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SIRO - ESB/Vodafone Fibre To The Home

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    #1922
    ukoda
    Registered Users Posts: 2,084 ✭✭✭ukoda


    the towns are being called "fibrehoods" :):) haha


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    #1923
    dbit
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,322 ✭✭✭dbit


    And immediately i hear that age old song from Sesame street "In your fiber hood , in your fiiiibeeeer hooooood !

    Replace correct wording here :-
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V2bbnlZwlGQ


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    #1924
    Nollog
    Registered Users Posts: 5,431 ✭✭✭Nollog


    dbit wrote: »
    Im Raw from all the Fapping . Tescos ran out of lotion , as they did also the baskets and rubber hose. Carrigaline has **** all houses for rent .......... Im off to Rgnar Lothbroks area they have fiber up the friggin mountains . Clonmel to cork commute for work can suck my nads too.

    I had a look in carrigaline too, crazy out of my price-range.

    Try Wexford Town. Bit bleak on the (IT)job front, but with SIRO, that might change? Maybe I'm being too hopeful.

    I'm mulling my options over, I was due to move in July anyway, and will be jobless the first week of June.
    I can't say gigabit isn't making me give some towns a little extra consideration.


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    #1925
    Liamario
    Registered Users Posts: 2,094 ✭✭✭Liamario


    ukoda wrote: »
    the towns are being called "fibrehoods" :):) haha

    Can we expect rival hoods now? The efibres and the siros!


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    #1926
    dbit
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,322 ✭✭✭dbit


    /\/ollog wrote: »
    I had a look in carrigaline too, crazy out of my price-range.

    Try Wexford Town. Bit bleak on the (IT)job front, but with SIRO, that might change? Maybe I'm being too hopeful.

    I'm mulling my options over, I was due to move in July anyway, and will be jobless the first week of June.
    I can't say gigabit isn't making me give some towns a little extra consideration.

    Same here, rental Contract is up in july 1st as is my sh1tty debtcom contract . I honestly thought blackrock cork was getting it . They say Cork City in first phase but they dont say what parts . Even then upc 240MB will be there in most of the city area's. Guy i know in Australlia is pinging me higher and higher offers to leave here and head over to run his operations (Construction industry).

    I am stuck in limbo , i know if i go there that fiber is roughly in the same situation it is here if not worse.
    #( fiber is not the reason i would leave, I have kids , my heart would be torn out . The state of our national Gov and financial affairs are pushing me towards free water and lower taxes.)


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    #1927
    dbit
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,322 ✭✭✭dbit


    Liamario wrote: »
    Can we expect rival hoods now? The efibres and the siros!

    WellEircom are going to be able to sell Siros solution so i dont really see Rival hoods as such , Eircom need to get FTTH asap else they loose on the higher profit margins of being the end user provider and the backhaul provider.


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    #1928
    Sterling Archer
    Registered Users Posts: 2,252 ✭✭✭Sterling Archer


    dbit wrote: »
    WellEircom are going to be able to sell Siros solution so i dont really see Rival hoods as such , Eircom need to get FTTH asap else they loose on the higher profit margins of being the end user provider and the backhaul provider.

    But why would eircom want to become a SIRO reseller when they are implementing (There own Efibre) FTTH in the same towns


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    #1929
    dbit
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,322 ✭✭✭dbit


    Shane_ef wrote: »
    But why would eircom want to become a SIRO reseller when they are implementing (There own Efibre) FTTH in the same towns

    Basic Math , if an area they have not vdsl cabed then it may be more profitable short term to re sell over some one lese backbone.

    They can then flip the user over once they have finished the area them selves .


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    #1930
    ED E
    Registered Users Posts: 36,167 ✭✭✭✭ED E


    I'm hoping BK can give us the business insights on that aspect. Its not a simple situation.


    eircom is the really "The eicom group" of eircom Wholesale, eircom Retail, Meteor and little old eMobile tagged on the end. The comreg rules are designed to make eircom Wholesale act as if its a separate entity, but theyre still the one group.

    Eircom wholesale loses out big time any time anyone drops off their access network. They dont want anyone on ESB or UPC. Eircom retail though, make a few euros a month off any sub they can pick up, more if they can sell TV too which is an option on FTTH.

    Which side wins out?


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    #1931
    dbit
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,322 ✭✭✭dbit


    Well if they sell and end user a solution that still carries the Eircom brand name in the home and the user is oblivious to the backhaul provider , is there anything in existance that stops eircom from doing this style of handover in the background ? . As in some form of cool off period where they must use the ESB backhaul for a period of contractual agreement ? then flip users over to theyre own network once ready . I just envisage that the ESB will roll to the door quicker than eircom with fatter or wider conduits and ducts than Ericom have . Plus the fact that Eircom do not seem to be reaching areas due to the last mile drop offs in signals and power/freq constraints - where as ESB can run right to the door from interconnects for miles with the fiber ? (YEs eircom can do this too but as we have discussed previously the state of that infrastructure is not the greatest)

    Eircoms backhaul i apprecaite may be the bigger network now , i dont see it being that way for much longer . FTTH currently has more users operational in ESB land (Residential) versus the digital revolution in belcara (LOLZ).


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    #1932
    ED E
    Registered Users Posts: 36,167 ✭✭✭✭ED E


    NB: Not really the correct use of the term backhaul there dbit, you mean access network.

    Scenario:

    Jbloggs is on a 30Mb VDSL Line. He pays €50/mo.
    €30 goes to Eircom Wholesale. €20 goes to eircom retail.

    Jbloggs goes to SIRO at €70/mo
    €45 goes to SIRO, €25/mo goes to eircom retail.

    Eircom group still has its USO requirements. Still has to maintain the copper (for now), loses lots of revenue.


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    #1933
    dbit
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,322 ✭✭✭dbit


    Errr yes i did mean access network , my bad im still fapping off over my NGA_Donut result over on eircom DF thread. ( which as guil points out means nothing)


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    #1934
    bk
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 22,615 Mod ✭✭✭✭bk


    ED E wrote: »
    I'm hoping BK can give us the business insights on that aspect. Its not a simple situation.

    As you say, it isn't a simple situation at all and it is hard to say without detailed access to company accounts, etc., which I certainly don't have.

    There is nothing stopping Eircom Retail from buying access from SIRO and selling it as Eircom eFiber. Most customers wouldn't be any the wiser.

    However Eircom Retail and Eircom Wholesale aren't really separate companies, they are just separate divisions within the same company Eircom Group. And in the end Eircom Group will look at it from the level of what is best for the whole company.

    The reality is the real money in the telecoms market is in owning the infrastructure. Profit margins are very tight for resellers, there really isn't much money to be made in being just a reseller. And Eircom has that massive debt still hanging over them and I'm not sure Eircom could afford to service this debt with the small margins of the reseller business.

    That is why it is so important for Eircom to push out their own FTTH network, to continue to be a strong infrastructure company. I expect Eircom would make more money having their own duplicated FTTH network and only 50% of the customers, versus having no network and just being a reseller on SIRO.

    Having said that, in other countries where Vodafone has rolled out FTTH, they have come to agreement with the incumbent teleco to share their FTTH networks and not overlap in the same areas. SIRO and Eircom Wholesale could come to a similar arrangement where they share their networks at an even lower level then bitstream resellers. However I think they both realise that they have to build out a significant portion of their networks before that can happen.

    Both companies need to first prove they are serious about building out a FTTH network, before they can start to think about sharing. I just hope that to start with they try and avoid each others FTTH network builds for the first year or two.

    I'd hate to see them both doing the same towns at the same time while other towns have nothing.


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    #1935
    positron
    Registered Users Posts: 6,308 ✭✭✭positron


    bk wrote: »
    There is nothing stopping Eircom Retail from buying access from SIRO and selling it as Eircom eFiber. Most customers wouldn't be any the wiser.

    True. However wouldn't the eircom fiber come in where the traditional copper wire comes in at the moment, and Vodafone one will come into the electricity meter / box thingee?

    PS: Hmmm.. I think my telephone line is going under tiled floor for a bit... :o


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    #1936
    dbit
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,322 ✭✭✭dbit


    positron wrote: »
    True. However wouldn't the eircom fiber come in where the traditional copper wire comes in at the moment, and Vodafone one will come into the electricity meter / box thingee?

    PS: Hmmm.. I think my telephone line is going under tiled floor for a bit... :o


    Yes it would, IS it not in a little sleeve or shield or conduit ? The esb fit a little box on the outside wall to feed internal to the ONT faceplate. (Pics in the Siro Vid show it mounted this way) Knowing Irish folk people may ask for it to be fed into the meter box - which would be a little less drilling of walls at least ??


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    #1937
    dbit
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,322 ✭✭✭dbit


    Postiron , if your hanging in for arrival of VDSL or any eircom fiber tech i would at least ensure easy access to the cable , the last three people i spoke with that had installs due were rejected at install time due to cable access , soooo i guess getting that preped will avoid disapointment . They will ask to pull up the tiles if the cable is not ambulant where it lies.

    Firend and myself had to do the same as KN would not terminate a new line to the conduit only 10 meters away, had to dig a trench ourselves and conect to the original line ( Tar mac guys cut the line pre moving into the house)


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    #1938
    irishgeo
    Registered Users Posts: 9,410 ✭✭✭irishgeo


    dbit wrote: »
    Yes it would, IS it not in a little sleeve or shield or conduit ? The esb fit a little box on the outside wall to feed internal to the ONT faceplate. (Pics in the Siro Vid show it mounted this way) Knowing Irish folk people may ask for it to be fed into the meter box - which would be a little less drilling of walls at least ??

    what video?


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    #1939
    dbit
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,322 ✭✭✭dbit


    irishgeo wrote: »
    what video?

    This one https://youtu.be/gkFVhUfGy0c


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    #1940
    Nollog
    Registered Users Posts: 5,431 ✭✭✭Nollog


    I can't stop reading shine in an Oasis voice.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wQHChSSpSmM


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    #1941
    dbit
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,322 ✭✭✭dbit


    Rotflcopter.


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    #1942
    rob808
    Registered Users Posts: 2,311 ✭✭✭rob808


    It funny really the 350 towns and villages are gona have up to 1gb connections.The people on the NBP are gona have up to 30mb connection forget about being in the dark age rural Ireland gona be in the Stone Age when come to Siro broadband luck people in towns and villages plus kinda put our government plan to shame :).


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    #1943
    murphaph
    Registered Users Posts: 19,018 ✭✭✭✭murphaph


    Wrong. The 30Mb is the MINIMUM that every premises must get under the NBP. The reality seems like FTTH is the preferred solution for most premises outside towns and villages so this 30Mb is looking increasingly irrelevant. Both Eircom and Siro are saying that FTTH is the solution to broadband delivery to Ireland's poorly planned one off and ribbon housing.


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    #1944
    Danny Boy
    Closed Accounts Posts: 98 ✭✭Danny Boy


    rob808 wrote: »
    It funny really the 350 towns and villages are gona have up to 1gb connections.The people on the NBP are gona have up to 30mb connection forget about being in the dark age rural Ireland gona be in the Stone Age when come to Siro broadband luck people in towns and villages plus kinda put our government plan to shame :).

    http://www.eircomwholesale.ie/belcarra-pilot/


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    #1945
    Nonoperational
    Registered Users Posts: 7,401 ✭✭✭Nonoperational


    If everyone had 30Mbit it would be far from the stone age. 30Mbit is plenty for the vast vast majority of people.


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    #1946
    monument
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators Posts: 14,076 Mod ✭✭✭✭monument


    Nonoperational wrote: »
    If everyone had 30Mbit it would be far from the stone age. 30Mbit is plenty for the vast vast majority of people.

    That is head wrecking stuff.

    You can't plan future broadband provision on the bases of what's "plenty" for most people now.

    We'd end up with the same kind of issue in the short to medium term and end up paying more in the long run to fix it.


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    #1947
    murphaph
    Registered Users Posts: 19,018 ✭✭✭✭murphaph


    Nonoperational wrote: »
    If everyone had 30Mbit it would be far from the stone age. 30Mbit is plenty for the vast vast majority of people.
    In 2015 maybe (and even then in a multi-person household where 2 people want to stream 4K content simultaneously it would in fact be insufficient). It certainly won't be enough in a few years when traditional TV broadcasting goes the way of the dinosaur and everything moves to being IP based and on demand. Traditional broadcasting will seem to our children like going to the cinema to see a Pathe newsreel seems to us.

    In the future everything will revolve around IP addresses and the internet of things. The explosion in bandwidth requirements over the past 5 years are proof enough that 30Mb will be insufficient for the vast vast majority in 10 years, if not before then.


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    #1948
    godskitchen
    Registered Users Posts: 1,826 ✭✭✭godskitchen


    No to 30mb, typical Irish attitude, ara sure it will do, what do you need all that speed for....

    I have heard the same from wisps when asking for more bandwidth. "What do you need it for"

    None of your business, ESB don't ask why you need 3 phase or what you plan to do with it.

    Do the job once and do it right, we have left enough of a mess for future generations to sort out, let's get this right at the very least.

    Once ftth is widespread, the debate is over. This forum will be very quite. I can't wait.


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    #1949
    WicklowTiger
    Registered Users Posts: 268 ✭✭WicklowTiger


    I live in Wexford in town. My house is on a road with just 5 houses on it. Went through years of fighting with eircom before I gave up on getting efibre. What's the chances of being able to get SIRO in these circumstances?


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    #1950
    OneEightSeven
    Registered Users Posts: 1,339 ✭✭✭OneEightSeven


    Nonoperational wrote: »
    If everyone had 30Mbit it would be far from the stone age. 30Mbit is plenty for the vast vast majority of people.
    This kind of attitude is very stupid and counter-productive. Are you even aware that Ireland has lost out on foreign investment due to our slow speeds in the past? Foreign companies will look at netindex.com and see Ireland lagging behind countries who have a more positive attitude than you and will invest in them instead of us. Ireland's economy heavily relies on foreign investment, hence the reason why our corporation is something like 12.5%. If we limit the speeds to 30Mb, our national average will be about 40/50Mb, which isn't very impressive now, nevermind in a few years time when we're being outclassed by most of Europe. Rolling out 1Gb internet to every urban area and industrial estate in Ireland would do wonders for the economy and people will only have to wait a few minutes to download ultra-HD movies. It's a win-win situation, so this "30Mb is enough" attitude can fúck right off.


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    #1951
    OneEightSeven
    Registered Users Posts: 1,339 ✭✭✭OneEightSeven


    Another thing, it costs the same to rollout 30Mb as it does with rolling out 1Gb, as FTTH is the only technology capable of delivering those speed consistently, so what's the point in limiting the speeds? I'm sure Eircom would love to limit it to 30Mb because they would have to spend less on upgrading their backhaul, but then many customers would move to Vodafone/ESB.


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