Ireland Team Talk XI: Team of nervoUS MOD warning Post 1

Niallof9 wrote: »

Who's nearly getting beat by Fiji? Daly 100 per cent deserved a shot. Keenan has been ok. He got a go, but yet again it seems he's now an automatic pick somehow. Doris needs a good run at 8. Stander isn't our 8. A settled 9 what like Marmion or his Ulster colleague Cooney? Murray is getting a little better but it was only last season people were up in arms. Its a joke shop selection and nobody should be defending it.

Fiji was a November international played over 2 years ago where Schmitt put a side out with a complete squad rotation. In the end due to absolute NO cohesion Ireland luckily ran out 2 point winners. It was a game to forget for both players and management. there is not point in changing the complete squad just so caps can be handed out. I want Farrell to pick and choose only 3 or four players who have a shout and play them with the senior squad. He also is a relatively new manager and I don’t think he has stamped his style of play (if he has any) on the senior squad as of yet.

Some disappointing elements to that selection, but predictably the general reaction here is OTT.

At loose head we are paying the price for a shortsighted squad selection a few weeks back. Having only 2 LHs in the squad was always a risk. That has now come back to bite us in both prop positions. We have to move 1 TH over to LH, leaving us with only 2 THs available. And obviously Ryan is simply not rated, meaning we're flogging Porter. What that means for next weeks selection I dont know. EOS will only have been in camp a day or two so not too surprised he isn't involved. For me the error here was not getting him in sooner.

Not too bothered by our hooker or lock selections for the most part, although I'd have started Roux here instead of Ryan just to manage the latters game time some. Although after last week maybe Ryan needs to get back on the horse and develop his partnership with Henderson. Not too much in this though.

In the back row we've capped a few guys this year so ultimately this game shouldn't be about new guys, but instead about managing game time. No complaints there as a result.

At half-backs Burns needed to start and Murray alongside him probably gives him the best chance to make his case so all good there.

In the centre, this was really the only selection we could make. I do think we need to start looking at a more like for like replacement for Ringrose at 13, which is tough on Farrell, but we need a bit more creativity in the centre and Farrell doesn't bring that. I dont know if Hume is worth a look, but we need to make some sort of change there going forward.

In the back 3, Stockdale has a load of potential at FB so giving him more time there was a must. With Lowe and Conway injured we were always going to have one of Keenan or Daly out there. Meaning we needed a steady hand too. Ideally that would have been Conway, but Earls will do I've no real issue with that selection at all tbh.

The big issue for me here is the initial squad selection with only 2 LHs. It has caused is real issues now in the front row for this week and next plus for Leinster in Europe. Other than that some minor quibbles but overall nothing of any real note. We have to remember we're missing quite a few players so that's going to make selections over the course of this tournament that bit more tricky.

sydthebeat wrote: »

Habana was still scoring against the all blacks in Sept 2016.

And as for missing the point...... Whoosh!!

I think you are both wrong. Everyone knows that international wingers are over the hill once they reach 27.

Niallof9 wrote: »

But he's had that run. I like Keenan he has something about him. I hope he bangs in a hatrick, but he's just an example of the weird way Irish rugby goes about its business. He played his first European game in Sept. But now yeah i reckon you'll see him become a mainstay for no real reason other than he had a good game against Italy, solid against Wales. And yeah i wouldn't be shocked if he suddenly gets a central deal while Conway or whoever is left pissing in the wind.

I don’t rate Keenan as a player but if a manager has made a decision to hand a first cap out and have that player play the biggest game of the year than he should certainly be given time in that jersey. Keenan is no where near Conway. That’s just my opionion.

molloyjh wrote: »

Some disappointing elements to that selection, but predictably the general reaction here is OTT.

At loose head we are paying the price for a shortsighted squad selection a few weeks back. Having only 2 LHs in the squad was always a risk. That has now come back to bite us in both prop positions. We have to move 1 TH over to LH, leaving us with only 2 THs available. And obviously Ryan is simply not rated, meaning we're flogging Porter. What that means for next weeks selection I dont know. EOS will only have been in camp a day or two so not too surprised he isn't involved. For me the error here was not getting him in sooner.

Not too bothered by our hooker or lock selections for the most part, although I'd have started Roux here instead of Ryan just to manage the latters game time some. Although after last week maybe Ryan needs to get back on the horse and develop his partnership with Henderson. Not too much in this though.

In the back row we've capped a few guys this year so ultimately this game shouldn't be about new guys, but instead about managing game time. No complaints there as a result.

At half-backs Burns needed to start and Murray alongside him probably gives him the best chance to make his case so all good there.

In the centre, this was really the only selection we could make. I do think we need to start looking at a more like for like replacement for Ringrose at 13, which is tough on Farrell, but we need a bit more creativity in the centre and Farrell doesn't bring that. I dont know if Hume is worth a look, but we need to make some sort of change there going forward.

In the back 3, Stockdale has a load of potential at FB so giving him more time there was a must. With Lowe and Conway injured we were always going to have one of Keenan or Daly out there. Meaning we needed a steady hand too. Ideally that would have been Conway, but Earls will do I've no real issue with that selection at all tbh.

The big issue for me here is the initial squad selection with only 1 LH. It has caused is real issues now in the front row for this week and next plus for Leinster in Europe. Other than that some minor quibbles but overall nothing of any real note. We have to remember we're missing quite a few players so that's going to make selections over the course of this tournament that bit more tricky.

Hume is not a creative force and plays more like a 12 but Stuart Moore can be a future Ireland 13 I think. Very exciting player

CMcsporty wrote: »

1 debut for Ireland off the bench

11 debuts in one match for France

https://twitter.com/murray_kinsella/status/1331913572151152640?s=21

how many pro players are there in France as opposed to Ireland? seems relevant. as does the fact that France have won the last two Junior World Cups and have approximately 50 insanely talented freaks that they're going to be capping over the next few years.

Paul Smeenus wrote: »

My real "unh?" at reading the team was about Herring instead of Kelleher. But I wonder are they going with the more reliable Herring to focus on getting the rest of the lineout straight - the lifting, the timing, the calls, and then, once that is running better, they'll bring in Kelleher and let him get his throwing up to speed. In other words, just isolating one wobbly issue at a time and addressing it.

Burns deserves his big moment. I hope Stu has a lovely time, before he leaves the camp, never to attend again.

Heffernan is on the bench. Kelleher has gotten some big game time so far so giving the others time makes sense.

Paul Smeenus wrote: »

My real "unh?" at reading the team was about Herring instead of Kelleher. But I wonder are they going with the more reliable Herring to focus on getting the rest of the lineout straight - the lifting, the timing, the calls, and then, once that is running better, they'll bring in Kelleher and let him get his throwing up to speed. In other words, just isolating one wobbly issue at a time and addressing it.

Burns deserves his big moment. I hope Stu has a lovely time, before he leaves the camp, never to attend again.

To be fair Kelleher was dreadful last time out.
Not too sure. If Stu puts in a good shift . I could see the media getting behind him and putting the pressure on Farrell to get him in ahead of Aki who has been abysmal!. Sure isn’t that the reason Hugo got playing in the first place and then drafted to 15

I think this is a general Internet problem. Polarisation seems to be the default. Most people are in some way shape or form disappointed or unenthused by the selection. It certainly has its issues. But for some reason, unless people are agreeing 100% with some posters, their position gets defined as 100% opposed by those posters. I think if they took a breath and actually looked through the posts they'd struggle to find anyone saying anything more positive than "ah look, I get it even if I don't fully agree". Most are more critical than that.

CMcsporty wrote: »

Oh no....
Did you know that the Irish U-20's won the grand slam last year?

Now i think you could reasonably argue that 3 out of the 4 of that side that were called up as part of the initial squad should also be playing v Georgia.

So that would be 4 caps

And the "junior" World Cup you referred to. Ireland were unlucky to loose to France in 2018 24-22. in France.
Another player in that side was also part of the initial squad.

So thats 5 new caps.

Does any of that seem relevant to you?

Or do you think we should still play Murray, Burns, Beirne, Roux and O 'Mahony ahead of them for the Georgia game?

Not 11. But maybe the penny is dropping here....we can cap allot more players but Farrell is choosing not to.

And how many pro players are there in France out of interest?

Just out of curiosity, who are the 5 players from last year's U20s that you would like to see capped.

Niallof9 wrote: »

But surely the more players we have the harder it would be to settle on a team. i mean thats part of the argument we're having here. He's trying to build a solid, collected group according to some. So he can't be selecting outside that too much, we're told. Adding another 1,000 players to the mix could be an issue? There's an argument to be had that our core group, and four teams and four academies has a better quality control to it. I mean if the Ail clubs had had their way back in the 90's and been our Europen teams, we'd automatically have more players but possibly be worse off. There's alot of **** players playing in those 30 clubs, same in England.

i don't really understand what you're arguing here.