Cork GAA Discussion Thread

Boom__Boom wrote: »

In the league Kildare's record was P7 W2 L5
They lost to Down, Meath, Westmeath, Roscommon and Galway.
They beat Cavan and Laois.

Kildare's result in the championship this year

Laois 0-16 Kildare 0-16
Laois 1-11 Kildare 3-18
Dublin 5-18 Kildare 0-14
Offaly 1-13 Kildare 1-15
Longford 0-11 Kildare 2-24

Very little evidence there to support the notion that Kildare will cause Cork trouble.

Overall this year Kildare played 12 Won 5 Lost 6 Drew 1 - However when you look at the 5 wins 1 was against a Division 4 side, 1 against a Division 3 side and 2 of the wins were against a side which was relegated to Division 3 this year. The fact that the Laois and Longford managers are both already gone from their posts says a lot about how those two teams performance were viewed this.

As always a voice of reasons your absoultey one hundred percent brilliant post
Fifty fifty game some say such nonsense
Cork loose shows how far fallen

The county board are some boys, crowing about an 'appointments committee' in the year of our lord 2015 i.e. before this it was a total and utter joke. Look who is on the committees to see how this will go........
If cork cant beat a Kildare team that have imploded under the over rated, under qualified Jason ryan we are in bog trouble. When players **** off to America after a couple of championship games it is some indictment of the set up there

We know we don't have a good management but lets get behind the players they have put a huge amount into the year now to lose on Saturday ...but the reality and the records show that the 7 day turnaround for any team is a very difficult thing to over come the lads are only humans they need to have there heads right ..its not easy ...and I don't like this oh we should hammer Kildare ..Kilkenny and Kildare neaver leave there guard down they respect all opposition the same ...they neaver dismiss them before they play the game ...I just hope the lads play to form and I am sure they know that there is still a big prize for winning on Saturday night ...best of luck rebels you deserve it .

thinkstoomuch1 wrote: »

Stop making excuses for the management will yeah if they learned lesson from drawn game wouldn't be in mess there in now

TTM - I used to think that you were a good poster due to your knowledge of the Cork GAA scene but you have completely lost the plot wrt the current management.

At least wait until the season is over before laying into them. These guys are doing the job for the love of Cork Football - Ciaran O Sullivan has to pay someone to drive his oil truck when he's off to the North for a league game and gets home early Monday Morning and is up working at 9 am. He doesn't deserve the crap that you are coming out with.

You are destroying this thread with your negativity - maybe you need to take a break again, for a while.

I know how you will reply and to save you the effort - Yes - I criticised Cuthbert last season because the efforts were shambolic but I've seen big improvement and I hope that this continues. As for your claims that my criticism was personal - FFS ? - how can you criticise a manager and it not be personal ?

If, as seems likely, you choose to continue your criticism - would you please stop replying to my posts - It's getting very tiresome - I'll reciprocate and not reply to yours.

Gary Neville wrote: »

TTM - I used to think that you were a good poster due to your knowledge of the Cork GAA scene but you have completely lost the plot wrt the current management.

At least wait until the season is over before laying into them. These guys are doing the job for the love of Cork Football - Ciaran O Sullivan has to pay someone to drive his oil truck when he's off to the North for a league game and gets home early Monday Morning and is up working at 9 am. He doesn't deserve the crap that you are coming out with.

You are destroying this thread with your negativity - maybe you need to take a break again, for a while.

I know how you will reply and to save you the effort - Yes - I criticised Cuthbert last season because the efforts were shambolic but I've seen big improvement and I hope that this continues. As for your claims that my criticism was personal - FFS ? - how can you criticise a manager and it not be personal ?

If, as seems likely, you choose to continue your criticism - would you please stop replying to my posts - It's getting very tiresome - I'll reciprocate and not reply to yours.

Gary you can critse a mangers on field play without being personal


Personal insults is different though you surely agree

Management critsed on field performance is fine



Your unbelievable
I never once question the commitment and passion either management
You trying paint different picture
What crap I'm coming out with
I said as you said many times sullivan Davis sexton no record managementy
That what I question
Your changing views my posting like some do here just cause I ask you explain your points which you choose to ignore
What have cork improved this year
League is exactly like last year winning few games destroyed by Dublin
Defence conceded huge every game
Attack not scoring in long spells
Players picked out position
Management picking players then dropping them totally

Any one these points you want debate please do so



I have no problem with anyone changing opinion but you absoultey critsed this management severely all last year and fair enough your change but on what basis

One game v kerry isn't enough imo
I haven't picked on any posts but you made posts I debates them
In fairness you accused let's be honest regular regular posters huge negative views here when greatest respect you barely posted from January to June
That's your choice but don't tell others stop negativity or take a break just cause you don't like view from Saturday


The views since Saturday are unfortunately negative but justification in read Michael quirk today said same, cork article other day said snags appears cork again and doubts remain
You seem think everything is rosy from Saturday
Can you not genuinely see scoring one point twenty six minutes play is poor


Players are being critsed by many as soft and not good enough win all Ireland
That's wrong imo and you even said yourself you think cork have players win all Ireland
We all want cork win all Ireland

Gary Neville wrote: »

I'd be very confident if we had 2/3 weeks break but the stats show that beaten provincial finalists generally lose when they play a week later.

The thing with this stat is that every year 8 out of the 33 teams get to the provincial finals. So while the quick turnaround doesn't help, the fact is that for a lot of the teams that make up that stat they were only very average teams anyway coming off a provincial final loss. Depending on how the draw goes in various provinces you can get some very very average sides ending up in the provincials - prime example being London in 2013 when they beat Sligo and Leitrim. in other provinces you often have teams who beat one of the stragglers to get to the semi, have a good day in the office for the semi and over-perform and then turn in a standard/usual level performance to lose in the provincial final.

Also Cork's record in the qualifiers is played 12 won 9 and the 3 loses came way back in 2004, 2003 and 2001.

It's not the easiest task in the world with the quick turnaround but it would have to be a serious car crash of a performance not to get the win over a struggling Kildare side.

http://www.irishexaminer.com/sport/gaa/football/mike-quirke-cork-leaders-were-struggling-for-oxygen-343858.html


Look this isn't easy read when kerry man reads it but hard disagree
One line stands out
Management earns crust any replay
That's why kerry Kilkenny normally like harte wins replay

thinkstoomuch1 wrote: »

Well you with respect stop this absoultey nonsense waving the flag type stuff in we have serious problems but look turn blind eye and we are cork that will win the day
You do realise such attuide causes huge decline cork hurling most grades last ten and more years
Support the team but hush hush don't say problem exist

where have i said I don't ever support cork or get behind team

Where absoultey no where let's be clear
But unfortunately and long term posters hear know I wear heart sleeve cork belive tough love in calling it as it is and I'm not going to go along with any shirsde rubbish any given day stuff we could win when there's huge weakness repeating themselves



Tell me and show me if I'm being harsh
Defence been conceding huge scores challenge matches league and championship
Teams most games go long spell out scoring
Changes made two slow
Management pick lads out position

Were cork ladies football harsh thirteen years ago when made tough call ask friend then manager to step down
They wanted to win
Malachi rourke gave ruthless statement intent before Donegal game in interview he said he wanted to win in winning is everything
It transpired to he's team
That's outstanding management


Get behind the team, I'll still support them thurles Saturday and grass roots will too but calling out problem within set up Imo true support in demanding cork cork do better as I firmly believe there's all ireland in this team if coached properly

You have with respect and said it other posts before we are cork we should be proud we field teams etc when sean mac correcty refuted such nonsense as if we had reason celebrate when cork gaa failed teams hurling and football wonderful talent we have by not giving them best management teams other counties give them


Your attuide do not critse has been the same attuide saw huge decline imo cork hurling and Cork football poor relation
I'm sorry if I want more for Cork gaa as I belive cork gaa should be winning more football hurling as legacy cork gaa truly deserves with the greatest respect


There's is no fixation with management as if I have agenda nonsense but some critse players etc
Who pick the players
Who coaches the team
Who gives game plan
Management do so it's quite reasonable to suggest they would be questioned after Saturday and give me one results against top team they have or any record sexton Davis or sullivan have and cuthbhertt has done what in management overall

I'm sorry genuinely but I'm not going look like a fool say beat Kildare great progress made and we'll beat Dublin
Hope we all want hope my friend we all do
But you must have a reason for hope
Give me reason for hope v Dublin
And if there logical I'll believe them

I'm not getting into an argument with you cause your knowledge of cork gaa is much higher than mine but I really think there is progress in the football this year. Last year leaving the park was the lowest I felt leaving a game in a long time. So at least this year we were a few bad ref decisions away from beating them.

I really think there is hope against Dublin. (No disrespect to Kildare) they haven't have a game yet. Leinster is a joke all division 2 and 3 teams. We have had 2 tough games under our belt. Dublin are a good team but the way they are talked about them in the media the all Ireland should be cancelled and give them Sam now. I really Believe we can get to all Ireland semi final. It is sport there has to be hope. Beware the wounded lion.

klairondavis wrote: »

Kildare haven't a bad panel of players. More or less the same group of players (apart from Hugh McGrillen and his clubmate Paddy Brophy) were a very soft last gasp free away from dumping Monaghan out at the same stage last year. The problem this year among other things has been a growing division between a member of this management team and the senior players. There have been a number of fall outs which have sapped away the morale (not necessarily all Ryan's fault). It's pretty much inevitable that there will be new management next year and unfortunately some of the younger lads know that they will have a clean slate next January so they have left for America.

Cork should beat us by 5 or 6 points. The reasons to be optimistic for Kildare are that Ryan seems to have stumbled upon a better team with Tommy Moolick, Eoin Doyle and Niall Kelly now starting. They were injured earlier in the year. The short turnaround after losing is never easy no matter how good you are and if Cork do take Kildare for granted then they could be caught. Cork in Thurles won't hold the same fear factor for the Kildare players then say Dublin in Croke Park. Kildare will need to produce their best display in four or five years to have any chance. That's probably unlikely but the Longford match was Kildare's best 70 minute display in a long time.

Will ye go for outside management again next year

thinkstoomuch1 wrote: »

Will ye go for outside management again next year

Unlikely given the state of the county's balance sheet.

Glenn Ryan is the obvious candidate but that won't happen due to the make up of the county board top table at the moment.

Cian O'Neill has spoken before about his ambition to manage Kildare some day but I could see him staying with Fitzmaurice until his term ends.

Bryan Murphy originally from Bishopstown would be popular with the players and supporters.

thinkstoomuch1 wrote: »

Would niall Ronan ex rugby player get involved as a coach

He's the trainer of the county hurlers. I'm not sure if that management team will be back next year after the way the Christy Ring defence fell apart after such a good league campaign. I hope they do give it another go.

klairondavis wrote: »

Kildare haven't a bad panel of players. More or less the same group of players (apart from Hugh McGrillen and his clubmate Paddy Brophy) were a very soft last gasp free away from dumping Monaghan out at the same stage last year. The problem this year among other things has been a growing division between a member of this management team and the senior players. There have been a number of fall outs which have sapped away the morale (not necessarily all Ryan's fault). It's pretty much inevitable that there will be new management next year and unfortunately some of the younger lads know that they will have a clean slate next January so they have left for America.

Cork should beat us by 5 or 6 points. The reasons to be optimistic for Kildare are that Ryan seems to have stumbled upon a better team with Tommy Moolick, Eoin Doyle and Niall Kelly now starting. They were injured earlier in the year. The short turnaround after losing is never easy no matter how good you are and if Cork do take Kildare for granted then they could be caught. Cork in Thurles won't hold the same fear factor for the Kildare players then say Dublin in Croke Park. Kildare will need to produce their best display in four or five years to have any chance. That's probably unlikely but the Longford match was Kildare's best 70 minute display in a long time.

On the face of it, you'd say a match-up between the team that finished top of League One and the team that finished bottom of League Two is easy to call and the bookies odds of 1/4 on Cork are justified.
However, Kildare scraped through v Offaly and got a huge morale boost from the hammering of Longford away. That shows what one win can do and now they've two.

One team is coming in on a massive high as huge under dogs and with nothing to lose. Cork are coming in on a huge low and with the knowledge that they'll get savaged by all and sundry if they lose.

Sligo v Roscommon showed that sometimes league status doesn't count. A few players like Donncha O Connor and Paddy Kelly will struggle physically but most will be OK - there is not time for the injured players to return either.

Boom Boom's point about the quality of many beaten provicial finalists it valid but we don't know whether Cork can lift themselves mentally. The circumstances are a great leveller here IMO and I see this as 50/50.

Gary Neville wrote: »

Fair Enough TTM - I accept that you are very supportive of Cork in both codes and that you want us to have the best possible management. I accept most of your points and agree with McGuinness who suggested it's far easier to plan for an opponent when you knw exactly the tactics of your opponent.
It's very clear that whilst Cuthbert perhaps had the theory last season, he was a complete novice at this level and he compounded this by going for 3 inexperienced selectors. One recently retired player would have brought a lot too.
But I believe that we deserved to beat Kerry, the first day and would have done so but for Hughes. That's huge progress in my books. It also, IMO, means that we should reserve judgement until the season is over. Let's discuss the performance then and whether another term is justified if Cuthbert wants another term.

Fair points but if we had beaten kerry the ist day I wouldn't have been truly convinced in kerry had weaker team and as fitzmaurice said Cork were extremely motivated and kerry were complacent

I was saying all year kerry would win
Soon as kerry had warm weather training camps in summer it told me focus wasn't on Cork at all
Soon as I heard kerry team said and posted Thursday night kerry lack pace half forward no creative eleven cork could win
Half time I posted here yes half time kerry were poor and complacent even with lead and there be beaten

If cork had one it galls me to say but it would been a one off just like Cork hurling beating tippeary five years ago


Start every year teams set goals
Monaghan goal was Donegal ist training session
Cavan nearly got them ist game
On logic you could say cavan aren't far off monaghan in results
Truth is my roscommon beating them now out championship cavan awful but lucky in monaghan under estimated them imo


Tony considine said tippeary were poor v waterford and just done enough
Tippeary only focus all year is indeed kk


Cork beaten all ireland thirteen years ago following year gardiner Cusack etc prayed wanted kk final
They wanted kk
Cork nearly beaten by Wexford in ist game as focus wasn't there but when got final peaked every sense blew kk away eight points


Kerry were never true kerry ist day
Murphy made huge difference in o connor
Maher midfield dominated cork
Mahony sweeper excellent
Geaney goal two

Positions change sheehan no pace dictated game like pirlo Italy picked pass after pass after pass


Donnacha could done same cork but instead out management stuck him corner again one best man markers around

Look at midfield statics turnover etc kerry well truly had cork number replay


Also you think cork were great ist day
As a team no they weren't if you look closely
I said this after that game and few posters said I was being too negative
Genuinely I wasn't I was pointing out what kerry saw in cork only scored four players only four scores all game

A point I consistently make is under this management cork play individual not team
Four scorers showed that
As poor kerry were ist day they had ten different players scored when that happens means players don't perform always have default system and even worse player Fitzgerald got level point


Kerry dig in
Soon kerry got goal cork were gone Saturday
In truth I hate be one point it out but we're gone nine minutes start second half at rest half didn't score


If cork were as great as ist day never been that bad drawn game
But they were in one six and one three play all game is appalling and colm Brian donnacha forwards there but pure lack coaching get ball defence attack again is problem here


Monaghan Donegal better defence than kerry but scores more cork
Mcmanus double marked got three points play as he still got good ball
Colm o Neill could do same didn't get ball
Kissane said after ist game and then replay they need more ball
This has been problem all year still not solved


Our defence is not blanket when you compare it Monaghan Donegal and Dublin
Kerry defence is poor seven goal three games but longer kerry there they will solve it
There excuse is valid have no option in defence

Cork have plenty option defence

A performance again Dublin isn't enough save management imo
Got to be win
There's no point in me saying Cork will win when I don't truly believe they will
Improve get no joy in negative views

My views to be fair though have stood test time Cork football last two years and indeed most management I don't rate is correct
Never rated tj Ryan mcgenney and said long before season ended
Never rated minor football
Could be wrong with McGrath waterford however still needs be tested and ist real test failed
Give him another term and see

Where I was wrong was Kevin o Driscoll who has been superb
He's excellent all championship but shouldn't be centre forward as expose weak parts game
Not creative but should be half back in swap Brian and or ahead Barry driscoll who can't defend

Kevin I'd have ahead gould midfield any everyday week

Kerry ist day was not real kerry
It showed Saturday

Progress is never judged by one game
True progress is constantly sustainable success and Cork haven't done that yet or showed any signs doing it when expected to

Gary Neville wrote: »

Fair Enough TTM - I accept that you are very supportive of Cork in both codes and that you want us to have the best possible management. I accept most of your points and agree with McGuinness who suggested it's far easier to plan for an opponent when you knw exactly the tactics of your opponent.
It's very clear that whilst Cuthbert perhaps had the theory last season, he was a complete novice at this level and he compounded this by going for 3 inexperienced selectors. One recently retired player would have brought a lot too.
But I believe that we deserved to beat Kerry, the first day and would have done so but for Hughes. That's huge progress in my books. It also, IMO, means that we should reserve judgement until the season is over. Let's discuss the performance then and whether another term is justified if Cuthbert wants another term.

Fair point in some cases
However
Another significant point media often choose to ignore is cuthbhertt has been with Cork before management one year selector

With couninhan
Like fitzmaurice with jack but difference was fitzmaurice learned one greatest tactical minds game couninhan cork owe lot to and had skills but game management and tactical astute calls were not one those

Cuthbhertt isn't so much novice in was with Cork minor football years ago under he's old pal mick slocum then took minor on he's own got to all ireland final and all out attack as defence was poor conceded five goals Galway nineteenth point armagh and chopped changed players so many times never settled team
Could beat Tyrone but made changes too late

He's been around but never had much success
With Bishopton no success


I see no surprise like I said here again I called this few days ago not I'm see in future just cork football so predicable not even funny in slocum gave interview today talking usual nonsense in cork were just small bit away drawn game fine line between winning loosing and feel cork loose Kildare they where will be huge critsim


Seriously that's common practise management expect on field critsim if loose team expected beat
Conor lehane said earlier year interview players must have harsh management and landers doesn't go easy and lehane said no problem in any player thinks harsh shouldn't been playing seniors as way game is


I got feeling slocum was saying we came close kerry were not that far away etc whatever happens here on in


Its always the same old voices come out talk
Tompkins teddy McCarthy slocum usually show support cork no matter who is in charge As never call it as it is

Slocum great great player but didn't do much cork minor management or the barrs
Course entitled view point is these managers rarely critse management any sorts in always have line given day we need breaks not always clear cut etc usual nonsense in never management control the controlsbrd



Malachi o rourke and fitzmaurice gave tactical master class in management the weekend
Gallagher Donegal wasn't far behind them but only one could win that game
Fitzmaurice people say lucky
Yeah he is but fortunate always favour brave like man United all black kk etc
When they do get lucky always next day they learn and evolve and adapt and make their own luck


Just look at three example kerry how treat their football
Ist off put jack in under twenty one straight away no pissballing about with committee after committee get manager
Dog on street knew year ago jack was going in like dog on street knows he will take kerry senior third term

Kerry under twenty have strength condition programme made out under him as he adapted physical demands new game knows kerry need work today be ready for tomorrow
Cork will take age appointment minor manager


Kerry ist team this year use gps tracking
Cork don't
Kerry warm weather camp abroad cork dont
I'm not sure if have it now but last year cork didn't use video analysis training
Kerry did
Kerry closes off training public
Kerry building real centre excellence arena in kerry football
Kerry appointed good junior football coaching played few minor last year and ex under twenty one who think could be late development

Rumour is tommy griffin could be minor manager
If so kerry football has full house all management with all ace spades in good management with no joker in the pack in terms were talking card games language


Kerry are now like modern day factory football
Modern day state art new academy build young talent and management every level develop them
People don't realise kerry learning mistake past from minor and under twenty one and yet still won all ireland but once sort it as their doing kerry like Dublin are will be almost untouchable as other counties Donegal etc will be there but don't have resources they have
Cork actually do have resources competitive kerry Dublin but imo don't treat football seriously enough and attuide is starting point any sporting success


And judging by attuide from Saturday still is imo one of accepting draw kerry and beaten few points is progress
No its not
As malachi o rourke said winning is bottom line senior big counties and mcguimness and harte and Gavin are same attuide
Kerry every year are bridging a bigger gap to cork football

Great post Boom Boom. I want to highlight a couple of things before I head back to the general forum. 

I think the league is an excellent competition. However if you look at some of the more impressive Cork wins.

Firstly the win against Dublin, it was the poorest squad we'd seen up to that. There was nobody on the bench. It was a deserved win but a poor Dublin side.

Kerry didn't want to know.

On the second game v Donegal they didn't want to know, their supporters seemed to not want the game as they have such a small squad and were focused on the championship.

Monaghan , Mayo and Tyrone were good results, but there there or four wins were where the opposition were blooding too many new players .

My position that Kerry wanted a wake up call in the first game and how they went about getting it were possibly correctly called crazy here. However I stand by my thoughts that TOS deliberately got the Cork lads backs up. Kerry would rather have lost a tough game against Cork than win a handy game, their eye is on the AI and we saw the real Kerry on Sunday

Wrt to Masterclass in management, I think Fitzmaurice made some excellent changes, Cork made none. When the two boys couldn't get the ball inside nothing significant was changed to address it.
I didn't see any masterclass from O'Rourke. He selected a team that we expected, they picked up who we thought they'd pick up. They were in better shape and deserved it, nearly lost it in the end they were flat out and beginning to look a little lost. Had McBreartys point gone over at the end the decisson to leave Clerkin off for so long could have come back on him.

But Cork have the players to do better IMHO. I know O'Connor played very well when he came back for the first game. But he is no more mobile now than when he was when he left two years ago. He should definitely be around the squad, just like Clerkin is , playing some, close out sub for some games but the top teams know how to nullify him a good bit now IMHO. Bringing him back as a starting option was a bit of a bandaid move.
It appears from the outside to need a shake up , new ideas, interest from the county and a bit more of the famous Cork cuteness on the line.

Good luck lads. ðŸ‘