Deontay Wilder v Tyson Fury - December 1st

yourdeadwright · 05-10-2018 11:28am

Draw

Very interesting fight as so many question Marks about both guys ,
Is Fury fit , Is he as good as he thinks, Was the Wlad fight a one off or is he world class, Is Ben a good trainer, Is Fury in it for Cash or Legacy , Can he make Wilder miss , Does he hit hard enough to gain Wilder respect
Can Wilder make the set up. Can he out box fury, Can he deal with a proper big fight attention , Can he deal with a guy who clearly isn't afraid of him ,How does he deal with a bigger man , How does his chin fair ,
Its going be great to see it unfold, Fury clearly got under Wilders skin ,
I think Fury is clearly a bit of a head case so its near impossible for anyone to get into his head ,
Wilder was claiming Fury looked nervous but it was the other way Fury was just taking the p*ss enjoying himself ( it was cringe ) and he got to Wilder ,

Mookie Blaylock · 05-10-2018 11:33am

Wilder Points

Reports matchroom have upped their offer to Wilder for a clash with AJ....
Might be more games being played as Eddie Hearn reckons Wilders team won't meet with them even though there's an updated offer on the table.... Wilder wants Fury first as a tune-up perhaps?

yourdeadwright · 05-10-2018 11:41am

Draw

Mookie Blaylock wrote: »

Reports matchroom have upped their offer to Wilder for a clash with AJ....
Might be more games being played as Eddie Hearn reckons Wilders team won't meet with them even though there's an updated offer on the table.... Wilder wants Fury first as a tune-up perhaps?

If Fury wins what happens , cause he won't fight AJ unless its 50/50 and he will go on about Aj being a coward and him doing the dirty work

walshb · 05-10-2018 11:45am

Wilder Points

yourdeadwright wrote: »

Very interesting fight as so many question Marks about both guys ,
Is Fury fit , Is he as good as he thinks, Was the Wlad fight a one off or is he world class, Is Ben a good trainer, Is Fury in it for Cash or Legacy , Can he make Wilder miss , Does he hit hard enough to gain Wilder respect
Can Wilder make the set up. Can he out box fury, Can he deal with a proper big fight attention , Can he deal with a guy who clearly isn't afraid of him ,How does he deal with a bigger man , How does his chin fair ,
Its going be great to see it unfold, Fury clearly got under Wilders skin ,
I think Fury is clearly a bit of a head case so its near impossible for anyone to get into his head ,
Wilder was claiming Fury looked nervous but it was the other way Fury was just taking the p*ss enjoying himself ( it was cringe ) and he got to Wilder ,

All good questions..

I have a sneaky feeling all the Fury fans and apologists will claim that he wasn't fit or ready even if he is knocked out in a rd or 2.

yourdeadwright · 05-10-2018 11:49am

Draw

walshb wrote: »

yourdeadwright wrote: »

Very interesting fight as so many question Marks about both guys ,
Is Fury fit , Is he as good as he thinks, Was the Wlad fight a one off or is he world class, Is Ben a good trainer, Is Fury in it for Cash or Legacy , Can he make Wilder miss , Does he hit hard enough to gain Wilder respect
Can Wilder make the set up. Can he out box fury, Can he deal with a proper big fight attention , Can he deal with a guy who clearly isn't afraid of him ,How does he deal with a bigger man , How does his chin fair ,
Its going be great to see it unfold, Fury clearly got under Wilders skin ,
I think Fury is clearly a bit of a head case so its near impossible for anyone to get into his head ,
Wilder was claiming Fury looked nervous but it was the other way Fury was just taking the p*ss enjoying himself ( it was cringe ) and he got to Wilder ,

All good questions..

I have a sneaky feeling all the Fury fans and apologists will claim that he wasn't fit or ready even if he is knocked out in a rd or 2.

To be fair I think everyone and there dog knows he's taking the fight earlier than anyone expected and won't be in "WLAD SHAPE" until next summer ,
Its his choice so you can't really knock him ,

walshb · 05-10-2018 12:04pm

Wilder Points

yourdeadwright wrote: »

To be fair I think everyone and there dog knows he's taking the fight earlier than anyone expected and won't be in "WLAD SHAPE" until next summer ,
Its his choice so you can't really knock him ,

You are assuming a lot there....

I am going to a assume that he never gets into Wlad shape...unless maybe he goes on the juice again?

Anyway, the excuses are ready...

yourdeadwright · 05-10-2018 2:19pm

Draw

walshb wrote: »

yourdeadwright wrote: »

To be fair I think everyone and there dog knows he's taking the fight earlier than anyone expected and won't be in "WLAD SHAPE" until next summer ,
Its his choice so you can't really knock him ,

You are assuming a lot there....

I am going to a assume that he never gets into Wlad shape...unless maybe he goes on the juice again?

Anyway, the excuses are ready...

I don't think its an assumption its quite clear he isn't back In the shape he was before he walked away,
He has no excuses he took the fight, I don't understand the mentality of people making excuses for him, why would they its his life .,
I'm never invested in a boxer outside of a friend or family, I just want to see a good fight and the better man win , We can talk about what we think may happen and each's strengths and weakness but I don't understand why anyone would have to make excuses for a another man losing a boxing fight that they are not connected to ,

walshb · 05-10-2018 5:38pm

Wilder Points

yourdeadwright wrote: »

I don't think its an assumption its quite clear he isn't back In the shape he was before he walked away, ,

The assumption I was getting at was more that he will be back in Wald shape next summer....

megadodge · 05-10-2018 7:41pm

Draw

Morrison J wrote: »

Wilder to me fights like a guy who doesn't have much faith in his chin. Very upright and tentative. I'd be surprised if he starts the fight aggressive tbh. Ortiz had him very hesitant through the use of feints and the left hand counter. Wilder hardly threw a jab in that fight he was so worried about what would come back. Had Ortiz sweeping the first four rounds personally until Wilder landed a straight shot in the 5th and things flipped.

I do think Wilder will take the risk that Wlad couldn't though and throw caution to the wind late knowing he's behind on the cards. Could be a classic finish to this I think especially if Fury is tired which he more than likely will be given its only his 3rd fight back.

This is a great fight. Big question marks over both for different reasons. Really looking forward to it.

Good post.

Mainly because you must have seen some of Wilder's fights! Some of the posts here have me thinking these fellas have actually never seen a full Wilder fight! He is ultra-cautious in the early rounds! Surely people can't possibly miss that?

The pace of his fights are usually slow, because he is afraid of getting hit and the opposition are usually more cautious than normal due to Wilder's power. Because of this his fights are usually dull affairs besides the finish. I fully expect this to be a dull repeat of the Fury / Klitchko fight with Fury's feints and jab completely bamboozling Wilder.

Hopefully, the judges will reflect what happens in the ring. It is an American in America versus a non-American....

Mookie Blaylock · 08-10-2018 2:35pm

Wilder Points

Fury has been given 7 days to sign up to the WBC "clean boxing" program (out of competition drug testing) or the fight with Wilder.... which they have not yet sanctioned...will not go ahead

liamoreilly · 08-10-2018 3:29pm

Wilder Points

...AFAIK it will still go ahead, but it will not be a title fight, will be shocked if he doesn't sign up to it, apparently just a delay in paper work...

Mookie Blaylock · 08-10-2018 3:50pm

Wilder Points

liamoreilly wrote: »

...AFAIK it will still go ahead, but it will not be a title fight, will be shocked if he doesn't sign up to it, apparently just a delay in paper work...

If the WBC don't sanction the fight they probably won't allow Wilder to take it...possible mandatory defence instead?

Underground · 08-10-2018 4:57pm

Did Canelo have to sign up for this programme?

squinn2912 · 10-10-2018 10:53pm

Draw

megadodge wrote: »

Morrison J wrote: »

Wilder to me fights like a guy who doesn't have much faith in his chin. Very upright and tentative. I'd be surprised if he starts the fight aggressive tbh. Ortiz had him very hesitant through the use of feints and the left hand counter. Wilder hardly threw a jab in that fight he was so worried about what would come back. Had Ortiz sweeping the first four rounds personally until Wilder landed a straight shot in the 5th and things flipped.

I do think Wilder will take the risk that Wlad couldn't though and throw caution to the wind late knowing he's behind on the cards. Could be a classic finish to this I think especially if Fury is tired which he more than likely will be given its only his 3rd fight back.

This is a great fight. Big question marks over both for different reasons. Really looking forward to it.

Good post.

Mainly because you must have seen some of Wilder's fights! Some of the posts here have me thinking these fellas have actually never seen a full Wilder fight! He is ultra-cautious in the early rounds! Surely people can't possibly miss that?

The pace of his fights are usually slow, because he is afraid of getting hit and the opposition are usually more cautious than normal due to Wilder's power. Because of this his fights are usually dull affairs besides the finish. I fully expect this to be a dull repeat of the Fury / Klitchko fight with Fury's feints and jab completely bamboozling Wilder.

Hopefully, the judges will reflect what happens in the ring. It is an American in America versus a non-American....

These posts make sense to me. Wilder has looked very ordinary and questionably behind vs Washington and Spzilka. Fury is a diffeeent prospect. I can only see a fury win here but if it comes down to the judges it’s hard to know. In the video of the two of them wilder looked confused and mumbling. Fury composed and relishing it.

Sweet.Science · 11-10-2018 9:17pm

Draw

If fury is back to his normal self he wins I think . However wilder won’t be as shy as wlad was and will let his hands go .

Still don’t know if this is a cash grab from Fury and his heart is no longer in it

We will see soon enough

Looking forward to it now though

walshb · 12-10-2018 7:49am

Wilder Points

All those picking or wanting/hoping Fury wins seem to want to hope and if their way to it...

He is NOT the same boxer from 2015. This is a 2018 fight...

squinn2912 · 12-10-2018 8:29am

Draw

Well he may not be but he's a fairly unknown quantity and there are lots of potential outcomes hence the ifs and maybes. No one can say what Fury will turn up or what his true motivation is so it's unpredictable. Wilder will do as Wilder does. I thought Fury did well in the psychological battles so far even if they were a bit staged looking early on especially but I would question whether or not even the 2015 Fury had enough power to really bother Wilder. That said, as some of the guys have commented - Wilder fights 3-4 rounds every fight looking petrified of being hit. If he hands over the initiative to Fury he could be in trouble

squinn2912 · 12-10-2018 8:29am

Draw

Well he may not be but he's a fairly unknown quantity and there are lots of potential outcomes hence the ifs and maybes. No one can say what Fury will turn up or what his true motivation is so it's unpredictable. Wilder will do as Wilder does. I thought Fury did well in the psychological battles so far even if they were a bit staged looking early on especially but I would question whether or not even the 2015 Fury had enough power to really bother Wilder. That said, as some of the guys have commented - Wilder fights 3-4 rounds every fight looking petrified of being hit. If he hands over the initiative to Fury he could be in trouble

walshb · 12-10-2018 8:44am

Wilder Points

Not buying into this angle of Wilder being petrified of being hit as being of any real importance regarding this fight..

There may be tentative moments or rds, but so what...he probably still wins them...unless Fury takes the initiative and goes on the offensive to win and earn the instances/rounds..can he? I say no..

squinn2912 · 12-10-2018 8:41pm

Draw

I sway for this fight. On one hand I often think fury’s pitter patter might well open wilder up and enable him to win, maybe even by ko. Wilder seems to reckon his chance is ko but fury was spot on with his praise for wilder about six months ago. He said he was fast, agile, powerful and with a deceptively effective jab. A wilder vs stiverne 1 type fight wouldn’t surprise me. Mightn’t be wonderful viewing though

Checkmate19 · 12-10-2018 8:52pm

Draw

Interesting fight. Think Fury has taken this fight to out trump eddie hearn and get wilder first. Fury probably needs another two tune up fights but he thinks he's ready. He's taken off alot of weight very quick and that can weaken you. Ricky Hatton put weight on and off and it eventually caught up with him.

Wilder has a decent jab. Also immense power. He showed also he can take a punch. Can see this fight going into the later rounds and it probably depend on fury's stamina. If it's there i think he'll win on points if not can see Wilder late stoppage. Interesting fight.

megadodge · 13-10-2018 12:21pm

Draw

Interesting article with Mark Breland in this week's Boxing News. Breland trains Wilder and when asked about him he said "he has a very good jab when he uses it" and "but sometimes the right hand is sloppy. I try to tell him to throw it straight, not overhand. That way, it will get there quicker." Hardly a ringing endorsement!

If Wilder's own trainer sounds frustrated, it's because I've no doubt he's told Wilder certain things a thousand times over and Wilder doesn't do them in a fight. Why? Because he has no composure. He's a panicker! And it's so obvious, I can't believe so few people ever mention it.

When he faces Fury, he's facing a fella who absolutely does NOT fear him and that can really have an affect on someone so weak mentally.

Wilder is superbly conditioned, so in all likelihood it will be a long boring fight, with Fury well ahead on points going into the late rounds. Then, maybe and that's a BIG maybe, Wilder will open up knowing he needs a KO. It could make for an interesting end to the fight, but I have my doubts.

megadodge · 13-10-2018 12:28pm

Draw

There's another thing too.

I was at Fury's last fight. We had crap seats, but overall I was quite impressed with Fury's stamina and movement. He threw an awful lot of punches for the entire 10 rounds and never looked remotely tired. Wilder's fights are mostly fought at a slow pace as he spends so much time trying to keep out of range and most opponents are worried about over-pressurising him for fear of walking into a big one.

Those things combined make me not particularly bothered about Fury's stamina. It's his clowning around that I'd be more worried about. If he's all business he'll dominate behind his excellent jab and win clearly. However, if he acts the eejet, he just might leave himself open that fraction too long....

Panthro · 13-10-2018 6:58pm

Just YouTubed it.
Looks real. If it is he's a knob.

liamoreilly · 13-10-2018 7:02pm

Wilder Points

Panthro wrote: »

Just YouTubed it.
Looks real. If it is he's a knob.

...If it's true he didn't realise there was a person in it, I worry about his level of IQ...I'm thinking it's staged, but if true could there be a case to sue, technically it's assault with deadly weapon considering his profession...

normanoffside · 14-10-2018 9:25am

Draw

liamoreilly wrote: »

...If it's true he didn't realise there was a person in it, I worry about his level of IQ...I'm thinking it's staged, but if true could there be a case to sue, technically it's assault with deadly weapon considering his profession...

The studio guys were telling him to hit it so technically it’s their fault. I do question his intelligence though ( but that’s a different story altogether).

yourdeadwright · 15-10-2018 10:10am

Draw

normanoffside wrote: »

liamoreilly wrote: »

...If it's true he didn't realise there was a person in it, I worry about his level of IQ...I'm thinking it's staged, but if true could there be a case to sue, technically it's assault with deadly weapon considering his profession...

The studio guys were telling him to hit it so technically it’s their fault. I do question his intelligence though ( but that’s a different story altogether).

There is zero chance that the story is real, There would be a law suit straight away and pictures of the guy in hospital and apologise from Wilder , Its hype that Wilder needs to become man stream ,

gimli2112 · 15-10-2018 12:03pm

ESPN must have a liability. If I came into work and my employer said, We're going to let a world heavyweight champion punch you in the face for a laugh, I would have some concerns.

walshb · 15-10-2018 1:30pm

Wilder Points

yourdeadwright wrote: »

There is zero chance that the story is real, There would be a law suit straight away and pictures of the guy in hospital and apologise from Wilder , Its hype that Wilder needs to become man stream ,

Do you think it wasn't Deontay in the video?

yourdeadwright · 15-10-2018 2:09pm

Draw

walshb wrote: »

yourdeadwright wrote: »

There is zero chance that the story is real, There would be a law suit straight away and pictures of the guy in hospital and apologise from Wilder , Its hype that Wilder needs to become man stream ,

Do you think it wasn't Deontay in the video?

What ? of course it was Wilder,but don't believe for one second he broke your mans jaw,

walshb · 15-10-2018 2:29pm

Wilder Points

yourdeadwright wrote: »

What ? of course it was Wilder,but don't believe for one second he broke your mans jaw,

Ok, but maybe he did some damage, and maybe doing what he did was wrong?

I wasn't sure what you meant.....

Would this only be a story IF the mascot suffered a broken jaw?

From what I saw it was a pretty reckless and ill advised "stunt."

yourdeadwright · 15-10-2018 3:24pm

Draw

walshb wrote: »

yourdeadwright wrote: »

What ? of course it was Wilder,but don't believe for one second he broke your mans jaw,

Ok, but maybe he did some damage, and maybe doing what he did was wrong?

I wasn't sure what you meant.....

Would this only be a story IF the mascot suffered a broken jaw?

From what I saw it was a pretty reckless and ill advised "stunt."

All I'm saying is it was a total set up, the guy obvious knew it was going to happen before hand and Wilder was probably told how tall he was and punched over his head height, remember how tall Wilder is himself,
If he truly hit the guy on just the word of the presenter and broke his jaw there would be a lawsuit and it would be all over the news,
Its was a cheap publicity stunt that's all I'm saying,

Kooto1982 · 16-10-2018 2:41am

Biggest confusion!! Both are my fav.

yourdeadwright · 31-10-2018 12:13pm

Draw

Just over a month to go now fella's ,
Really looking forward to this fight, fingers crossed there is no late injuries,
Still finding this impossible to call, but with a gun to my head id' slightly favour a Wilder KO ,
I would like to see Fury win just to see him v AJ next
Would be a massive massive fight , the build up would be great,

Sweet.Science · 31-10-2018 1:17pm

Draw

Made my final decision

Fury is going to school him for a lobisided points win

walshb · 31-10-2018 2:29pm

Wilder Points

Sweet.Science wrote: »

Made my final decision

Fury is going to school him for a lobisided points win

Were you unsure for a while?

If so it's some pick......not just happy with a points win....:pac:

Sweet.Science · 31-10-2018 2:31pm

Draw

I was unsure

But i watched his fight with Ortiz again last night . He really is so limited. A hail mary is what he'll be looking for.

I must of been half asleep watching it the 1st time around.

walshb · 31-10-2018 2:34pm

Wilder Points

Sweet.Science wrote: »

I was unsure

But i watched his fight with Ortiz again last night . He really is so limited. A hail mary is what he'll be looking for.

I must of been half asleep watching it the 1st time around.

Personally if Fury wins on points I can't see it being clear or easy. Wilder is big and rangy and awkward and can box. Add in that Fury will most likely need to box very cautiously and carefully and with defense in mind, all this likely meaning his own offense will suffer.

If Fury wins on points expect it to be very ugly, awkward and difficult to score....

yourdeadwright · 31-10-2018 3:06pm

Draw

Very possible its the Wlad fight all over again, which Fury won ugly but clearly,
But I do think if its going that way Wilder will lose his cool and could get dropped,

Again I think Wilder KO is the highest percent chance of being the outcome,

walshb · 31-10-2018 3:15pm

Wilder Points

yourdeadwright wrote: »

Very possible its the Wlad fight all over again, which Fury won ugly but clearly,
But I do think if its going that way Wilder will lose his cool and could get dropped,

Again I think Wilder KO is the highest percent chance of being the outcome,

Very much doubt it will be like the Wald fight...

The Wlad fight win was not clear....argument could be made for a heap of rds in that fight for either man.

yourdeadwright · 31-10-2018 3:40pm

Draw

I thought it was pretty clear that Tyson won ,
I think I read after the fight only 5% of pundits whole watched the fight gave it to Wald , Not sure how they worked that out,
But even online at the time ,on twitter and that all respected boxing people had Fury winning,

yourdeadwright · 31-10-2018 3:44pm

Draw

Johnathan Banks was even telling Wlad in the 10th he needed a KO to win , It wasn't pretty but Fury won clearly on the cards, Doesn't mean it was an easy win but it was certainly a clear Fury win ,

I

walshb · 31-10-2018 4:01pm

Wilder Points

I thought overall Fury won the fight..I juts didn't think it at all clear.

Clear to me means easy enough to decide and with real clarity....

Too many rds in that fight didn't have this.

Going back to the fight Dec 1, I feel that Fury won't be winning anything clearly.

yourdeadwright · 31-10-2018 4:58pm

Draw

Id agree with your opinion on what clear means, but id say it was clear Fury won more rounds than Wlad that night so he Clearly won the fight,

Anyway as regards to this fight with Wilder its very hard for anyone to have a real opinion of Fury as we haven't seen him fight anyone half decent nearly 3 years now,

I still think the obvious big right by Wilder for the KO or Fury on the cards,

walshb · 31-10-2018 5:18pm

Wilder Points

yourdeadwright wrote: »

Id agree with your opinion on what clear means, but id say it was clear Fury won more rounds than Wlad that night so he Clearly won the fight,

Anyway as regards to this fight with Wilder its very hard for anyone to have a real opinion of Fury as we haven't seen him fight anyone half decent nearly 3 years now,

I still think the obvious big right by Wilder for the KO or Fury on the cards,

Good points....

And it lends to such differing views and cards throughout boxing.

I think there may be two types of clear for some. Clear on the actual cards and clear on what actually happened.

One fighter could be sneaking/nipping rd after rd in a less than clear fashion, and end up with a clear win as regards scorecards...

So I could give it wide for one man and still say that it wasn't clear, because clear would mean that others too should see what I see, or be able to score similarly. And we all know that cards can differ, and sometimes differ hugely depending on who is scoring, in a fight that is very close and difficult to score.

I have judged many 3-0 cards for boxers in amateur fights, as in awarding one boxer all three rds. That would seem to be clear, but in several fights it was far from clear. And other judges had it 3-0 the other way. And I couldn't argue it. I have been almost always on the winners' side I may add.....Just saying!

yourdeadwright · 31-10-2018 5:28pm

Draw

I agree with you a fighter can win a very close fight by a long distance on the cards
Iv always thought myself its a shame judges rarely give spit rounds , its human nature to prefer a certain style and in close fights it can make a huge difference ,

I 100% get what your saying ,

walshb · 31-10-2018 5:35pm

Wilder Points

It's why I get fed up to the back teeth of this assumption that if a fight is close (close to a good boxing eye) it has to have close cards, and people giving out stink because a card was wide, but failing to show why it shouldn't be....

We will get this for the Fury fight against Wilder, if Fury does in any way well and makes it interesting/competitive. THE cards will be scrutinized and screamed at should Wilder get the nod, and god forbid get the nod BIG!

Look at the Ortiz fight......Ortiz did well and folks were outraged because Wilder was ahead on the cards......in a fight with many hard to award/score rds.

Morrison J · 31-10-2018 7:30pm

Wilder Points

If its a close fight that most people feel Fury won and Wilder gets a wide decision there'll be outrage. It'll be another case of the house fighter getting every advantage. Boxing has built its bed in that regard and its not going to change. Can't blame people for being frustrated with it I think. Close fights never have wide cards in favour of the b-side.

yourdeadwright · 01-11-2018 11:09am

Draw

There really is no house fighter in this one,
Fight is in California not really Wilder country,
I think he's fought there only 3 or 4 times but last time was like 4 years ago

Too Tough To Die · 01-11-2018 12:25pm

Fury Points

yourdeadwright wrote: »

There really is no house fighter in this one,
Fight is in California not really Wilder country,
I think he's fought there only 3 or 4 times but last time was like 4 years ago

Of course he's the house fighter. He's a showtime fighter and his guys are running the promotion.

Deontay Wilder v Tyson Fury - December 1st

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