NBA Regular Season & Playoffs 2019-20 Thread

Ceist_Beag · 22-05-2020 1:46pm

Carcharodon wrote: »

Jordan is arguably one of the greatest athletes/sport stars ever, scrutiny is expected but it seems so desperate at times

I don't think there is any arguably about it. Without doubt Jordan is one of the greatest. I thoroughly enjoyed watching this, for the memories of all the great players of that era but also just for another chance to see Jordan in action.
The only one negative for me in all of it was the horrible way in which Jerry Krauss was portrayed - the show really did a job on him and the man isn't even around to defend himself, nor was there even a mention that he died. At least at the very end we saw Pippen credit him but most of the references to him throughout were very negative.

For Forks Sake · 22-05-2020 2:20pm

Ceist_Beag wrote: »

I don't think there is any arguably about it. Without doubt Jordan is one of the greatest. I thoroughly enjoyed watching this, for the memories of all the great players of that era but also just for another chance to see Jordan in action.
The only one negative for me in all of it was the horrible way in which Jerry Krauss was portrayed - the show really did a job on him and the man isn't even around to defend himself, nor was there even a mention that he died. At least at the very end we saw Pippen credit him but most of the references to him throughout were very negative.

I think that Pippen was being deeply sarcastic with those comments

Ceist_Beag · 22-05-2020 2:22pm

yeah I figured that might have been the case alright, I was grasping at straws that he might have a begrudging respect for him even if he did screw him over in contract negotiations!

Coneygree · 22-05-2020 3:59pm

Krause was/is an easy target, especially with him being dead but Reinsdorf should come in for much more slack than what he got. The Bulls are still in tatters and it is 15 years since Krause was GM.

eagle eye · 22-05-2020 4:05pm

I thought they really bashed Krause early in the documentary but gave him a lot of credit later for putting the team together.
I'm of the opinion that his target was to build another championship team sans Jordan, Jackson and Pippen and then be lauded as the greatest GM ever. Obviously he failed.

Gregk961 · 23-05-2020 1:39am

I actually watched the series AGAIN(lockdown is a terrible thing) and it occurred to me how much Jordan is trying to force his ultra competitive persona onto the audience. It's repeated over and over that a player/coach/random passer-by disrespects him and he subsequently proves them wrong. Every single person he has conflict with in the series is "defeated" by him..It.just can't be an accurate reflection of his or anybodys career/life.

The highlight for me was him crying when he spoke about giving his teammates a hard time, it stands out as a genuine moment amongst a lot of bravado.

Sorry for bringing up the Last Dance again, there isn't a whole lot else going on in Basketball! And before people get defensive of Jordan:this isn't a slight against him as a player at all, he is the best I've ever seen, it's against the series.

Itssoeasy · 23-05-2020 2:21am

RIP jerry Sloan who has died. He was of course the HC of the Utah jazz for years.

Coneygree · 23-05-2020 9:42am

Gregk961 wrote: »

I actually watched the series AGAIN(lockdown is a terrible thing) and it occurred to me how much Jordan is trying to force his ultra competitive persona onto the audience. It's repeated over and over that a player/coach/random passer-by disrespects him and he subsequently proves them wrong. Every single person he has conflict with in the series is "defeated" by him..It.just can't be an accurate reflection of his or anybodys career/life.

The highlight for me was him crying when he spoke about giving his teammates a hard time, it stands out as a genuine moment amongst a lot of bravado.

Sorry for bringing up the Last Dance again, there isn't a whole lot else going on in Basketball! And before people get defensive of Jordan:this isn't a slight against him as a player at all, he is the best I've ever seen, it's against the series.

I recently read the book Relentless by Tim Grover. Grover featured in the doc too and also choked up talking about how committed Jordan was. It is a great book, a real motivator but it gives you an insight into the likes of Jordan and Kobe, both of whom were loyal clients of Grover. I think everyone can list 5 or 6 stories off the top of their head of when someone challenged Jordan and Jordan just shat on them for the rest of the game and the book helps to explain why a little.

At times Grover comes across as preachy and at the time of writing the book he had doubts about LeBron and seemed to think DWade (also a client) was the main reason why Miami was a force but it is a great read and really made a few things click for me with regards to Jordan, and to a lesser extent Kobe.

Igotadose · 23-05-2020 10:28am

Patrick Ewing tests positive for COVID-19 and is isolated, in hospital.

https://twitter.com/CoachEwing33/status/1263964626271776769

eagle eye · 23-05-2020 11:17am

Itssoeasy wrote:

RIP jerry Sloane who has died. He was of course the HC of the Utah jazz for years.

An all time great. Got more out of players than anybody else.
RIP.

ButtersSuki · 23-05-2020 11:23am

RIP on Sloan. Great coach, and a classy man - I respect him enormously for how he handled the Deron Williams situation at the time.

He got a lot of criticism for his game management of both Bulls Jazz Finals series though in recent weeks, a tad unfair but some of it valid.

BrentMused · 26-05-2020 12:51pm

Coneygree wrote: »

Krause was/is an easy target, especially with him being dead but Reinsdorf should come in for much more slack than what he got. The Bulls are still in tatters and it is 15 years since Krause was GM.

When that Bulls dynasty ended, I feel Jerry was constantly trying to be too clever.

At times in the proceeding years, it felt the Bulls just about had a core they could start to build around again together, and then Jerry would flip players for picks and/or try to start the process all over again. He was a decent drafter (although the Bulls have always drafted reasonably well in the years after Jerry) and clearly had a great eye for talent, but would never give it a chance to materialise. Whether it was ego or

Now in fairness to him there were a few things that he couldn't have helped, e.g. - Jay Williams motorbike crash, but just look at the players the Bulls drafted by Krause in the years following Jordan:

1999:

#1) Elton Brand - had a very good career overall and was named Rookie of the Year in Chicago, but was traded after only 2 years in Chicago. See Marcus Fizer in 2000 for more info.

#16) Ron Artest - picked in the same draft class as Brand. Was essentially traded by Jerry 3 years later for Jalen Rose. Artest went on to have a fantastic career.

2000:

#4) Marcus Fizer - for some reason Jerry decided to draft Fizer who played in the same position of Rookie of the Year and #1 pick the year before Elton Brand played in.

#8) Jamal Crawford - Jerry traded for Jamal Crawford at #8 overall. Crawford is another who would go on to have a great career, just not in Chicago.

2000 was a perfect example of what I'm talking about with Krause. A nice pick in Crawford, but drafting Fizer when you have Brand doing very well is over-complicating things.

In the space of just 2 years the Bulls could have had a young core of Brand/Artest/Crawford to build around!

2001:

#2) Tyson Chandler - hard to pin too much blame on Jerry here as he was gone before Chandler was traded, but another example of a good pick that would go on to have a great career - just not in Chicago.

#4) Eddy Curry - promising player but fell out with the front office over the handling of his health (rings plenty of bells with a certain D Rose!). Would be traded, again after Jerry left, and again would go on to have a solid career, winning a ring in 2012 with Miami.

2002:

#2) The Bulls unfortunately just missed out on the chance to grab Yao Ming here. Oh how things may have been different! But at #2 the Bulls took Jay Williams. Williams unfortunately had a motorbike accident after 1 year and was forced to retire. IMO it was another Jerry-style pick, someone who would take minutes away from Crawford who was starting to show improvement.

So overall what you find is, for the most part, good drafting, but constant flipping and flopping of players without them ever having a chance to develop.

I'm a Bulls fan and have lived through the "torture" of the last 20 odd years post-Jordan aside from lucking into D-Rose, but even that whole situation and wasting of a talented roster was true Bulls style :pac:

I've gotten off track a bit but I doubt you'll find another team in the NBA who at one point in time have had players on their roster who go on to have such great careers elsewhere. In the 5 years following MJ, the Bulls had players such as Brand, Artest, Crawford and Chandler on their roster. The development and building around such players just never happened. No big free agent signed in about 15 years either which is a joke for such a storied franchise.

It's all a stain on everyone involved at ownership and front office level and hopefully the recent changes will have the desired impact on getting the franchise back fighting at the top table. The changes are a long time coming!

Alf Veedersane · 27-05-2020 1:54pm

Gregk961 wrote: »

I actually watched the series AGAIN(lockdown is a terrible thing) and it occurred to me how much Jordan is trying to force his ultra competitive persona onto the audience. It's repeated over and over that a player/coach/random passer-by disrespects him and he subsequently proves them wrong. Every single person he has conflict with in the series is "defeated" by him..It.just can't be an accurate reflection of his or anybodys career/life.

I read it slightly differently. Its clear that he manufactures a lot of these sleights to spur him on.

When Karl Malone was MVP he said as much. He said he wasn't saying Malone didn't deserve it but that it made him want to go out and show why he thought he was the MVP.

Though it is entirely possible he wanted to crush them, see them driven before him and hear the lamentation of their women.

Mick McGraw · 27-05-2020 2:27pm

Alf Veedersane wrote: »

I read it slightly differently. Its clear that he manufactures a lot of these sleights to spur him on.

When Karl Malone was MVP he said as much. He said he wasn't saying Malone didn't deserve it but that it made him want to go out and show why he thought he was the MVP.

Though it is entirely possible he wanted to crush them, see them driven before him and hear the lamentation of their women.

I imagine in some way winning must become boring/routine after a while and a lot great sportspeople use revenge, spite etc rather than purely the joy of winning as a new way of motivating themselves.I really doubt that Jordan is the only sportsperson like this as much as the media likes to pretend he is.

Alf Veedersane · 27-05-2020 2:47pm

Mick McGraw wrote: »

I imagine in some way winning must become boring/routine after a while and a lot great sportspeople use revenge, spite etc rather than purely the joy of winning as a new way of motivating themselves.I really doubt that Jordan is the only sportsperson like this as much as the media likes to pretend he is.

Not even boring/routine per se but if you know you need to be at the top of your game, a perceived sleight might help.

eagle eye · 27-05-2020 3:06pm

If you listen to his HOF speech, he just goes on and on about stuff that drive him on. Anybody suggesting this is something new needs to look at that.
And it's the same with all the greats. Tom Brady is always finding something to spur him on like the media saying his team isn't good enough in a particular season. Tiger Woods, Serena Williams to name two more who just always found something they felt they had to prove wrong.
It's just being ultra competitive.
Remember the coin toss game? See how seriously Jordan took that?

chopperbyrne · 27-05-2020 11:16pm

Will Smith was being interviewed on one of the late night talk shows and said that Tiger and Jordan are on a different level to anyone he's ever met when it comes to competitiveness, with Jordan being the worst.

Wanted to race him in drinking a glass of water at a restaurant.

Osmosis Jones · 27-05-2020 11:29pm

The documentary to me is in two parts; the old footage and all the stuff from the 97/98 season is great, the modern-day interviews just feel like PR spin.

BrentMused · 28-05-2020 9:28am

The Nike store have a 30% off sale on all items (including those already reduced) which has led to some great deals on basketball apparel.

Many of their swingman jerseys have already been reduced from €90 to €63, so with the 30% discount you can pick one up for €44.

I'll include the link below but a selection of what they have left at that price (it'll vary based on size but plenty left from what I see):

Bulls - Lauri and LaVine
Bucks - Giannis
Celtics - Hayward
Nets - Kyrie
76ers - Simmons and Embiid
Pistons - Griffin
Pelicans - Zion
Cavs - Love
Jazz - Mitchell
Pacers - Oladipo
Rockets - Harden and Westbrook

Plus plenty more.

Here's the link:

https://www.nike.com/ie/w/mens-nba-teams-1vofiznik1?sort=priceAsc

I'm a big fan of the Nike swingman jerseys as they are a much tighter fit than what we're accustomed to from NBA jerseys and pretty much true to size. I'm a medium myself and would generally have found a small NBA jersey still too baggy over the years, but the medium in these Nike swingmans is a perfect fit for me even when wearing with nothing underneath it. If you are between sizes though or prefer more room maybe have a check out on some YouTube videos for a better idea of what may suit size-wise.

There are also plenty of shoes, tees, hoodies etc available but the shoes can be hit or miss on whether they qualify for the discount as "some exclusions apply."

There are also really nice Warriors, OKC and just general NBA logo hoodies for example available for less than €30 when you include your discount and these usually retail at double that.

Hope you manage to find something you like!

Rolling Stone · 02-06-2020 6:51pm

Thanks for that link BrentMused

K.O.Kiki · 12-06-2020 11:15am

Lonnie Walker IV on why he cut his hair:

The real truth as to why i started doing this early 5th grade, it was a cloaking device for me. During the summer of my 5th grade year I was around more family. Some that names will be left alone I was around more. I was sexually harassed, raped, abused, I even got accustomed to it because being at that age you don’t know what is what. I was a gullible curious kid that didn’t know what the real world was. I had a mindset that my hair was something that I can control. My hair was what I can make and create and be mine. And it gave my confidence. As of recently I wasn’t at my best. Previous History popping up in my head and it sucked mentally “demons”..... because of this virus, I began to truly look at myself in the mirror and see who I truly was even behind closed doors. Long story short I have found peace and internal happiness through this journey god willingly. I forgave everyone even the people that don’t deserve it why? Because it’s dead weight. Time doesn’t wait on anyone so why should I waste my time on it ? Me cutting my hair was more than a cut. My hair was a mask of me hiding the insecurity’s that I felt the world wasn’t ready for. But now better then ever. Out with old. In with the new. I have shed my skin mentally, emotionally, physically, and spiritually. Life will always be hard. Gotta play with the cards your dealt with and try and make a winning hand. And if you lose. It’s never a lost. It’s a lesson &#55357;&#56911;&#55356;&#57342;. I’m gonna be off this for awhile still growing through this. Just know I love each and everyone one of y’all. Peace love and happiness &#55357;&#56469;&#55357;&#56911;&#55356;&#57342;

ButtersSuki · 12-06-2020 9:49pm

Have you seen Nikola Jokic’s weight loss? Wow.

ButtersSuki · 12-06-2020 9:50pm

K.O.Kiki wrote: »

Lonnie Walker IV on why he cut his hair:

Wow. Incredibly brave of him to admit this.

Igotadose · 17-06-2020 9:27am

Sad day for we old farts who saw him "play."

https://movieweb.com/fred-curly-neal-dead-harlem-globetrotters/

ButtersSuki · 03-07-2020 1:02pm

10 years since The Decision. Scary how fast it's flown by. For anyone interested there's a couple of good Podcasts from Lowe and Windhorst on the topic.

2smiggy · 23-07-2020 10:06am

Bol Bol had a good first game back for Denver, who started with 3 centres. It would be a spectacle seeing them play Houston, possibly with no centres !!

ButtersSuki · 23-07-2020 10:31am

2smiggy wrote: »

Bol Bol had a good first game back for Denver, who started with 3 centres. It would be a spectacle seeing them play Houston, possibly with no centres !!

Could watch Jokic play all day, such a joy to watch from a traditionalist POV.

2smiggy · 30-07-2020 12:09pm

season finally starting up again tonight. 2 good games, Jazz Pelicans and Clippers Lakers.

I'm not too well up on all the permutations , but I'm sure it will become clear after a few days viewing.

Vital Transformation · 03-08-2020 2:59pm

Celtics - Blazers game was great yesterday. I saw maybe half the 3rd quarter onwards, Blazers were down nearly 20 at one point in the game. The shooting was very good from both sides down the stretch. Celtics nicked it at the end.

Vital Transformation · 04-08-2020 11:31pm

Amazing buzzer beater from Devin Booker just there, tough contested mid range fadeaway (with Kawhi and Paul George in his face) to beat the Clippers by two points.

NBA Regular Season & Playoffs 2019-20 Thread

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