Do you consider nationalists from Northern Ireland to be Irish?

Sharp MZ700 · 12-10-2019 8:34pm

As polls go that's a good one.

Charles Babbage · 12-10-2019 8:39pm

The 26 counties is only part of Ireland. If someone wants to characterise someone as not being from there then some other term like not Freestater or not 26 countier can be used.

But as Mary McAleese's election showed normal people don't distinguish between one Irish person and another and the sad few who do should get a life.

Citizenpain · 12-10-2019 8:54pm

mfceiling wrote: »

Not being a smart arse but is the flag not green white and orange?

I have heard it being described as green white and gold before though and always wondered where it originated from.

the Constitution of Ireland states

The national flag is the tricolour of green, white and orange.

facehugger99 · 12-10-2019 9:02pm

As long as we don’t have to pay for them they can call themselves whatever they like.

12-10-2019 9:02pm

I think I've spotted Ivan Yates.

Itssoeasy · 12-10-2019 9:11pm

I do consider people born in Northern Ireland to be Irish, but whether they consider themselves Irish or not is the question. The GFA sets out the position of people in the north. They can be Irish or British but they have the choice.

Wibbs · 12-10-2019 9:15pm

Silent Running wrote: »

Why would people born in occupied territory be anything but Irish? Ireland is an Island.

Well Iberia is a peninsula, but they're not all Spanish.

SharpshooterTom · 12-10-2019 9:16pm

ChikiChiki wrote: »

Without reading the thread, I view Nationalists as Irish and Unionists as Trannys. (They are in transition and becoming Irish prior to renification when the British eventually get rid, they just do not realise the poor craythurs).

Theres a song in there somewhere, "Come out you black and trans"

I personally wouldn't consider protestants/unionists from NI to be Irish. The vast majority identify as British ONLY, are of full (or near full) British ancestry, have fought and died with the British army in various wars over the past 100 years (with heavy casualties in WWI, WWII, Iraq, Afghanistan etc).

A lot of blood has been spilt for their right to call themselves British and I think that should be respected, whether we agree with it or not. Just as I would hope people in the ROI would consider the native Irish population up here to be as Irish as those in the 26 counties. If an English person pulled an Ali G "Iz you on holiday?" I would defend that protestant's person right to call himself British and not for him to be mocked.

tdf7187 · 12-10-2019 9:22pm

Shocking though not entirely surprising that 26% do not consider anyone in the Six Counties to be Irish, a view that runs directly counter to the GFA. Not sure if this is a reflection of loyalists on boards.ie, much of the southern media and establishment being aggressively partitionist, the education system being infiltrated by partitionists, or some combination of these factors.

joseywhales · 12-10-2019 9:24pm

Jesus did we not vote for Fianna fail for long enough?

SharpshooterTom · 12-10-2019 9:27pm

Wibbs wrote: »

Well Iberia is a peninsula, but they're not all Spanish.

I get what you are saying but I don't think we're comparing apples with oranges here.

The nationalist population in NI are native to 6 counties and have been for centuries, are ethnically Irish, have Irish surnames (mostly), play Irish sports, learn Irish at school and have resisted any attempts to conform to British rule, losing themselves a lot of blood in the process to do so. The state of Northern Ireland was only created to appease the descendents of the ulster plantation with no consideration whatsoever for the wishes of the native population.

I don't see this as the same as Portugal and Spain who 'organically' if you like, have identified as two seperate nations with different cultures, different languages etc.

I do get the regional differences, i.e. Geordies and Scousers in England sometimes feel a seperate identity to the people in London, so a "Northern Irish" identity I sometimes get, but they're still part of the wider Irish umbrella nonetheless IMO.

Danzy · 12-10-2019 9:31pm

tdf7187 wrote: »

Shocking though not entirely surprising that 28% do not consider anyone in the Six Counties to be Irish, a view that runs directly counter to the GFA. Not sure if this is a reflection of loyalists on boards.ie, much of the southern media and establishment being aggressively partitionist, or some combination of these factors.

The Tory cabinet consider them Irish.

Boris Johnson has paraphrased Tone.

"Let us replace Protestant, Catholic Unionist and Republican with the common name of Paddy."

SharpshooterTom · 12-10-2019 9:57pm

tdf7187 wrote: »

Shocking though not entirely surprising that 26% do not consider anyone in the Six Counties to be Irish, a view that runs directly counter to the GFA. Not sure if this is a reflection of loyalists on boards.ie, much of the southern media and establishment being aggressively partitionist, the education system being infiltrated by partitionists, or some combination of these factors.

Even though I'm not from here I have heard these sentiments expressed myself whilst living here.

I was at Monaghan bus station just last month, getting a bus over the border to Armagh City (only 30 minute journey) and whilst getting on I heard a couple of girls getting excited saying "OMG I've never been to Northern Ireland before" whilst boarding, they had southern accents, not sure where, but it wasn't a Monaghan one.

I didn't think much of it but they sitting near me and I heard them talking about they've been to England, Scotland and Wales but never to "this part of the UK before".

They're not wrong obviously, but for some people in south, I have noticed NI is some very very different place and a distinction is made between "them" and "us".

Personally living rural Tyrone with all the GAA bunting and flags doesn't feel that different to living in rural Meath, culturally speaking. Each to their own though.

mickdw · 12-10-2019 10:13pm

Wouldn't ever ask to go to NI. A strange lot up there.

dartboardio · 12-10-2019 10:22pm

I think of Northern Ireland as Britain completely

Try to tell myself different but it just doesn't work, I cannot see how anyone can say it is irish.

dartboardio · 12-10-2019 10:24pm

I am from the South btw. Have been to Belfast a good few times but can't see any similarities or ways, and therefore it is a different country for me technically.

Donnielighto · 12-10-2019 10:24pm

ThomasFlynn wrote: »

But do you consider Northerners who wish to identify as Irish, to be as Irish yourself?

That was what the second option in the poll was for.

The third option was for people who don't consider nordies Irish even if they played nothing but GAA, spoke fluent Irish and only held an Irish passport.

I haven't voted because I'm not Irish and only want people from the ROI to vote in it to make the results more accurate (if that's possible) but the second option would be my prefered option.

I absolutely would consider protestants/unionists to be British as anyone in England, Scotland or Wales, that's their choice and should be respected. They are of full British heritage after all.

Yeah but that wasn't an options I wouldn't force the Irish identity on anyone who doesn't want it. Fyi plenty of unionists consider themselves both Irish and British

SharpshooterTom · 12-10-2019 10:24pm

mickdw wrote: »

Wouldn't ever ask to go to NI. A strange lot up there.

You do realise that not everyone in NI is not atypical of what you see on the falls and shankill?

Plenty of parts of NI didn't see much of the troubles e.g. North Down, Strangford, South Down.

A lot of people in NI aren't even that political, in fact Northern Ireland consistently has the lowest voter turnout of all the UK in general elections typically, highligting how much apathy and indifference their is to politics here.

When you say "a strange place up there", if you head to say Lisnaskea in Fermanagh, Strabane, Derry, etc, they just look like normal Irish towns with normal people. I don't always notice when exactly I cross the border sometimes.

If you went to the New Lodge or the Short Strand I might agree with you, I wouldn't want to be in those places either, but they're easy to avoid.

I actually think a lot of people in the Republic know very little about the North, I used to think being on the same island they would know about NI more than the average English person does but I'm not sure they do, some of their understanding and perceptions of the place is quite an eye opener.

Ironicname · 12-10-2019 10:28pm

People from Northern Ireland are Northern Irish. People from north Korea are Northern Korean. Both are two different countries.

votecounts · 12-10-2019 10:30pm

My family members up there are the same as ourselves, some political, some not, majority work to have a House, pay Bills, go on holiday,etc and want the best for their children through education, etc.

Mrs OBumble · 12-10-2019 10:34pm

Silent Running wrote: »

Those born in the North of Ireland are as Irish as those born in the West of Ireland,or the south of Ireland, or the East of Ireland.

What if they are born to parents who are from Eastern Europe or Africa?

Donnielighto · 12-10-2019 10:35pm

tdf7187 wrote: »

Shocking though not entirely surprising that 26% do not consider anyone in the Six Counties to be Irish, a view that runs directly counter to the GFA. Not sure if this is a reflection of loyalists on boards.ie, much of the southern media and establishment being aggressively partitionist, the education system being infiltrated by partitionists, or some combination of these factors.

Ah that's fairly agenda driven it seems. Maybe you should ask why instead of proffering your guess?

SharpshooterTom · 12-10-2019 10:35pm

Donnielighto wrote: »

Yeah but that wasn't an options I wouldn't force the Irish identity on anyone who doesn't want it. Fyi plenty of unionists consider themselves both Irish and British

Ok fair enough.

With regards to unionists very few consider themselves Irish, have a look at the 2011 census results.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/People_of_Northern_Ireland#National_identity

40% identified as British ONLY, given protestants and unionists are just over 50% of the population I'm going to assume at least three quarters of them did not tick the Irish box nor the Northern Irish box or anything that said "Irish" in it.

Only 0.7% ticked British AND Irish, its not that common really.

igCorcaigh · 12-10-2019 10:45pm

These forms of identity (perhaps all forms) are subjective and overlapping. Nothing is written in stone, neither by geography or allegiance.

Too much trouble has been caused by a rigid mindset of one's own or others identity, IMHO.

Panthro · 12-10-2019 10:48pm

They're hardly Fcukin Mexican

joseywhales · 12-10-2019 10:49pm

The hint is in the name of the island

Vologda69 · 12-10-2019 10:53pm

Ulster was the most gaelic, independent and least anglicized province of Ireland....one of the reasons they planted the province...

normanoffside · 12-10-2019 10:55pm

From North and lived in Dublin for 20 years. Of course we are Irish. Go from a border villiage to another and you won't see the difference except currency.

LoughNeagh2017 · 12-10-2019 11:03pm

I don't really care what southerners think, all I know is my surname is O'Neill and I live in a townland with an Irish name, if I'm not Irish then I'm sure as hell more Gaelic than some clown from the pale. As I've got older I don't really pay much attention to nationality anyway, having the same passport doesn't mean I have anything else in common with the other human, the people I view as "my own" are the ugly short autistic men of this world whether they be from Cork or China.

SharpshooterTom · 12-10-2019 11:06pm

normanoffside wrote: »

From North and lived in Dublin for 20 years. Of course we are Irish. Go from a border villiage to another and you won't see the difference except currency.

Did you experience any prejudice for being from up north whilst being there? Is Boards.ie a accurate representation of what 'freestaters' think about the North? :pac:

bobbysands81 · 12-10-2019 11:08pm

Thelonious Monk wrote: »

I would never have expected such an answer from you, bobbysands81

Am I wrong?

Perhaps there’s different levels of Irishness that you can enlighten me about?

Someone who is Irish is Irish regardless of where they are born.

bobbysands81 · 12-10-2019 11:10pm

Your Face wrote: »

Not part of the Republic = not Irish.

You do realise you are utterly wrong don’t you?

normanoffside · 12-10-2019 11:17pm

ThomasFlynn wrote: »

Did you experience any prejudice for being from up north whilst being there? Is Boards.ie a accurate representation of what 'freestaters' think about the North? :pac:

There are clowns everywhere including boards.ie, however Dubs (and Irish people in general) are mostly accepting of everyone once they feel you have a respect of and connection to the local place where you live.

Junkyard Tom · 12-10-2019 11:41pm

I think those in the 26 counties with a partitionist mindset need to understand that they have no right to appropriate our flag, our history of resistance, our language, our music, our dance, and so on, as their own - these trappings of the Irish nation belong to us all.

To think those who live south of the border have any exclusivity to the above is a combination of arrogance and stupidity - they do not and never will.

Your Face · 13-10-2019 12:19am

bobbysands81 wrote: »

You do realise you are utterly wrong don’t you?

If the socially backwards North wants to be part of our Republic, they better get used to idea of being ruled by the Dail in Dublin. We have a progressive Democracy and don't want it ruined by sectarianism and entitled bitterness.

They need to prove they're worthy to join the real Irish people - the ones who didn't cop out.

13-10-2019 5:07am

Junkyard Tom wrote: »

I think those in the 26 counties with a partitionist mindset need to understand that they have no right to appropriate our flag, our history of resistance, our language, our music, our dance, and so on, as their own - these trappings of the Irish nation belong to us all.

To think those who live south of the border have any exclusivity to the above is a combination of arrogance and stupidity - they do not and never will.

Well said.

facehugger99 · 13-10-2019 9:10am

People from the ROI would have more in common with the average Englishman than with the average Nationalist from NI.

Very different values and outlooks are prevalent up there.

It's not surprising that so many don't consider them to be Irish - I think the term 'Northern Irish' is far more appropriate way of describing them myself as it recognises they are from this island but not part of our Republic.

careless sherpa · 13-10-2019 9:15am

facehugger99 wrote: »

People from the ROI would have more in common with the average Englishman than with the average Nationalist from NI.

Very different values and outlooks are prevalent up there.

It's not surprising that so many don't consider them to be Irish - I think the term 'Northern Irish' is far more appropriate way of describing them myself as it recognises they are from this island but not part of our Republic.

Utter drivel. So someone from Blacklion has more in common with someone from Birmingham than someone from Belcoo

mehico · 13-10-2019 9:15am

facehugger99 wrote: »

People from the ROI would have more in common with the average Englishman than with the average Nationalist from NI.

That's your opinion, though I definitely wouldn't agree with it.

Really it's up to the individuals themselves whether they identify as Irish or not.

Ralphyroo · 13-10-2019 9:29am

I consider anyone born on the island of Ireland to be Irish but I respect the right of those in the north who identify as British to do so.
For the moment I wouldn't agree with people from the north voting in the presidential election, only residents of the 26 counties should have a vote for any election in the republic of Ireland.
I also was never in favour of a United Ireland for the practical reason that I pay enough tax for crap services and don't really want to get stung again. But with the brexit fiasco I'm coming round to it because the people in the north are being shafted particularly by the DUP, and I'd say its becoming clear to even those who identify as British that the only government that is standing up for them is the Irish government.

Montage of Feck · 13-10-2019 9:34am

Panthro wrote: »

They're hardly Fcukin Mexican

Maybe south of the border, :rolleyes::pac:.

TheW1zard · 13-10-2019 9:42am

Republic of Irish, Northern Irish, both Irish!
They are from Ireland.

What am I missing?

Oh and theyre part of the UK. NI is not Britain obviously. Britain is an Island.

#primaryschoolgeography

13-10-2019 9:48am

Ralphyroo wrote: »

I consider anyone born on the island of Ireland to be Irish

But they are not.
Children born in the Republic are not automatically Irish, so I don't know why someone born in the North should have more rights to be Irish than someone born here.

Tangatagamadda Chaddabinga Bonga Bungo · 13-10-2019 10:01am

Well people from Dublin and Cork have a lot more in common with someone from west Belfast than a Cockney has with someone from east Belfast. So Unionists are fully entitled to identify as British, but they are still very much Irish people.

Nobody born on the island of Ireland has any right to claim they are 'more Irish' simply because they were born in the south of the country.
You won't find any American, European or Chinese person making a distinction between an Irish person born in the west of Ireland or in the north of Ireland.

Invisibleman · 13-10-2019 10:03am

If you were born on the island of Ireland you are Irish, simple as that.

13-10-2019 10:11am

Invisibleman wrote: »

If you were born on the island of Ireland you are Irish, simple as that.

Not true though

rockatansky · 13-10-2019 10:16am

Invisibleman wrote: »

If you were born on the island of Ireland you are Irish, simple as that.

No, it is not that simple.

That's the same as everyone born in NI is Brittish. It's wrong.

Some people just don't want to acknowledge the realities of the Northen Ireland. Their life is just easier if they just pigeon hole the entire population and not even entertain the complexities of the situation* (said in a nordy accent).

We've all heard the attitude from some people that they'd happily cut the 6 counties off the island and let it float away just so they don't have to hear about it. Some on here no doubt would be of this opinion.

Invisibleman · 13-10-2019 10:18am

rockatansky wrote: »

No, it is not that simple.

That's the same as everyone born in NI is Brittish. It's wrong.

Some people just don't want to acknowledge the realities of the Northen Ireland. Their life is just easier if they just pigeon hole the entire population and not even entertain it.

We've all heard the attitude from some people that they'd happily cut the 6 counties off the island and let it float away just so they don't have to hear about it. Some on here no doubt would be of this opinion.

Some people say they are the other gender, when clearly they are not, it’s the same thing.You can put make up on a pig, but it’s still a pig.

Sleeper12 · 13-10-2019 10:19am

Very strange question in the opening post IMO.

Of course they are Irish. The Irish state recognise them as Irish. They are automatically entitled to both Irish and British passports. It's not that they just identify as Irish. Legally they are Irish.

Ralphyroo · 13-10-2019 10:20am

bubblypop wrote: »

Ralphyroo wrote: »

I consider anyone born on the island of Ireland to be Irish

But they are not.
Children born in the Republic are not automatically Irish, so I don't know why someone born in the North should have more rights to be Irish than someone born here.

Fair enough I phrased that badly, raised on the island of Ireland then

Do you consider nationalists from Northern Ireland to be Irish?

Comments