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Shootings in Paris - MOD NOTE UPDATED - READ OP

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Comments

  • #2672
    Custardpi
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,807 ✭✭✭Custardpi


    walshyn93 wrote: »
    Those who bomb abortion clinics are clearly not taking a literal interpretation of the bible.

    Why "clearly"? There's plenty of bloodthirsty verses to be found in the Bible. If a moderate Christian went up against a hardline type in a theological debate I wouldn't be at all confident of the former winning.


  • #2673
    Bannasidhe
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,218 ✭✭✭✭Bannasidhe


    IrishTrajan wrote: »
    And herein lies the problem. You seem to think a huge portion of Muslims coming here want to be Westernized. However, we've seen in Sweden, second-generation immigrants from non-EU/Arab backgrounds form ghettoes and tend not to work. They come radicalized in their own neighbourhoods. We've seen it in Copenhagen, Paris, London, Amsterdam, Brussels, Berlin... This idealistic notion of "everyone who comes here wants to be Western" just doesn't work.

    These people are coming to Europe in the hopes of prosperity. But they have no skills, no money, and poor English. They are set for a life of dole payments and social housing. You think that's going to work to integrate them? No, they will fall back on their cultural roots. They'll think of their homeland with fondness and many will turn to Islam's teachings. They'll wonder why the grass in Europe wasn't as green as they thought it would be, and they'll call for changes to make things more "Islamic" for them.

    Europe simply can't be responsible for the rest of the world's problems, especially when the times it does take people in, tragedies like last night occur. The right-wing will continue to grow in importance as the left screams down any moves to restrict this mass migration, and that will only backfire on refugees in the long-run.

    So stop this failed experiment before the moderate majority is pushed into choosing one of two extremes. Stop this idealistic, unworkable philanthropic mission.

    Stop it before things spiral out of control and we have bloodbaths.

    Or course skillless Irish never went to any other part of the world ever.
    No Irish went to the UK and claimed the dole ever.

    Or lived in little Paddy Ghettos like Kilburn spending their days in Irish pubs becoming radicalised by Irish republicans...

    No - all the Irish were peaceful, well educated people like Sir Bob and Sir Terry and Graham who quickly embraced Anglicisation and cheered Huzzah Huzzah at cricket matches.

    If all the Irish hadn't been like the Three Nice Paddies mention above surely the UK should have closed the borders to the Irish - That would have prevented Hyde Park, Brighton, Warrington etc.


    As an aside I am quite impressed at the number of posters who seem to know what I think even when I haven't said anything of the kind - appeasement, cuppa tea and now Muslims want to come here to be Westernized.

    I happen to think most of the Muslims who currently want to come 'here' actually want to escape from the bombing and killing and civil wars raging through their homelands. Dunno if they wish to become 'Western' (because the West is of course a monoculture) but I am fairly sure they don't want to become dead.


  • #2674
    custard gannet
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 426 ✭✭custard gannet


    ricero wrote: »
    Its time for ireland as a country to fight against isis and our government to help with the fighting by sending irish troops overseas. I feel cowardly that our country are allowing evil like this to exist in the world and not help combat it with our european allies

    Our rangers unit is one of the best trained in the world yet they sit on their arse waiting to be called into action for something that will, thankfully, probably never happen. It would be great to see them sent out there with a remit of taking out all identified Irish passport holders, if the figure of 30 of them being out there is true.

    Of course, the usual scumbags would never allow this to happen.


  • #2675
    Shurimgreat
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,133 ✭✭✭Shurimgreat


    There is very little in what IS do from what I can see that deviates significantly from what Mohammad did.

    Far from not understanding Islam, these guys follow Mohammad to the letter. We have to face up to that fact.

    There's tens of thousands of IS followers all over the world and in Europe.

    They go quiet for a few months while they plan their next "spectacular".

    Its impossible for governments and Intelligence Agencies to track them all, completely impossible.

    They can shoot us but we can't criticise their religion. No wonder we can't win.


  • #2676
    RedemptionZ
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,758 ✭✭✭RedemptionZ


    Arbiter of Good Taste wrote: »
    If that 25% allegation is true, that's very worrying

    That's according to Brigitte Gabriel from the video posted earlier. She's a Lebanese-American I believe and an anti-extremist


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  • #2677
    Ghost Buster
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 5,172 ✭✭✭Ghost Buster


    walshyn93 wrote: »
    Those who bomb abortion clinics are clearly not taking a literal interpretation of the bible.

    It's important to note that most of the bad stuff that happened in the bible predated Christianity whereas all of the Quran happens at the foundation of the religion.

    Same author, same culprit.


  • #2678
    That_Guy
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 51,342 ✭✭✭✭That_Guy


    This speech from Charlie Chaplin in 'The Great Dictator' is poignant right now.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dX25PDBb708


  • #2679
    walshyn93
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,685 ✭✭✭walshyn93


    Custardpi wrote: »
    Why "clearly"? There's plenty of bloodthirsty verses to be found in the Bible. If a moderate Christian went up against a hardline type in a theological debate I wouldn't be at all confident of the former winning.

    The New Testament though. It's a later revision of the bloodthirsty texts and it softens up the stance re violence.


  • #2680
    Ghost Buster
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 5,172 ✭✭✭Ghost Buster


    screamer wrote: »
    You'll be waiting

    They issued a statement late last night condemning the attacks.


  • #2681
    walshyn93
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,685 ✭✭✭walshyn93


    Ghost Buster wrote: »
    Same author, same culprit.

    Lol what? There was a bunch of authors, many of whom were probably never even alive at the same time


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  • #2682
    hatrickpatrick
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,798 ✭✭✭✭hatrickpatrick


    walshyn93 wrote: »
    The New Testament though. It's a later revision of the bloodthirsty texts and it softens up the stance re violence.

    And yet the Old Testament is still considered canon and is still used by right wing nutjob Christians to justify stuff like "God hates fags" and bombings of abortion clinics.


  • #2683
    Dkinn
    Site Banned Posts: 16 ✭Dkinn


    Ghost Buster wrote: »
    They issued a statement late last night condemning the attacks.

    Who?, I haven't seen anybody let's say from clonskeagh issuing any condemnation...You know... The mosque that represents the majority of Sunnis in Ireland.


  • #2684
    walshyn93
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,685 ✭✭✭walshyn93


    Ghost Buster wrote: »
    They issued a statement late last night condemning the attacks.

    That might satisfy you or the person you're responding to, but anyone who's been following the likes of Majid Nawaz for years will know that condemning it is not enough. It's not enough to condemn child sex abuse in the Catholic Church if you know of priests who are abusing kids. Similarly it's not enough to condemn attacks if you know the names of recruiters operating in your local Mosque. As yet none have been outed.


  • #2685
    My name is URL
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 25,563 ✭✭✭✭My name is URL


    suicide_circus wrote: »
    That... or maybe the cùnt was Syrian.

    I asked why an attacker would be carrying a passport while engaging in such an act. I didn't question or dispute the possibility that he was Syrian

    It's blindingly obvious that carrying a passport in such circumstances would be done in order to suit the agenda and goals of those responsible, who want discussion and fear in the west to be about refugees in general... and they're getting their way in that regard.


  • #2686
    Fuhrer
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,661 ✭✭✭Fuhrer


    Arbiter of Good Taste wrote: »
    If that 25% allegation is true, that's very worrying

    A recent poll of Muslims in the Uk said that a quarter of them sympathised with the Gunmen who massacred the people in the Charlie Hebdo offices and 10% said they got what they deserved.


  • #2687
    Ghost Buster
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 5,172 ✭✭✭Ghost Buster


    walshyn93 wrote: »
    Lol what? There was a bunch of authors, many of whom were probably never even alive at the same time

    But guided by God, about his deeds.


  • #2688
    suicide_circus
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,801 ✭✭✭✭suicide_circus


    hatrickpatrick wrote: »
    And yet the Old Testament is still considered canon and is still used by right wing nutjob Christians to justify stuff like "God hates fags" and bombings of abortion clinics.

    You actually weaken your own argument here by clutching at straws like westboro and abortion clinics as it highlights just how wide the gulf is between Christian wackos and Islamic wackos.


  • #2689
    godtabh
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 23,255 Mod ✭✭✭✭godtabh


    Dkinn wrote: »
    Who?, I haven't seen anybody let's say from clonskeagh issuing any condemnation...You know... The mosque that represents the majority of Sunnis in Ireland.

    They must all be in on it so


  • #2690
    orubiru
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,290 ✭✭✭orubiru


    _oveless_ wrote: »
    you're not even hiding your racism any more consider yourself reported

    I'm seeing a lot of this kind of thing online today. Social media especially.

    If someone wouldn't mind, can you explain how opposition to Islam is classified as racism?

    A Muslim is someone who believes that the Qur'an is the literal, verbatim, word of God, right?

    As an Atheist, how should I expect to be treated if I publically, loudly, declared my Atheism in an Islamic state such as Saudi Arabia?

    So, I don't believe that God exists and I believe that the Qur'an is a fictional story. Do you agree with me?

    I believe that anyone who thinks that the Qur'an is factual and so CHOOSES to believe and become a Muslim is a delusional fool with a childlike understanding of reality. Does that make me racist?

    If these attacks were committed in the name of religion then surely it's logical that the other sections of society would speak out against that religion?

    If you followed a religion that encourages warfare against "non believers" and then you saw events like those in Paris unfold would you not be inclined to think that maybe Islam is the problem here? Maybe it's the crazy fantasy beliefs that these morons collectively hold that actually cause this kind of violence?

    I refuse to respect their beliefs. The Qur'an is the word of God? Prove it or get ready for ridicule. People are willing to f*cking KILL in the name of fictional bullsh!t and the stock response to people pointing out the problem with that is "you're racist".

    Belief in religion is a sick, tragic, joke at this stage. If someone says "I'm a Muslim" or "I'm a Christian" or "I'm a Scientologist" etc might as well be saying "I am a delusional buffoon". It should be f*cking open season for criticism of these fools but instead we're gonna try and play the "race card", right?

    OK, OK, OK. Nobody should be talking about bombing or going to war or trying to kill Muslims for their beliefs. Responding to violence with violence does not work.

    The solution is that belief in imaginary supernatural beings should be mercilessly ridiculed and their nonsense claims should be debunked continuously to the point were anyone talking about God or Jesus or Allah or Mohammed should just die of embarrassment.

    Whether you like it or not, Mohammed was indeed a liar, a mass murderer and a paedophile. Yet, people CHOOSE to follow this religion. They don't deserve respect. They deserve to be told to f*ck right off.


  • #2691
    WheatenBriar
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,170 ✭✭✭WheatenBriar


    Custardpi wrote: »
    I'm no expert but my understanding is that ISIS behaviour on the battlefield & conquered territory is based on their interpretation of the Hadith as well as accounts from other sources of life at the time of Mohammed.

    The idea that a religon & a "death cult" are mutually exclusive is of course laughable. Look at Christianity for instance - they literally worship a guy who committed suicide by cop in the arrogant belief that this would somehow cleanse the sins of his followers.
    Lol,being nailed by the authorities on a cross is not suicide, religions and cults are not the same
    The cults are of course used by some atheists to bash religions under the false premise that they are the same, its handy..


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  • #2692
    Ghost Buster
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 5,172 ✭✭✭Ghost Buster


    walshyn93 wrote: »
    That might satisfy you or the person you're responding to, but anyone who's been following the likes of Majid Nawaz for years will know that condemning it is not enough. It's not enough to condemn child sex abuse in the Catholic Church if you know of priests who are abusing kids. Similarly it's not enough to condemn attacks if you know the names of recruiters operating in your local Mosque. As yet none have been outed.

    Who said i was satisfied?
    I was simply pointing out to a poster who stated that we would be waiting for a condemnation from any Irish Muslim rep that one issued last night.


  • #2693
    suicide_circus
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,801 ✭✭✭✭suicide_circus


    My name is URL wrote: »
    I asked why an attacker would be carrying a passport while engaging in such an act. I didn't question or dispute the possibility that he was Syrian

    It's blindingly obvious that carrying a passport in such circumstances would be done in order to suit the agenda and goals of those responsible, who want discussion and fear in the west to be about refugees in general... and they're getting their way in that regard.
    So complete speculation it is then


  • #2694
    Dkinn
    Site Banned Posts: 16 ✭Dkinn


    godtabh wrote: »
    They must all be in on it so

    Well if they're not showing any condemnation to their peers then I suppose there would be some degree of support there no?

    Neutrality to the actions last night is despicable enough.


  • #2695
    Bannasidhe
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,218 ✭✭✭✭Bannasidhe


    hatrickpatrick wrote: »
    And yet the Old Testament is still considered canon and is still used by right wing nutjob Christians to justify stuff like "God hates fags" and bombings of abortion clinics.

    Jesus seemed to consider it valid. ‘The Scripture cannot be broken’ (John 10:35) said Jesus, it is ‘the commandment of God’ (Matthew 15:3) and ‘Word of God’ (Mark 7:13). Apparently ‘Until Heaven and earth pass away, not the smallest letter or stroke shall pass away from the law, until all is accomplished’ (Matthew 5:18).


  • #2696
    walshyn93
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,685 ✭✭✭walshyn93


    hatrickpatrick wrote: »
    And yet the Old Testament is still considered canon and is still used by right wing nutjob Christians to justify stuff like "God hates fags" and bombings of abortion clinics.

    A bombing of an abortion clinic 30 years ago and one deranged family. Are you honestly going to compare that to the attacks last night and the series of wars all over the middle east finding it's way into Europe with the intention of establishing a caliphate?


  • #2697
    evolving_doors
    Closed Accounts Posts: 11,810 ✭✭✭✭evolving_doors


    My name is URL wrote: »
    I asked why an attacker would be carrying a passport while engaging in such an act. I didn't question or dispute the possibility that he was Syrian

    It's blindingly obvious that carrying a passport in such circumstances would be done in order to suit the agenda and goals of those responsible, who want discussion and fear in the west to be about refugees in general... and they're getting their way in that regard.

    There were reports in the media saying that the attackers who were heard speaking/shouting spoke fluent french as if they were natives of france. Hence why I think the carrying of syrian passports was more a message than a form of personal identity.

    Although would I be wrong in saying that everyone in France must carry some form of identity at all times (or maybe that's just drivers).


  • #2698
    Amirani
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 12,563 Mod ✭✭✭✭Amirani


    My name is URL wrote: »
    I asked why an attacker would be carrying a passport while engaging in such an act. I didn't question or dispute the possibility that he was Syrian

    It's blindingly obvious that carrying a passport in such circumstances would be done in order to suit the agenda and goals of those responsible, who want discussion and fear in the west to be about refugees in general... and they're getting their way in that regard.

    Potentially. Another scenario is he'd just flew or got a train into Paris and was carrying it anyway.

    Fairly sure non-EU citizens have to carry identification at all times in France too. There could be a couple of reasons, but yours certainly has a lot of credibility.


  • #2699
    david75
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 7,611 ✭✭✭david75


    If only all the keyboard warriors here would go and fight Isis. Or at least get informed before they spout their uneducated, racist, sectarian bile.


  • #2700
    stefanovich
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,490 ✭✭✭stefanovich


    Gebgbegb wrote: »
    There were reports in the media saying that the attackers who were heard speaking/shouting spoke fluent french as if they were natives of france. Hence why I think the carrying of syrian passports was more a message than a form of personal identity.

    Although would I be wrong in saying that everyone in France must carry some form of identity at all times (or maybe that's just drivers).
    Probably was not too worried about being stopped for not having ID at the time.


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  • #2701
    Tangatagamadda Chaddabinga Bonga Bungo
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,009 ✭✭✭Tangatagamadda Chaddabinga Bonga Bungo


    :(


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