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project 40/41

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  • Registered Users Posts: 4,576 ✭✭✭MojoMaker


    Peter, when you use the word "strength" you mean aerobic endurance, right?


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,359 ✭✭✭peter kern


    no
    ( iam getting better with shorter replies;-) but i will add it in todays swim reflection email as i like the question)


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,359 ✭✭✭peter kern


    wed pm weather quite nasty with a high wind chill factor 1 hour nice and easy run
    main set 6x 800 got seriously beaten up but worked really really hard and my times where not so bad considering the weather and .so nothing to complain about and run approx 22k

    thursday 2 x45 min bikes way out super tough in the wind already my turbo session of the day ;->)
    pm easy run with a few 4 min k pace parts overall 14-5 km
    turbo session planned for after run but not in the mood for it and also would no thave makde much sense

    friday off day went to bed at 1am got up to go swimming went back to bed to sleep for 75 min more ( not good but not the biggest problem in the world either )

    sat run all i can say it was tough cross country , struggled very much and felt really bad still about 1 hour cycling and 14 k run done and even on a bad day faster than on a very fast day last year. not bad and overall and today just re-enforced the weakness i have and need to address it NOW .besides losing weight.(diet at orange level this week)

    somebody asked me the other day how do i know i am improving on the bike. and certainly this is where i would have improved least in the last few weeks.but i can defo feel iam putting out more power and cycle faster at measured out test segments when the wind is comparable. but overall the swim ( a bit a fail this week ) and run are more important to me at least for another week.but swim bike and run times are getting bigger and iam in no rush right now and iam a good bit ahead of where i was last year.

    so while last few days were not great i also see that iam a bit tired and its not the mind that says no its the body and i have to respect that.


    sorted out quite a few things this week and the good thing of this blog is Bill invited me to go out for bike rides and told me about lunchtime run sessions ( thanks Bill !!!)
    so all kind of in the green zone bare the weight and way to little sleep( i have entered the red zone here and really need to watch that (of to bed now ) .no sleep no good training its as simple as that.


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,359 ✭✭✭peter kern


    sunday 95 min turbo constant 10 min 2oo watts 5 min 290 2 min 360 watts

    monday 100 min swim was just in the zone and did 80 min solid paddle and pb intervals of various lenght plus 500m 25 kick 25 swim .

    in between had to run quite a few errants and meetings so about 2 -2.15 hours of cycling done. 2 solid 30 min blocks with 10 min talking inbetween

    7.30 pm 1.46 h run along the coast just loved it approx 24 k dosnt happen often that I have to hold myself back for a long run ( started too fast but just totally enjoyed it ) did not do the planned session but got a good solid session in and longest run of the year will be god enough for stimuli . as much as i enjoyed it i was happy to be home .

    snapped up a ticket for 75 euro yesterday( plus 100 euro name change) to go to tenriffe from the 20th to 27.december.
    ( this will be a proper training camp as i will go camping so will be cheap as chips )
    if you know anybody cycling in teneriffe south during this time please let me know.
    plan is aprox 800 k cycling 20k swimming and 80 k running


    and aother miles and more camp planned 20 th of february to 2nd of march in fuerteventura . ( that will be 'posher one' still basic ) I think we are looking for few serious guys for that one will be about 1100k cycling 25k swimming and 95 k running ( lees for the 2nd group ;-)
    you dont have to be fast as we will have 2 groups but it will be an training eat sleep camp and not a coffee and whining camp ,..

    this is getting serious now.


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,576 ✭✭✭MojoMaker


    Coffee and whining camp :)


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  • Registered Users Posts: 3,359 ✭✭✭peter kern


    tuesday lunchtime intervals with running group was absolutely cool as i did not have to think and just had to run ( bill was a bit worried that i would try to take over the session ... I think i will wait for 2 weeks ;-) 60 min from door to door 400 800 1200 1600 1200 800 400 as average k pace 3.21 (casio measured and maybe 3.22 )
    to be fair i have no idea about rest but i assume is was 30 sec for every 400 m off running . found the last 1200 a bit hard but funnily enough at the 800s i felt fresh as a daisy... and was sure we had to do anthoer 400 ...v positively suprised when they stopped .


    pm 90 min x mas special turbo each participant was the coach for 2 minutes . i alwyas love it usualy people complain sessions are to tough but if you let them do the session. each of them tries to outdo the person before with a more cruel 2 min set ( was actually the 2nd time ever i participated in a turbo session i coach and it was fun.only thing i nticed i was sweating much more than the guys
    despite old wesely is actually quite cold and some powerfiles showing high poweroutputs.and i was certainly not working the hardest.


    wed am swim tts i felt wrecked but did quite well and each 100 meter split of the various 400 m tts I swam was within 2 sec, i had no speed but what iam trying to do in the pool is working ok
    and despite being totally wrecked i was a good bit faster than last year.( not that this was a hard thing ....) only litte issue i was more than 40 sec faster than my fasted 400 in ww so far since september ( i am still such a lazy b.......d at the same time i really killed myself y day and i do work hard fridays in the pool) and use extra big paddles right now.

    pm light easy run felt good as i loosened up a bit during it.

    thur am the usual commute due to gear failure i had to spin it out at approx 120 rpms a always easy to hold for a few min after 40 min it started to get good work and i was cycling in the wind.

    quick dipp in the pool as recovery session.approx 2.2 k

    http://www.slowtwitch.com/Interview/A_chat_with_Snowy_the_Great_4796.html
    reminder I must read that interview every 4 weeks


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,359 ✭✭✭peter kern


    Thursday pm 19 k run with a few steady intervals

    Friday usual swim. Good pace and for first time felt fresh enough to some sprints. Well fresh not quite the right work was more as splash festival but work I did .... Mental note need to do some leading work .

    Pm running home from pool since bike was stolen... Funny how though running can be when one is not happy

    Sat no training

    Sunday am15 k run heaven outside my camp fantastic running trails with brill hills in all variations
    5 hour bike ride first did not like traffic than decided to enjoy the sunshine rather the worrying about traffic and it was worth it


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,359 ✭✭✭peter kern


    ok re cut and pasted and this time it should be ok

    22nd
    am 75 min good run going through all the paces and loads of hills very pleased and the warm weather does me well for running

    Am 72 min non stop swim with paddles great fun and approx 4.6-8 k

    Pm 5 hour bike first a bit flat, than from 0 to 2100not not to crazy pace but not too slow easier . Wonderful climbing . Bit late and downhill getting cold and shoulder in bits by the time I arrive home

    23rd
    am. 70 min run after20 min wu all kind of fartelegs and hill reps very good session and pleased with the speed and leg turnover.

    Am 6 hour bike straight from o to 2100m in first hour I go 7 min quicker than day before meet 2 cyclist realize they have the same speed wait a bit and join them . After 1 hour the Swiss guy wants a coffe stop ( little does he know how that infuriates me ..) Anyway the Norwegian girl def not into coffee stops either and we march on at a solid pace and time is flying while talking about training . Reach 2100 25 min faster than day before. After going down to 1900 m ( being pushed out of my confort zone at downhill that girl can corner and agressivey attacts out of every corner and keeps the pressure on all the time ) . my own again climbing up to 2300m gong around the tide. ( one of the most amazing places to cycle in Europe) hit the downhill 1 hour earlier and defo more confi.
    Easy 20 min run as to cold to go for a swim .


    24th
    am 75 min swim good pace all paddles approx 4.4k
    30 min easy run with some drills

    4h.50 bike ride though good pace 3 h with company. Vita smashing it in downhills me taking the climbs v good learning experience to cycle with a roadie she really knows her cornering and brutally sprints out every corner again (of which there seems to be one every 150m) she dosnt train much but totally switched on for 3 hours.

    Pm another 4- 4 .2 k swim nonstop mainly for recovery right now the most painfully parts are the shoulders from long downhills.



    25th Thursday. Am 80 min run physiological the first Junk session as rest would be better, but good training for mind and long steady climb for 52 or so min.

    Am bike 40 min wu. I was 1 min late and Thor was already cycling in my direction ... i was trying to hang on downhill and me taking the lead uphill for next 70 min to get to a good place for intervals ( well for me that was almost the interval ...) . Plan 4-6x 10 min reps all I remember is I feel like a boxer in the ropes for 65 min when I call it a day for intervals. Was a bit worried how to get home struggled to count 80cents for a drink. ( it's 2 pm and I already drunk 5 liter still feeling Thirsty anyway after 20 min I come back to live and finish strong , 5.55h later Iam home. Overall Pleased how day went and noticing that the way I cycle is changing .


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,359 ✭✭✭peter kern


    26th
    75 min swim with fartlegs all paddles,i play guess 60 min look at my watch at 58 min 33 so not bad timing. again approx 4.5 k swim and as usual a decent current in my face in one direction and a push back ( like often atthe bray aquathon )

    am 6 hour bike ride going up another route up the the teide. (the steeper one ) having my first climbing meltdown after 2 hours and thinking to turn back ,call the whambulance (buy some choclate biscuits ) look inside myself, and body is not too tired ( and as i usually do nowadays in such a moment i rember this years april camp and ask myslef do i want to be a clown or an triathlete... that does the trick), I find my mojo and ryhthem and set a new pb for the villafloor to 2100 m split . enjoy cycling and watching the scenery at the teide base road and then push the downhill


    pm 75 min nonstop swim no paddles with a few fartlegs


    27th
    leave in darkness for a 1 hour climb ( absolutely fantastic expereince to cycle in the darkness ) for the first time this week i see gran canaria .
    40 min run through all paces
    pm 75 min good paced paddle swim

    home


    overall not a bad camp stopped counting hours after 3 days and just focused on training , realistically could not have done more apart from the last day, but decided on day 6 to have 2 hours on last day where i just enjoy the sunshine ( and a fresher body flies better and less chance to get sick. so i think a good decison ) . I know overall i would have liked to do 1 more proper swim session in the fantastic pool in los christianos and 1 more proper run. At the same time i did the work i wanted on the bike (and did a bit more intnesity than planned )
    so nothing really to write home but having done 4.30 hours on the bike in dublin the next day i can defo say the bike has come on . at the same time i am under no illusion that there is plenty to catch up and while i have a good bike base fitness at the higher end stuff i am behind scedule and need to adress that ASAP.

    was great to train 3 days with a female pro cyclist that works full time and shares my expectations of traits a serious athlete should have. we shared a lot of training stuff the first day and without talking much just got on with the work the other 2 days, without racing each other but pushing each other.

    I got in enough maintencance work and slept enough and while enjoying the great food and wine . I ate very healty and lost a bit of execess fat .
    teneriffe has its dark side with the some horrible constructions and drinking tourism but oveall its my favorite canary island and for what i wanted to get out of it it was the best location for a week.
    its always questionable if it makes sense to fly 8 hours for a 1 week camp ( risk of cold etc very high) but while i cant really judge the success of the camp for another week i am positive it worked well and when i cycled home from the airport i was happy to got in a good weeks work in nice weather and it did my body good to train in a warm climate and i come home feeling better than i left. ( apart from shoulders that suffered from the long downhills. ( and me still breaking way to much )

    while it made me realise how hard it is to train at my limit i did enjoy it . I feel a bit more positive about project 40. (without any ilusions that dark days will come.... at the same time december is usually one of the toughest training times and the first hurdle is taken and days are getting longer from now on)

    ps saw one of those downhill longboarder first i thohgt what a brill cyclist before i saw he was on a board at neck braking speed those guys have balls . magaged to speak to one of them for 2 min and it was quite impressive

    also on the way home clearest atmoshere i have ever seen not a single cloud over ireland and could see cork and galway at the same time from the plane. amazing stuff and worth the flight alone/


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 7,454 ✭✭✭hf4z6sqo7vjngi


    Good weeks training by the looks of it, finding the same with tight shoulders and sore arms, descents in Spain certainly bring you out of your comfort zone especially when going down them the first time you tighten up.

    Also noted your comment on feeling stronger when cycling home, often found an easy 5-10% improvement after a big cycling week abroad. My biggest improvement I felt was a week away with the fastest Irish IM athlete and a multiple IM winner female athlete, no bull**** and straightforward hard training for the week!


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  • Registered Users Posts: 3,359 ✭✭✭peter kern


    Good stuff.
    Personally Iam not too worried if i have improved I am more interested to improve In the next few weeks.its only a part of the puzzle and a camp for me is a bit like a swim in a race you can't win it but you can set up or destroy your race in the camp ( and I have seen the guys racing each other ) most of the time I tried to think about the long term impact of what I did. I certainly haven't improved that much as you do but what I have done is that I found the motivation to do the work I need to do by breaking some mental barriers I still had . ( ie did not like climbing lately and on the turbo did not do the required work ) Sally gap looks like a small hill now and 3 hour climbs are good turbo prep.
    Good weeks training by the looks of it, finding the same with tight shoulders and sore arms, descents in Spain certainly bring you out of your comfort zone especially when going down them the first time you tighten up.

    Also noted your comment on feeling stronger when cycling home, often found an easy 5-10% improvement after a big cycling week abroad. My biggest improvement I felt was a week away with the fastest Irish IM athlete and a multiple IM winner female athlete, no bull**** and straightforward hard training for the week!


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,359 ✭✭✭peter kern


    28th 40 min run cant rember what and not even sure if 40 min
    4.30 ish bike ride last 90 min pushing home

    29th 1 hour run

    30th am 40 min 7 k easy run with pick up
    70 min turbo 4x10 roughly 3 min easy ( hated every second of it but by far the best session so far )

    pm 30 min bike 9x 620s at good pace decending in speed strangly enugh i enjoyed that session felt good at most times when the pace went higher i moved very quickly from confort zone into working too hard ( not a suprise )
    30 min bike home
    and few 100s recovery swim and stretching .

    31st swim 70 min not very motivated (suprise suprise stiff form y day as 2 hards sessions were very close to each other ) but feeling for the water quite decent . reminded me how much i dislike pool swimming those days ;-0
    60 min run with a few fartleks

    1st easy bike no idea what time approx 2 hours
    45 min run

    apart from the 30th which was a good day the only really positive thing is weight still comming down slowly ( meassured with the dreamcatcher meathod ,

    2nd 2.5 hour bike with hoth hill reps
    run to the pool and home approx 45 min (run out of energy on way too the pools so quick stop at a shop
    shambolic swim session did quit triathlon after the first 5x 200s ( felt like it was the first time in a pool and miscounted every 2nd interval ) anyway it was not so bad to be honest
    given the fact that i was leading out all intervals bare the 2nd last one . 4x400 set was pretty good and approx 5.35 average
    and the 2nd 200s also not bad .. no still the times cant hide it was the worst friday set i swam bare the first one as there was 0 rythem . the positive given the fact i had run out of energy and doing all the lead work i did work well but jaysus i am pretty sure i would have had a heart attack had i watched that session.

    3rd 60 min cycle 90 min run 14 ,12 9.30 min intervals at prety good effort ( way to long rest ) still for sombody that was quitting triathlon again during the session . pretty good times.

    pm 45 min run

    4th 1.10 easy run 2 hours on the turbo

    not happy with the training since back home totally lost the rythem dont enjoy cycling from home at the same time not a bad weeks training either with some pretty good sessions and while i only hit 1 good turbo it was a really good one . on the other hand overall i was never in the risk of getting ill or overdoing it , and sometimes a bit less than i wanted can be more and while a bit frustrated i also know that something is going to happen in the nexy 2-4 weeks the running is very close to get to the next level and fitness is coming on overall.
    so a mixed back of training this week but weight is comming down and in the laast 8 weeks i have changed my diet each week a bit and its getting closer to where it needs to be. and before you ask i do nothing special i use the base
    the less pre prepepared foot i eat the better. the less sugar i take on the better and iam actually increasing my fat intake right now. its very simple if i eat bad i put on wieght very quickly if i eat solid and train, I like 85 % of people one should not have to worry too much about weight. ( and for most people just stop making excuses i also put on 8 kg in 3.5 month so its not like iam a miracle in losing weight and being so lucky)
    like training or not eating is a choice we make ( and of course for some its difficult but it cant be difficult for 80% of triathletes who are quite frankly overweight. not a suprise ireland has one of the higher obesity rates with its chipper and and carry out culture and supermarkets full of ready made foot. ( end of my little uncalled rant and back to focus on myself )
    but new years resulutions do my head in ( mine is quitting tri btw )


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,576 ✭✭✭MojoMaker


    What's your normal training rotation Peter - 3 weeks hard, 1 recovery? 4/1? Do you work off a 7 days schedule or a longer one, say 10-12 days etc?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 4,361 ✭✭✭Kurt Godel


    4*400 averaging 5:35 is exceptional in Tri. It'd be smiled at by proper pool guys though. You've a talent for the three sports together; stick at that.

    You should find a better New Years resolution Peter. Every year I ask my wife what her resolution is; every year the same reply- "drink more water". Try that one instead.


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,359 ✭✭✭peter kern


    Kurt Godel wrote: »
    4*400 averaging 5:35 is exceptional in Tri. It'd be smiled at by proper pool guys though. You've a talent for the three sports together; stick at that.

    You should find a better New Years resolution Peter. Every year I ask my wife what her resolution is; every year the same reply- "drink more water". Try that one instead.

    yes thats exeptional for an average triathlete , i did not swim a single 4x400 in 5.35 off 6min in last years season...
    the only problem with that... this year i want to push my boundaries and dodnt want to be medicore like last year and for that its not nearly good enough. i will need to be 20-5 sec faster eventually . being happy about average sessions is not going to cut it and after last friday and reading your comments i was sufficiently motivaveted to put in a good session this morning ;-)
    lets not beat behind the bush if i was to go to kona next year i want to be in a shape where i would go sub 8.40 on a normal day in roth if i dodnt see this happen i would likely not go to kona and aobut sub 8.40 in roth is where top agers in my age group(40-44) will be in kona... so lets say if iam not going to be 3 min overall faster in kilkee this year ( same conditons and course as last year ) it would not look that great for me , non of my splits last year were really decent ,given the swim level in ireland the swim was the least medicore but in australia it would have been just as medicore than my bike and run.
    the guy that was first out of the water in the tri under 23 worlds just swam 3.56min 400m short course in november and 15.50 for 1500 i guess that would have him on the podium for 1500 m( an triathelte ) at irish national champs so a very good tri swimmer should be a good swimmer in ireland. like we would expect bryan keane in the top 6 at irish nat cross country champs and alister browlee in contention to win them.
    so what iam saying tri world class performace should be nat level performace and kienle would have won senior the tt champs ( in the given field ) and we should not be happy with medicore splits/ of course its not realistic for me as an adult leanrer to be a competetive pool swimmer but in an open water environment i would need to be reasoable competetive ( and even 2 years ago when i was swiming sh.te i beat one guy out of the water with a 4.4x 400m time that year . and last year a triathlete was the 5 k open water champ.
    sorry for being an a.se but i dodnt like it that we aim so low in irish triathlon.there is place for fun triathlon ( and its very important to get people of the couch ) but overall we need to look outside our little pond. and lets face it even sub 8.40 shape is not that special when graig alexnder cameron brown go 8 flat at the age of 40 . ( and especially alexander has more outside tri commitments than most full time working people.
    my 2 cent
    but thank you for getting me motivated in the pool today !!!!

    mojo i have used my credit and will reply to your question another day.


  • Registered Users Posts: 278 ✭✭littlemsfickle


    peter kern wrote: »
    the less pre prepepared foot i eat the better

    Agreed. Freshly prepared foot is the secret to a good diet.

    On a more serious note - I'm enjoying following your log. As an experienced coach and athlete I think it's great that you're posting up your training for others to learn from. In particular, for triathletes who are often at risk of overtraining, I think it's important to be able to recognise when a missed session is better than pushing through a session when you're tired/unmotivated and failing to hit the quality required - something I think you've touched on a few times. Hope you stick with it!


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,359 ✭✭✭peter kern


    a fresh chicken foot a day is very good for the knees . other people pay big money for glucosamin ;-0

    ups thought i did that but meant to say thank you for the kind words, but iam narcistic enough that i realise its actually good for me to read what i do. even though i have not the slighetest idea how much iam training right now
    ( and i suspect some weeks i think i train more than i i did and others I do more than i think.
    the only time i counted since i started was the first 3 days in the camp and then a client of mine asked me if i wanted a pad on my back after i told him i had done 20.5 hours in the first 3 days and i stopped counting again ( as this is exactly what i must not do ) . this might sound maybe i dodnt care or its oversimplistic but at the same time i could rattle down my trainings weeks 8 and 15 weeks before ironman western australia 2004 with out having written it down and i know the mistakes i have made for varous races and it was not the week to week training 9 apart from the fact that bike sessions where to much in the grey zone) it was taking bad single day desions ( like running a training marathon in the wild between darwin and broome when the temarature was some 24 degree when i started and 40 by the time i finished my marathon and not having enough water till the next water stop when 32 k on a day and my given water resources would have been a much better decison) so right now what i really look is getting 3 sessions a week right and the rest is v freestyle.


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,359 ✭✭✭peter kern


    What's your normal training rotation Peter - 3 weeks hard, 1 recovery? 4/1? Do you work off a 7 days schedule or a longer one, say 10-12 days etc?
    a little brain strom ,,,,

    right now i really work of nothing I have things i want to do each week but my sessions change a lot depending on many things .
    its not structured training ( at the same time i guess in my head i do have a fairly thought out structure how i am going to move but like the irish weather is does change a lot )
    i do not work of 2 3 4 on 1 week off it can be 2 weeks on 3 or 4 weeks on ( i look more at my fatique levels )
    personally i have worked well on 2 on 1 week rec with tt s but also 4 weeks on 1 week off.
    i have had one guy this morning the threw his poul buoy away twice and i will be watching him very carefully tonight and most liklely he will be doing a shorter session unless i am satisfyed he will be ok
    also 4 hours for me does not mean its going to be 4 hours its a guide i have before the session but nothing more . same with a 2 hour run it does not have to be 2 hours as i can change the parameters around and its not like that if you have a 2 hour run planed bad thinkgs happen if you stop at 1.55 or 2.07 h and often real life time constraints etc govern what i do . likewise is i run faster than i have planned i run shorter if i run slower than planned and not too tied i run longer
    overall i need to make sure that buy the end of january iam not worn out but ready to train ( and traiing in the dark time of the year is not that easy, even the most consitent guy i have ever coached once had a close to x mas burnout )

    overall my thinking is that that most familly people should take their rest weeks due to work or family commitments etc so its often taken care for them so i dont really think for most agers it makes sense to work of a fixed on and off rythem. and looking at the sbr board most people dodnt train enough to actually need rest weeks ...but for some reason even the 6 hours a week atheltes seem to follow of season x mas break etc etc when it dosnt make sense they never train enough that they would overreach . or think it this way when a good atheltes does 18 hour weeks a rest week is still more than 6 hours training a week ...
    ( of course its different for beginners etc but i think we get the gist ...)

    overall i believe much more to get an amount of key sessions into a 1o day circle than a weekly circle but again real live makes this complicated but i do change run sessions around.
    and a 25 min good workout is better than no workout ....)

    iam more reacting than planing ( and both ways have pros and cons ) but it is very clear there is so many things that change the parameters i cant plan them.
    its very differetnt for a person that gets up every monring a 6 am trains goses to work finishes at 5 in bed by 9.30 .....
    (the more you get that the better you can plan. but training fatiuqe is a lot infliuenced by work sleep stress and family factors and its important to include them into ones planning ( or reacting if you dodnt have a stable live rythem ) .

    quite simpley my goal right now is more quality ( the week in teneriffe it was all about miles but still ...its quality i need ) despite the fact that is my seem crazy what i do i have a very good idea where iam am and i want to work more on those weaknesses.( still being clear that i could not even train the way i wanted as iam just not ready for it ,(both mentaly and physically and of course my body is not the same as 8 years ago )


    credit used despite race entry irony last monday ;-)


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,576 ✭✭✭MojoMaker


    Thanks - very helpful Peter.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,839 ✭✭✭zico10


    peter kern wrote: »
    same with a 2 hour run it does not have to be 2 hours as i can change the parameters around and its not like that if you have a 2 hour run planed bad thinkgs happen if you stop at 1.55 or 2.07 h

    I agree with the gist of your post and bad things certainly won't happen if you cut a two hour run short. Same way bad things won't happen to someone who doesn't swim to the wall when finishing off an interval, but I think both instances can sometimes reveal a lot about the mindset of the athlete.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 278 ✭✭littlemsfickle


    zico10 wrote: »
    I agree with the gist of your post and bad things certainly won't happen if you cut a two hour run short. Same way bad things won't happen to someone who doesn't swim to the wall when finishing off an interval, but I think both instances can sometimes reveal a lot about the mindset of the athlete.

    Tbh I think it says more about the mindset of the athlete who arrives at their front door with 1:55 done and runs up and down the street for 5 mins to make it 2 hours (and yeah I've done this but I feel it just feeds into the quantity over quality approach)


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,839 ✭✭✭zico10


    Tbh I think it says more about the mindset of the athlete who arrives at their front door with 1:55 done and runs up and down the street for 5 mins to make it 2 hours (and yeah I've done this but I feel it just feeds into the quantity over quality approach)

    Well I think running the full two hours shows determination, which is a good mindset to have, and no doubt goes some way to explaining why you do well in the sport.


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,359 ✭✭✭peter kern


    both zico and littlemissfrickel make very good points and i would agree with zico if runs are always 1.55. and not swimming into the wall does give great insight into an atheltes mind set ( so does swimming into the wall if there is no space at wall sometimes)
    there is soft atheltes that always stop short
    there is people that find the happy medium ( knows when 1.55 or 2.07 are called for
    and there is the compulsive ones.who run around the car if run is 3 seconds short 2 hours.

    with one you know they hardly ever get anywhere. 2 is what you want but dodnt often get and 3 is what most good triatheltes are .


  • Registered Users Posts: 278 ✭✭littlemsfickle


    zico10 wrote: »
    Well I think running the full two hours shows determination, which is a good mindset to have, and no doubt goes some way to explaining why you do well in the sport.

    And possibly also why I've been out for six months with a stress fracture...

    To clarify of course commitment is required but compulsion can be dangerous


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,359 ✭✭✭peter kern


    Well I think running the full two hours shows determination, which is a good mindset to have, and no doubt goes some way to explaining why you do well in the sport.
    And possibly also why I've been out for six months with a stress fracture...

    To clarify of course commitment is required but compulsion can be dangerous


    fantastic stuff zico and littlemissfrickle i think the above is very valuable for any athlete to read
    athletic performance and mishappenings explained in less than 100 words
    ( same goes for gear powermeter hr monitors certain toys can be very valuable being compulsive about them not the best)

    i just rember scott molina once said it even better ( in the lines off ) . the reason i was a world champ was i trained crazy hard and crazy hours , the reason why i did not win more world champs was that often i pushed myself too hard.


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,359 ✭✭✭peter kern


    5th I think I mentioned that swim as one of my best outside a
    Friday
    pm long run had no idea how that would work out started slow than a solid rythem a few hill reps from 57min to 1.03 and back home
    realized i was getting faster saw the speed indicator in DL hovering around 15-16 kmh and suddenly hit a runners high. As i said i kind of know something was to happen with the running soon and I think we can now say I am back running. in the last 10 k there was 6k hovering around 3,57-403 k pace for a 1.55h run and i loved it ( iam sure there was a bit of a tail wind but not a crazy one so approx 4.10 pace and not slower than 4.25 min k in 2nd half which is fast for me for a long run. but as i said i loved it.

    at home i got a message g barcelona down to last 50 entries (thanks marry and niamh) . so i went straight to the computer, as this was the first session which showed i like this stuff again ,and tried to enter but race sold out ( 2 good things i had myself there to enter , but also didnt get a place and to be fair it absolutely againts my thinking to enter a race 9 month in advance ,which was the only reason i raced pro to not have to deal with this .Anyway I am sure it will have some entries later on so no sweat. and lanza 2016 would not be a bad choice either. mallorca just dosnt do it for me (my plan is to spend 1 day in the altair bookshop in bareclona ( one of my favorite bookshops in the world)

    6th 4o min lunch run easy
    Short but high intensity turbo session pm ( better a bit really fast than nothing at all )

    7th am swim no idea what i was doing but swam largley beside another swimmer that was also doing long reps and kept myself entertained by slowing down speeding up etc 68 min in pool

    pm same session as last week in the park total fun i was playing catch the Niall with 10 sec handicap and it was great. starting behind somebody motivates me and he motivates me . Iam amazed how much niall is improving and we really getting somewhere with his pacing. he is really turning himself around right now to become the best athelte he can be , and again ,of course this has an impact on my session ( surround yourself with positive people) . 2 since i start behind him i can see what he needs to work on and how he progresses and of course it helps him too tohave somebody to pace off . hit 1 sub 2min for 600m up the pass 4 sub 208s and 3 sub 2.10 ( and 2 slower ones to focus on niall. overall 17 k of running
    some 1h 40min commuting on bike

    8th an 2 x 45min ish bike rides

    7 x 5 turbo intervals bit low on energy, but giving it to myself and went into a few dark places. ( we are getting there on the turbo to start proper training)

    pm 10 k easy run

    9th
    main set 6x200 off 3,05 i have no idea what average i know i did 2 250ms ,tango led the last 3x 200
    4x400 in 5min.20.5 average off 6 5x200s average 2.49 off 3.05

    despite another clown performance by myself until tango hit the water, which raised the spirit of the session massively.
    but even then i kept losing the pb and sabotaging myself in any possible way. i
    still good session and i seriously worked at some stages of that session .
    so far my best week training in terms of hitting the sessions i wanted
    and was tired entering the water today but this is the good thing when your bike gets stolen outside the pool it does give you a bit of belly fire every time you lock your bike and enter the pool...
    also if you just entered a bloody race which is 3 times as expensive for what i want ie a race and not a tri show- i guess its time to get a bit serious now and stop fluffing around in the pool.
    as project 40 step 1 is entered. (its funny some people tell me they heared iam doing an ironman but that is really the C goal for this year )

    Since running is now at an decent level again and much more importantly i am loving it again.
    its now time to bring the swimmng up so i will like it more again, until the bike focus starts on feb the 21st in fuerteventura .

    I have to say its pretty nice to have swam a few 1.15s for 100 in the 400s this morning. i guess 1.15 is the pace when swimming starts to actually feel like swimming as you feel like you start moving through the water. they say it never gets easier but when you hit sub 3.30 k run pace or sub 1.15 100m in the pool it certainly starts to feel more like being in harmony with the task than working against something.


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,576 ✭✭✭MojoMaker


    1:15 would certainly be the magic number for holding ITU swim splits. Nice to hear it's coming together in line with the effort - must feel good at the moment?


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,359 ✭✭✭peter kern


    MojoMaker wrote: »
    1:15 would certainly be the magic number for holding ITU swim splits. Nice to hear it's coming together in line with the effort - must feel good at the moment?

    in itu you have to have the ability to start the first 400 in 4.30 and then hold about 1.10 pace for the rest.

    of course it does feel nice to progress at the same time as with everything to see progress, effort has to go into , and fatigue level is now at close to saturate level before i have a few easier days.
    so no it dosnt feel good at the moment. but there is nice glimpses of hope to get faster ( the proverbial carrot that keeps one going- we are simple creatureas after all ;-)

    but yes I did swim two 2013/14 pbs in the pool this am ( did not wear drag suits this morning ... its a bit silly to trick yourself feeling good about yourself but it works ...)
    ps at the same time i skipped the weigh in this morning as iam fairly certain i would not want to see the result


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,359 ✭✭✭peter kern


    friday 9th
    pm
    25 min bike easy
    20 min run

    sat am 30 min bike easy run drills and hill sprints easy run 30 min bike all in all close two 3 hour with some good efforts but easy session.

    pm 45 min easy run. i cant be too sure but i guess thats approx 85k of running this week a fair mix of faster stuff and easier stuff

    sunday 4 hours on the bike that felt a bit harder thant there should have been but i gues not a too big suprise with approx 100 hours plus minus 3 hours in last 4 weeks of training and i have done ( for myslef ) some very very decent intensity sessions

    monday
    am
    as said one of the best monday swims with 2 x 100 pbs 80 min plus 30min cycling

    pm
    30 min bike 85 min run warm up 9 x 600s this was a bit of a mind over matter session with 6 out of the 9 sub 2.05 min with spectacular meltdown at the 7th rep where i tried to push one more time for a fast time and after 400 m the body gave in (legs and tummy) and after 500m the mind too and i was on all 4 ( not very pleased with the mind meltdown ). finished the last 2 well enough and was actually very pleased as i can see what i am trying to address is moving in the right direction , so cycled home very happy but knowing that i need to do some serious maintenance work at home as i pushed the body a bit more than i should have.

    tue
    am easy 45 min run

    pm 80 min turbo session . 20 . 12 . 2x 5 min got of the bike for some water after the 12 min and if i was to deny i did not have jelly legs i would be lying. but with the help of norman stadler i got the last 2x 5 min done and i was happy , felt very weak in legs going to work not so bad going home.and this morning felt good in the legs I guess we will see on sunday where my bike really is , but that was almost a proper turbo session and thebreathing goot very uncontrolled for prolonged efforts and i start to enjoy it again to be in the turbo hurt box.

    wed
    am
    75min swim the am swim session went brilliantly this morning so i was in high spirit entering the pool myself the fast 100s did not quite work as well as i wanted but after about 2 k in the swim i set a new 400 pb for 2013/14 beating my pre kilkee time trial time by 2 seconds.(that doesn't say much to be fair but it certainly shows that my attitude- like the guys in the am session - in the pool is changing)

    Anyway, till next Wednesday things will calm a bit down apart from Friday Swim and Sunday race (which will be a serious test) it will be a bit hard to assess the bike ,since i have not sat on the bike i will be using on Sunday but looking forward to it ,in a way the only performance iam interested in is race day, all the rest I dodnt care very much about, they are nice things to look at but only when there is race pressure do those numbers really become meaningful. I call this the brain switch effect , based on a cork athelte that would get beaten in every club trainings tt often by a good bit only to beat those people on race day in that discipline and sometimes by a good bit ....


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  • Registered Users Posts: 4,377 Mod ✭✭✭✭pgibbo


    Solid training Peter. What race is on Sunday? Best of luck


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