If the Green Party got into government are they mad

Wheeliebin30 · 17-06-2019 6:18pm

Also if you read up on these heat pumps they have huge costs in maintaining them on an annual basis and a lot of them have to be ripped out as they don’t work properly.

This all seems rushed and pie in the sky to me.

Shefwedfan · 17-06-2019 6:21pm

Wheeliebin30 wrote: »

I mean when they ban all fossil fuels will they have Forty foots been towed by an electric engine?

I believe it takes 40 minutes to charge your car, how would that work if you’re commuting from Dublin to cork on a given day?

You would loose an hour waiting for your van or car to charge.

Hugely unreliastic.

Current electric cars have range to travel from Belfast to Cork.

I love to Cork to Dublin example, always given. I drive the Cork to Dublin road alot and it is empty, you might not pass a car for over an hour. Just because people move to electric do they suddenly have an urge to drive to Cork that they don't have now?

Anyway vans will have more than plenty of range, VW van will have 100kWh+ battery in it

Volvo/Tesla etc are all developing electric trucks. So yes they will have a 40ft as you put it pulled by a electric truck. A lot sooner than you think.

Shefwedfan · 17-06-2019 6:23pm

Wheeliebin30 wrote: »

Also if you read up on these heat pumps they have huge costs in maintaining them on an annual basis and a lot of them have to be ripped out as they don’t work properly.

This all seems rushed and pie in the sky to me.

A lot of pub talk going on in this thread. Eary heat pumps had issues, mostly due to poor installation. Also because builders did not protect the under floor piping.

New system do not have these issues, of course you can have a bad one but for majority they have no issues. Not sure what the huge cost is to maintain? like any boiler they should get a yearly service. What exactly are these costs?

gctest50 · 17-06-2019 6:25pm

Wheeliebin30 wrote: »

Also if you read up on these heat pumps they have huge costs in maintaining them on an annual basis and a lot of them have to be ripped out as they don’t work properly.

......

FUD c/w added " respect muh authiritay cos i have read up so i have "

is_that_so · 17-06-2019 6:28pm

Wheeliebin30 wrote: »

Also if you read up on these heat pumps they have huge costs in maintaining them on an annual basis and a lot of them have to be ripped out as they don’t work properly.

This all seems rushed and pie in the sky to me.

It's been a year coming so not exactly rushed. Some of it will require a whole lot more detail but it's not bad in principle.

tayto lover · 17-06-2019 6:28pm

gctest50 wrote: »

Easy - increase the price of diesel to match price of petrol

Trucks, large vans have electronic tachos for years.

Upload yer tacho to new Revenenue website to get the few extra cent per litre back

No upload shiny electronic tacho ? no money back for you

And how does that help to reduce carbon emissions exactly?

17-06-2019 6:32pm

Wanderer78 wrote: »

Have we entered the world of 'alternative facts'!

New cars v's old cars! Really!

Half the lifetime carbon emissions of a fossil fuel car are produced during manufacture. Cars produced in the last 10-15 years aren't much more polluting than new cars. So it's more environmentally friendly to keep an old car running than buy a new one. Perhaps electric might change that calculation, but not hugely.

17-06-2019 6:34pm

They just said the cost of failure is 1.9 billion. I'd say the cost of success is multiples of that.

tayto lover · 17-06-2019 6:34pm

Richard Briton on RTÉ News saying that things are going to get more expensive if we continue to use fossil fuels. At least he’s being honest. We knew that anyway.
He got an easy ride as usual from the interviewer.

facehugger99 · 17-06-2019 6:36pm

Wheeliebin30 wrote: »

Also if you read up on these heat pumps they have huge costs in maintaining them on an annual basis and a lot of them have to be ripped out as they don’t work properly.

This all seems rushed and pie in the sky to me.

Spent €100 on a routine service on mine in the last 7 years. Never had a day's trouble with it.

17-06-2019 6:38pm

No mention of agriculture, Moneypoint or the cement or airline industries in this analysis, which are our biggest sources of emissions. Better to tackle the 10% that are caused by the ordinary joe soap than tackle the other 90%.

Don't get me wrong, we need action yesterday but surely you should start with the big hitters and work your way down to stuff that will cause people real hardship?

Shefwedfan · 17-06-2019 6:39pm

Deleted User wrote: »

No mention of agriculture, Moneypoint or the cement or airline industries in this analysis, which are our biggest sources of emissions. Better to tackle the 10% that are caused by the ordinary joe soap than tackle the other 90%.

A plane full of people produce less CO2 per person that those people driving cars for the same distance.

17-06-2019 6:41pm

Shefwedfan wrote: »

A plane full of people produce less CO2 per person that those people driving cars for the same distance.

Cars don't typically drive a thousand miles or more in a day though.

17-06-2019 6:46pm

https://www.epa.ie/climate/communicatingclimatescience/whatisclimatechange/whatareirelandsgreenhousegasemissionslike/

Trasport also includes air transport

Shefwedfan · 17-06-2019 6:46pm

Deleted User wrote: »

Cars don't typically drive a thousand miles or more in a day though.

I am not saying they do, if you want to get from A to B. Lets say London to Edinburgh. If you fill the plane and fly it would produce less CO2 than those people getting into a car and driving the journey.

17-06-2019 6:49pm

Shefwedfan wrote: »

I am not saying they do, if you want to get from A to B. Lets say London to Edinburgh. If you fill the plane and fly it would produce less CO2 than those people getting into a car and driving the journey.

If they got in a ferry it would be less.

Point is if you are jetting off to the sun 4-5 times a year you are contributing massively to the problem. Or as one guy I know flies constantly around Europe giving speeches about climate change.

j8wk2feszrnpao · 17-06-2019 6:51pm

Listening to the Greens highlights why they’ve never take power.
Saw an earlier post in here that suggested the way to avoid carbon tax is to buy a new electric car. Sums it up, no idea of people living real lives.
We (Ireland) can try do our bit, but when Greens preach from a different reality, they thankfully won’t be the ones directing change.

17-06-2019 6:54pm

munstermagic11 wrote: »

Listening to the Greens highlights why they’ve never take power.
Saw an earlier post in here that suggested the way to avoid carbon tax is to buy a new electric car. Sums it up, no idea of people living real lives.
We (Ireland) can try do our bit, but when Greens preach from a different reality, they thankfully won’t be the ones directing change.

In fairness Richard Bruton is equally out of touch with reality

tayto lover · 17-06-2019 7:01pm

Deleted User wrote: »

In fairness Richard Bruton is equally out of touch with reality

These people have no problem affording any change.
They live on a different planet to most working class people.

GreeBo · 17-06-2019 7:12pm

maccored wrote: »

its as realistic as the government charging me more money just to get to work. can you not get up earlier? for what? to walk to work quicker? for the FOURTH TIME - theres no public transport alternatives

They are charging you more money for polluting more. They dont force you to work there.

Im not asking you what is there now, I'm asking you do you think it's reasonable to expect public transport to cater for your 40 mile commute within a reasonable time, let's pick 90 minutes?

kanuseeme · 17-06-2019 7:15pm

I do not understand why people think they need to buy a new electric car, 2nd hand is an option, in fact I would recommend one if it is a 2 car family, the person who does the maximum mileage within its range should drive it. if you are like me then I would recommend a phev, no range anxiety, so far since march 20 last I have spent 250 euro less on petrol, compared to my last hybrid.

In time I will upgrade the house also, keep the heating system till it gives up the ghost, but attic insulation is next, then maybe walls. I would really love solar electric. bit by bit.

GreeBo · 17-06-2019 7:15pm

maccored wrote: »

where did the 10 million for trump come from? whereever that was would be a start. How about the 40 odd percent taxes I end up paying?

Where did your roads and water come from?
Where does your education and healthcare come from?
How about police, fire and ambulance services?
How about all the public utilities and services that you avail of everyday?

Are you trying to tell us that if you got to keep that 40% you could do it for cheaper privately?

GreeBo · 17-06-2019 7:17pm

kanuseeme wrote: »

I do not understand why people think they need to buy a new electric car, 2nd hand is an option, in fact I would recommend one if it is a 2 car family, the person who does the maximum mileage within its range should drive it. if you are like me then I would recommend a phev, no range anxiety, so far since march 20 last I have spent 250 euro less on petrol, compared to my last hybrid.

In time I will upgrade the house also, keep the heating system till it gives up the ghost, but attic insulation is next, then maybe walls. I would really love solar electric. bit by bit.

What mileage do you do to need the phev?
If you are doing large mileage then an ev makes even more sense imo.
Pays for itself the more you drive.

kanuseeme · 17-06-2019 7:32pm

Not much to tell you the truth, but when I want to I can drive to the airport and home again without stopping for a charge. I can fit all I want into it without playing tetris. so it suits me fine, most car accidents are within 25 miles of home because people are driving within that radius the most and my phev's range covers most of my weekly driving. If I lived nearer to Dublin an EV would suit some of my needs better, but 2 adults 2 kids another on the way and bags hard fit that into a leaf.

For a one car family I would recommend a phev, 2 car family at least one EV.

Wheeliebin30 · 17-06-2019 7:34pm

So will planes be allowed to fly into Ireland once the fossil fuel ban comes in?

What about huge factories who use fossil fuels for production with huge ovens and steam generators?

kanuseeme · 17-06-2019 7:47pm

Wheeliebin30 wrote: »

So will planes be allowed to fly into Ireland once the fossil fuel ban comes in?

What about huge factories who use fossil fuels for production with huge ovens and steam generators?

A bit extreme, if we get our own country in order, I think we can suffer a few planes.

As for huge factories allowances have to be made for them, speaking as a foundry man, I see it deeply unfair that scrap metal is sent to china and processed into something that is shipped back here to be sold.

China is clamping down on huge factories, we got some business back as the Chinese shut down factories to stop them polluting.

I remember reading about fish caught in Norway sent to china to be processed and then sent back to Norway to be consumed. I do not know how they will fix that problem.

Berserker · 17-06-2019 9:47pm

maccored wrote: »

how about because I havent got 40 grand?

What are you planning on buying? You can get an electric car or a hybrid for less than that. I've a 172 Auris (Hybrid) and it cost me far less than that, second hand.

munstermagic11 wrote: »

Listening to the Greens highlights why they’ve never take power. Saw an earlier post in here that suggested the way to avoid carbon tax is to buy a new electric car. Sums it up, no idea of people living real lives. We (Ireland) can try do our bit, but when Greens preach from a different reality, they thankfully won’t be the ones directing change.

Does the reality from which they preach really matter? People voted for them and that gives them the green light to implement these changes.

tayto lover · 17-06-2019 10:12pm

[QUOTE=Berserker;110461362.

Does the reality from which they preach really matter? People voted for them and that gives them the green light to implement these changes.[/QUOTE]

Very few actually voted for them. About 5% in fact.
Does that give them the right to railroad the vast majority who didn’t vote for them?
I believe the Government are just using the opportunity to extract more money from the working man.
I’ll wait to see the incentives they offer in exchange for greener measures. It will show how genuine they actually are.

Water John · 17-06-2019 10:17pm

Wheelie, we are largely talking about energy, it sources and uses. Most functions will be switching to electric and the electricity will largely come from renewable sources.

Berserker · 17-06-2019 10:31pm

tayto lover wrote: »

Very few actually voted for them. About 5% in fact.
Does that give them the right to railroad the vast majority who didn’t vote for them?
I believe the Government are just using the opportunity to extract more money from the working man.
I’ll wait to see the incentives they offer in exchange for greener measures. It will show how genuine they actually are.

Oh, this is gold for the government. They can implement these measures, which will not go down well with the majority when they cost of them hits home and they'll blame it on the GP. The GP will be back down to 1% and no seats soon after that.

Chips Lovell · 18-06-2019 9:46am

Deleted User wrote: »

No mention of agriculture, Moneypoint or the cement or airline industries in this analysis...

All four are mentioned in the plan. The word "agriculture" is mentioned 101 times in a 145 page document. Moneypoint is to close in 2025

tayto lover · 18-06-2019 9:58am

Berserker wrote: »

Oh, this is gold for the government. They can implement these measures, which will not go down well with the majority when they cost of them hits home and they'll blame it on the GP. The GP will be back down to 1% and no seats soon after that.

Could be right but they might suffer like FF did too. The Greens could cause them the same problem.

abcabc123123 · 18-06-2019 10:10am

Berserker wrote: »

Oh, this is gold for the government. They can implement these measures, which will not go down well with the majority when they cost of them hits home and they'll blame it on the GP. The GP will be back down to 1% and no seats soon after that.

They can blame the party with 2 seats that is in opposition. Yeah, that'll work well. If they implement policies badly, they'll lose more votes to FF and the Greens will just say that they would have done things differently.

At any rate, the assumption that that Green policies are intrinsically negative economically is false.

average_runner · 18-06-2019 10:12am

I take it taxi and bus fares will all drop now also when we move to Electric cars, as fuel cost will be alot cheaper?

The Specialist · 18-06-2019 10:54am

tayto lover wrote: »

Very few actually voted for them. About 5% in fact.
Does that give them the right to railroad the vast majority who didn’t vote for them?
I believe the Government are just using the opportunity to extract more money from the working man.
I’ll wait to see the incentives they offer in exchange for greener measures. It will show how genuine they actually are.

Exactly, they have decided to go head first like a bull in to these plans on the assumption that the greens have a sizeable support - they don't. They will find out loud and clear in the next election what the majority thinks of this ****ing nonsense.

maccored · 18-06-2019 10:58am

GreeBo wrote: »

They are charging you more money for polluting more. They dont force you to work there.

Im not asking you what is there now, I'm asking you do you think it's reasonable to expect public transport to cater for your 40 mile commute within a reasonable time, let's pick 90 minutes?

why the whataboutery?

Im saying dont charge me more money to get to work unless you give me an alternative way to get there.

no idea where your going with your 90 minutes

maccored · 18-06-2019 11:00am

Berserker wrote: »

What are you planning on buying? You can get an electric car or a hybrid for less than that. I've a 172 Auris (Hybrid) and it cost me far less than that, second hand.

i'm not planning on buying anything.

GreeBo · 18-06-2019 11:22am

maccored wrote: »

why the whataboutery?

Im saying dont charge me more money to get to work unless you give me an alternative way to get there.

no idea where your going with your 90 minutes

Its not whataboutery. You keep saying there is no alternative, I'm asking you is it realistic to expect public transport for your commute.
You keep ignoring the question and then bring up walking and other random distractions.

You are the only person to blame for your commute. Why you think its someone elses problem to solve is beyond my comprehension.

Everyone is going to be charged more for using fossil fuels, its not some personal vendetta against you.

Still waiting for a reply on where you think your 40% tax is going...

The Specialist · 18-06-2019 11:23am

GreeBo wrote: »

Its not whataboutery. You keep saying there is no alternative, I'm asking you is it realistic to expect public transport for your commute.
You keep ignoring the question and then bring up walking and other random distractions.

You are the only person to blame for your commute. Why you think its someone elses problem to solve is beyond my comprehension.

Everyone is going to be charged more for using fossil fuels, its not some personal vendetta against you.

Still waiting for a reply on where you think your 40% tax is going...

What an attitude to have, it's his fault for having a job???! **** out of that

Shefwedfan · 18-06-2019 11:47am

average_runner wrote: »

I take it taxi and bus fares will all drop now also when we move to Electric cars, as fuel cost will be alot cheaper?

Electric taxis already on the road....the few clever taxi drivers worked out the regulator charges are based on petrol/diesel and not electric so they can make a tidy profit.

So at the moment, you can take an electric taxi but you pay the same as combustion engine.....

GreeBo · 18-06-2019 12:19pm

The Specialist wrote: »

What an attitude to have, it's his fault for having a job???! **** out of that

No, its his decision to commute 40 miles everyday.
Who do you think is to blame? Leo?:rolleyes:

The Specialist · 18-06-2019 12:20pm

GreeBo wrote: »

No, its his decision to commute 40 miles everyday.
Who do you think is to blame? Leo?:rolleyes:

Yes it's called having a job and being required to travel to that job - it's not a "decision" as you put it, but rather something expected of adults who aren't parasites with their hands out for welfare. Do you work?

rabbidpeach · 18-06-2019 12:21pm

GreeBo wrote: »

No, its his decision to commute 40 miles everyday.
Who do you think is to blame? Leo?:rolleyes:

Government policy of putting a significant number of jobs in Dublin and the high cost of living there is to blame. If we had more balanced development and/or reasonable cost housing in Dublin, maybe there wouldn't be such a need for huge commutes.

Shefwedfan · 18-06-2019 12:52pm

Are we really complaining about 40 miles? that is 60km....hardly a long commute.

I do that a few times a week into Dublin city centre.

Seriously are we saying a 40-mile commute the best option is diesel?

Shefwedfan · 18-06-2019 12:55pm

rabbidpeach wrote: »

Government policy of putting a significant number of jobs in Dublin and the high cost of living there is to blame. If we had more balanced development and/or reasonable cost housing in Dublin, maybe there wouldn't be such a need for huge commutes.

Have a look around this forum, it was started before about a person living outside Dublin but would prefer to travel into Dublin for "Dublin wages"

A number of companies have tried to move out, Dunnes Stores got a huge new office and the staff wouldn't move out.

Try our lovely civil servants who strike anytime anyone tries to move them out.

Companies based in Dublin has nothing to do with the government, it is all to do with the irish people.

GreeBo · 18-06-2019 12:56pm

rabbidpeach wrote: »

Government policy of putting a significant number of jobs in Dublin and the high cost of living there is to blame. If we had more balanced development and/or reasonable cost housing in Dublin, maybe there wouldn't be such a need for huge commutes.

They "put" the jobs in Dublin did they?

The Specialist wrote: »

Yes it's called having a job and being required to travel to that job - it's not a "decision" as you put it,

The decision is to not work near where you live.

The Specialist wrote: »

but rather something expected of adults who aren't parasites with their hands out for welfare. Do you work?

:rolleyes:

is_that_so · 18-06-2019 1:36pm

GreeBo wrote: »

Its not whataboutery. You keep saying there is no alternative, I'm asking you is it realistic to expect public transport for your commute.
You keep ignoring the question and then bring up walking and other random distractions.

You are the only person to blame for your commute. Why you think its someone elses problem to solve is beyond my comprehension.

Everyone is going to be charged more for using fossil fuels, its not some personal vendetta against you.

Still waiting for a reply on where you think your 40% tax is going...

This really is a bit silly as a post. Let's try a simple question. Why do you think the poster has such a long commute?

is_that_so · 18-06-2019 1:38pm

GreeBo wrote: »

They "put" the jobs in Dublin did they?

The decision is to not work near where you live.

Are you representative of Green thought on all of this? If so there is really no hope for any of us.

maccored · 18-06-2019 2:27pm

GreeBo wrote: »

No, its his decision to commute 40 miles everyday.
Who do you think is to blame? Leo?:rolleyes:

theres this thing called 'work'. see, if you dont live in the city, you could find that your expertise in this thing called 'work' might not be next door to you. you might have to 'travel' .. that might be a new word for you as well. thats where you have to go from a to b using transport.

the government have this thing called 'public transport' - you know, the likes of those bus things and the luas that you might find in dublin - but outside cities, its a bit ****. where I am its none existent. if it wasnt non existent, then I would use it and wouldnt mind if fuel got more expensive. the problem is it isnt.

your answer is to get a job nearer my house. thats a stupid answer.

Now, while you wait on me to (for some reason) explain where my taxes go (wasnt that the question I was asking?) maybe you could explain to me where we're going to find the precious metals we need to make electric cars with because - as outlined earlier in an article about the subject - we might find (as many already suspect) that electric cars arent as green as you think they are.

maccored · 18-06-2019 2:34pm

Shefwedfan wrote: »

Are we really complaining about 40 miles? that is 60km....hardly a long commute.

I do that a few times a week into Dublin city centre.

Seriously are we saying a 40-mile commute the best option is diesel?

the other option is petrol ... my point is public transport is not an option as there isnt any public transport options. as per my first post, my issue with carbon taxes is theres no public transport option to stop me from having to drive, therefore Im going to end up paying more money but still having to pollute the atmosphere. charging me more wont stop me having to drive. providing a public transport option will

If the Green Party got into government are they mad

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