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Men Bashing and Women Saluting

245

Comments

  • #52
    Tacklebox
    Registered Users Posts: 419 ✭✭Tacklebox


    Won't be long before this thread is scraping at the bottom of a barrel lol


  • #53
    meeeeh
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,624 ✭✭✭✭meeeeh


    sportsfan90 wrote: »
    There's a difference and you know it.. Quotas for the nice jobs, but men can continue doing the not so nice ones. That seems to be the message.

    Are you so deluded to think women do just the nice jobs? Care assistants are mostly women, do you think they are nice jobs because you just have tee all day and chat to couple of pensioners?


  • #54
    Omackeral
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,956 ✭✭✭✭Omackeral


    Mrsmum wrote: »
    Ah it's still quite physical though. Not family friendly for women either as not really suitable while pregnant what with the bump to be minded and morning, noon and night sickness.

    Yeah but if she gives birth to a baby boy on the route he can do the job for her cos he'll be big and strong and all that.


  • #55
    Reviews and Books Galore
    Closed Accounts Posts: 964 ✭✭✭Reviews and Books Galore


    Mrsmum wrote: »
    Ah it's still quite physical though. Not family friendly for women either as not really suitable while pregnant what with the bump to be minded and morning, noon and night sickness.

    In fairness, that is an element of the gender pay gap?


  • #56
    Omackeral
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,956 ✭✭✭✭Omackeral


    Mrsmum wrote: »
    Yeah, although I still maintain bins can be very heavy just to push and you often see lads pulling two towards the truck, maybe taking the physicality out of it, it's quite an easy job really. That must be why men are attracted to it.

    It's a tough, physical job. I certainly wouldn't fancy it.
    Mrsmum wrote: »
    But then if bin companies put up ads looking for women to apply, to encourage the ladies into this traditional male area, the men would be going nuts about that also. No pleasing the lads these days.

    Guarantee you ''the lads'' would be very interested to see the uptake from the fairer sex.


  • #57
    givyjoe
    Registered Users Posts: 3,287 ✭✭✭givyjoe


    Mrsmum wrote: »
    Yeah, although I still maintain bins can be very heavy just to push and you often see lads pulling two towards the truck, maybe taking the physicality out of it, it's quite an easy job really. That must be why men are attracted to it. But then if bin companies put up ads looking for women to apply, to encourage the ladies into this traditional male area, the men would be going nuts about that also. No pleasing the lads these days.

    If you're going fishing.. try harder.


  • #58
    raze_them_all_
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,768 ✭✭✭raze_them_all_


    sportsfan90 wrote: »
    There's a difference and you know it.. Quotas for the nice jobs, but men can continue doing the not so nice ones. That seems to be the message.

    Don't see too many female underwater welders....


  • #59
    Omackeral
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,956 ✭✭✭✭Omackeral


    meeeeh wrote: »
    Thank god for bin collectors. I'm starting to think they are a Goodwin of gender discussions. Keep a thread open long enough and someone will mention bin collecting. Actually it doesn't need to be long, abiut 7 posts on average is enough.

    Not be be hyperbolic but have you ever seen a city when refuse collections cease. The place turns into a nightmare. Rats everywhere and just all round vile. Also, it's a valid point so why not address it instead of your sniping?


  • #60
    meeeeh
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,624 ✭✭✭✭meeeeh


    Ok lads I think it's time someone opens a thread dedicated to bin collectors. I can see the deep fondness and admiration you all have for it.

    Or maybe it's just token whataboutery...


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  • #61
    Omackeral
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,956 ✭✭✭✭Omackeral


    raze_them_all_ wrote: »
    Don't see too many female underwater welders....

    That's because they're underwater.


  • #62
    jk23
    Closed Accounts Posts: 877 ✭✭✭jk23


    meeeeh wrote: »
    Thank god for bin collectors. I'm starting to think they are a Goodwin of gender discussions. Keep a thread open long enough and someone will mention bin collecting. Actually it doesn't need to be long, abiut 7 posts on average is enough.

    You are talking rubbish!!!


  • #63
    Omackeral
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,956 ✭✭✭✭Omackeral


    meeeeh wrote: »
    Ok lads I think it's time someone opens a thread dedicated to bin collectors. I can see the deep fondness and admiration you all have for it.

    Here ya go bbz


  • #64
    givyjoe
    Registered Users Posts: 3,287 ✭✭✭givyjoe


    Omackeral wrote: »
    Not be be hyperbolic but have you ever seen a city when refuse collections cease. The place turns into a nightmare. Rats everywhere and just all round vile. Also, it's a valid point so why not address it instead of your sniping?

    You'll be waiting a long long time.


  • #65
    meeeeh
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,624 ✭✭✭✭meeeeh


    Omackeral wrote: »
    Not be be hyperbolic but have you ever seen a city when refuse collections cease. The place turns into a nightmare. Rats everywhere and just all round vile. Also, it's a valid point so why not address it instead of your sniping?

    And people are paid for refuse collection. Do you want a standing ovation for a job you are paid for? Or are bin collectors dragged into every thread because they are the only profession with little prospects that is male dominated? There isn't much variety in the arguments.


  • #66
    Mrsmum
    Registered Users Posts: 1,860 ✭✭✭Mrsmum


    Seriously guys, it's fairly pathetic that you seem to be so hanging your hats on the binmen to show that men take equal responsibility as women in organising and doing all the stuff that keeps a household going, which is what the op was actually about. If that's all you've got, it's telling.


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  • #67
    sportsfan90
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 641 ✭✭✭sportsfan90


    meeeeh wrote: »
    Are you so deluded to think women do just the nice jobs? Care assistants are mostly women, do you think they are nice jobs because you just have tee all day and chat to couple of pensioners?

    Absolutely not and I apologise if my post suggested as such. My own mother cared for the elderly and I've no doubt it was a very difficult job, probably every bit as physically demanding as my fathers job as a farmer. Both of them have problems with knee joints now due to the strain of their work.

    I was referring to the jobs where there's pushes for quotas to be introduced.


  • #68
    givyjoe
    Registered Users Posts: 3,287 ✭✭✭givyjoe


    Mrsmum wrote: »
    Seriously guys, it's fairly pathetic that you seem to be so hanging your hats on the binmen to show that men take equal responsibility as women in organising and doing all the stuff that keeps a household going, which is what the op was actually about. If that's all you've got, it's telling.

    If you actually agree with the absolute sexist tripe in the origin op's links, it's fairly telling.


  • #69
    meeeeh
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,624 ✭✭✭✭meeeeh


    Omackeral wrote: »
    Here ya go bbz

    It's not me that needs the thread, it's for you. It's obviously topic close to a lot of posters in this thread hearts.


  • #70
    Gimme A Pound
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,482 ✭✭✭Gimme A Pound


    But the dirtier, smellier, more physically demanding, more dangerous jobs ARE mostly done by men - I don't see how this is up for debate.

    So bin collection (not a pleasant job) is viewed by someone here as a cliched response - ok, how about: mining, steel production, multi-storey building, automobile manufacturing, oil drilling, war.


  • #71
    Alan Important Stationery
    Posts: 0 CMod ✭✭✭✭ Alan Important Stationery


    I had a google of female binmen
    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/women/womens-business/10431062/Im-the-only-one-of-my-friends-doing-a-job-like-this-my-life-as-a-bin-lady.html

    that's all i got


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  • #72
    givyjoe
    Registered Users Posts: 3,287 ✭✭✭givyjoe


    Jase Clean Quitter wrote: »
    But the dirtier, smellier, more physically demanding, more dangerous jobs ARE mostly done by men - I don't see how this is up for debate.

    So bin collection (not a pleasant job) is viewed by someone here as a cliched response - ok, how about: mining, steel production, multi-storey building, automobile manufacturing, oil drilling, war.
    I'd have thought it was obvious why it was trotted out, it's a clearly visible every day example, literally visible on the streets. I e. Undeniably male dominated and visibly unpleasant.


  • #73
    Mrsmum
    Registered Users Posts: 1,860 ✭✭✭Mrsmum


    givyjoe wrote: »
    If you actually agree with the absolute sexist tripe in the origin op's links, it's fairly telling.[/QUOTE

    Absolutely I know women in general carry the bigger load of housework even if they are working full time and also organise the household, no small job. I think most men would admit the same if they were honest. But you see when you get men immediately going to but but but whatabout once in the blue moon jobs and whatabout binmen and other dirty jobs, it proves the point.


  • #74
    Tacklebox
    Registered Users Posts: 419 ✭✭Tacklebox


    Mrsmum wrote: »
    Seriously guys, it's fairly pathetic that you seem to be so hanging your hats on the binmen to show that men take equal responsibility as women in organising and doing all the stuff that keeps a household going, which is what the op was actually about. If that's all you've got, it's telling.

    Myself and my girlfriend live apart because we're very independent and need our space.
    Works out very well for both of us,as we like our down time.

    She definitely struggles with her 2 year old son, and getting the house work done the way she likes it.

    Well with a man and a woman living together it should be negotiated as to what's done right and both taking responsibility for the chores.

    There's nothing worse than having to pick up after someone, wet clothes in the machine, iron board left out in the kitchen, vacuum cleaner in the middle of the floor when one gets home.

    Himself cleaning a boat engine on the table before dinner and thinking it's ok.
    Leaving fishing bait in the fridge, leaving the kettle empty when it's easy to fill up again.

    A trail of odd socks from the bedroom to the kitchen, yes some men are sloppy that's for sure.

    A man who cannot pull his weight has no business living with a woman who's constantly picking up after him etc
    It's irritating definitely a headache and exhausting.

    I live alone not because I'm sloppy but because I like my own space and man cave.

    I'm into art's and crafts and have lot's of hobbies, so it is only fair that I don't have to be in someone's way and I can do my thing.

    My girlfriend/partner is very house proud and respect's my pinky ponky set up and our relationship is flourishing because we set out our boundaries.

    Some men and women get on way better living apart.

    It's all about boundaries and respect.


  • #75
    Irish Guitarist
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,736 ✭✭✭Irish Guitarist


    I've seen loads of shite about how those ads targeting womens insecurities and telling them to shave their arms and that they smell is the equivalent to that Gillette ad.

    Actually what those womens ads are the equivalent of is ads telling men to use deodorant and to shave their face. An ad for razors lecturing men about their supposed personality traits is completely different.

    Imagine an ad for womens razors that shows women shaving their legs while contemplating, among other evils, female teachers having sex with male pupils because this is somehow the fault of all women.


  • #76
    meeeeh
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,624 ✭✭✭✭meeeeh


    Jase Clean Quitter wrote: »
    But the dirtier, smellier, more physically demanding, more dangerous jobs ARE mostly done by men - I don't see how this is up for debate.

    So bin collection (not a pleasant job) is viewed by someone here as a cliched response - ok, how about: mining, steel production, multi-storey building, automobile manufacturing, oil drilling, war.
    All those professions have a lot in common with bin collection. The most obvious thing they have in common is that they are paid professions. You dragged them in to a thread about domestic unpaid work. If you want to continue to whine about how hard you have it, I think someone opened a thread about bin collectors.

    As for the topic of domestic chores, I do about 97% of house work in our house (I also work shorter hours) but I will not touch our huge garden or any handywork.


  • #77
    Mrsmum
    Registered Users Posts: 1,860 ✭✭✭Mrsmum


    meeeeh wrote: »
    All those professions have a lot in common with bin collection. The most obvious thing they have in common is that they are paid professions. You dragged them in to a thread about domestic unpaid work. If you want to continue to whine about how hard you have it, I think someone opened a thread about bin collectors.

    Exactly.


  • #78
    Gimme A Pound
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,482 ✭✭✭Gimme A Pound


    meeeeh wrote: »
    All those professions have a lot in common with bin collection. The most obvious thing they have in common is that they are paid professions. You dragged them in to a thread about domestic unpaid work. If you want to continue to whine about how hard you have it, I think someone opened a thread about bin collectors.
    I'm a woman.

    I didn't whine.

    I didn't drag anything in, it was already dragged in.


  • #79
    Strumms
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 25,810 ✭✭✭✭Strumms


    I think if you take a moment, step away from the computer, ditch the stereotypes, stop looking for offence where none exists and realize that whatever gender we are, whatever sexuality we are, whatever shape our body is, whatever we work at, love to do in our spare time, drink on a Friday night, go on holiday... IT doesn’t ****ing matter. There are arseholes all over the world, every race, colour, gender, sexuality, age, religion or job. The dickhead gene doesn’t seem to discriminate in fact. So to have it broken down further into some caveman / cave woman men vs women debate isn’t exactly a great advertisement for the human spirit or the intellect there of. So if you are anti any gender you are anti fûcking thinking and should really take up some form of education that can reinforce for you the basics of humanity, love and if you are unfortunate enough to have to go this last resort of the mindbendly obvious then I feel sor...... no wait I don’t, please just fûck off....


  • #80
    feargale
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,636 ✭✭✭feargale


    eviltwin wrote: »
    Maybe women should date men who are capable of doing their share instead of marrying them and then complaining

    Maybe intending men should require a prenuptial agreement stipulating that their shortcomings, real or imagined, will not be plastered allover a newspaper. After all if the family court works on that basis why should it be different before you get there? And maybe wives who want to satisfy that kind of voyeurism should be reminded that two can play that game. Next we will see photos from between the sheets in our awful press.
    But oh, life's a bitch. Wives have to remember things. Like if hubby forgot things at work he wouldn't get the sack or lose his business. No? No stress there? I'll tell you what real stress was, back when probably none of you were born, nor many of your parents either: going to national school to a son of a bitch of a psychpathic teacher who beat you mercilessly when you forgot something.


  • #81
    meeeeh
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,624 ✭✭✭✭meeeeh


    Jase Clean Quitter wrote: »
    I'm a woman.

    And?


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  • #82
    Gimme A Pound
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,482 ✭✭✭Gimme A Pound


    meeeeh wrote: »
    And?
    "If you want to continue to whine about how hard you have it..."


  • #83
    meeeeh
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,624 ✭✭✭✭meeeeh


    Jase Clean Quitter wrote: »
    "If you want to continue to whine about how hard you have it..."

    You can change it to 'they' then... still doesn't change the fact it's just whataboutery.


  • #84
    nullzero
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,428 ✭✭✭✭nullzero
    °°°°°


    The first article in particular is a real denigration of the authors husband.

    Why is it that we accept this type of nonsense as fact when we're being fed a sanitised version of one side of the story?

    It's laughable that these women have the lifestyles they have (houses with dedicated play rooms no less) from writing such dull and uninspired nonsense that seems to stem from arguments they've had with their spouses over the division of household labor.

    Is this the standard of "journalism" that keeps not one but two women in employment to the sound of ringing cash registers at the Irish Times in an era where children are being raised in hotel rooms whilst their parents work for pittance?

    In any responsible society these women would be shunned for their petulant self indulgent rants for money that passes as production of journalistic material.

    Glazers Out!



  • #85
    feargale
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,636 ✭✭✭feargale


    nullzero wrote: »
    The first article in particular is a real denigration of the authors husband.

    Why is it that we accept this type of nonsense as fact when we're being fed a sanitised version of one side of the story?

    It's laughable that these women have the lifestyles they have (houses with dedicated play rooms no less) from writing such dull and uninspired nonsense that seems to stem from arguments they've had with their spouses over the division of household labor.

    Is this the standard of "journalism" that keeps not one but two women in employment to the sound of ringing cash registers at the Irish Times in an era where children are being raised in hotel rooms whilst their parents work for pittance?

    In any responsible society these women would be shunned for their petulant self indulgent rants for money that passes as production of journalistic material.

    I wish I could thank this post ten times. You've said it all. How often have you heard anything from these priveleged, white, wealthy amazons about hardship endured by women (and men) in parts of the third world, not to talk of doing something about it. They have more to say about gender discrimination in golf clubs than about female circumcision.


  • #86
    nullzero
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,428 ✭✭✭✭nullzero
    °°°°°


    feargale wrote: »
    I wish I could thank this post ten times. You've said it all. How often have you heard anything from these priveleged, white, wealthy amazons about hardship endured by women (and men) in parts of the third world, not to talk of doing something about it. They have more to say about gender discrimination in golf clubs than about female circumcision.

    Cheers I appreciate that.
    You're spot on as well, they have nothing to say about women being stoned to death under Sharia law but can't get angry enough about the perceived injustices they face in the free Liberal Western countries they live in.

    Glazers Out!



  • #87
    antodeco
    Registered Users, Subscribers, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,585 ✭✭✭✭antodeco


    nullzero wrote: »
    sanitised

    I think you mean sanitaryised


  • #88
    IK09
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,055 ✭✭✭IK09


    Mrsmum wrote: »
    Seriously guys, it's fairly pathetic that you seem to be so hanging your hats on the binmen to show that men take equal responsibility as women in organising and doing all the stuff that keeps a household going, which is what the op was actually about. If that's all you've got, it's telling.

    Im a single Dad. Who do you think takes care of my household?


  • #89
    meeeeh
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,624 ✭✭✭✭meeeeh


    nullzero wrote: »
    Cheers I appreciate that.
    You're spot on as well, they have nothing to say about women being stoned to death under Sharia law but can't get angry enough about the perceived injustices they face in the free Liberal Western countries they live in.

    Should Irish women invade Saudi Arabia and sort them out? I'm just wondering what more do you want people to do. I constantly hear Amnesty International and similar organisations protest human rights violations around the world (and housing crisis at home) but then I don't live in Facebook bubble of lifestyle articles like most of the outrage brigade here does.

    On separate topic, can anyone list when forced re education worked. Interference seems to breed even more extreme opinions so they are best left to their own devices.


  • #90
    nullzero
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,428 ✭✭✭✭nullzero
    °°°°°


    Another thing that I forgot to mention in my rant; both these women are at pains to remind everyone that they are in partnership with their spouses, at what point is it acceptable for somebody who has freely entered into such a partnership to publicly denigrate and essentially make a fool of their partner?

    Most people take the marriage vows "love, honour and obey" (obey being something that is a hangover from less enlightened times), surely honouring your partner is paramount. I couldn't imagine putting my name to an article in which I denigrated my wife publicly, how low can somebody sink?

    Glazers Out!



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  • #91
    meeeeh
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,624 ✭✭✭✭meeeeh


    nullzero wrote: »
    Another thing that I forgot to mention in my rant; both these women are at pains to remind everyone that they are in partnership with their spouses, at what point is it acceptable for somebody who has freely entered into such a partnership to publicly denigrate and essentially make a fool of their partner?

    Most people take the marriage vows "lover, honour and obey" (obey being something that is a hangover from less enlightened times), surely honouring your partner is paramount. I couldn't imagine putting my name to an article in which I denigrated my wife publicly, how low can somebody sink?

    Maybe they are not that easily offended.


  • #92
    nullzero
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,428 ✭✭✭✭nullzero
    °°°°°


    meeeeh wrote: »
    Should Irish women invade Saudi Arabia and sort them out? I'm just wondering what more do you want people to do. I constantly hear Amnesty International and similar organisations protest human rights violations around the world (and housing crisis at home) but then I don't live in Facebook bubble of lifestyle articles like most of the outrage brigade here does.

    On separate topic, can anyone list when forced re education worked. Interference seems to breed even more extreme opinions so they are best left to their own devices.

    I applaud your consistency.
    On every occasion I have encountered you on this site you have offered consistently insipid opinions on every topic imaginable.

    Glazers Out!



  • #93
    nullzero
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,428 ✭✭✭✭nullzero
    °°°°°


    meeeeh wrote: »
    Maybe they are not that easily offended.

    Maybe they have no self respect. That would appear to be the most likely explanation.

    Glazers Out!



  • #94
    pq0n1ct4ve8zf5
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,070 ✭✭✭✭pq0n1ct4ve8zf5


    nullzero wrote: »
    Cheers I appreciate that.
    You're spot on as well, they have nothing to say about women being stoned to death under Sharia law but can't get angry enough about the perceived injustices they face in the free Liberal Western countries they live in.

    By that logic, what are you doing about the slaughter of young men in Syria? The gender imbalance in China and its impact on young men? The suicide rates in some Nordic and Asian countries? The appalling life expectancy of men in the entire developed world? The rates of incarceration and death by homicide in the states?

    I'd say those are all bigger complaints than some Irish Times article about housework so presumably you can link to a load of your opining and activism about very serious issues affecting men halfway around the world since otherwise you're not allowed to talk about smaller issues which directly and daily affect you?


  • #95
    Grayson
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,316 ✭✭✭✭Grayson


    nullzero wrote: »
    Cheers I appreciate that.
    You're spot on as well, they have nothing to say about women being stoned to death under Sharia law but can't get angry enough about the perceived injustices they face in the free Liberal Western countries they live in.

    You do realise that's the definition of whataboutery.

    saying someone can't complain about something here because something worse is happening elsewhere.


  • #96
    meeeeh
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,624 ✭✭✭✭meeeeh


    nullzero wrote: »
    I applaud your consistency.
    On every occasion I have encountered you on this site you have offered consistently insipid opinions on every topic imaginable.

    Since it's coming from someone like you I will take it as a huge compliment.


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  • #97
    nullzero
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,428 ✭✭✭✭nullzero
    °°°°°


    meeeeh wrote: »
    Since it's coming from someone like you I will take it as a huge compliment.

    Your username perfectly encapsulates my feeling towards you and the opinions you have.

    Glazers Out!



  • #98
    feargale
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,636 ✭✭✭feargale


    meeeeh wrote: »
    Maybe they are not that easily offended.

    Oh I see. The offended are "snowflakes," are they? By Jesus, watch a male journalist denigrate his other half publicly in the same way and see who is offended. Is the "equality of esteem" mantra an Irish disease? Equality for me but not for you, yes? That "snowflakes" argument is now being used to shield every bully's display of bad manners.


  • #99
    nullzero
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,428 ✭✭✭✭nullzero
    °°°°°


    Grayson wrote: »
    You do realise that's the definition of whataboutery.

    saying someone can't complain about something here because something worse is happening elsewhere.

    Complaining about your husband's contribution to the housework isn't what anybody should consider to be legitimate journalism.

    You're just being contrary.

    Glazers Out!



  • #100
    Church on Tuesday
    Registered Users Posts: 3,858 ✭✭✭Church on Tuesday


    nullzero wrote: »
    Maybe they have no self respect. That would appear to be the most likely explanation.

    Most likely.

    If I where the 'hubby' in that situation I would be absolutely mortified.

    I'd feel extremely let down. And all for just a few clicks.

    Imagine if the roles where reversed?


  • #101
    nullzero
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,428 ✭✭✭✭nullzero
    °°°°°


    Kole Alive Fingertip wrote: »
    By that logic, what are you doing about the slaughter of young men in Syria? The gender imbalance in China and its impact on young men? The suicide rates in some Nordic and Asian countries? The appalling life expectancy of men in the entire developed world? The rates of incarceration and death by homicide in the states?

    I'd say those are all bigger complaints than some Irish Times article about housework so presumably you can link to a load of your opining and activism about very serious issues affecting men halfway around the world since otherwise you're not allowed to talk about smaller issues which directly and daily affect you?

    What are you banging on about?

    Glazers Out!



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