RSA ad on unaccompanied L drivers

Stheno · 06-01-2019 12:01am

road_high wrote: »

You sound like the ad- there was no deliberate “killing someone’s family” just a horrible, unfortunate accident that that poor girl and their family will have to live with forever.

And what of the family who have to live without a wife and mother and daughter for ever?

punisher5112 · 06-01-2019 12:02am

Stheno wrote: »

Thats a myth tbh

Back in 70s it was true. They had such back logs the minister just waived the test procedure.... Nearly sure 70s apologies if 80 but nearly sure.

lbc2019 · 06-01-2019 12:03am

UrbanFret wrote: »

Back in the 70s they were far fewer cars yet the death tolls on or roads regularly hit close to 600 per annum. What exactly will an experiernced driver sitting in a passenger seat do in these circumstances. The girl could have passed her test an hour before this accident, would it have made any difference?

She would have been passed competent to drive- she wasn’t

The good news when her ban expires she has to go through the whole learning permit process again

ayux4rj6zql2ph · 06-01-2019 12:03am

Stheno wrote: »

Thats a myth tbh

In 1979 then Minister Sylvester Barrett made an order that full driving licenses be issued to people who had applied for the driving test only, this resulted in people being issued with licenses for vehicles such as buses and hgv’s.

My own father was one of those people.

This decision by Barrett cemented his status in Irish history for all the wrong reasons.

Stheno · 06-01-2019 12:03am

punisher5112 wrote: »

Back in 70s it was true. They had such back logs the minister just waived the test procedure.... Nearly sure 70s apologies if 80 but nearly sure.

It was the early seventies.

Very few current licences would include those issued then

OldMrBrennan83 · 06-01-2019 12:03am

Needles73 wrote: »

I think the ad is very inappropriate. I have nothing but sympathy for this man who lost his wife and daughter.
But I also have sympathy for the unaccompanied driver who was unsupervised and made a terrible mistake. They have to live with this. That’s punishment enough without an ill thought out type of advert.

I'd have none and hope she never gets over it. People have far too much sympathy for people who cause these things these days, but she was in the wrong and should always be paying for it.

Only issue I'd have with the ad is the sound is poor enough on it. Not sure why it's fairly inaudible.

ayux4rj6zql2ph · 06-01-2019 12:05am

Stheno wrote: »

It was the early seventies.

Very few current licences would include those issued then

Anyone from that era would be at least 55/56 years old now.

punisher5112 · 06-01-2019 12:05am

Stheno wrote: »

It was the early seventies.

Very few current licences would include those issued then

But it did happen.

Sure the test had only got more difficult in the last few years.

Stheno · 06-01-2019 12:05am

Patww79 wrote: »

I'd have none and hope she never gets over it. People have far too much sympathy for people who cause these things these days, but she was in the wrong and should always be paying for it.

I'm the same

Charles Babbage · 06-01-2019 12:05am

Stephen15 wrote: »

Yes but that doesn't mean many still do. I know people who commute to and from work everyday by car driving on the motorway from down the country to Dublin and they've been driving for the guts of four or five years.

I suggest you call the Gardai.

Garda Confidential: 1800 666 111
Traffic Watch: 1890 205805

punisher5112 · 06-01-2019 12:06am

Parker Clever Sextant wrote: »

Anyone from that era would be at least 55/56 years old now.

And still sh1te driving.

Sure I see a hell of a lot of N plates being driven like absolute plonkers.

OldMrBrennan83 · 06-01-2019 12:06am

emeldc wrote: »

There’s shed loads of experienced drivers out there that shouldn’t even be let out in a car after dark!
You’re spouting some amount of nonsense TBH.

That's always the thickest argument in all this.

"There's loads of bad drivers so let loads of new inexperienced drivers out too, because!!!!"

Rubbish.

ayux4rj6zql2ph · 06-01-2019 12:07am

punisher5112 wrote: »

And still sh1te driving.

Sure I see a hell of a lot of N plates being driven like absolute plonkers.

Spot on,

Those who received licenses from the amnesty will be on the road for many years yet.

The N plates are the only ones you see, imagine the ones who aren’t displaying L/N plates. Very common.

Sleeper12 · 06-01-2019 12:10am

road_high wrote:

Yes in so much as was in the media. An accident can happen even the most experienced of drivers, pretty hard to pin blame solely on that aspect.

But MUCH more likely to be caused by an inexperienced driver.

The Gardai did a full investigation. There would have been a coroners report. Do you honestly believe that you know what did or didn't contribute to the accident and the professionals investigating got it wrong?

punisher5112 · 06-01-2019 12:10am

I'll give you all a good one.

I witnessed a delivery van from ready chef driven at speed the wrong way down George's Street in town. He overtook 3 buses and a car in the 3 rd lane which is the opposite side and through a red light pedestrian crossing with people crossing.

I reported it.

But as it was my word against his the guard would be unable to prosecute.

Bit of a strange one to be honest as the footage in my vehicle showed him overtaking.

Oh well.

UrbanFret · 06-01-2019 12:12am

Parker Clever Sextant wrote: »

Spot on,

Those who received licenses from the amnesty will be on the road for many years yet.

My elderly female neighbour has a HGV licence for god sake.:eek:

the_pen_turner · 06-01-2019 12:12am

anyone got a link to the add in question

splinter65 · 06-01-2019 12:12am

Victor wrote: »

Killing someone's family is also in poor taste/tone.

I did a 3-day first aid course and was taught the basics of first aid. If I try to do CPR on someone, but they die anyway, I won't be held accountable. However, if I try to do brain surgery, which I'm not trained for and they die, well, I was acting far beyond my training and would be negligent to have tried brain surgery at all. I would be held accountable.

Similarly, learner drivers are required to be accompanied by trained drivers. If they aren't accompanied, they are acting beyond their training and need to be held accountable.

She was held accountable and she has been punished. This is further punishment. How much punishment is enough. My heart goes out to the bereaved man but this vengeance is not going to bring his family back.

ayux4rj6zql2ph · 06-01-2019 12:13am

UrbanFret wrote: »

My elderly female neighbour has a HGV licence for god sake.:eek:

Does she know there’s a hgv driver shortage? Better get her signed up :pac:

pablo128 · 06-01-2019 12:13am

freshpopcorn wrote: »

and they very controversial question did he leave any of his children drive unaccompanied?

Could you expand on this please?

emeldc · 06-01-2019 12:14am

lbc2019 wrote: »

What nonsense? Ah shure youll be grand had our road fatalities at the numbers they were

37 years ago when I was 21, I had already passed bikes, cars and HGV tests. No amount of licenses or experience could have prevented a girl walking out in front of my car on Baggot St one day. She landed on the roof, thankfully just badly bruised. In spite of what you say, accidents do just happen.
My fear for the learner driver in this case is that if they keep vilifying her in the media they might push her into doing something more stupid than driving unaccompanied. She’s been given her punishment. They need to leave her alone. There isn’t one of us here that hasn’t driven unaccompanied.

Stheno · 06-01-2019 12:15am

splinter65 wrote: »

She was held accountable and she has been punished. This is further punishment. How much punishment is enough. My heart goes out to the bereaved man but this vengeance is not going to bring his family back.

If this ad like t he drunk driver ad stops one person it's good imo

The drunk driver was jailed for 7.5 years, she was banned for 15

Shame the ads don't mention that

Purple Mountain · 06-01-2019 12:16am

Stheno wrote: »

If she had not caused them to go off the road perhaps they might still be alive?

She admitted in court to driving dangerously and causing the collision

I didn't know this as it's not mentioned in the ad.
I'm not going to comment further because I feel it's a really sensitive topic.
Rest in peace mum and daughter.

lbc2019 · 06-01-2019 12:17am

emeldc wrote: »

37 years ago when I was 21, I had already passed bikes, cars and HGV tests. No amount of licenses or experience could have prevented a girl walking out in front of my car on Baggot St one day. She landed on the roof, thankfully just badly bruised. In spite of what you say, accidents do just happen.
My fear for the learner driver in this case is that if they keep vilifying her in the media they might push her into doing something more stupid than driving unaccompanied. She’s been given her punishment. They need to leave her alone. There isn’t one of us here that hasn’t driven unaccompanied.

No the pedestrian was at fault for crossing where she shouldnt be and you are required to be mindful of pedestrians

gctest50 · 06-01-2019 12:17am

Sleeper12 wrote: »

But MUCH more likely to be caused by an inexperienced driver.

......

Maybe if they fixed up the roads and barriers n stuff instead of wasting money on flowers on roundabouts and other crap that pair wouldn't have drowned :

( I'm presuming there is a car sized gap in the wall because someone else went through it previously )

Sgt McNamara said that there had been a gap in the wall for many years.

In the collision, the Clancys’ car flipped over and went through this gap, down an embankment, and into a flooded trench not much wider than the car, thereby wedging the car in the drain, which was flooded to a height of 82 centimetres

The RSA are probably a bit butthurt because it didn't involve excess speed or mobile phone use by a young person

robarmstrong · 06-01-2019 12:19am

Learners aren’t the main problem, there are plenty of full license drivers out there who have below-par driving ability.

I’ve been involved in numerous crashes, I’ve had an elderly woman reverse full whack into the front of my car, I’ve had an elderly man smash into the side of my car as I was pulling out of an industrial estate (he was driving with no lights on... at night... in a black f*cking car..) and I’ve had two separate occasions where fully qualified drivers have driven down the wrong way on a one way street and cause an incident to my car and my friends car (occasion 1 they were looking for parking, occasion 2 they were texting and driving)

Rather than starting a witch hunt and proclaiming learner drivers to be the worst ever and I’m sorry but the majority of people have driven on a provisional by themselves, I don’t have stats to back that up other than anecdotal experiences but it’s a lax law(until recently) we need to heavily invest in training and proper driving procedures.

I’m a full license driver, I didn’t do motorway driving as part of my test. Why? Why is this not included? Motorways are such a core representative of the users of the road so why is there no modules/practical modules?

A friend of mine has her full license 3 years, she does not do more than 60km/h on a motorway. That is ridiculous and dangerous, she does not do more than this because she’s not a confident driver. Yet she’s “fully qualified”? Makes no sense.

I’d love to see an overhaul of our driving infrastructure and education platforms and tbh, get rid of the “theory” or “learner permit”. Do it all in one, you sit a theory the morning and do a practical after you’ve received lessons that can be verified by a nominated instructor, if you pass? Great!! If you don’t? Try again.

lbc2019 · 06-01-2019 12:19am

Stheno wrote: »

If this ad like t he drunk driver ad stops one person it's good imo

The drunk driver was jailed for 7.5 years, she was banned for 15

Shame the ads don't mention that

He got it reduced on appeal because he wrote a letter of apology to the family. They said they never received it. It was just standard solicitor sentence reduction techniques

OldMrBrennan83 · 06-01-2019 12:19am

splinter65 wrote: »

She was held accountable and she has been punished. This is further punishment. How much punishment is enough. My heart goes out to the bereaved man but this vengeance is not going to bring his family back.

No matter what punishment she got (she didn't really get any punishment for killing two people) it won't come close to the sentence she put on both her victims and he husband/father.

emeldc · 06-01-2019 12:19am

lbc2019 wrote: »

No the pedestrian was at fault for crossing where she shouldnt be and you are required to be mindful of pedestrians

I was mindful of her. Maybe you’re a fuggin' mind reader but I’m not.

lbc2019 · 06-01-2019 12:20am

gctest50 wrote: »

Maybe if they fixed up the roads and barriers n stuff instead of wasting money on flowers on roundabouts and other crap that pair wouldn't have drowned :

The RSA are probably a bit butthurt because it didn't involve excess speed or mobile phone use by a young person

I think they are doing a good job, road fatalities are at their lowest level ever

lbc2019 · 06-01-2019 12:20am

emeldc wrote: »

I was mindful of her. Maybe you’re a fuggin' mind reader but I’m not.

Drivers are required to be alert for other road users

Stheno · 06-01-2019 12:20am

gctest50 wrote: »

The RSA are probably a bit butthurt because it didn't involve excess speed or mobile phone use by a young person

It involved an l driver in as unacompanied taking a blind turn at speed

gctest50 · 06-01-2019 12:22am

Patww79 wrote: »

No matter what punishment she got (she didn't really get any punishment for killing two people) it won't come close to the sentence she put on both her victims and he husband/father.

Why is there a gap in the wall " for many years " ?

Bit of barrier would have saved them

Sgt McNamara said that there had been a gap in the wall for many years.

road_high · 06-01-2019 12:22am

gctest50 wrote: »

Maybe if they fixed up the roads and barriers n stuff instead of wasting money on flowers on roundabouts and other crap that pair wouldn't have drowned :

( I'm presuming there is a car sized gap in the wall because someone else went through it previously )

The RSA are probably a bit butthurt because it didn't involve excess speed or mobile phone use by a young person

Lot of our rural (Non national) routes have almost nothing in terms of crash barriers etc and are absolutely littered with dangerous, lethal obstacles like trees, walls, banks etc
Course it would cost tens of millions in safety measures to address all these so the easy, cheap option is focus on the driver rather than addressing both.

Henry Ford III · 06-01-2019 12:23am

She shouldn't have been driving alone.

lbc2019 · 06-01-2019 12:24am

road_high wrote: »

Lot of our rural rural (Non national) routes have almost nothing in terms of crash barriers etc and are absolutely littered with dangerous, lethal obstacles like trees, walls, banks etc
Course it would cost tens of millions in safety measures to address all these so the easy, cheap option is focus on the driver rather than addressing both.

That’s why drivers have to drive with an awareness of the conditions around them

OldMrBrennan83 · 06-01-2019 12:24am

gctest50 wrote: »

Why is there a gap in the wall " for many years " ?

Bit of barrier would have saved them

Why did she put them through it?

Stheno · 06-01-2019 12:24am

road_high wrote: »

Lot of our rural rural (Non national) routes have almost nothing in terms of crash barriers etc and are absolutely littered with dangerous, lethal obstacles like trees, walls, banks etc
Course it would cost tens of millions in safety measures to address all these so the easy, cheap option is focus on the driver rather than addressing both.

Why does that not make sense?
People should be aware when driving

lbc2019 · 06-01-2019 12:24am

gctest50 wrote: »

Why is there a gap in the wall " for many years " ?

Bit of barrier would have saved them

Her not driving unaccompanied would have

road_high · 06-01-2019 12:26am

lbc2019 wrote: »

That’s why drivers have to drive with an awareness of the conditions around them

Human beings haven’t an aura of infallibility around then- surely you do realize that if you worked assessing insurance claims?
Hence why we often have barriers and controls around as a safety net when human judgement fails

ANXIOUS · 06-01-2019 12:27am

lbc2019 wrote: »

Her not driving unaccompanied would have

You can't say that if she was accompanied it wouldn't have happened.

JP Liz V1 · 06-01-2019 12:27am

Stheno wrote: »

I think it like the drunk driver ad are very appropriate tbh.

I'd like to see that learner driver charged appropriately

What was she charged with?

Also did she drive off or get help after the crash?

road_high · 06-01-2019 12:28am

lbc2019 wrote: »

Her not driving unaccompanied would have

How do you know being unaccompanied would have prevented the accident? I find nothing more distracting than yapping passengers.

gctest50 · 06-01-2019 12:28am

road_high wrote: »

Lot of our rural (Non national) routes have almost nothing in terms of crash barriers etc and are absolutely littered with dangerous, lethal obstacles like trees, walls, banks etc
Course it would cost tens of millions in safety measures to address all these so the easy, cheap option is focus on the driver rather than addressing both.

Why don't "they" do that then, bit by bit - it'd also provide employment**

** i'm not talking about letting 3 lads off in a truck full of tarmac n tea for the day

lbc2019 · 06-01-2019 12:29am

ANXIOUS wrote: »

You can't say that if she was accompanied it wouldn't have happened.

He can’t say if the wall was repaired it wouldn’t have either. We don’t have sliding doors vision

Stheno · 06-01-2019 12:29am

JP Liz V1 wrote: »

What was she charged with?

Also did she drive off or get help after the crash?

Dangerous driving banned for 15 years.

No idea about the aftermath of the crash

ayux4rj6zql2ph · 06-01-2019 12:29am

Henry Ford III wrote: »

She shouldn't have been driving alone.

Has her father ever publicly spoken on the issue as it was he who gave her his car and permitted her to drive unaccompanied? I’ve just seen that ad on tv in the last few minutes.

North Cork Star · 06-01-2019 12:29am

The ad to me is in more bad taste than anything. I'm from the same general area as this man. The man has been bitter ever since the incident. It is well known around the area that he has fallen out with the girl's family. Both families are closeby neighbours and were friendly before the accident. The man has openly spoke out about this girl's wrongdoings and how terrible it was that she was on the road that day. He's been harking on about it ever since. In my opinion, he's using this current RSA campaign just to twist the knife even more and make this girl and her family's lives a misery.

I think the RSA and Department of Transport need to be more pro active with their campaigning and their actions. I do think they really need to stamp down on the amount of unaccompanied Learner drivers in order to avoid similar incidents in the future. Using this bitter campaign doesn't do it for me.

Also, I do have great sympathy for the man. It must be an awful ordeal and I wouldn't wish it upon my worst enemy. R.I.P.

splinter65 · 06-01-2019 12:30am

Stheno wrote: »

And what of the family who have to live without a wife and mother and daughter for ever?

The unaccompanied driver was a young girl. She took one of those risks that most young people take, like we all did.
Hitching a lift to save the train fare. Smoking a joint in the college toilets. Unprotected sex with a one night stand. Buying knock off gear from a guy in a van. She did the wrong thing and she’s been punished and her family have been punished and her life is never going to be anyway right.
The bereaved man will never recover from this but persecuting this girl is never ever going to help him in any way.
There is no closure in this case. For anyone.

lbc2019 · 06-01-2019 12:30am

JP Liz V1 wrote: »

What was she charged with?

Also did she drive off or get help after the crash?

I can’t provide a link (new) but google the case

RSA ad on unaccompanied L drivers

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