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Irish Players outside the Provinces 15/16

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    #62
    irishbucsfan
    Registered Users Posts: 37,978 ✭✭✭✭irishbucsfan


    connachta wrote: »
    That's not my point at all to include him in the Irish squad. I was just refering to Exiles vs Emerging, and said Andress among most of my 23 Exiles selection can well hold against their Emerging counterparts and give them a good test match

    Well then I'm not sure why you're referring to Archer or Ah You because he'd be scrummaging against the loosehead who would be Denis Buckley or James Cronin.


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    #63
    wp_rathead
    Registered Users Posts: 10,067 ✭✭✭✭wp_rathead


    connachta wrote: »
    Aki saved us by himself against 6-7 Dragons players, he's unmovable. Sad they had so little gametime together, because Akishaw is the best pairing in Ireland. Only position where Connacht can claim that tittle

    Connachta, my friend, please oh please don't ever use that word again- my eyes nearly melted when I read it :pac:


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    #64
    connachta
    Registered Users Posts: 7,965 ✭✭✭connachta


    irishbucsfan wrote: »
    Well then I'm not sure why you're referring to Archer or Ah You because he'd be scrummaging against the loosehead who would be Denis Buckley or James Cronin.

    I wasn't thinking face-to-face, but inner level comparison...:)


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    #65
    rrpc
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,244 ✭✭✭rrpc


    connachta wrote: »
    I wasn't thinking face-to-face, but inner level comparison...:)

    No. You took a list of exiles and cobbled together a team which you said would beat emerging Ireland despite most of them never having played together and EI being coached by Joe Schmidt and his team.

    No amount of semantic contortions will make that premise a fact.


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    #66
    connachta
    Registered Users Posts: 7,965 ✭✭✭connachta


    wp_rathead wrote: »
    Connachta, my friend, please oh please don't ever use that word again- my eyes nearly melted when I read it :pac:

    I love contraction of the names, laziness and fun. But just for you, I won't used this one anymore and imagine another ones like Masterdoon:D:pac:


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    #67
    connachta
    Registered Users Posts: 7,965 ✭✭✭connachta


    rrpc wrote: »
    No. You took a list of exiles and cobbled together a team which you said would beat emerging Ireland despite most of them never having played together and EI being coached by Joe Schmidt and his team.

    No amount of semantic contortions will make that premise a fact.


    on a one game situation, yes they could. No coaching in my stances..


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    #68
    rrpc
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,244 ✭✭✭rrpc


    connachta wrote: »
    on a one game situation, yes they could. No coaching in my stances..

    No real thought either. Just a forlorn hope :D


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    #69
    connachta
    Registered Users Posts: 7,965 ✭✭✭connachta


    No, reasonnable hope that Andress can give Archer a nightmare Yes
    reasonnable hope that Annett and Tom Court can hold on Yes
    That Griffin and Macken are nearly as talented as Reid/McCloskey for the moment, I insist for the moment, yes
    Same for Butler, Hart, Morris, top quality guys

    Look I'm not pro-Exiles or against Emerging players (most of them are Connacht ones). I'm just saying since the beginning that the gap is thin, and players abroad aren't Exiles because they "sucks". I didn't appreciated the implicit scornful tone, that's it, no more..


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    #70
    irishbucsfan
    Registered Users Posts: 37,978 ✭✭✭✭irishbucsfan


    connachta wrote: »
    No, reasonnable hope that Andress can give Archer a nightmare Yes
    reasonnable hope that Annett and Tom Court can hold on Yes
    That Griffin and Macken are nearly as talented as Reid/McCloskey for the moment, I insist for the moment, yes
    Same for Butler, Hart, Morris, top quality guys

    Look I'm not pro-Exiles or against Emerging players (most of them are Connacht ones). I'm just saying since the beginning that the gap is thin, and players abroad aren't Exiles because they "sucks". I didn't appreciated the implicit scornful tone, that's it, no more..

    There was no scornful tone.

    Maybe when you said that the Exiles would beat the Wolfhounds, but that was particularly ridiculous. They'd do better against the EI squad but the EI squad mostly consists of players who were preferred to those Exiles and is better man for man in pretty much every position. Also if POC isn't allowed then surely Court shouldn't be there! :D


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    #71
    connachta
    Registered Users Posts: 7,965 ✭✭✭connachta


    irishbucsfan wrote: »
    There was no scornful tone.

    Maybe when you said that the Exiles would beat the Wolfhounds, but that was particularly ridiculous.

    I made amends for what was just a confusion

     They'd do better against the EI squad but the EI squad mostly consists of players who were preferred to those Exiles and is better man for man in pretty much every position. Also if POC isn't allowed then surely Court shouldn't be there! :D

    95% disagree (except for Coughlan who might be behind, and still..)


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    #72
    rrpc
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,244 ✭✭✭rrpc


    connachta wrote: »
    Look I'm not pro-Exiles or against Emerging players (most of them are Connacht ones). I'm just saying since the beginning that the gap is thin, and players abroad aren't Exiles because they "sucks". I didn't appreciated the implicit scornful tone, that's it, no more..

    Yes, but then discuss those players on their individual merits and why they went abroad. Don't just make up a hypothetical team from those players and invent a hypothetical result from a hypothetical match with the wolfhounds or EI and expect people to swallow it without a thought.

    It's a meaningless exercise.


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    #73
    connachta
    Registered Users Posts: 7,965 ✭✭✭connachta


    rrpc wrote: »
    Yes, but then discuss those players on their individual merits and why they went abroad. Don't just make up a hypothetical team from those players and invent a hypothetical result from a hypothetical match with the wolfhounds or EI and expect people to swallow it without a thought.

    It's a meaningless exercise.

    the topic is about Irish Players outside the Provinces 15/16 , not about why they left in 2012, 14, 15...
    Someone talked about a 5th province, implying a certain amount of "waste talents", all I say is I agree. And with the 23 Exiles selection and 46-men potential Meath province, I just showed that the debate exists. Not that they will succeed with certainty, of course it's hypothetical, it can't be otherwise, the accusation makes no sense here...


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    #74
    rrpc
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,244 ✭✭✭rrpc


    connachta wrote: »
    the topic is about Irish Players outside the Provinces 15/16 , not about why they left in 2012, 14, 15...
    Someone talked about a 5th province, implying a certain amound of "waste talents", all I say is I agree, and with the 23 selection and 46-men potential Meath province, I just showed the debate exists. Not that they will succeed, of course it's hypothetical, it can't be otherwise, the accusation makes no sense here...

    The topic is about how those players are faring abroad and if there's a possibility that they may come home having furthered their trade in other leagues. That's what this thread is supposed to be about.

    There's no chance of a 5th Province. If you accept it's hypothetical why are you trying to prove the unprovable?


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    #75
    connachta
    Registered Users Posts: 7,965 ✭✭✭connachta


    rrpc wrote: »
    The topic is about how those players are faring abroad and if there's a possibility that they may come home having furthered their trade in other leagues. That's what this thread is supposed to be about.

    There I agree

    There's no chance of a 5th Province. If you accept it's hypothetical why are you trying to prove the unprovable?

    I don't want to proove anything except debate is on about Exiles, their quantites, qualities, and, why not, renewed links with the IRFU. And whatever realistic or not the 5th province is, that doesn't prevent from evaluating its potential strenght...


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    #76
    rrpc
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,244 ✭✭✭rrpc


    connachta wrote: »
    I don't want to proove anything except debate is on about Exiles, their quantites, qualities, and, why not, renewed links with the IRFU. And whatever realistic or not the 5th province is, that doesn't prevent to evaluate its potential strenght...

    Why?


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    #77
    total former
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,784 ✭✭✭total former


    The initial question was, would there be enough talent to sustain a 5th pro team? (Leaving aside questions of where they'd play, who would support them etc)

    The answer is a resounding, unequivocal NO.


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    #78
    connachta
    Registered Users Posts: 7,965 ✭✭✭connachta


    rrpc wrote: »
    Why?

    Why what?:pac:


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    #79
    connachta
    Registered Users Posts: 7,965 ✭✭✭connachta


    total former wrote: »
    The initial question was, would there be enough talent to sustain a 5th pro team? (Leaving aside questions of where they'd play, who would support them etc)

    The answer is a resounding, unequivocal NO.

    For you it is. That's an open and welcoming stance toward any other opinion for sure...:rolleyes:


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    #80
    bilston
    Registered Users Posts: 17,769 ✭✭✭✭bilston


    connemara man wrote: »
    I personally think having McCloskey inside Henshaw would create the room for him to be at his best. He's a constant threat on the gainline.
    That's nothing against Aki I just think he's a different type of 12 and the balance could be better with a McCloskey type inside him

    Ieuan Evans was on Sky today saying that McCloskey/Henshaw was the future for Ireland. Not that his opinion matters in the grand scheme of things but the idea of the two of them together for Ireland is pretty exciting.

    We may have to wait a while to see it. Unless there are injuries Nov 2016 may be the first time we see it.


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    #81
    connachta
    Registered Users Posts: 7,965 ✭✭✭connachta


    By the way, Jack O'Connell plays tomorrow for Bristol on TV. May be worth to have a look, final year on his contract, will be 24 next season, if Connacht can bring him back to Ireland (Munster and Leinster have enough LH)...


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    #82
    total former
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,784 ✭✭✭total former


    connachta wrote: »
    For you it is. That's an open and welcoming stance toward any other opinion for sure...:rolleyes:

    What do you think? Tell me if you think that team would be competitive. I honestly have no idea.

    And maybe leave the condescending eye roll emoticons out, it's very rude.


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    #83
    irishbucsfan
    Registered Users Posts: 37,978 ✭✭✭✭irishbucsfan


    JOC would be a great addition for Connacht but if Bristol do manage promotion this year (which would be more likely if the Premiership goes to 14 teams) then he might stay on over there. Was disappointed he didn't go west originally.


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    #84
    connachta
    Registered Users Posts: 7,965 ✭✭✭connachta


    total former wrote: »
    What do you think? Tell me if you think that team would be competitive. I honestly have no idea.

    And maybe leave the condescending eye roll emoticons out, it's very rude.

    I had recieved your previous stance rude too.. but no harm there, you think that team wouldn't be competitive in hypothesis, on the paper, I think it could be. Nobody can't proove anything, so there's no need to get upset. Sorry if you did too. shake hands?:)


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    #85
    connachta
    Registered Users Posts: 7,965 ✭✭✭connachta


    irishbucsfan wrote: »
    if the Premiership goes to 14 teams.


    Is this really happening?

    And that's why I said IRFU has to reinforce binding with exiles guys, for exemple by playing them against Emerging Ire. If not, they tend to pave their way without thinking to a come-back...


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    #86
    irishbucsfan
    Registered Users Posts: 37,978 ✭✭✭✭irishbucsfan


    connachta wrote: »
    Is this really happening?

    And that's why I said IRFU has to reinforce binding with exiles guys, for exemple by playing them against Emerging Ire. If not, they tend to pave their way without thinking to a come-back...

    Yes, it'll be happening quite soon, there could be an announcement before the World Cup starts (or they might hold onto it as ammunition for the negotiations of the new LTA)


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    #87
    connachta
    Registered Users Posts: 7,965 ✭✭✭connachta


    irishbucsfan wrote: »
    Yes, it'll be happening quite soon, there could be an announcement before the World Cup starts (or they might hold onto it as ammunition for the negotiations of the new LTA)


    So, time for a 14-team Celtic league, with Meath Province and Scottish Borders or Pontypridd valley Warriors back:D


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    #88
    rrpc
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,244 ✭✭✭rrpc


    connachta wrote: »
    Is this really happening?

    And that's why I said IRFU has to reinforce binding with exiles guys, for exemple by playing them against Emerging Ire. If not, they tend to pave their way without thinking to a come-back...
    That's just not possible. You're talking about players in different leagues in different countries and trying to get them together long enough to train for a match that would have little or no merit.

    And I'm being kind in saying that. Much pithier words came to mind.


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    #89
    irishbucsfan
    Registered Users Posts: 37,978 ✭✭✭✭irishbucsfan


    connachta wrote: »
    So, time for a 14-team Celtic league, with Meath Province and Scottish Borders or Pontypridd valley Warriors back:D

    There's absolutely zero chance of another Irish team. Connacht barely survived a couple of years ago. The Celtic League are under pressure as it is to stay at 12 sides.


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    #90
    connachta
    Registered Users Posts: 7,965 ✭✭✭connachta


    rrpc wrote: »
    That's just not possible. You're talking about players in different leagues in different countries and trying to get them together long enough to train for a match that would have little or no merit.

    And I'm being kind in saying that. Much pithier words came to mind.

    That's not only the game per se. Which would be better than Uruguay/Emerging Italy. But about maintaining the relationship with Irish rugby, in both way


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    #91
    connachta
    Registered Users Posts: 7,965 ✭✭✭connachta


    irishbucsfan wrote: »
    There's absolutely zero chance of another Irish team. Connacht barely survived a couple of years ago. The Celtic League are under pressure as it is to stay at 12 sides.

    I know that. Was just a sweet dream, and who knows in 10 years...


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