Milk Price- Please read Mod note in post #1

mahoney_j · 25-07-2015 09:06AM

Been reading some of the articles coming out of France over last while and on one hand I say fair fools to them they protested hard and got a result and non farming French public seemed ok with it .some of it went a bit too far though ....

orm0nd · 25-07-2015 09:11AM

mahoney_j wrote: »

Been reading some of the articles coming out of France over last while and on one hand I say fair fools to them they protested hard and got a result and non farming French public seemed ok with it .some of it went a bit too far though ....

did you see them burning the used bale wrap on the highway , a huge mountain of it

on a side note I read that france has the highest farmer suicide rate in eu

alps · 25-07-2015 09:23AM

Blackgrass wrote: »

So a bunch of thugs who can't deal with economics/markets and will just throw their toys out of the pram because, reasons?

Maybe the result showed they had good reason...

Maybe the economic market world you speak about can pay more, but just doesn't have to....nor do we really demand that it does...

frazzledhome · 25-07-2015 09:26AM

orm0nd wrote: »

did you see them burning the used bale wrap on the highway , a huge mountain of it

on a side note I read that france has the highest farmer suicide rate in eu

That's nothing, in Belfast you can burn tyres and pallets on the 11 night. Mob rule

jaymla627 · 25-07-2015 09:29AM

Dawggone wrote: »

Looks like we are guaranteed a minimum milk price of 34cpl until the new year.

Even though I don't entirely agree with the way that French farmers protest, I have to admit they get results.

Who subs the difference between 34cpl and what the processors real market price should be is it the government our does the processor/co-op take the hit

orm0nd · 25-07-2015 09:41AM

i see the uk & belgian are staging huge protests now as well

no doubt the paddys will sit on their arses lash out on feed & fert & listen to the crap dished out by co ops

mahoney_j · 25-07-2015 09:45AM

orm0nd wrote: »

i see the uk & belgian are staging huge protests now as well

no doubt the paddys will sit on their arses lash out on feed & fert & listen to the crap dished out by co ops

Wonder will we see the Arrabawn action group been reformed??.like u I think we'll all sit on our arses whinging and moaning about things till it's too late.action needs to be taken NOW against most of our under performing coops

Buford T. Justice XIX · 25-07-2015 10:05AM

mahoney_j wrote: »

Wonder will we see the Arrabawn action group been reformed??.like u I think we'll all sit on our arses whinging and moaning about things till it's too late.action needs to be taken NOW against most of our under performing coops

The problem with pressurising those co-ops into paying more for their raw materials is that they probably can't without putting huge pressure on their viability. In general, they are run by older farmers on the board and older management structures and thinking in place.

Those processors need to be moving along the lines of the west cork processors and their Carbury structure, imo, but easier said than done.

The question arises about whether farmers want their own, small, independent co-ops which, most of the time, under perform and under pay or do they want that co-op join onto a bigger co-op and get a better milk price?

Then the question arises about whether the farmers can/will pressurise those bigger processors into paying more.

Blackgrass · 25-07-2015 10:06AM

orm0nd wrote: »

did you see them burning the used bale wrap on the highway , a huge mountain of it

on a side note I read that france has the highest farmer suicide rate in eu

Why are the kiwi's so low then?,
is it because the euro is scarcely worth more than the sawdust and linen it's mostly printed on? Wait until the 20%+ increase in fert costs etc hits.

mahoney_j · 25-07-2015 10:11AM

Blackgrass wrote: »

Why are the kiwi's so low then?,
is it because the euro is scarcely worth more than the sawdust and linen it's mostly printed on? Wait until the 20%+ increase in fert costs etc hits.

Most of their produces goes into milk powder which sees full effect of market peaks and troughs .they need a much more diverse range of value added products

mahoney_j · 25-07-2015 10:13AM

Buford T. Justice V wrote: »

The problem with pressurising those co-ops into paying more for their raw materials is that they probably can't without putting huge pressure on their viability. In general, they are run by older farmers on the board and older management structures and thinking in place.

Those processors need to be moving along the lines of the west cork processors and their Carbury structure, imo, but easier said than done.

The question arises about whether farmers want their own, small, independent co-ops which, most of the time, under perform and under pay or do they want that co-op join onto a bigger co-op and get a better milk price?

Then the question arises about whether the farmers can/will pressurise those bigger processors into paying more.

A lot of coops in this country I think are not long term or future viable....

jaymla627 · 25-07-2015 10:14AM

orm0nd wrote: »

i see the uk & belgian are staging huge protests now as well

no doubt the paddys will sit on their arses lash out on feed & fert & listen to the crap dished out by co ops

We can scream and shout all we want the fact we export 90% of our dairy output means we are price takers, French/English dairy farmers hold alot more cards as nearly all their milk is used up in their own markets

Buford T. Justice XIX · 25-07-2015 10:24AM

mahoney_j wrote: »

A lot of coops in this country I think are not long term or future viable....

Sadly, I agree:(

But it may not be a bad thing either. It's only just over 40 years ago that Kerry was founded from a huge quantity of unviable small co-ops held by the Dairy Disposal Board. The rest of the co-ops and processors would have a similar beginning and are doing much better than their predecessors.

I remember a lot of the talk at the creamery and at home about what a bitter pill it was to swallow that 'our' co-op had to join up with 'their' co-op to survive. Amazingly, all that was forgotten when the milk price was becoming viable and people became proud of their processor again.

I think it is something that will have to be looked at again and again until a viable 3-4 processors or entities like Carbury are formed. I wouldn't really trust a single processor similar to Fonterra, tbh.

Mulumpy · 25-07-2015 10:35AM

mahoney_j wrote:

A lot of coops in this country I think are not long term or future viable....

In fairness J. I think we need to be a bit more supportive of our coops. I know im biased but in Arrabawns case I think they've done fantasticly well to turn things around the past few years. They're gradually moving away from being solely dependant on the likes of skim. In fairness they kept up price in 2 of the 3 peak months and have done really well to fight of glanbia and dairy gold. Sure mistakes have been made but i think they are in a great position going forward.

cute geoge · 25-07-2015 11:03AM

I cant see the point on getting cross with your co-op over the milk price.
This is the downside of the removal of quotas which mostly all of ye wanted a bit like turkeys looking for christmas imo'
I think the golden age of dairying might be coming to an end with the EU continually decreasing their cap ,i cant see any incentive for farmers to expand in any sector ,
It is certainly a big difference to years ago when there was subsity for sucklers , beef premium ,area aid and reps and dairying is not looking much more profitable either but farmers are been kept over a barrell to keep there single payment so the eu can rely on food for feckall

mahoney_j · 25-07-2015 11:17AM

Mulumpy wrote: »

In fairness J. I think we need to be a bit more supportive of our coops. I know im biased but in Arrabawns case I think they've done fantasticly well to turn things around the past few years. They're gradually moving away from being solely dependant on the likes of skim. In fairness they kept up price in 2 of the 3 peak months and have done really well to fight of glanbia and dairy gold. Sure mistakes have been made but i think they are in a great position going forward.

Disagree mulumphy,price was kept up during peak yes but now through trough period of price were fooled and don't pocess the cash reserves to support price in any way .hence we never had an offer of fixed price schemes etc that likes of Glanbia offer.another reason our price was held up was as u outlined to fight off Glanbia and dairy gold ,it worked for a while but now Glanbia are paying a better price than us and dairygold are just lagging behind.conor I believe is making a huge mistake in not introducing milk contracts for us and there is absolutely nothing to stop a supplier leaving to a rival supplier currently..lads are finally starting to wake up and take note since we dropped price from over 32 cent to 27.87 in 2 months with further cuts almost guaranteed.our position in kpmg audits over last 4 years also tells its own story ,11/12 out of 13 coops audited.going forward I think we will massively regret not thrashing out that dairygold merger proposal further last year.as usual at agm this year we were given commitments and promises on our milk price and given a speil re savings natural gas will give us.i know markets are in a negative at moment but I see nothing different in our set up..
By the way congrats on new arrival,hope all is doing well!!!!

milkprofit · 25-07-2015 12:25PM

Mulumpy wrote: »

In fairness J. I think we need to be a bit more supportive of our coops. I know im biased but in Arrabawns case I think they've done fantasticly well to turn things around the past few years. They're gradually moving away from being solely dependant on the likes of skim. In fairness they kept up price in 2 of the 3 peak months and have done really well to fight of glanbia and dairy gold. Sure mistakes have been made but i think they are in a great position going forward.

That is what all co ops tell us
Have heard that for last 40 years
When are we going to put younger members on the boards of these co ops not
Oldies

Brown Podzol · 25-07-2015 12:28PM

Jaysus, support your co-op.

Support your family. Support Cork hurling and football teams. Support Munster rugby team. It's business, not sport. As sure as I'm typing this all co-op staff will have gotten pay rises this year and last. Almost all on defined benefit pensions fully funded. As knowtow said, and I paraphrase, a monkey would run our co-ops. Captive supply, process into bulk commodities and flog on the world market mainly through Ornua for which a levy is collected from every litre. If your run out of capital take some from your suppliers.

alps · 25-07-2015 12:31PM

Brown Podzol wrote: »

Jaysus, support your co-op. Support your family. Support Cork hurling and football teams. Support Munster rugby team. It's business, not sport. As sure as I'm typing this all co-op staff will have gotten pay rises this year and last. Almost all on defined benefit pensions fully funded. As knowtow said, and I paraphrase, a monkey would run our co-ops. Captive supply, process into bulk commodities and flog on the world market mainly through Ornua for which a levy is collected from every litre. If your run out of capital take some from your suppliers.

And the cheerleaders on the committee and boards have to buy 80% of their inputs from said coop.....so much for getting businessmen on the board.

mahoney_j · 25-07-2015 12:39PM

milkprofit wrote: »

That is what all co ops tell us
Have heard that for last 40 years
When are we going to put younger members on the boards of these co ops not
Oldies

Don't matter a Shyte wether young or old ,been on a board is an extremely important position and no one should be on one unless competent and able to add significantly to it.i see lots on boards of coops etc because of a father etc been there before which is totally wrong .they can be an intimidating place where a different opinion is dismissed or not taken seriously because it dosnt go with the majority .i was on rep committee for a year and there no more for some of above and more id rather not print changing long standing ways of doing things and points of view is a hard thing to do for anyone new stepping on to something like that

Dawggone · 25-07-2015 12:40PM

Brown Podzol wrote: »

Jaysus, support your co-op. Support your family. Support Cork hurling and football teams. Support Munster rugby team. It's business, not sport. As sure as I'm typing this all co-op staff will have gotten pay rises this year and last. Almost all on defined benefit pensions fully funded. As knowtow said, and I paraphrase, a monkey would run our co-ops. Captive supply, process into bulk commodities and flog on the world market mainly through Ornua for which a levy is collected from every litre. If your run out of capital take some from your suppliers.

+1. Bang on.
Pull on the green/red/blue jersey and knuckle down and take your medicine whilst all other workers/management/interested parties make a very comfortable living.

Excellent post.

mahoney_j · 25-07-2015 12:41PM

Brown Podzol wrote: »

Jaysus, support your co-op. Support your family. Support Cork hurling and football teams. Support Munster rugby team. It's business, not sport. As sure as I'm typing this all co-op staff will have gotten pay rises this year and last. Almost all on defined benefit pensions fully funded. As knowtow said, and I paraphrase, a monkey would run our co-ops. Captive supply, process into bulk commodities and flog on the world market mainly through Ornua for which a levy is collected from every litre. If your run out of capital take some from your suppliers.

Absolutely nothing else to add to that brown ðŸ‘

Dawggone · 25-07-2015 12:42PM

alps wrote: »

And the cheerleaders on the committee and boards have to buy 80% of their inputs from said coop.....so much for getting businessmen on the board.

But at discount?

Buford T. Justice XIX · 25-07-2015 12:46PM

Brown Podzol wrote: »

Jaysus, support your co-op. Support your family. Support Cork hurling and football teams. Support Munster rugby team. It's business, not sport. As sure as I'm typing this all co-op staff will have gotten pay rises this year and last. Almost all on defined benefit pensions fully funded. As knowtow said, and I paraphrase, a monkey would run our co-ops. Captive supply, process into bulk commodities and flog on the world market mainly through Ornua for which a levy is collected from every litre. If your run out of capital take some from your suppliers.

+1

The basic business plan of an Irish Co-op:D

Dawggone · 25-07-2015 12:46PM

jaymla627 wrote: »

Who subs the difference between 34cpl and what the processors real market price should be is it the government our does the processor/co-op take the hit

Atm the processors and government are "in discussions".
Government auditors are examining Coop's books...

Buford T. Justice XIX · 25-07-2015 12:48PM

Dawggone wrote: »

Atm the processors and government are "in discussions".
Government auditors are examining Coop's books...

If the government subs the milk price, wouldn't that be counted as state aid?

Surely the Co-op has to sub it?

Dawggone · 25-07-2015 12:52PM

Blackgrass wrote: »

Why are the kiwi's so low then?,
is it because the euro is scarcely worth more than the sawdust and linen it's mostly printed on? Wait until the 20%+ increase in fert costs etc hits.

We are enjoying a double whammy of devalued currency and low oil prices Atm.
Fert cost I'm thinking will hit hard next year. Should be a good time to get the French thugs onto the whole monopoly/price fixing issues in that industry.

kowtow · 25-07-2015 12:59PM

Dawggone wrote: »

We are enjoying a double whammy of devalued currency and low oil prices Atm.
Fert cost I'm thinking will hit hard next year. Should be a good time to get the French thugs onto the whole monopoly/price fixing issues in that industry.

If the euro printing presses weren't running we would definitely be feeling it, as bad - worse even - than NZ I think.

But we have to stop thinking of our co-ops as buyers, and thanking them when they spend (our) shareholder funds playing smoke and mirrors with the price. The price is the price, is what they can get for it. And we'd better hope that they stop trying to be clever *buyers* and *processors* and become - instead - loyal agents, picking the milk up and getting the most that can be got for it, this time and every time.

Any other way lies ruin.

Dawggone · 25-07-2015 01:02PM

Buford T. Justice V wrote: »

If the government subs the milk price, wouldn't that be counted as state aid?

Surely the Co-op has to sub it?

I will post the outcome...

Perspective...12% corporate tax, NAMA, bank bailouts etc etc are also state aid.

alps · 25-07-2015 01:06PM

Dawggone wrote: »

But at discount?

No.....Get a nosebag and a bit of milage now nd again and like pigs in shi***.
Very few brave enough to say the emperor has no clothes. Know a few good lads who gave it a try but gave up in despair. Wrecking their head and too much of a cost on their business...

Milk Price- Please read Mod note in post #1

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