Pubs on xmas day

Annasopra · 26-12-2013 01:19AM

hotmail.com wrote: »

Not all value judgements relate to the law.

Yes but all laws are value judgements. I mean your argument is value judgements shouldn't be imposed through law - if you work through that argument and take it to it's logical conclusion then we shouldn't have a tax system or social welfare or educarion sysyem because they are value judgements.

P_1 · 26-12-2013 01:23AM

Aidric wrote: »

I stand corrected. Also seems there was some action in Tunisia. No doubt huge liquidity in those markets.

Massive I'd wager

Full fixtures of basketball and ice hockey too with a spot of cricket thrown in as well. Probably too niche to justify opening them up mind especially with the online bookie being open 24/7

Shout Dust · 26-12-2013 01:25AM

Aidric wrote: »

Why would they be open? No financial markets open or sporting events taking place on Christmas day that I know of.

There is, but thats not the point, someone was saying why are bar workers getting preferential treatment by being the only ones forced to close.

Do you think we should do away with paying people extra for working on Christmas day? After all, if I want to open my shop I should only have to pay normal wages, its not fair that people are imposing their values on me and I have to pay extra

Aidric · 26-12-2013 01:31AM

Shout Dust wrote: »

There is, but thats not the point, someone was saying why are bar workers getting preferential treatment by being the only ones forced to close.

Do you think we should do away with paying people extra for working on Christmas day? After all, if I want to open my shop I should only have to pay normal wages, its not fair that people are imposing their values on me and I have to pay extra

That's another matter. I have no objection to people being paid a premium to work on Christmas day. My objection was to pub owners having to close for the day.

hotmail.com · 26-12-2013 01:31AM

mango salsa wrote: »

Yes but all laws are value judgements. I mean your argument is value judgements shouldn't be imposed through law - if you work through that argument and take it to it's logical conclusion then we shouldn't have a tax system or social welfare or educarion sysyem because they are value judgements.

No that's not the case at all.

We're talking about the selling of alcohol on a particular day. I think there should be a choice. You want to force the closure of pubs. We have a difference of opinion.

The notion of people arguing against pubs opening on Xmas Day because it's Xmas on Boards.ie isn't lost to most people. What has boards.ie got to do with Xmas Day?

HalloweenJack · 26-12-2013 01:33AM

I'm here in Spain for Christmas and there are a few bars open today. This in a country that is similarly Catholic to home.

Chancer3001 · 26-12-2013 01:58AM

Ok, answer me this. Why are all petrol stations not FORCED BY LAW to close Xmas day?

Don't those hundreds of workers deserve a nice day at home with their family too.???

That argument is such nonsense.

omega666 · 26-12-2013 02:15AM

Chancer3001 wrote: »

Ok, answer me this. Why are all petrol stations not FORCED BY LAW to close Xmas day?

Don't those hundreds of workers deserve a nice day at home with their family too.???

That argument is such nonsense.

Well for a start none of the petrol stations near me were open today but even if they were petrol could be deemed a necessity. Emergencies etc. Skulling pints isn't a necessit. I've yet to hear a good reason for pubs opening.

hotmail.com · 26-12-2013 02:16AM

omega666 wrote: »

Well for a start none of the petrol stations near me were open today but even if they were petrol could be deemed a necessity. Emergencies etc. Skulling pints isn't a necessit. I've yet to hear a good reason for pubs opening.

Choice.

catallus · 26-12-2013 02:22AM

The argument against having pubs closed on christmas day is a counter-cultural one; it is just against the prevailing cultural constructs, and that makes it evil.

What kills me is that the same people who argue for pubs being open on christmas day seem to have no beef at all with the arbitrary law brought in a few years ago dictating that all off-licences have to close at ten bloody pm.

omega666 · 26-12-2013 02:24AM

hotmail.com wrote: »

Choice.

I said a good reason.

Henlars67 · 26-12-2013 02:33AM

omega666 wrote: »

I said a good reason.

Freedom of choice isn't a good reason?

catallus · 26-12-2013 02:35AM

Not when the choice being made is based on counter-cultural intolerance.

meoklmrk91 · 26-12-2013 02:47AM

I am an atheist, I don't feel like my rights are bing infringed upon because the pubs are closed on Xmas day, there is no point in comparing it to Good Friday because its apples and oranges, nobody spends Good Friday with their family, nobody really observes the day properly any more, only old folks.

The religious part of Xmas has nothing to do with it for most people, it's about spending time with those you love, eating good food, watching good TV, playing games, exchanging gifts, Santa, Christmas has very little to do with Jesus and most people who do go to Xmas mass only really do so because its tradition.

I spent Xmas in the UK one year, it didn't really feel like Xmas because everything was open. I am from the country where the local shop would open for an hour after mass and that was it. Where i am currentky living nothing opening today. I like everything being closed, it feels like everything stops for just one day before the madness begins again. I am not a massive Xmas person but I really do like this aspect and I would be sad if we became more like the UK.

I can guarantee you that the vast majority of the businesses like garages or shops opened today were not being run by the owners but by their employees and it would be the same for any pubs that aren't family run. The owners will have been at home with their families, relaxing on Xmas day like they should be be while their employees were running their business because they want to make their money.

dd972 · 26-12-2013 02:48AM

That's another one over with, someone pick up this thread next year rather than start again :P

Why don't the ''why can't you stay indoors for one day?'' brigade realise that the world doesn't revolve around their particular desideratum. ( as Will Self would put it )

MadYaker · 26-12-2013 02:51AM

If people want to get hammered on xmas day closing the pubs isn't going to stop them. They only people who go are probably people who would be spending xmas day alone anyway.

uch · 26-12-2013 03:02AM

No bother getting a few in my local on xmas Day

jimmynokia · 26-12-2013 03:39AM

for and against it,two pals from the uk text today said they where in the pub,great,been there once for xmas,great day out than the norm here,staff get well paid its big in the uk and been that way,but i also concede to the the fact there should be adequate time off for everyone at xmas.

Retail would be another prime example ,staff have to come in to work ,i remember years ago when everything was shut for a few days,yet was complaining nothing was opened,xmas is like any other festive time,commercialised,it should be a time where we all stay at home and enjoy rather than things are now,but no,greed sets in by these companies ,people should be organised and let the sales etc begin on new years day or the 2nd.

Working in the service industry myself i see both sides of the coin,personally now i think it should be time off for all,and if there is options the staff should not be forced to work or else well paid and work if by their own choice.

Christmas is for family and friends,anything else that's available is a bonus for those who require it.On a whole i think everywhere should be shut,but if anything is there for pickings ive no problem,once its fair to the staff involved.

mikemac1 · 26-12-2013 08:47AM

CB19Kevo wrote: »

Think of it this way, In order for a pub to open Christmas day they will have to.
- Restock the bar late into Christmas eve as its normally a busy night.
- Managers and staff will have to leave there family's to open up.
- Security staff will have to be on at busy / city venues.

- Extra Guards will have to be rostered for public order / traffic.
- Council street cleaners will have to work or start earlier on stephens day.
- Extra a&e staff will have to work / be on standby.
- Taxi drivers will be expected to come out and ferry people from home to pub.
- City centre / town residents will have to put up with noise level from any bar that opens.
- Takeaways will want staff to come in to make extra money.

Its not as simple as saying sure cant the barman come in for a few hours,All this so people can have the choice to drink on Christmas day :rolleyes:

I understand that some people don't like to sit at home on a winters evening and also that many are alcohol dependant and i can also understand that people want as much freedom as possible but one day off for the pubs cant be that bad.

All valid points apart from taximen who are self employed and choose to do whatever they want.

I had a look at the Hailo app on Christmas morning and there were plenty out and about in the map. Maybe some are Irish, maybe some are Muslims and Christmas is just another day.

They work on the highest fare, fare C so there is potential to make some money. Though I had a taximan moaning to me on December 23rd that Fare C is not double money and other workers get double money.

A poster over in Dublin forum was asking about booking a taxi for Christmas morning and he got lots of pm's wanting the job

It'd be different out rural where you rely on a hackney

Iggy154 · 26-12-2013 11:02AM

Henlars67 wrote: »

I don't cause any trouble.

Why shouldn't I have the option of going out for a pint tonight?

Because other people might like to vist their parent or play with their nephwe on Christmas Day and wouldn't have any option about if if the pubs had to stay open just so that you could turn up if you felt like it and drink your half pint of beer and stagger around the place looking for a fight.

Valetta · 26-12-2013 11:12AM

Were any people / families worse off yesterday because all the pubs were closed?
I doubt it.

Were any people / families better off?
I would say most definitely.

Leave well enough alone.

Henlars67 · 26-12-2013 12:34PM

jimmynokia wrote: »

for and against it,two pals from the uk text today said they where in the pub,great,been there once for xmas,great day out than the norm here,staff get well paid its big in the uk and been that way,but i also concede to the the fact there should be adequate time off for everyone at xmas.

Retail would be another prime example ,staff have to come in to work ,i remember years ago when everything was shut for a few days,yet was complaining nothing was opened,xmas is like any other festive time,commercialised,it should be a time where we all stay at home and enjoy rather than things are now,but no,greed sets in by these companies ,people should be organised and let the sales etc begin on new years day or the 2nd.

Working in the service industry myself i see both sides of the coin,personally now i think it should be time off for all,and if there is options the staff should not be forced to work or else well paid and work if by their own choice.

Christmas is for family and friends,anything else that's available is a bonus for those who require it.On a whole i think everywhere should be shut,but if anything is there for pickings ive no problem,once its fair to the staff involved.

Says who? Christmas is whatever you want it to be, and for some people that's nothing at all

Henlars67 · 26-12-2013 12:36PM

Iggy154 wrote: »

Because other people might like to vist their parent or play with their nephwe on Christmas Day and wouldn't have any option about if if the pubs had to stay open just so that you could turn up if you felt like it and drink your half pint of beer and stagger around the place looking for a fight.

If you need to throw out insults than it renders your argument completely invalid

Dublinstiofán · 26-12-2013 12:42PM

WhiteRoses wrote: »

Clearly all those wanting the pubs to be open have never worked in the service industry.

If pubs were allowed to open today, a great deal of them would do so with no consideration for their staff. I work in one and we are not allowed ask for time off in December as its too busy.

All these comments about requesting the day off due to religious reasons makes me laugh. How many court cases do we see each week about pregnant women being fired for needing maternity leave, etc? Employers would find a way around it to fire anyone who didn't want to work Christmas Day. They'd use another excuse just get rid of anyone unwilling to work. Why should someone potentially lose their job over something
like this?

Also, as for the shops being closed, it's completely different. Nobody goes for a celebratory spot of shopping on Christmas Day but I bet people would want to go for a celebratory drink.
If the pubs were open they'd be jammed and they'd require a lot of staff - no one who doesn't have to would want to work on a day like today.

December is such a rough month for pubs and clubs. We're already stretched to our limit staff wise and the abuse from drunken idiots is unbelievable. Working all the big nights like Xmas eve,
St. Stephens night and New Year's Eve isn't fun but I understand that this is what I signed up for. I have no problem working these nights or even putting up with the abuse but all that has been keeping me going is spending time
with my family today. If I thought I'd have to work today I'd go insane. I think I deserve the day off. A pub is nowhere to be on Christmas Day.

This pretty much exactly sums up how I feel about it.

Had a lovely day yesterday . . off to work now!

Fingers crossed people remember to eat before milling into about 20 pints today, unlike last year!

jimmynokia · 26-12-2013 12:49PM

Henlars67 wrote: »

Says who? Christmas is whatever you want it to be, and for some people that's nothing at all

Which is my point if your read it properly rather than pander on comments like you have done.

Maybe the people that do work xmas day are the ones that couldn't care about it.

hotmail.com · 26-12-2013 05:46PM

Valetta wrote: »

Were any people / families worse off yesterday because all the pubs were closed?
I doubt it.

Were any people / families better off?
I would say most definitely.

Leave well enough alone.

No because people got locked at home instead.

Whether it bothers people or not, forcing the closure of pubs on Xmas Day is outdated and should be changed.

It doesn't mean that all pubs will open on Xmas Day or that people will be forced to visit the pub.

It's about choice.

hotmail.com · 26-12-2013 05:50PM

meoklmrk91 wrote: »

I am an atheist, I don't feel like my rights are bing infringed upon because the pubs are closed on Xmas day, there is no point in comparing it to Good Friday because its apples and oranges, nobody spends Good Friday with their family, nobody really observes the day properly any more, only old folks.

The religious part of Xmas has nothing to do with it for most people, it's about spending time with those you love, eating good food, watching good TV, playing games, exchanging gifts, Santa, Christmas has very little to do with Jesus and most people who do go to Xmas mass only really do so because its tradition.

I spent Xmas in the UK one year, it didn't really feel like Xmas because everything was open. I am from the country where the local shop would open for an hour after mass and that was it. Where i am currentky living nothing opening today. I like everything being closed, it feels like everything stops for just one day before the madness begins again. I am not a massive Xmas person but I really do like this aspect and I would be sad if we became more like the UK.

I can guarantee you that the vast majority of the businesses like garages or shops opened today were not being run by the owners but by their employees and it would be the same for any pubs that aren't family run. The owners will have been at home with their families, relaxing on Xmas day like they should be be while their employees were running their business because they want to make their money.

If your Xmas Day is affected by what is opened and what is not, then that is pretty sad.

I don't really think about these things when I'm enjoying myself.

Your first paragraph implies that all people in Ireland celebrate Xmas Day with their families, even atheists. This is not true and many people spend Xmas abroad, on their own etc.

I don't see the legal selling of alcohol on Xmas Day as a religious thing or anti-religious thing, I just see it as giving people the choice, rather than forcing people into particular behaviour. We all know that people seem to drink more on Xmas Day and Good Friday, so it's not as if it curtails drinking.

Oh and I have no support for publicans and probably wouldn't go to a pub on Xmas Day - I just wouldn't force that view on other people.

Valetta · 26-12-2013 06:53PM

hotmail.com wrote: »

No because people got locked at home instead.

Whether it bothers people or not, forcing the closure of pubs on Xmas Day is outdated and should be changed.

It doesn't mean that all pubs will open on Xmas Day or that people will be forced to visit the pub.

It's about choice.

You completely ignored the two points I made in my post.

hotmail.com · 26-12-2013 09:02PM

Valetta wrote: »

You completely ignored the two points I made in my post.

Your point wasn't valid.

Valetta · 26-12-2013 09:28PM

hotmail.com wrote: »

Your point wasn't valid.

Of course it was valid. I offered two opinions. Neither of which you commented on.

Pubs on xmas day

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