Season 4 Episode 5 "First of His Name": HAVE read the books

krudler · 06-05-2014 07:04PM

Blay wrote: »

Ned never fights Jaime in the books, only the show.

Bronze Yohn beat the crap out of him when he visited Winterfell.

That's why I didnt remember it then :pac: that's the problem with reading the books after the show you forget which is which at times.

Good ep this week, I prefer the scheming, family plots and workings of well, the game of thrones to all the dragon and white walker stuff, not that those things arent cool too but the show for me is made on the interaction between the characters.

DM addict · 06-05-2014 07:49PM

Not a blow-your-mind episode, but still interesting.

I enjoyed the plotting - Cersei seemed to be drinking less and slightly more in control.

Glad that Jon and Bran didn't meet, would have been too screwy. Kinda odd that Jon now knows that at least one of his siblings is alive though. Am I right in recalling that he assumes they're all dead in the books? My memory for details is fading . . .

A meta-note - did anyone else think it was odd that Nikolai Coster-Waldau (definitely didn't spell that right) got first billing for the episode even though Jamie wasn't really in it - just background at the coronation? I suppose the 'key' characters will always have first billing during episodes they feature in, I just don't even remember him getting a line.

Hotale.com · 06-05-2014 08:10PM

DM addict wrote: »

A meta-note - did anyone else think it was odd that Nikolai Coster-Waldau (definitely didn't spell that right) got first billing for the episode even though Jamie wasn't really in it - just background at the coronation? I suppose the 'key' characters will always have first billing during episodes they feature in, I just don't even remember him getting a line.

It's been like that all season :P I'm sure Peter Dinklage was down second, did he even turn up? I was only half watching for parts of it...

DM addict · 06-05-2014 08:26PM

Hotale.com wrote: »

It's been like that all season :P I'm sure Peter Dinklage was down second, did he even turn up? I was only half watching for parts of it...

Dinklage wasn't credited - I double checked after expecting to see Jamie and then not, really. It must be a contract thing - Cersei, Jamie, Tyrion, Dany and Jon (and Ned and Robert Baratheon, when they were alive) seem to share the top billing, before everyone else gets the alphabetical treatment.

Sulla Felix · 06-05-2014 09:40PM

Nerdlingr wrote: »

And the fact that Brienne was basically going at crawling pace when she was talking about heading for the wall.

Bug bear of mine because it seems to pop up a lot.

If you want a horse to survive the journey from Dublin to Wicklow, never mind King's Landing to the Wall, you don't gallop the whole way. Considering they have to make their way through a warzone and are unlikely to find succour north or south of the neck, those two horses are going to want to be treated with kid gloves.

Nerdlingr · 06-05-2014 11:18PM

Sulla Felix wrote: »

Bug bear of mine because it seems to pop up a lot.

If you want a horse to survive the journey from Dublin to Wicklow, never mind King's Landing to the Wall, you don't gallop the whole way. Considering they have to make their way through a warzone and are unlikely to find succour north or south of the neck, those two horses are going to want to be treated with kid gloves.

Yes yes I know... but I'm not saying gallop all the way. But walking pace to the wall? Westeros will be frozen over by the time she gets out of Kings Landing the rate she's going. She knows that Sansa needs saving some time this century right?:P

(They do rest at a few towns along the way in her journey but I guess the show had them at walking pace in order to accentuate the 'comedy' provided by Gendry's horse-riding 'skills')

Hotale.com · 06-05-2014 11:22PM

Nerdlingr wrote: »

Yes yes I know... but I'm not saying gallop all the way. But walking pace to the wall? Westeros will be frozen over by the time she gets out of Kings Landing the rate she's going. She knows that Sansa needs saving some time this century right?:P

(They do rest at a few towns along the way in her journey but I guess the show had them at walking pace in order to accentuate the 'comedy' provided by Gendry's horse-riding 'skills')

Gendry's Podrick? :O

Paddy Cow · 06-05-2014 11:25PM

Sulla Felix wrote: »

Bug bear of mine because it seems to pop up a lot.

If you want a horse to survive the journey from Dublin to Wicklow, never mind King's Landing to the Wall, you don't gallop the whole way. Considering they have to make their way through a warzone and are unlikely to find succour north or south of the neck, those two horses are going to want to be treated with kid gloves.

If anyone has read the Wheel of Time series, this will know that this point comes up a lot, especially in the earlier books. On long journeys they walk the horses as much as possible because they don't know when they might have to run from danger and a horse can only run/gallop for so long. After a gallop, they are always careful to take it extra slowly with the horses again.

In those times a well cared for horse could mean the difference between life and death so they didn't take any chances.

Hotale.com · 06-05-2014 11:27PM

Paddy Cow wrote: »

If anyone has read the Wheel of Time series, this will know that this point comes up a lot, especially in the earlier books. On long journeys they walk the horses as much as possible because they don't know when they might have to run from danger and a horse can only run/gallop for so long. After a gallop, they are always careful to take it extra slowly with the horses again.

In those times a well cared for horse could mean the difference between life and death so they didn't take any chances.

Just wondering, are the Wheel of Time books worth reading? I've heard they get average in the middle, and if they're a drag I wouldn't have much interest in starting it :P

Paddy Cow · 06-05-2014 11:37PM

Hotale.com wrote: »

Just wondering, are the Wheel of Time books worth reading? I've heard they get average in the middle, and if they're a drag I wouldn't have much interest in starting it :P

I haven't finished them. I've read the first ten and really enjoyed them. A couple of them do drag a little bit but overall I found them more enjoyable than ASOIAF. It's my favourite fantasy series and I would definitely recommend it but each to their own

Sulla Felix · 06-05-2014 11:38PM

Nerdlingr wrote: »

Yes yes I know... but I'm not saying gallop all the way. But walking pace to the wall? Westeros will be frozen over by the time she gets out of Kings Landing the rate she's going. She knows that Sansa needs saving some time this century right?:P

(They do rest at a few towns along the way in her journey but I guess the show had them at walking pace in order to accentuate the 'comedy' provided by Gendry's horse-riding 'skills')

Yes, more than likely walking pace all the way to the wall. They can't rely on getting remounts pretty much anywhere along the way. If a trot or canter now might speed things up, the repercussions when you lame the horse and have to walk the rest of the way are really going to slow you down.

Take a look at competitive endurance riding. These are one day events, covering no more than a couple of hundred miles and even at these short durations the riders will often get off and jog alongside a trotting horse to ensure the horse doesn't take an injury.

I blame westerns. You always see cowboys and indians galloping around. In reality, if you don't want to walk on your two feet, you treat your horses four hooves a lot better than you'd think.

Rosy Posy · 06-05-2014 11:49PM

Hotale.com wrote: »

Just wondering, are the Wheel of Time books worth reading? I've heard they get average in the middle, and if they're a drag I wouldn't have much interest in starting it :P

I don't know anyone who's actually managed to finish them. I really enjoyed the first few, reading them as they came out every year but then there was a gap after book 6 and by the time book 7 came out I couldn't remember all the ins and outs and couldn't be ar$ed going back reading six big fat books. I have to say I prefer the characterisation in asoiaf, it seems more real somehow. Wot is pure escapism.

Sulla Felix · 06-05-2014 11:53PM

With all respect to the dead, Sandersons ghost writing invigorated the series. I haven't finished them all yet, but they're better than they have been since book 4-5.

Jelle1880 · 07-05-2014 12:02AM

I for one am glad that next week we'll see more of Yara.

With Daenerys now stuck in her city I think it would be nice if they focus more on the Iron Islands.

bopper · 07-05-2014 01:46AM

username123 wrote: »

Agree on the Jon Arryn reveal. I watch with a non book reader and the significance of it went straight over his head, I had to pause it and remind him who Jon Arryn was and why this was a big reveal. I'd say it was missed by a fair few.

In fairness though I'd imagine at whatever point it was revealed in the show it still would have went over a lot of non-book readers head's.

bopper · 07-05-2014 01:50AM

DM addict wrote: »

Dinklage wasn't credited - I double checked after expecting to see Jamie and then not, really. It must be a contract thing - Cersei, Jamie, Tyrion, Dany and Jon (and Ned and Robert Baratheon, when they were alive) seem to share the top billing, before everyone else gets the alphabetical treatment.

Dinklage always gets top billing unless he doesn't appear in the episode. Then it goes Jamie, Cersei, Dany, Jon. Not sure how they're ordered overall but I don't think it's alphabetical as Alfie Allen always seems to be near the end. Even if they appear in the background they still get credited, hence Nikolai's name appearing. Brienne and Varys were credited in episode 3 even though they were simply spotted in the background at the beginning of the episode during the aftermath of Joff's death. Joffrey was also credited in that episode even though he was simply playing a corpse during the rape scene!

celica00 · 07-05-2014 06:31AM

bopper wrote: »

Dinklage always gets top billing unless he doesn't appear in the episode. Then it goes Jamie, Cersei, Dany, Jon. Not sure how they're ordered overall but I don't think it's alphabetical as Alfie Allen always seems to be near the end. Even if they appear in the background they still get credited, hence Nikolai's name appearing. Brienne and Varys were credited in episode 3 even though they were simply spotted in the background at the beginning of the episode during the aftermath of Joff's death. Joffrey was also credited in that episode even though he was simply playing a corpse during the rape scene!

Imagine they dont get mentioned, even though they are only in for a few seconds...they probably would go mad

And its probably a day or half days work for them as well to just show up, be dressed up etc and play a role in the background....

Turtyturd · 07-05-2014 06:56AM

A good episode. I am not too bothered that Coldhands hasn't made an appearance, I always thought introducing him could be the point where casual viewers could be put off by the fantasy elements.

The Sansa 'I'm a virgin' scene irked me for a while and I couldn't figure out why until I read this thread.

My only complaint would be that some stuff seems a bit rushed, especially the whole Locke/Jon/Bran storyline.

RobbingBandit · 07-05-2014 09:19AM

Problem is there are only 10 episodes each season so some stuff has to be cut or altered but when they start splicing characters and blowing open story lines yet leaving out pivotal characters it seems stupid.

One of the main reasons Brienne and Pod go off in the book is to search for Sansa and Ser Dontos, the show will be full of plot holes soon which will make it unbearable to watch.

username123 · 07-05-2014 09:20AM

RobbingBandit wrote: »

One of the main reasons Brienne and Pod go off in the book is to search for Sansa and Ser Dontos, the show will be full of plot holes soon which will make it unbearable to watch.

Thats what they have gone off to do?

Jelle1880 · 07-05-2014 09:24AM

username123 wrote: »

Thats what they have gone off to do?

Yeah, I don't see how this will lead to a plothole....

The only difference is how they meet, but that part in the books is pretty boring and uninteresting anyway.

wispa9 · 07-05-2014 09:37AM

Hotale.com wrote: »

Just wondering, are the Wheel of Time books worth reading? I've heard they get average in the middle, and if they're a drag I wouldn't have much interest in starting it :P

I've read them all, and I loved them! They do drag a bit in the middle, but I find that's not an uncommon problem with fantasy. There's a far greater magical element in WoT than ASOIAF, so bear that in mind. Personally, I think they're worth the read!

07-05-2014 09:41AM

I love wot

stevenmu · 07-05-2014 09:47AM

Hotale.com wrote: »

Gendry's Podrick? :O

I actually was thinking during this episode that they do look quite similar. I can't remember was there any hints in the book that Podrick is another one of Robert's bastards?

Michael D Not Higgins · 07-05-2014 09:54AM

stevenmu wrote: »

I actually was thinking during this episode that they do look quite similar. I can't remember was there any hints in the book that Podrick is another one of Robert's bastards?

Podrick is a Payne, related to Ser Ilyn.

Duckworth_Luas · 07-05-2014 09:56AM

stevenmu wrote: »

I actually was thinking during this episode that they do look quite similar. I can't remember was there any hints in the book that Podrick is another one of Robert's bastards?

Podrick Payne is a relative of Ser Ilynn Payne who separated Ned Stark's head from his body.

It's just coincidence that the actors for Pod and Gendry are similar.

I mean Karl commented on Meera Reed's curly black hair. Jon Snow also has curly black hair.

Daith · 07-05-2014 10:02AM

RobbingBandit wrote: »

Problem is there are only 10 episodes each season so some stuff has to be cut or altered but when they start splicing characters and blowing open story lines yet leaving out pivotal characters it seems stupid.

Only to book readers though. It is really unfair to expect the TV show to be a direct retelling of the book.

Korvanica · 07-05-2014 11:23AM

The hound suffered no wounds that could kill him form the bar fight.

Do you think arya nicked him when she stuck him with pointy end. And that will kill him ?

Either that or we have another Hound & Arya vs the world fight to look forward to.

FunLover18 · 07-05-2014 01:19PM

OK apologies if this has already been covered (and I know I keep harping on about it) but can anyone make sense of the timelines? There's no way that Locke got to The Wall, made his vows, and then out to Craster's in the space of three weeks!! On the same note it's extremely doubtful that news of Tommen's coronation would cross the Narrow Sea and all the way to Meereen in the space of a week, even in the books news never travelled that fast. I'm just going to go into every episode assuming that events are not occurring parallel to each other.

celica00 · 07-05-2014 01:23PM

you are right, I think it is out of the timeline a bit.
But I'm afraid it won't work otherwise, especially if you think about people who don't know it any better (if they didnt read the books)?

Season 4 Episode 5 "First of His Name": *HAVE* read the books

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Season 4 Episode 5 "First of His Name": HAVE read the books