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The Pro Austerity Crowd

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Comments

  • #452
    ryan101
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,671 ✭✭✭ryan101


    Idbatterim wrote: »
    Ryan my response was pretty much an agreeing with you, I mean the austerity they have experienced will be higher taxes or reduced asset wealth etc. A lot of normal people are struggling with the basics and paying a mortgage etc, food, utility bills etc, you are of course right, if you are that rich, you could lose 50% and ask what difference it will make to your day to day living and the answer is probably none, because you are nowhere near close to struggling for the absolute basics / essentials...

    So in reality the Austerity that is supposed to be for everyone, is in fact only for the ordinary working person. I've no issue with Austerity for everyone, but those who can afford to pay the most should, instead Ireland richest people have become even richer, while preaching that everyone must endure austerity to the ordinary working person.


  • #453
    RecordStraight
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,292 ✭✭✭RecordStraight


    ryan101 wrote: »
    Sounds about right if you are on the Sunday times rich list for Ireland.
    Can you explain what austerity they have suffered exactly ?
    What austerity have YOU 'suffered'?


  • #454
    longhalloween
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,207 ✭✭✭longhalloween


    ryan101 wrote: »
    So in reality the Austerity that is supposed to be for everyone, is in fact only for the ordinary working person. I've no issue with Austerity for everyone, but those who can afford to pay the most should, instead Ireland richest people have become even richer, while preaching that everyone must endure austerity to the ordinary working person.

    Why are you repeating yourself, while ignoring the questions posed to you?

    Of course they're getting richer. They're working hard to get richer. Same as everyone else on this little island.
    Do you really expect the rich to bring themselves down to the breadline? They already pay many multiples more tax that "ordinary working people".


  • #455
    ryan101
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,671 ✭✭✭ryan101


    RecordStraight wrote: »
    What austerity have YOU 'suffered'?

    I lost my job, and my wife's wages have been slashed, after the bills are paid, we've just enough left for food, is that good enough for you ?
    "We all have to endure austerity" - I agree, I don't see it happening the wealthy though.


  • #456
    Ray Palmer
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,351 ✭✭✭Ray Palmer


    Idbatterim wrote: »
    I feel like I am being cheated by the system though. Ray I agree with all that you are saying, but say you could potentially take all your income out with 0% tax? would you do it? Do you give a toss about what those wasters in government would waste it on. Every man for him or herself IMO, that is the kind of society that has been created here. I read a finanical times article in Greece, how nobody wouldnt be on the take, what kind of an idiot wouldnt be when everyone else is at it? I really think its the same here...
    No I do believe in paying taxes. I just think the system has to be fairer and not preventing investment and growth.


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  • #457
    RecordStraight
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,292 ✭✭✭RecordStraight


    ryan101 wrote: »
    I lost my job, and my wife's wages have been slashed, after the bills are paid, we've just enough left for food, is that good enough for you ?
    What has that got to do with public spending 'austerity' though? Did you work for the government?


  • #458
    beardy_mcgrath
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 27 ✭beardy_mcgrath


    ryan101 wrote: »
    What increased taxes ?
    They don't pay PAYE.

    capital gains tax rates have increased by 50% since 2007 , tax deductions for pension investments have been halved , that measure however effects middle income earners more most likely

    its a pretty vague question tbh

    i think you might be aiming in the wrong direction , an enormous strain on our nations finances is the enormous spend on pensioners who are already well off , free transport , home allowances , medical cards , once your over seventy and your spouse is alive , you can still earn a grand per week and receive a range of benefits , costs the state several billion per year

    the elderly have faced zero austerity since 2007 bar a token removal of phone rental allowance and a measley 50 cents levy on prescriptions which cost many multiples of that , thats a fact


  • #459
    Ray Palmer
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,351 ✭✭✭Ray Palmer


    ryan101 wrote: »
    I lost my job, and my wife's wages have been slashed, after the bills are paid, we've just enough left for food, is that good enough for you ?
    "We all have to endure austerity" - I agree, I don't see it happening the wealthy though.
    Well how many wealthy people do you know? You obviously don't understand the tax system.

    You do get you losing your job isn't anything to do with government austerity and you probably pay no income tax on your wife's wages with 2 tax free allowances


  • #460
    ryan101
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,671 ✭✭✭ryan101


    Ray Palmer wrote: »
    Well how many wealthy people do you know? You obviously don't understand the tax system.

    You do get you losing your job isn't anything to do with government austerity and you probably pay no income tax on your wife's wages with 2 tax free allowances

    With stealth taxes and levies, my wife pays more tax now than ever she did.
    Disproportionately more than any wealthy person will ever pay.

    Now explain what austerity the wealthy in Ireland are undergoing ?


  • #461
    ryan101
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,671 ✭✭✭ryan101


    beardy_mcgrath wrote: »
    capital gains tax rates have increased by 50% since 2007 , tax deductions for pension investments have been halved , that measure however effects middle income earners more most likely

    its a pretty vague question tbh

    i think you might be aiming in the wrong direction , an enormous strain on our nations finances is the enormous spend on pensioners who are already well off , free transport , home allowances , medical cards , once your over seventy and your spouse is alive , you can still earn a grand per week and receive a range of benefits , costs the state several billion per year

    So austerity should be for ordinary pensioners in Ireland, but not the wealthy, I see. I would disagree, austerity should be for everyone.


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  • #462
    mickydoomsux
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 4,287 ✭✭✭mickydoomsux


    ryan101 wrote: »
    With stealth taxes and levies, my wife pays more tax now than ever she did.

    What stealth taxes and levies are those?


  • #463
    RecordStraight
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,292 ✭✭✭RecordStraight


    ryan101 wrote: »
    With stealth taxes and levies, my wife pays more tax now than ever she did.
    Disproportionately more than any wealthy person will ever pay.

    Now explain what austerity the wealthy in Ireland are undergoing ?
    How do you propose they should be subjected to austerity? A government grab for a huge portion of their wealth?

    Do you think they would stick around for this?

    Do you propose the government detaining them at airports while helping itself to a portion of their wealth?


  • #464
    bumper234
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,250 ✭✭✭✭bumper234


    ryan101 wrote: »
    With stealth taxes and levies, my wife pays more tax now than ever she did.
    Disproportionately more than any wealthy person will ever pay.

    Now explain what austerity the wealthy in Ireland are undergoing ?

    You really have a knack for avoiding Rays question don't you?


  • #465
    beardy_mcgrath
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 27 ✭beardy_mcgrath


    ryan101 wrote: »
    So austerity should be for ordinary pensioners in Ireland, but not the wealthy, I see. I would disagree, austerity should be for everyone.

    define ordinary pensioners

    i started off by refering to wealthy pensioners on a grand per week betwen both spouses

    however , no pensioners have faced anything close to austerity since 2007 , they are too politically powerful


  • #466
    ryan101
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,671 ✭✭✭ryan101


    bumper234 wrote: »
    You really have a knack for avoiding Rays question don't you?

    You were caught lying, so that pretty much rules you out.


  • #467
    srsly78
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,157 ✭✭✭srsly78


    What is the obsession with PAYE? Income tax is payable on all income, paye has nothing to do with it.


  • #468
    Ray Palmer
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,351 ✭✭✭Ray Palmer


    ryan101 wrote: »
    With stealth taxes and levies, my wife pays more tax now than ever she did.
    Disproportionately more than any wealthy person will ever pay.

    Now explain what austerity the wealthy in Ireland are undergoing ?

    You mean the pay by use charges that people like to call "taxes"? Why do you want to change away from income tax now?

    Answer my question about how to avoid paye tax and I'll answer all your questions. You can't claim you missed it at this point but it is becoming apparent you don't know. The reason being it isn't true


  • #469
    bumper234
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,250 ✭✭✭✭bumper234


    ryan101 wrote: »
    He doesn't answer the question, what austerity have the wealthy endured exactly ?

    Oh he asked you first so its only right and polite that you answer first. Something tells.me that you won't answer but let's give you the chance and see do you man up.


  • #470
    bumper234
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,250 ✭✭✭✭bumper234


    ryan101 wrote: »
    You were caught lying, so that pretty much rules you out.

    Sure ;)


  • #471
    Bubbaclaus
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,460 ✭✭✭Bubbaclaus


    ryan101, Ireland has the most progressive income tax system in the EU and the 3rd most progressive in the OECD. Yet you want to tax the rich even more? Don't be ridiculous. The tax system is already overly progressive as it is.


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  • #472
    longhalloween
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,207 ✭✭✭longhalloween


    ryan101 wrote: »
    With stealth taxes and levies, my wife pays more tax now than ever she did.
    Disproportionately more than any wealthy person will ever pay.

    Disproportionally? Really?

    A guy on 200k will take home maybe 106k after tax. So nearly half his wages are gone.

    Are half your wifes wages taken in tax?


  • #473
    ryan101
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,671 ✭✭✭ryan101


    Ray Palmer wrote: »
    You mean the pay by use charges that people like to call "taxes"? Why do you want to change away from income tax now?

    Answer my question about how to avoid paye tax and I'll answer all your questions. You can't claim you missed it at this point but it is becoming apparent you don't know. The reason being it isn't true

    I already did, they don't pay PAYE, they are not salaried employees, as directors they get a cut of the profits, they get share options, they get share dividends, and they have offshore vehicles set up to filter all this, hence they get richer.

    Now can you explain what austerity they have endured exactly ?


  • #474
    beardy_mcgrath
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 27 ✭beardy_mcgrath


    Bubbaclaus wrote: »
    ryan101, Ireland has the most progressive income tax system in the EU and the 3rd most progressive in the OECD. Yet you want to tax the rich even more? Don't be ridiculous. The tax system is already overly progressive as it is.

    thats what happens when you have an overwhelmingly left wing media , people become conditioned into believing stuff which isnt true


  • #475
    ryan101
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,671 ✭✭✭ryan101


    longhalloween wrote: »
    Disproportionally? Really?

    A guy on 200k will take home maybe 106k after tax. So nearly half his wages are gone.

    Are half your wifes wages taken in tax?

    Half her income is yes, and she does not have 106k to live on afterwards.

    I'll ask you again, what austerity do the wealthy in Ireland have to endure exactly ?


  • #476
    ryan101
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,671 ✭✭✭ryan101


    Bubbaclaus wrote: »
    ryan101, Ireland has the most progressive income tax system in the EU and the 3rd most progressive in the OECD. Yet you want to tax the rich even more? Don't be ridiculous. The tax system is already overly progressive as it is.

    Progressive for who ~? If "austerity is for everyone", why are only ordinary working people the ones experiencing it ?


  • #477
    longhalloween
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,207 ✭✭✭longhalloween


    ryan101 wrote: »
    Half her income is yes, and she does not have 106k to live on afterwards.

    I'll ask you again, what austerity do the wealthy in Ireland have to endure exactly ?

    Unless she's on 200k as well, I'd find that hard to believe she pays that much in income USC and PRSI.


  • #478
    ryan101
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,671 ✭✭✭ryan101


    longhalloween wrote: »
    Unless she's on 200k as well, I'd find that hard to believe she pays that much in income USC and PRSI.

    Answer the question


  • #479
    beardy_mcgrath
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 27 ✭beardy_mcgrath


    ryan101 wrote: »
    Half her income is yes, and she does not have 106k to live on afterwards.

    I'll ask you again, what austerity do the wealthy in Ireland have to endure exactly ?

    its a relative - borderline philosophical question


  • #480
    Bubbaclaus
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,460 ✭✭✭Bubbaclaus


    ryan101 wrote: »
    Half her income is yes, and she does not have 106k to live on afterwards.

    I'll ask you again, what austerity do the wealthy in Ireland have to endure exactly ?

    Your wife must be earning at least €720,000 a year so, since that is the amount where the portion of pay taxed reaches 50%.


    So either your wife earns €720k a year, or you are lying.


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  • #481
    ryan101
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,671 ✭✭✭ryan101


    beardy_mcgrath wrote: »
    its a relative - borderline philosophical question

    For who, the ordinary people suffering the austerity measures, or the rich ?


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