Cavan v Dublin Semifinal in Navan?

ArielAtom · 24-11-2020 6:01pm

Cavan_King wrote: »

And what's wrong with that? I don't see how its being a whinge bag to ask that the game is played at a venue other than somewhere Dublin play at maybe twenty times a year whereas Cavan have played there 5 times I think it is in the last decade.

Also, Cavan have only won there once in that decade against London.

Dublin have played 5 times in Croke park this year. Where are you getting 20 from? Are you counting Ladies football, hurling and camogie. You might get near 20 then. If you are going to throw out figures to get likes at least get them near the figure that id factual.

For Forks Sake · 24-11-2020 6:06pm

Cavan_King wrote: »

Mullingar? Portlaoise?

No floodlights in Mullingar afaik.

Off the top of my head,
Omagh
Armagh (again)
Newry (dump)
Enniskillen

Portlaoise

ArielAtom · 24-11-2020 6:08pm

Cavan_King wrote: »

Mullingar? Portlaoise?

Have they the required facilities? I feel that Pair Frank would be a very good choice. Taking both teams on a road trip and giving the Pairc some use. It did cost us taxpayers and GAA members quite a bit of money.

Tombo2001 · 24-11-2020 6:14pm

ArielAtom wrote: »

Dublin have played 5 times in Croke park this year. Where are you getting 20 from? Are you counting Ladies football, hurling and camogie. You might get near 20 then. If you are going to throw out figures to get likes at least get them near the figure that id factual.

Cluxton has played 206 times for Dublin.

Of those - would maybe 150 games been in Croke Park? Possibly more?

Against that, the Cavan players have played how many times......never? Not once? Not a single time?..three or four times maybe...

Alternative argument: Cluxton has only played there twice since June, so that evens it up.

EICVD · 24-11-2020 6:22pm

tanko wrote: »

Breffni Park

So change the venue because one team has home advantage by playing it in the other teams home? You couldn’t make it up

Scoundrel · 24-11-2020 6:24pm

You could play it on the moon and it won't make any difference to the inevitable 15-20 point hammering the Dubs give Cavan.

ArielAtom · 24-11-2020 6:30pm

Tombo2001 wrote: »

Cluxton has played 206 times for Dublin.

Of those - would maybe 150 games been in Croke Park? Possibly more?

Against that, the Cavan players have played how many times......never? Not once? Not a single time?..three or four times maybe...

Alternative argument: Cluxton has only played there twice since June, so that evens it up.

So picking the player with the most championship appearances in history is a great example. My point was directed at a poster throwing out figures of 20 times a year. That is simply not true. I have suggested PUC, but there seems a reluctance to use it. Great surface, great facilities, not advantage to either team.

billyhead · 24-11-2020 6:40pm

Scoundrel wrote: »

You could play it on the moon and it won't make any difference to the inevitable 15-20 point hammering the Dubs give Cavan.

That's what I said. You'd swear they have a chance the way posters are going on here. Dublin couldn't give a rats wherever it's played.

Tombo2001 · 24-11-2020 6:40pm

ArielAtom wrote: »

So picking the player with the most championship appearances in history is a great example. My point was directed at a poster throwing out figures of 20 times a year. That is simply not true. I have suggested PUC, but there seems a reluctance to use it. Great surface, great facilities, not advantage to either team.

Yes it is a great example when he is Dublin's captain and starting goalkeeper.

The debate here is whether Dublin have a very significant advantage playing in Croke Park; its not about how often they have played there this year.

You are trying to turn semantics into the issue, and thereby avoiding the issue.

What really turned me on this issue was the Cork game last year (football). I live near Croker so I go to a lot of the championship and league games up to semifinal (though as Im not a 'real fan' I dont get to go to the final.

Cork put on a great defensive show first half, but ran out of steam. Second half Cork run out of steam and are getting hammered. Dublin playing keep ball, Dublin fans starting shouting Ole every time there was a pass..... No cork fans in the stadium, all Dublin fans.

It was just pathetic and so unfair.

Hammar · 24-11-2020 6:43pm

billyhead wrote: »

That's what I said. You'd swear they have a chance the way posters are going on here. Dublin couldn't give a rats wherever it's played.

I'm sure if we got 16 million quid for Games and Development between 2007-2017, we would stand a chance.

ArielAtom · 24-11-2020 6:48pm

Tombo2001 wrote: »

Yes it is a great example when he is Dublin's captain and starting goalkeeper.

The debate here is whether Dublin have a very significant advantage playing in Croke Park; its not about how often they have played there this year.

You are trying to turn semantics into the issue, and thereby avoiding the issue.

What really turned me on this issue was the Cork game last year (football). I live near Croker so I go to a lot of the championship and league games up to semifinal (though as Im not a 'real fan' I dont get to go to the final.

Cork put on a great defensive show first half, but ran out of steam. Second half Cork run out of steam and are getting hammered. Dublin playing keep ball, Dublin fans starting shouting Ole every time there was a pass..... No cork fans in the stadium, all Dublin fans.

It was just pathetic and so unfair.

It’s a game played by a squad of 26. Not a goalkeeper. I’ve already stated PUC would be a suitable alternative venue. But ignore that. Jesus the tone of the post is of a little boy hard done by. I’m a member of a club and ended up getting my ticket from Limerick. So we all have our problems in that sense. Would you go along with PUC as an alternative?????

ArielAtom · 24-11-2020 6:49pm

Hammar wrote: »

I'm sure if we got 16 million quid for Games and Development between 2007-2017, we would stand a chance.

And the money is brought up! If ye got it you’d still have if FFS!

Hammar · 24-11-2020 6:54pm

ArielAtom wrote: »

And the money is brought up! If ye got it you’d still have if FFS!

We spent millions on an actual stadium that could host matches unlike a certain county that won't spend the money on a fit for purpose stadium and uses the stadium which the entire organisation built. There's only one "mean" county when it comes to the GAA.

Flukey · 24-11-2020 6:55pm

Tombo2001 wrote: »

I would say its quite simple.

Its a bigger pitch than most with a semi artificial surface that the ball moves faster on.

Much harder to defend on, to play a pressing game on.

No its not Dublins home pitch - but the team plays there 8 or 10 times a year and would rarely play as a team in Parnell park. It gives them all the advantages of being at home.

Same argument does not apply to Mayo, as they play there once or twice a year max.

An All-Ireland Finalist will already have played a semi-final and a quarter-final game there, so they are there for at least the third time. If they were a Leinster team that managed to get to the All-Ireland Final, which can happen despite Dublin's dominance, they will have played a Leinster semi-final and Leinster final there too. A team may have got to any of the League finals and played there then. Last year Meath played in the Division Two Final, the Leinster semi, Leinster-Final and a Super 8s game. If a team played Dublin in the league there, that's another match. So other teams can play there a lot.

You mentioned Mayo. In 2017 Mayo played Dublin in the League, Roscommon in a drawn quarter-final, Roscommon in a victorious quarter-final, Kerry in a drawn semi-final, Kerry in a victorious semi-final and Dublin in the final. So that is six matches in Croke Park, five of them in the Championship, so in a relatively short space of time. Granted, that is exceptional, but lots of the big powers easily play four or five times a year there. Mayo have played there a lot more than "once or twice a year", between replays, league games and Championship games. Last year they played us in the League, the League Final against Kerry, a Super 8s match and an All-Ireland semi-final, so that is four matches. So if Dublin make it to the final, they are never coming up against a team that have never seen Croke Park before. It will be at least their third Championship match and they may even have played one or two League games. Croke Park is very familiar territory to a team like that and to suggest Dublin have an advantage over them is ridiculous.

ArielAtom · 24-11-2020 7:19pm

Hammar wrote: »

We spent millions on an actual stadium that could host matches unlike a certain county that won't spend the money on a fit for purpose stadium and uses the stadium which the entire organisation built. There's only one "mean" county when it comes to the GAA.

Oh sweet Jesus, the funding received stopped in 2017, it was for game’s development at primary school level. What part of that do you not understand. MeanðŸ˜¢

C__MC · 24-11-2020 7:22pm

First time I have ever heard a game wanting to be in navan
What a dump of a ground, a dodgy 19th century stand and outdated dressing rooms for the modern intercounty team, surface isn't bad all the same
It's not even floodlit btw!

ArielAtom · 24-11-2020 7:23pm

Tombo2001 wrote: »

Yes it is a great example when he is Dublin's captain and starting goalkeeper.

The debate here is whether Dublin have a very significant advantage playing in Croke Park; its not about how often they have played there this year.

You are trying to turn semantics into the issue, and thereby avoiding the issue.

What really turned me on this issue was the Cork game last year (football). I live near Croker so I go to a lot of the championship and league games up to semifinal (though as Im not a 'real fan' I dont get to go to the final.

Cork put on a great defensive show first half, but ran out of steam. Second half Cork run out of steam and are getting hammered. Dublin playing keep ball, Dublin fans starting shouting Ole every time there was a pass..... No cork fans in the stadium, all Dublin fans.

It was just pathetic and so unfair.

So Corks fitness levels were poor are you think that’s unfair. News for you, that’s poor preparation. PPPPPP.

Fuzzyduzzy · 24-11-2020 7:26pm

Agree we have a huge advantage which is well documented at this stage but every Dublin player put in huge amount of graft to earn their place in the team & it could be argued, worked even harder as the competition for places so high for us

Hammar · 24-11-2020 7:27pm

ArielAtom wrote: »

Oh sweet Jesus, the funding received stopped in 2017, it was for game’s development at primary school level. What part of that do you not understand. Mean&#55357;&#56866;

Care to tell us the distribution of grant money per registered player, per county over that period??
A county getting provincial level funding.
Anyway this is getting away from the topic in question.

Cavan_King · 24-11-2020 7:45pm

ArielAtom wrote: »

Dublin have played 5 times in Croke park this year. Where are you getting 20 from? Are you counting Ladies football, hurling and camogie. You might get near 20 then. If you are going to throw out figures to get likes at least get them near the figure that id factual.

Sorry, should have said ten times a year. Even just playing there five times this year, that’s the max any of the Cavan lads could have played there in their entire careers!

ArielAtom · 24-11-2020 7:48pm

Hammar wrote: »

Care to tell us the distribution of grant money per registered player, per county over that period??
A county getting provincial level funding.
Anyway this is getting away from the topic in question.

You brought up funding not me. Happy to get back on topic. PUC then???

ArielAtom · 24-11-2020 7:49pm

Cavan_King wrote: »

Sorry, should have said ten times a year. Even just playing there five times this year, that’s the max any of the Cavan lads could have played there in their entire careers!

So how does 5 become 10? why not PUC?

Cavan_King · 24-11-2020 7:52pm

ArielAtom wrote: »

And the money is brought up! If ye got it you’d still have if FFS!

Nice to throw out a stereotype there. Oh, you’re a Dub, does that mean you’re a drug dealer like Love Hate!?

Cavan have always pumped significant money into our facilities and training. Breffni Park for example has seen significant redevelopment.

At the moment, we are fundraising to build 4 training pitches and a training centre at the back of Breffni.

This is all being done off the fact that we’re a county of only 76,000 people, with 10,000 of those coming in the last decade and the majority of them will be shouting for their own home county on Saturday week.

You’d see as many Dublin jerseys in Virginia, Ballyjamesduff or Mullagh as you would Cavan some days.

Fann Linn · 24-11-2020 7:53pm

ArielAtom wrote: »

So how does 5 become 10? why not PUC?

Have they Hawkeye in PUC?
Semple Stadium?

Cavan_King · 24-11-2020 7:55pm

ArielAtom wrote: »

So how does 5 become 10? why not PUC?

I said most years, not specific to this year. Most years Dublin would play 3/4 League games at home, Leinster semi final, Leinster final, 2 x Super 8s, All Ireland semi final & final all in Croke Park so quite easy to get to ten games.

I’ve already advised PUC is too far for both teams. If there was no Covid and they could travel the day before and stay in hotels, then yes but, if there was no Covid, there’d be no debate as the game would just be in Croke Park for the crowd.

PUC might suit Tipp & Mayo better.

ArielAtom · 24-11-2020 7:57pm

Fann Linn wrote: »

Have they Hawkeye in PUC?
Semple Stadium?

I’m not sure, just trying to see what ground Cavan would accept as a neutral one.

Cavan_King · 24-11-2020 7:59pm

ArielAtom wrote: »

I’m not sure, just trying to see what ground Cavan would accept as a neutral one.

Not sure why you keep bringing up one on the other side of the country? I’ve already said I’d accept anywhere above Croke Park, even Parnell Park.

ArielAtom · 24-11-2020 8:00pm

Cavan_King wrote: »

Nice to throw out a stereotype there. Oh, you’re a Dub, does that mean you’re a drug dealer like Love Hate!?

Cavan have always pumped significant money into our facilities and training. Breffni Park for example has seen significant redevelopment.

At the moment, we are fundraising to build 4 training pitches and a training centre at the back of Breffni.

This is all being done off the fact that we’re a county of only 76,000 people, with 10,000 of those coming in the last decade and the majority of them will be shouting for their own home county on Saturday week.

You’d see as many Dublin jerseys in Virginia, Ballyjamesduff or Mullagh as you would Cavan some days.

My post was intended to be one of humour. Yours obviously was not, junkies!!!

jmayo · 24-11-2020 8:02pm

Fann Linn wrote: »

Cavan lads wouldn't pay for the flights.

Shure haven't Dublin an official Airline, they could organise a few tickets for them.

Fann Linn wrote: »

Those fcukers won't pay for the batteries.

Ever seen those windup torches. You gotta think outside the box lad.

Fann Linn wrote: »

Was there a reason the Kerry Mayo semi was held in Limerick 6 years ago?

Yeah because a shyte American football farce had to be played in Croker.
:rolleyes:

Weepsie wrote: »

It was a replay, probably a compromise so fans were not travelling big distances twice.

Nope. As above. The GAA wouldn't be so kind. silly me

The GAA hierarchy thinking of travelling fans ?
That's a new one on me.

I mean why else organise a Mayo game in Newry for 7pm on a Saturday night.
Or having to play in the Gaelic Grounds in Limerick at 6pm on a Saturday night.

tanko · 24-11-2020 8:02pm

EICVD wrote: »

So change the venue because one team has home advantage by playing it in the other teams home? You couldn’t make it up

So it's ok for Dublin to have home advantage but not Cavan, yeah you couldn't make it up alright.
At last a Dub admits Croke park is their home ground.

ArielAtom · 24-11-2020 8:04pm

Cavan_King wrote: »

Not sure why you keep bringing up one on the other side of the country? I’ve already said I’d accept anywhere above Croke Park, even Parnell Park.

I keep brining it up as it’s the next best ground in ireland to showcase our game. You really don’t want to play in a ploughed field do you. The majority of grounds mentioned are a step up but not much. Breffni is one of the better surfaces.
Would it be acceptable, it could throw in at 12.00 and light would not be an issue.

jmayo · 24-11-2020 8:05pm

Flukey wrote: »

That is irrelevant, but if you want it, Dublin's last home game in the Championship was in June 2004. Since then, all our Championship matches have been away or in neutral venues. A few weeks ago we played Meath in our first home match in the league in a decade. There is no argument about Parnell Park being Dublin's home ground. It is our home ground. We may not play there often, but it is our home ground. On that issue there is no doubt whatsoever.

Do Dublin have an advantage playing in Croke Park? I've heard plenty of people say they do, but nobody has ever been able to say what it is. "They are used to it", is the best they can come up with, which means nothing. As I said in my last post, plenty of counties are very used to playing in Croke Park. All the big powers play there very regularly and Dublin hold no advantage over them. As I said, it is strange that nobody is objecting to the other semi-final being played in Croke Park, even though Mayo are very used to playing there.

I have no problems with the Cavan match being moved, but just like you are tired of people saying Parnell Park is Dublin's home ground (which it is), I am tired of people saying Dublin have an advantage in playing in Croke Park without giving any evidence of this. The one advantage that Dublin will have over Cavan is that they are a better team and that would be the case no matter where they played them. That is something that just about everyone agrees on.

This has to be a pi**take.

Jaysus I thought for a minute there you were going to say Croke Park was as much a home ground for Mayo as Dublin.

Granted for a while there we were in it a fair bit, but it is in a different county and about 120 miles away on the other side of the country.

Could you remind us all again what county it is in?

Fann Linn · 24-11-2020 8:06pm

ArielAtom wrote: »

I keep brining it up as it’s the next best ground in ireland to showcase our game. You really don’t want to play in a ploughed field do you. The majority of grounds mentioned are a step up but not much. Breffni is one of the better surfaces.
Would it be acceptable, it could throw in at 12.00 and light would not be an issue.

Eir, Rte, and Sky Sports will more than likely dictate the time.

Cavan_King · 24-11-2020 8:07pm

ArielAtom wrote: »

I keep brining it up as it’s the next best ground in ireland to showcase our game. You really don’t want to play in a ploughed field do you. The majority of grounds mentioned are a step up but not much. Breffni is one of the better surfaces.
Would it be acceptable, it could throw in at 12.00 and light would not be an issue.

Do you read the replies? I’ve already said I’d happily play it anywhere in Ireland above Croke Park. I already said though that the logistics with Covid don’t make sense for two teams with travel to Cork from so far away.

Not sure why you’re acting like people won’t “accept” various pitches. We’re hardly primamadonnas.

All people are asking for is a chance at a level playing field and Croke Park isn’t that.

ArielAtom · 24-11-2020 8:16pm

Cavan_King wrote: »

Do you read the replies? I’ve already said I’d happily play it anywhere in Ireland above Croke Park. I already said though that the logistics with Covid don’t make sense for two teams with travel to Cork from so far away.

Not sure why you’re acting like people won’t “accept” various pitches. We’re hardly primamadonnas.

All people are asking for is a chance at a level playing field and Croke Park isn’t that.

No probs, I’d like to see the game played on the best possible surface, PUC is that. We’ll leave it there.

Bonniedog · 24-11-2020 8:32pm

They should play it in Parnell. That's halfway between Croke Park and Meath and Cavan and the North Pole, etc.

Dyr · 24-11-2020 8:52pm

Cavan_King wrote: »

All people are asking for is a chance at a level playing field and Croke Park isn’t that.

Croke Park is very level though, I think you're looking for the opposite, some ploughed up piece of bog

StupidLikeAFox · 24-11-2020 8:53pm

ArielAtom wrote: »

No probs, I’d like to see the game played on the best possible surface, PUC is that. We’ll leave it there.

PUC would be a much shorter and handier spin from Dublin than from Cavan. I'd go with tullamore.

ArielAtom · 24-11-2020 9:04pm

StupidLikeAFox wrote: »

PUC would be a much shorter and handier spin from Dublin than from Cavan. I'd go with tullamore.

It’s a poor surface. My point is that this game should be played in the best facility and on the best surface to encourage good football from both teams. Playing in a ploughed field won’t add to the spectacle. This time of year that’s what most of them are.

willowthewisp · 24-11-2020 9:30pm

It’s going to be played in Croke Park, no question over that whatsoever.

EICVD · 24-11-2020 9:32pm

tanko wrote: »

So it's ok for Dublin to have home advantage but not Cavan, yeah you couldn't make it up alright.
At last a Dub admits Croke park is their home ground.

But it’s not in Parnell? Look forward to heading to Croker on a Wednesday night for a home O’Byrne Cup tie or U20 Leinster QF/SF

beggars_bush · 24-11-2020 9:35pm

EICVD wrote: »

But it’s not in Parnell? Look forward to heading to Croker on a Wednesday night for a home O’Byrne Cup tie or U20 Leinster QF/SF

Dublin play 90% of senior games in croker, ergo its a hime game.

quidel · 24-11-2020 10:53pm

Let’s say Donegal had won last Sunday as almost everyone expected and were to meet Dublin in the All Ireland Semi final. Their players would be faced with a journey of 3-4hours minimum to Dublin in their own cars travelling down. This would be a distinct disadvantage to them in pre game preparation compared to the minimal travel Dublin players would have. Where is the fairness in that? If Donegal had won then Breffni would be the perfect location to play. The pitch and grounds would be unquestionably suited to a high profile game of this nature. No need for Mayo Tipp to be brought across the country for their game. This is a strange year and the GAA ought see that their logistical decisions are fair to all.

Grats · 24-11-2020 11:25pm

Haven't read any of the previous posts. All I will say is that if I were a Cavan player I'd be thrilled to play in Croke Park. And especially so at this time of year. Suggestion other venues is only a distraction. Dublin are fully expected to win, and that applies wherever it's played. Best of luck to Cavan following their wonderful win against Donegal. Enjoy your day out in the best stadium in Ireland.

tayto lover · 24-11-2020 11:25pm

Pairc Esler in Newry seems like a very suitable venue for a semi-final.
Just an hour travel for both teams.
Floodlights and a lovely surface too.

Hammar · 24-11-2020 11:41pm

Grats wrote: »

Haven't read any of the previous posts. All I will say is that if I were a Cavan player I'd be thrilled to play in Croke Park. And especially so at this time of year. Suggestion other venues is only a distraction. Dublin are fully expected to win, and that applies wherever it's played. Best of luck to Cavan following their wonderful win against Donegal. Enjoy your day out in the best stadium in Ireland.

Nice condescending post there, "thrilled to play in Croke Park" "Enjoy your day out". :rolleyes: . You'd think Dublin were playing against 15 middle aged morbidly obese lads, judging by the talk of the likes of you and others.

tobefrank321 · 24-11-2020 11:44pm

Imagine if all crucial Liverpool games were played at Anfield. Imagine if their big home and "away" games were played at Anfield. And all their cup games and cup final games. And imagine the Premier League also gave 50% share of TV revenue to Liverpool ever year.

You"d then get a feeling for what happens for one team in the GAA. Not only the Leinster Championship is dead, the AI has been killed off too!

rrs · 25-11-2020 12:07am

:cool:

tayto lover wrote: »

Pairc Esler in Newry seems like a very suitable venue for a semi-final.
Just an hour travel for both teams.
Floodlights and a lovely surface too.

Newry is around 1hr 30 from Cavan, unless you drive like Lewis Hamilton.

A good venue and probably will come into consideration. Thought a venue would have been announced by now, either way. Cavan playing against Dublin in Croker would be a novelty too. I don't recall Cavan playing against Dublin in CL before

ArielAtom · 25-11-2020 8:58am

Below are some of the considerations for the venue.

There must be 4 dressing rooms wherever it’s played.

Floodlights. Croke Park has the best floodlights and considering it will be in December depending on the day they may be needed in even a early morning throw in. Not all county grounds even have floodlights.

HawkEye. Don’t say it dosent matter because it does. It was needed in last Saturdays match.

Facilities for TV crews. Like it or not it’s easier for TV crews to show a match in CP than anywhere else.

Facilities for journalists/reporters. Again better in CP than elsewhere. An all Ireland semi final will mean probably more than another game. CP can accommodate that.

It also has one of if not the best surfaces in the country. An All Ireland Semi Final should be played on the best surface available.

I’m not 100% sure on this but I think the mic and communication system for referees is different in Croke Park than it is elsewhere.

Also the fact that the semi-final was down to be played there initially.

These points were all put to me by a Corkman. They are not my doing. He was unsure if PUC could provide the same but thought it was the best alternative regarding all of the above.

Can any other ground provide the above? If so happy days lets play there.

He makes sense. But I do understand the point that playing it somewhere else would level the playing fields. If there is a venue that fits all his points lets look at it then.

elefant · 25-11-2020 9:13am

Enough with the Pairc Ui Chaoimh nonsense as an effort to make some sort of laboured point already.

Obviously Cavan are not going to be made drive 8 hours on Saturday next week to play a game in Cork.

Cavan v Dublin Semifinal in Navan?

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