earthsnotflat · 13-12-2018 4:17pm

Yes but do you not think there is nothing new under the sun? I mean what really people expect to achieve by protesting against governments, yes there is lots of wrong in our societies, lots of injustice and inequality, but are people waiting for saviour? Someone to heal all that is wrong? What I mean when there's need there might just be someone round the corner to fill the void.. I prefer imperfect government protecting some basic freedoms and order than 'saviours' with ready answers

For Forks Sake · 13-12-2018 4:18pm

You know that no matter how well intentioned any protest may be, those Eirigi muppets are going to show up and f*ck it up.

Ray Palmer · 13-12-2018 4:20pm

DS86DS wrote: »

What a load of crap. The "permanently outraged classes".....the smug, arrogant and elitist left that run Ireland today like every other country in Western Europe...............are the ones that find the most ridiculous things to be outrsged by, including for anybody DARING to have an opinion on the EU or immigration differing from there's.

So you are basically calling for some kind of birth right like royalty of old but at a lower level so you have more rights.

Your annoyance seems to be the lower less privileged people don't like that people with less opportunities in life can compete with them. Do you see how they would see you as the privileged one?

You are more than welcome to your opinions but certain things are beyond your choice and will not change. They are the pillars of agreements the country made decades ago. Like people asking for capital punishment to return. It can't happen, we signed an agreement and it part of our EU membership. Same with refugees. Same mentality, it was democratic and is binding. You can't do what you want and that is the end of it. You can keep your opinion all you like and nobody is stopping you but it can't happen without some other massive changes that won't happen.

yourdeadwright · 13-12-2018 4:21pm

People are odd,

We are actually part of this bio sphere, the bio sphere created us , Basically we are they same thing as the world we live in,

Will climates changes because of us yes they will have an effect but that just part of the bio sphere evolving its going to happen no mater what,

Its like you see add's that animas are going extinct and we most save them but they fail to tell you that 99% of all Earth species to have lived on this planet are now Extinct ,It happened since time began ,

We get so caught up in our little time frame we imagine everything is new, but its all happened before , Don't be to worried about things you can't effect and enjoy your life ,

,

Ray Palmer · 13-12-2018 4:24pm

whisky_galore wrote: »

So we all have to walk to work now, because there's no public transport and driving has become something only the rich can afford?
It's a bit Irish.

Something that is happening all around the world and you think there is something uniquely "Irish" about it?:rolleyes: Some people really need to look outside their own little bubble and check out the rest of the world

whisky_galore · 13-12-2018 4:26pm

Ray Palmer wrote: »

Something that is happening all around the world and you think there is something uniquely "Irish" about it?:rolleyes: Some people really need to look outside their own little bubble and check out the rest of the world

Would you walk 20 or 30km to work?

dundalkfc10 · 13-12-2018 4:26pm

Wheeliebin30 wrote: »

Failing education?????

Yes our education system is a shambles. Kids lifes basically shaped on leaving cert exams that are 50 years out of date

Wheeliebin30 · 13-12-2018 4:28pm

dundalkfc10 wrote: »

Yes our education system is a shambles. Kids lifes basically shaped on leaving cert exams that are 50 years out of date

Yeah it shows in our unemployment rate and general well known educated population.

Franz Von Peppercorn · 13-12-2018 4:30pm

whisky_galore wrote: »

So we all have to walk to work now, because there's no public transport and driving has become something only the rich can afford?
It's a bit Irish.

Strawman. I didn’t say that. I actually said the taxes won’t ever work.

tabby aspreme · 13-12-2018 4:31pm

dundalkfc10 wrote: »

Yes our education system is a shambles. Kids lifes basically shaped on leaving cert exams that are 50 years out of date

Used to be the way, but nowadays anybody over 23 can enter college as a mature student

Franz Von Peppercorn · 13-12-2018 4:31pm

dundalkfc10 wrote: »

Yes our education system is a shambles. Kids lifes basically shaped on leaving cert exams that are 50 years out of date

Naw, it’s pretty good comparatively.

Wheeliebin30 · 13-12-2018 4:33pm

dundalkfc10 wrote: »

Yes our education system is a shambles. Kids lifes basically shaped on leaving cert exams that are 50 years out of date

It’s all Leo’s fault!!!

MonkeyTennis · 13-12-2018 4:38pm

tabby aspreme wrote: »

Used to be the way, but nowadays anybody over 23 can enter college as a mature student

Nope.

dundalkfc10 · 13-12-2018 4:40pm

tabby aspreme wrote: »

Used to be the way, but nowadays anybody over 23 can enter college as a mature student

A low % of places are set aside for mature students! Not anybody over 23 can just start any course they want!

Ray Palmer · 13-12-2018 4:40pm

whisky_galore wrote: »

Would you walk 20 or 30km to work?

That is neither the point nor what you said. You claimed increasing costs on cars regardless of public transport is uniquely Irish. It isn't and that is what I commented on.

dundalkfc10 · 13-12-2018 4:42pm

Wheeliebin30 wrote: »

It’s all Leo’s fault!!!

Did anyone say that?

Leo was on tv last week saying he has sleepless nights regarding homeless etc... Does he ****!

Scumbag

gozunda · 13-12-2018 4:43pm

mammajamma wrote: »

The fuel tax in France was just the straw that broke the camels back for a lot of French people. It could easily have been a plastic tax, a housing tax, an onion tax that tipped it over the edge

The reaction is not indicative of peoples attitude to climate problems, rather an outcry against "everything".

There are just so many things going wrong in Europe that climate change is one problem amongst hundreds. Yes, it obviously has greater long-term impact, but I have the inclination that the world is has accepted it and is instead engaged in a "who'll be the last man standing" competition.

The American government, basically, pulled out of climate agreements because it gave the likes of china way too much advantage. I can agree with that stance. Why should an irish person be fretting over separating bins when they know that India is a cesspool of filth comparatively?

Either this is all equal, no concessions for being late to the party as a developed country, or else this isn't going anywhere.

Anyway, good times ahead!

I would agree with much of that - however the French are a nation of whingers even at the best of times

Road (motor) tax in France was abolished for private vehicles in 2001 ...

I would look at this pushing of the concept of carbon emissions as a tax and whom it benefits most.

Tbh most of the planet is neither signed up to or gives a proverbial about how much carbon or other greenhouse gases are being produced and yet here are the masses being squeezed by the main parties behind the EU. What gives?

oceanman · 13-12-2018 4:43pm

John Sacrimoni wrote: »

Effective in delaying the inevitable.

were water charges reintroduced ???

_Kaiser_ · 13-12-2018 4:44pm

The Tetrarch wrote: »

The French like a riot.
The Irish like to moan.

Alternatively..

The French get out and protest until the politicians remember that they are there to serve the electorate, not the other way around.

The Irish whinge and moan but rarely stand up for themselves. Part of that is the divide and conquer "us vs them" tactic that is used so effectively in this country, but a lot of it is the me fein attitudes.

Last real protest was against the farce and scandal around Irish water and it worked.. Before that was what? Anti drug protests in the 90s? That worked too.

If we want real change in our lives we need to make our voices heard effectively

seamus · 13-12-2018 4:52pm

gozunda wrote: »

Tbh most of the planet is neither signed up to or gives a proverbial about how much carbon or other greenhouse gases are being produced and yet here are the masses being squeezed by EU. What gives?

Somebody has to. It won't just go away if we all stick our fingers in our ears. I would rather we attempted something rather than said "fvck it, we'll go out in a blaze of glory, enjoy ourselves".

The problem is that the individual has trouble with this. Just like you're saying, "China isn't doing anything, so why should we?", the farmer in France is also saying, "Chinese farmers don't have to pay carbon tax, why should I?".

People can't be trusted to act in their own long term interests, they have to be pushed.

But carbon tax is not an incentive. A suggestion I heard during the week was to repay carbon taxes back to people. So if we take in €200 of carbon tax per person, you give them a €200 cheque in December, then you hike their carbon tax by 5% and give them €210 the following December.

People can then see that it's not a cynical tax to extract more money from their pockets, but an honest attempt to reduce carbon emissions. And people will reduce their use of fossil fuels to try and save money and then pat themselves on the back for "cheating" the system when they still get their fuel fossil fuel rebate at the end of the year.

dundalkfc10 · 13-12-2018 4:52pm

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

Alternatively..

The French get out and protest until the politicians remember that they are there to serve the electorate, not the other way around.

The Irish whinge and moan but rarely stand up for themselves. Part of that is the divide and conquer "us vs them" tactic that is used so effectively in this country, but a lot of it is the me fein attitudes.

Last real protest was against the farce and scandal around Irish water and it worked.. Before that was what? Anti drug protests in the 90s? That worked too.

If we want real change in our lives we need to make our voices heard effectively

Yeh Irelands towns and Citys are not littered with drug since the 90s

Standman · 13-12-2018 4:53pm

You're right OP, it's about time.

I, for one, am outraged.

I'm not really sure why, though. But it must be because of all the things that have been happening in this so-called "country", because why else would I feel so annoyed and unhappy all the time?

13-12-2018 4:54pm

blanch152 wrote: »

Given our failure to reduce emissions, we should be No. 1 in that list with the highest excise duty rate.

Since we have so many relying on the car in order to commute to work, until alternative environmentally friendly power sources for cars reach critical mass and/or sufficient public transport capacity is provided as an alternative, your idea of immediate implementation of such tax increases is a non-runner.

listermint · 13-12-2018 4:56pm

Aye, all those Yellow Vest bolting through Electrical Stores and Department Stores tearing equipment off walls and stealing Apple Products.

They really want low taxes on fuel or whatever nonsense they are peddling

Chips Lovell · 13-12-2018 4:57pm

DS86DS wrote: »

...smug, arrogant and elitist ...One World Creed of the EU and UN....haughty leftist smugness ... elitist ivory tower ledtiets.........snivelling and privileged leftists ...

Jaysus. Who pissed on your chips?

realdanbreen · 13-12-2018 4:57pm

johndeere3350 wrote: »

Why should anyone have to?
We must be one of the only first works country's that they can't get all your information up inside the police or garda car

So you want to put on a hi vis jacket and wreck the place because you're too precious to carry a driving license in your wallet? Bet you were on the water protests too.!

jmayo · 13-12-2018 4:59pm

johndeere3350 wrote: »

Have a licence.
If a guard stops me who are you? Joe bloggs.
Checks data base joe bloggs has a licence to drive this vehicle.
Cop car is behind me reads number plate.
This car belongs to Joe bloggs he has 0 penalty points

Whatabout if you Prawo Jazdy ?

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

Alternatively..

The French get out and protest until the politicians remember that they are there to serve the electorate, not the other way around.

The Irish whinge and moan but rarely stand up for themselves. Part of that is the divide and conquer "us vs them" tactic that is used so effectively in this country, but a lot of it is the me fein attitudes.

Last real protest was against the farce and scandal around Irish water and it worked.. Before that was what? Anti drug protests in the 90s? That worked too.

If we want real change in our lives we need to make our voices heard effectively

The French are a nation of whingers and they are in for one almighty surprise because the welfare system, early retirement state is coming to a shuddering end.

A number of years back a Goodyear tractor tyre plant was closing, the French government hit on an American tyre company to take it over.

The CEO of that company wrote an letter to the French that became public and it should have brought home to them how inefficient their country is, but no it was those awful yanks and their work practices.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/feb/20/so-called-workers-french-tyres

As for water demonstrations.
Yes Irish Water was a fooking disaster in planning, but Irish people need to cop on that they should pay for their water usage because it is a fooking service.
This cr** that it comes from the sky so why should I pay. :mad:
So wait until next time it is raining to go out and fill the kettle and have a shower at the same time.

I am one of the many thousands that pay for my own water and sewage, I don't get to tell revenue to divert a few grand towards the installation and upkeep of my well or my sewage system.

Now if you want a demonstration against the entitlement culture and classes in this country I might be interested.

Doctor Jimbob · 13-12-2018 5:01pm

Baron de Charlus wrote: »

Jaysus. Who pissed on your chips?

The leftists by the look of it :pac:

listermint · 13-12-2018 5:02pm

jmayo wrote: »

As for water demonstrations.
Yes Irish Water was a fooking disaster in planning, but Irish people need to cop on that they should pay for their water usage because it is a fooking service.
This cr** that it comes from the sky so why should I pay. :mad:
So wait until next time it is raining to go out and fill the kettle and have a shower at the same time.

I am one of the many thousands that pay for my own water and sewage, I don't get to tell revenue to divert a few grand towards the installation and upkeep of my well or my sewage system.

Now if you want a demonstration against the entitlement culture and classes in this country I might be interested.

I have my own well too,

I still believe water should be provided by the State.

Oh also i have to pay for my own upkeep of my own well too, including a new pump / filters / switchgear etc.

seamus · 13-12-2018 5:05pm

Deleted User wrote: »

Since we have so many relying on the car in order to commute to work, until alternative environmentally friendly power sources for cars reach critical mass and/or sufficient public transport capacity is provided as an alternative, your idea of immediate implementation of such tax increases is a non-runner.

Reliance on cars is overstated. More people think they need a car than actually do. Nationally the length of the average commute is just shy of 15km. In Dublin, it's less than 10.

That's a whole big chunk of people who don't need to drive to work but choose to do so because it's convenient.

John Sacrimoni · 13-12-2018 5:05pm

Guy:Incognito wrote: »

How are you paying for the milk? With the cash or card that's in your wallet beside your licence by any chance?

Or maybe the two euro in his back pocket.

tigerboon · 13-12-2018 5:11pm

The yellow vest protest was triggered by introduction of the deisel tax. As someone already said, it's the straw that broke the camel's back. It's seen as another way of milking the worker. They're right. If the government was serious about reducing pollution then where is the big tax incentives for lower polluting alternatives. The protests are about people not being able to afford to have a life despite working all their lives.
To answer the op, can people in Ireland afford to have a work/life balance? Is effort properly rewarded? I recently read that years ago a house was roughly 5 times earnings. It's now 11 times, so even with 2 people working, a house is still less affordable per worker. Maybe house prices are our deisel tax!

channaigh · 13-12-2018 5:11pm

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

Alternatively..

The French get out and protest until the politicians remember that they are there to serve the electorate, not the other way around.

The Irish whinge and moan but rarely stand up for themselves. Part of that is the divide and conquer "us vs them" tactic that is used so effectively in this country, but a lot of it is the me fein attitudes.

Last real protest was against the farce and scandal around Irish water and it worked.. Before that was what? Anti drug protests in the 90s? That worked too.

If we want real change in our lives we need to make our voices heard effectively

That's why I think we should do it an Irish way
Instead of going out wrecking the place just call a red alert day
Everyone stay at home and have the craic stock up on the bread though ðŸ˜‚
The country will still come to a standstill

Lux23 · 13-12-2018 5:11pm

johndeere3350 wrote: »

Have a licence.
If a guard stops me who are you? Joe bloggs.
Checks data base joe bloggs has a licence to drive this vehicle.
Cop car is behind me reads number plate.
This car belongs to Joe bloggs he has 0 penalty points

And how do they ensure that you're actually Joe Bloggs, do they just take your word for it?

13-12-2018 5:15pm

seamus wrote: »

Reliance on cars is overstated. More people think they need a car than actually do. Nationally the length of the average commute is just shy of 15km. In Dublin, it's less than 10.

That's a whole big chunk of people who don't need to drive to work but choose to do so because it's convenient.

Short distances in theory but it takes a long time to do them due to congestion. Plus most Irish car drivers will not walk or cycle to work. Period. Weather, perceived danger of being a cyclist on car crowded roads etc means the majority will not make the switch.

Turbohymac · 13-12-2018 5:21pm

Like a previous poster said the French take action we irish simply moan
.except for the water charges when did the majority of the nation stand together to our government......we simply vote them in and sure well wait and see.....and also our population is so small and at any point in time everyone has a different issue to moan about..
Don't like the French in general but they at least got liathroidis..

facehugger99 · 13-12-2018 5:23pm

johndeere3350 wrote: »

Personally the fuel tax here bothers me the most.

johndeere3350 wrote: »

The hospital and bed situation is absolutely dire.
Discuss

As yes, it's the usual 'I want to pay less taxes and get better services' rant.

Luckily OP, there are plenty of political parties established in Ireland for the sole purpose of pandering to people such as yourself.

May you always remain a minority or god help the rest of us.

Guy:Incognito · 13-12-2018 5:24pm

oceanman wrote: »

were water charges reintroduced ???

No. People who don't pay tax continued to not pay for water while the rest of us do.

And before you start, paying vat on goods from money you got from the government doesn't count. Giving someone 200 and getting 23% of it back in vat doesn't make you €46 better off than when you started.

flazio · 13-12-2018 5:25pm

Driving licences these days are the size of bank cards. I very much doubt a person who drives various vehicles is without their bank card. Carry the license in the same slot as your bank card.

Guy:Incognito · 13-12-2018 5:26pm

John Sacrimoni wrote: »

Or maybe the two euro in his back pocket.

But what if he forgets the €2? People can't be expected to remember their €2 every time. So the shop should give it to him for free.

oceanman · 13-12-2018 5:28pm

Guy:Incognito wrote: »

No. People who don't pay tax continued to not pay for water while the rest of us do.

And before you start, paying vat on goods from money you got from the government doesn't count. Giving someone 200 and getting 23% of it back in vat doesn't make you €46 better off than when you started.

I have being paying for my water since I started working over thirty years ago...

flazio · 13-12-2018 5:33pm

The Gardaí are already starting the yellow vest movement themselves.
https://twitter.com/GardaTraffic/status/1072474839951269889?s=19

Guy:Incognito · 13-12-2018 5:33pm

oceanman wrote: »

I have being paying for my water since I started working over thirty years ago...

And you need to continue paying for it. But not just your own.
Water isn't something you buy once. Its ongoing. It needs paying for forever.

Unless we just shut off mains water and let everyone buy their own bottles. But sure then we may as well just meter everyone and let each person pay for their own...............

Yellow vest movement ireland

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