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Covid 19 Part XXVIII- 71,942 ROI(2,050 deaths) 51,824 NI (983 deaths) (28/11) Read OP

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  • Options
    #3932
    Jim_Hodge
    Registered Users Posts: 10,433 ✭✭✭✭Jim_Hodge


    Kermit.de.frog wrote: »
    Any day under 500 cases is a good day in my opinion.

    Only if you don't want any relaxing of restrictions. Kermit, you know anything above 150-200 a day is not what we need to get to.


  • Options
    #3933
    niallo27
    Registered Users Posts: 16,002 ✭✭✭✭niallo27


    polesheep wrote: »
    The vaccine really is imminent. It will be quickly rolled out to those most at risk and we will rapidly get back to normal.

    I really think it is too, other vaccines are being mass produced as we speak as well so once some of them get approval the stock level of vaccines rises dramatically.


  • Options
    #3934
    stephenjmcd
    Registered Users Posts: 15,199 ✭✭✭✭stephenjmcd


    Goldengirl wrote: »
    Because he is saying they are to be blamed for that .

    How can you blame the most vulnerable to this virus for picking it up ?

    Would you think its correct to blame immunocompromised or cancer patients if they pick it up ?

    I don't think that's the point being made here, another poster said you can attribute blame to older people if they pick it up and from what I can see ACE attempted to question that by asking said poster would they now blame older people and said poster replied saying yes if they aren't following restrictions.

    Nobody should be being blamed, I thought that was the whole point here, if you start the blame game people just won't come forward for tests.


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    #3935
    Strumms
    Registered Users Posts: 24,807 ✭✭✭✭Strumms


    niallo27 wrote: »
    OK ill go with it, what do you think deserves jail time. Going over 5k, having someone in your house. What do you think deserves jail time.

    I think by breaking restrictions you receive a probation order with a fine. A probation order can last up to three years...or for three years, do it a second time, criminal record and conviction... taking you chances with the sentence.

    That’s fair, reasonable and a deterrent.


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    #3936
    Goldengirl
    Registered Users Posts: 12,015 ✭✭✭✭Goldengirl


    screamer wrote: »
    I am really hoping for the best, that the vaccine will be available soon, however, I fear Groundhog Day is just going to continue. We’ll be in rolling lockdowns till at least the end of April, moving between level 3 and 5 depending on the covid infection rates. It’s so hard to accept that, so much has been taken from us already in terms of quality of our lives. I genuinely don’t believe what Nphet are spinning us either. It just seems this will run on and on for a lot longer than anyone wants it to. Just fed up of covid now, fed up hearing of it, reading stats, listening to Holohan and the government, I’m kinda numb to it at this stage and nothing actually surprises me, nor do I care anymore.

    I think most would agree with this except a lot do believe NPHET .
    I think/ hope we will be at level 2 for Christmas but think we will be back up the levels again after January .


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    #3937
    niallo27
    Registered Users Posts: 16,002 ✭✭✭✭niallo27


    froog wrote: »
    well sorry but you don't speak for the public. most people are in favour of restrictions, particularly in light of the global situation right now where in case you haven't been following the news, is completely out of control.

    You said till next June, you think people really want to be stuck to 5km for the next 8 months. You think we can afford to pay pup to half a million people for 8 months. Are you listening to what your saying


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    #3938
    spookwoman
    Registered Users Posts: 9,922 ✭✭✭spookwoman


    Uploaded the age data to google docs for anyone to see. r7 and r14 are rolling 7 and 14 day totals.

    https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1GY0ro2kCYeiWceTNmX_eQGP3vDzZ3DWAcpEnXxT_65A/edit?usp=sharing


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    #3939
    niallo27
    Registered Users Posts: 16,002 ✭✭✭✭niallo27


    Strumms wrote: »
    I think by breaking restrictions you receive a probation order with a fine. A probation order can last up to three years...or for three years, do it a second time, criminal record and conviction... taking you chances with the sentence.

    That’s fair, reasonable and a deterrent.

    Do you realise how utterly stupid and unworkable that would be.


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    #3940
    political analyst
    Registered Users Posts: 4,442 ✭✭✭political analyst


    davemckenna25 wrote: »
    People socialising in open air is not safe, they should still social distance by 2 metres..... been the case for months now....

    I don't go around checking on house parties but lets all be honest, they are happening.

    I agree the Majority of Irish people deserve the credit and the majority of Irish people do get the credit they deserve, however the low numbers compared to Europe are due to our Government putting in the restrictions earlier than most of Europe.

    So overall we agree that the majority of people are doing good and deserve the credit, however those minority who aren't deserve to also get the blame they deserve. It is them stopping us from getting go level 2 or less for Christmas, not the governments fault.

    Such parties are illegal anyway if they take place without permission from the authorities, e.g. the illegal raves that took place in Britain in the 1980s.

    Clamping down on gatherings because of Covid is like banning alcohol because it causes cirrhosis - you only have to ask the Americans to see how that turned out in the 1920s! Furthermore, HPV causes cancer but the authorities didn't ban people from having sex with each other when awareness of cervical cancer increased.


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    #3941
    froog
    Registered Users Posts: 3,784 ✭✭✭froog


    niallo27 wrote: »
    You said till next June, you think people really want to be stuck to 5km for the next 8 months. You think we can afford to pay pup to half a million people for 8 months. Are you listening to what your saying

    it's about 3-4 billion to pay PUP for 6 months. that will not break the country.


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    #3942
    Macu17ab
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 90 ✭✭Macu17ab


    froog wrote: »
    it's about 3-4 billion to pay PUP for 6 months. that will not break the country.

    And whatever the government loses out on tax revenue as a direct result of lockdown


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    #3943
    Strumms
    Registered Users Posts: 24,807 ✭✭✭✭Strumms


    niallo27 wrote: »
    Do you realise how utterly stupid and unworkable that would be.

    If it saves lives it’s not stupid, it’s very workable.

    There are less people going to prison since covid. Crime and crime trends are way down ... that would facilitate the implementation of such an idea, act as a deterrent to fûckwits risking the health of their fellow citizens.


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    #3944
    Goldengirl
    Registered Users Posts: 12,015 ✭✭✭✭Goldengirl


    stephenjmcd wrote: »
    I don't think that's the point being made here, another poster said you can attribute blame to older people if they pick it up and from what I can see ACE attempted to question that by asking said poster would they now blame older people and said poster replied saying yes if they aren't following restrictions.

    Nobody should be being blamed, I thought that was the whole point here, if you start the blame game people just won't come forward for tests.

    Nobody should be blamed for picking it up , that can happen anyone .
    But I am pvssed off at the constant partying in the streets when we have community transmission .
    I don't agree that the police are doing enough.
    Those crowds are not distancing and are in large groups when rest of us are not meeting anyone from outside our family .
    It's just not on .
    Move them on , break them up , with good humour but firmly , and respect the fact that people doing their best and businesses are not happy about it .

    Btw fair enough if that is what ACE was saying , but it was a bit opaque to more than me !


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    #3945
    Stark
    Registered Users Posts: 20,892 ✭✭✭✭Stark


    It's a false trade-off between "protecting the economy" and "protecting public health" anyway. Uncontrolled covid spread is devastating for both supply (businesses forced to shut down due to sick employees) and demand (no-one wants to go out for dinner during a raging pandemic). You can see this in economic data from the US states with very relaxed restrictions, they suffered far more economic damage than the states that locked down. Sweden isn't looking too good compared to its Nordic neighbours either. The question isn't whether we lift lockdown and accept higher case numbers in turn for "protecting the economy", it's how can we come up with measures of controlling covid that give more bang for buck.

    In Ireland, from what I can see, we need to up our contract tracing game and also do something to tackle outbreaks in private homes.


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    #3946
    stephenjmcd
    Registered Users Posts: 15,199 ✭✭✭✭stephenjmcd


    Goldengirl wrote: »
    Nobody should be blamed for picking it up , that can happen anyone .
    But I am pvssed off at the constant partying in the streets when we have community transmission .
    I don't agree that the police are doing enough.
    Those crowds are not distancing and are in large groups when rest of us are not meeting anyone from outside our family .
    It's just not on .
    Move them on , break them up , with good humour but firmly , and respect the fact that people doing their best and businesses are not happy about it .

    The Gardai broke them up last night after a while using public order legislation but there's nothing they can do in terms of distancing etc, none of that is a penal provision, its a public health guideline which Gardai have no powers to enforce hence in the Garda statement it referenced no breaches detected. I know that's not what people want to hear but its the reality here. All they can ask is you move on.

    Its an offence to organise an event such as a protest, any gathering etc at the moment but only to organise, attending isn't, as silly as thst is.


  • Options
    #3947
    niallo27
    Registered Users Posts: 16,002 ✭✭✭✭niallo27


    froog wrote: »
    it's about 3-4 billion to pay PUP for 6 months. that will not break the country.

    And you think people will be happy seeing no family or friends for 8 months. No social life, no job, not being able to pay mortgages. Are you out of work may I ask.


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    #3948
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 4,727 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    froog wrote: »
    it's about 3-4 billion to pay PUP for 6 months. that will not break the country.

    People have certainly lost touch with reality...
    3 or 4 billion is a staggering amount. And we’ve already been paying it for months with possibly months more ahead


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    #3949
    Strumms
    Registered Users Posts: 24,807 ✭✭✭✭Strumms


    niallo27 wrote: »
    And you think people will be happy seeing no family or friends for 8 months. No social life, no job, not being able to pay mortgages. Are you out of work may I ask.

    Banks have offered payment breaks of 3 months with reviews.

    Nobody is happy about it but it’s better then being sick or dead.


  • Options
    #3950
    froog
    Registered Users Posts: 3,784 ✭✭✭froog


    niallo27 wrote: »
    And you think people will be happy seeing no family or friends for 8 months. No social life, no job, not being able to pay mortgages. Are you out of work may I ask.

    no one's "happy" with the restrictions ffs. it's about a bit of sacrifice to stop people dying.

    and my working status is none of your business.


  • Options
    #3951
    Goldengirl
    Registered Users Posts: 12,015 ✭✭✭✭Goldengirl


    stephenjmcd wrote: »
    The Gardai broke them up last night after a while using public order legislation but there's nothing they can do in terms of distancing etc, none of that is a penal provision, its a public health guideline which Gardai have no powers to enforce. I know that's not what people want to hear but its the reality here. All they can ask is you move on

    Well most of the people there are not troublemakers just young people gathering so I for one am happy if the guards do just move them on because most will disperse amicably .
    What annoyed me is that I heard stories of the guards not doing anything at all in the instances other than South William St last night .


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    #3952
    stephenjmcd
    Registered Users Posts: 15,199 ✭✭✭✭stephenjmcd


    Strumms wrote: »
    Banks have offered payment breaks of 3 months with reviews.

    Nobody is happy about it but it’s better then being sick or dead.

    Payment breaks no longer have to be offered in the form that they were earlier this year. Its up to your bank. Some banks are now closed for new applicants to this and operate on a case by case basis.

    There's no blanket break anymore that finished in September


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    #3953
    froog
    Registered Users Posts: 3,784 ✭✭✭froog


    Deleted User wrote: »
    People have certainly lost touch with reality...
    3 or 4 billion is a staggering amount. And we’ve already been paying it for months with possibly months more ahead

    it's not a staggering figure at all. ireland's GDP is about 340 billion. we borrowed well over a hundred billion during the recession. and money is very cheap right now from europe.


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    #3954
    ACitizenErased
    Registered Users Posts: 11,632 ✭✭✭✭ACitizenErased


    Economics isn't a strong point here, clearly


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    #3955
    Strumms
    Registered Users Posts: 24,807 ✭✭✭✭Strumms


    stephenjmcd wrote: »
    Payment breaks no longer have to be offered in the form that they were earlier this year. Its up to your bank. Some banks are now closed for new applicants to this and operate on a case by case basis.

    There's no blanket break anymore that finished in September

    Don’t ‘have’ to be but ‘ARE’ being, I know two families in this scenario.


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    #3956
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 4,727 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    froog wrote: »
    it's not a staggering figure at all. ireland's GDP is about 340 billion. we borrowed well over a hundred billion during the recession. and money is very cheap right now from europe.

    It’s not just about paying PUP though. IMO, 3 or 4 billion is a staggering amount. There is a reason social welfare is considerably less, even though there is much fewer to pay.

    But you also have to consider that nearly half a million are out of work. People that would have more money to spend if employed.

    The economy will be f*cked beyond belief. But the government don’t want to highlight that right now.

    Hard to get people to comply if you tel them their reward will be extra taxes and possibly losing their homes.


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    #3957
    hmmm
    Registered Users Posts: 11,205 ✭✭✭✭hmmm


    Goldengirl wrote: »
    Well most of the people there are not troublemakers just young people gathering so I for one are happy if the guards do just move them on because most will disperse amicably .
    What annoyed me is that I heard stories of the guards not doing anything at all in the instances other than South William St last night .
    I wish we had more consistency in policing restrictions from the Guards in difficult situations, and less checkpoints pulling in families on the N11 heading to the beach. "Policing by consent" is all very well, but that shouldn't be confused with passiveness.

    In saying that rant, I'm torn about the street drinking. You'd prefer it not to happen, but if it did you'd prefer it to be outside and not inside. We lost a trick I think by not creating outdoor areas which could be controlled - apparently our climate makes this impossible, despite the obvious evidence of hundreds of people standing out in a street when they get a chance.


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    #3958
    froog
    Registered Users Posts: 3,784 ✭✭✭froog


    Deleted User wrote: »
    It’s not just about paying PUP though. IMO, 3 or 4 billion is a staggering amount. There is a reason social welfare is considerably less, even though there is much fewer to pay.

    But you also have to consider that nearly half a million are out of work. People that would have more money to spend if employed.

    The economy will be f*cked beyond belief. But the government don’t want to highlight that right now.

    Hard to get people to comply if you tel them their reward will be extra taxes and possibly losing their homes.

    a few sections of the economy will be/are fcuked, mainly pubs and hotels. some retail. everything else is pretty much as normal. the economic argument is way overstated.


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    #3959
    stephenjmcd
    Registered Users Posts: 15,199 ✭✭✭✭stephenjmcd


    Strumms wrote: »
    Don’t ‘have’ to be but ‘ARE’ being, I know two families in this scenario.

    As I've said its a case by case basis, for the 2 you know that got a break I've a family member that didn't when they lost their job due to 2nd lockdown, know others in the same boat as well.

    So there isn't the automatic safety net there that was there previously when you got a break no questions asked


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    #3960
    niallo27
    Registered Users Posts: 16,002 ✭✭✭✭niallo27


    froog wrote: »
    no one's "happy" with the restrictions ffs. it's about a bit of sacrifice to stop people dying.

    and my working status is none of your business.

    Well if your not willing to discuss your working status then I can presume your still in full employment with full pay, so its very easy to preach and tell people to stay at home and sure don't worry about your job, here is 350 quid that should cover your mortgage and pay for your family needs you greedy bollox, just watch Netflix.


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    #3961
    Russman
    Registered Users Posts: 5,848 ✭✭✭Russman


    froog wrote: »
    no one's "happy" with the restrictions ffs. it's about a bit of sacrifice to stop people dying.

    That’s it in a nutshell really, when you strip away all the noise.

    The problem is when some people’s definition of “bit of sacrifice” is wildly different to someone else’s. I think in the last, I dunno, 50 years maybe, we’ve generally become unaccustomed to being told we can’t do something. We haven’t really had wars or famines or anything long lasting that required collective action (thankfully).


This discussion has been closed.
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