By-Election Confirmed for March 27th

Sierra Oscar · 28-03-2013 4:51pm

Official results for first count coming through:

FG - 9,356
FF - 8,002
SF - 3,165
DDI - 1,568
Labour - 1,112

The rest have been eliminated for now.

raymon wrote: »

They talk about FF and the recovery of the party.

The recovery of the economy is FF's utmost concern, hence why I am glad to see FF candidates preform well so as we can carry that message.

goose2005 · 28-03-2013 4:52pm

Sierra Oscar wrote: »

Meh not really, our result in the election shows once and for all that there is a real FF recovery underway. This result will be good to steady the nerves heading into the local elections campaign, which is what is needed considering we are just over a year out now. Naturally it would have been absolutely fantastic if we won the seat, but all the same I will happily take a 21% increase in our first preference vote any day. Eitherway the number of representatives in our parliamentary party remains the same. If that figure held up on election day we would return a TD to every constituency, with multiple seats in certain areas. Considering the government is in for a very rocky ride ahead, especially now that Labour have imploded, then the future is bright for the opposition.

And then what? What FG-Lab policies will FF change? What's the point of winning for the sake of it?

Sierra Oscar · 28-03-2013 4:53pm

goose2005 wrote: »

And then what? What FG-Lab policies will FF change? What's the point of winning for the sake of it?

Don't worry, by the time the next GE comes around FF will have its own manifesto that you can judge for yourself. It is being worked on all the time.

EDIT: Tallon (47), O'Brien (73), Keddy (110), Martin (190), McDonagh (263) & O'Buachalla (423) eliminated. Votes currently being transferred.

Sierra Oscar · 28-03-2013 5:46pm

Fianna Fail concedes defeat in by election

FIANNA Fail has conceded defeat in the Meath East by-election with Fine Gael's Helen McEntee on course to be formally elected to the seat previously held by her late father.

Fair play to Helen, congratulations.

DJCR · 28-03-2013 5:48pm

Well that's it. Helen McEntee elected as Fianna Fáil concedes.

Wish her all the best in her new post.

tayto lover · 28-03-2013 5:50pm

Sierra Oscar wrote: »

Fianna Fail concedes defeat in by election

Fair play to Helen, congratulations.

Sympathy vote but glad FF didn't get in.
Labour the new greens it seems.

Hijpo · 28-03-2013 5:53pm

Vladimir Kurtains wrote: »

So 90 per cent of this thread was spent talking about a guy who got 6 per cent of the vote.

Much of it was answers to the same questions over and over again, oh and look, as i read down past your little dig people are still talking about DDI.

Great result for a party only going since november.

Onwards and upwards.

Mr.Micro · 28-03-2013 6:17pm

tayto lover wrote: »

Sympathy vote but glad FF didn't get in.
Labour the new greens it seems.

Too right. This from Byrne.

Fianna Fáil candidate Senator Thomas Byrne said people were sending a strong message that they were hurting, and a fresh approach was needed.

What a laugh, FF and fresh. People not that gullible despite all the economic problems.

Sully · 28-03-2013 6:59pm

Sierra Oscar wrote: »

Meh not really, our result in the election shows once and for all that there is a real FF recovery underway. This result will be good to steady the nerves heading into the local elections campaign, which is what is needed considering we are just over a year out now. Naturally it would have been absolutely fantastic if we won the seat, but all the same I will happily take a 21% increase in our first preference vote any day. Eitherway the number of representatives in our parliamentary party remains the same. If that figure held up on election day we would return a TD to every constituency, with multiple seats in certain areas. Considering the government is in for a very rocky ride ahead, especially now that Labour have imploded, then the future is bright for the opposition.

I see you dodged half of my points again. Is the FF recovery to black out the past beahviour and pretend it didn't happen? It wasn't that long ago that Byrne was playing the violin in the Dail saying goodbye to Bertie Ahern and it wasn't that long ago your party ensured the opposition would have a tough 4 or so years in government with an absolutely disgrace EU/IMF bailout agreement.

DJCR wrote: »

I would disagree. I would say there are a lot of Fianna Fáil supporters out there giving an actual alternative. Not only spured on by the increased power the individual member has been granted under the new rules and procedures but by the state of the other parties in this country, a faltering government and the joke that is the split personality Sinn Fein.

Long story short, no one knows better than Fianna Fáil members where we went wrong in the last government. It's no secret where we went wrong both internally and externally. Thing is you can do two things:- Stay down (easy thing to do) or you can get up and do what just under 400,000 people wanted us to do. Get out there and give this country something it hasn't had for the last 15 years..... A credible opposition.

Essentially, we know we went wrong, the electorate know we went wrong, people like yourselves have told all of us enough times. But people want a way out of this mess, one that was exacerbated by some of the decisions made by FF but to say it was completely caused by FF is incorrect.

We will continue to provide a decent opposition. When we agree with a move we'll vote with it, when we don't we'll propose an alternative. Like we have been doing.

I know that some in Fianna Fail want change, want to be considered credible and offer policies that are actually going to be implemented not just spin to get elected. But the whole covering their eyes and ears to the past, lambasting Fine Gael (like suggesting they had a quick election to suit McEntee) for everything they do especially when it comes to government decisions and cuts that are a result of Fianna Fail - that's where the "reform" bull**** stinks to the high heavens.

If you want true reform you don't have a party leader who was making decisions that impacted on the state and resulted in our downfall and severe beating and ignorance by Fianna Fail. The same party leader who made a balls of our health system and a candidate in Meath East who was full of praise for Bertie Ahern. You don't sit in the Dail saying "You cant do that!" and blaming Fine Gael for your mess.

Hijpo wrote: »

Much of it was answers to the same questions over and over again, oh and look, as i read down past your little dig people are still talking about DDI.

Great result for a party only going since november.

Onwards and upwards.

You got 1k first preferences in a low turn out when there is huge dissatisfaction with the government. Lets not get ahead of ourselves here, you polled well because Labour got a hammering and their supporters didn't bother coming out. There was little or no other credible choice after the three main parties - hence they got the top three. You were expected to poll better than the Independents, but nobody expected Labour to get this much of a hammering.

Silentcorner · 28-03-2013 7:05pm

Sierra Oscar wrote: »

Meh not really, our result in the election shows once and for all that there is a real FF recovery underway. This result will be good to steady the nerves heading into the local elections campaign, which is what is needed considering we are just over a year out now. Naturally it would have been absolutely fantastic if we won the seat, but all the same I will happily take a 21% increase in our first preference vote any day. Eitherway the number of representatives in our parliamentary party remains the same. If that figure held up on election day we would return a TD to every constituency, with multiple seats in certain areas. Considering the government is in for a very rocky ride ahead, especially now that Labour have imploded, then the future is bright for the opposition.

DJCR wrote: »

I would disagree. I would say there are a lot of Fianna Fáil supporters out there giving an actual alternative. Not only spured on by the increased power the individual member has been granted under the new rules and procedures but by the state of the other parties in this country, a faltering government and the joke that is the split personality Sinn Fein.

Long story short, no one knows better than Fianna Fáil members where we went wrong in the last government. It's no secret where we went wrong both internally and externally. Thing is you can do two things:- Stay down (easy thing to do) or you can get up and do what just under 400,000 people wanted us to do. Get out there and give this country something it hasn't had for the last 15 years..... A credible opposition.

Essentially, we know we went wrong, the electorate know we went wrong, people like yourselves have told all of us enough times. But people want a way out of this mess, one that was exacerbated by some of the decisions made by FF but to say it was completely caused by FF is incorrect.

We will continue to provide a decent opposition. When we agree with a move we'll vote with it, when we don't we'll propose an alternative. Like we have been doing.

Sierra Oscar wrote: »

Official results for first count coming through:

The rest have been eliminated for now.

The recovery of the economy is FF's utmost concern, hence why I am glad to see FF candidates preform well so as we can carry that message.

Jesus ye really are beginning to sound like desperate pyramid scheme salesmen...

Because when you drill down past all the b*lls**t all the focus group policies all the false promises all the spin thats really what FF boil down to....a pyramid scheme...great and lucrative for all those at the top but extremely damaging for everyone else...

Be under no illusion, this result is a disaster for FF....who polled nearly 20,000 1sr preference votes in 2007, now polled 8,000....in what is traditionally a FF stronghold, against a very unpopular government....of course that is not how it will be spinned (a marketeers term for telling bare faced lies)

FF are not an alternative
FF have no constructive roll to play in the future of this country.

Nobody with a sound moral compass can defend the actions of the most destructive political party in Europe...in recent times...

Hijpo · 28-03-2013 7:10pm

Sully wrote: »

You got 1k first preferences in a low turn out when there is huge dissatisfaction with the government. Lets not get ahead of ourselves here, you polled well because Labour got a hammering and their supporters didn't bother coming out. There was little or no other credible choice after the three main parties - hence they got the top three. You were expected to poll better than the Independents, but nobody expected Labour to get this much of a hammering.

how am i getting ahead of myself by saying we did well after being on the road since christmas? unless you win you have nothing to work towards is that it?
What an arse hole, self important opinion you have, my god the venom in your posts turns my stomach it really does.

1k+ people that probably would have voted for one of the four main parties had DDI not been in the running and they didnt, you make it sound as if our votes were grown in a field for the purpose of only voting DDI. Take your FG obsessed head out of your FG arse.

Arrogance in its truest form.

raymon · 28-03-2013 7:15pm

Hijpo wrote: »

how am i getting ahead of myself by saying we did well after being on the road since christmas? unless you win you have nothing to work towards is that it?
What an arse hole, self important opinion you have, my god the venom in your posts turns my stomach it really does.

1k+ people that probably would have voted for one of the four main parties had DDI not been in the running and they didnt, you make it sound as if our votes were grown in a field for the purpose of only voting DDI. Take your FG obsessed head out of your FG arse.

Arrogance in its truest form.

Come on , a FF campaign worker calling others arrogant, you are joking??

Lockstep · 28-03-2013 7:15pm

Hijpo wrote: »

What an arse hole, self important opinion you have, my god the venom in your posts turns my stomach it really does.

Take your FG obsessed head out of your FG arse.

Arrogance in its truest form.

Lay off the personal abuse.

DJCR · 28-03-2013 7:16pm

Silentcorner wrote: »

Be under no illusion, this result is a disaster for FF.

:D:D:D:D

Silentcorner · 28-03-2013 7:30pm

DJCR wrote: »

:D:D:D:D

Is that all you can do....is a 12,000 decrease in a parties vote anything other than a disaster...

DJCR · 28-03-2013 7:32pm

Silentcorner wrote: »

Id that all you can do....is a 12,000 decrease in a parties vote anything other than a disaster...

2011 was a disaster.

http://www.rte.ie/news/byelection2013/

Today, today is good.

Sierra Oscar · 28-03-2013 7:37pm

Sully wrote: »

I see you dodged half of my points again. Is the FF recovery to black out the past beahviour and pretend it didn't happen?

Nope, not at all. One thing that is clear though is that people are not overly interested in continually hearing about the past, but rather they want to hear about proposals for the future. So you can keep harping back to the past, but we will look to the future.

Sully wrote: »

But the whole covering their eyes and ears to the past, lambasting Fine Gael . . .

What? I have said on a number of occasions that FF royally ****ed up in government regarding economic matters. However I am focused on the future, so I dont keep harping back to it.

Don't worry Sully, chances are that you will be in the same position after the next election and you'll understand pretty quickly about the need to look to the future.

Sully wrote: »

If you want true reform you don't have a party leader who was making decisions that impacted on the state and resulted in our downfall and severe beating and ignorance by Fianna Fail.

True reform goes beyond the party leader, they come down to your policies and what you are offering as an alternative. Again, don't worry about that - FF is continually working on alternative policies and building up a manifesto for the next election. To be honest I think Micheál Martin is doing a fantastic job in fostering renewal within FF. I think the fact that we jumped from 13% to 34% in terms of first preference votes in just over two years justifies his position as party leader for now.

Silentcorner · 28-03-2013 7:37pm

DJCR wrote: »

2011 was a disaster.

http://www.rte.ie/news/byelection2013/

Today, today is good.

You may not think that when you sober up but enjoy the party for as long as you can anyway...

DJCR · 28-03-2013 7:40pm

Silentcorner wrote: »

You may not think that when you sober up but enjoy the party for as long as can anyway...

No party to be had, lots more work to do.

For the next by-election in Tipperary perhaps.

Sierra Oscar · 28-03-2013 7:40pm

Silentcorner wrote: »

You may not think that when you sober up but enjoy the party for as long as you can anyway...

No party for me here anyways, I am off out knocking on doors again in my local area. Local elections are just over a year off afterall, and they will be the biggest test for all parties!

DJCR wrote: »

For the next by-election in Tipperary perhaps.

Hopefully now that the election is over we can start focusing on Lowry and the extraordinary revelations regarding him and the Moriarty Tribunal.

antoobrien · 28-03-2013 9:29pm

Silentcorner wrote: »

Be under no illusion, this result is a disaster for FF....who polled nearly 20,000 1sr preference votes in 2007, now polled 8,000....in what is traditionally a FF stronghold

1) It was an FG seat. Before the McEntees it was John Bruton's (McEntee won his seat originally in a by-election to replace him) and before him it was Dennis Farelly's (constituency changes not withstanding). It's been an FG seat for at least 50 years. Realistically speaking, all the bad blood aside this was always a politcal mountain to climb - even leaving out the fact that children usually win their father's seat.

2) In 2007 FF polled 43.5% of the vote, in 2011 they polled 19.6, today it was 32.9. Considering the bad feelings towards FF that's a great recovery in 2 years.

3) Byrne polled 32.9 today, actually getting more votes than he did in 2007 when he was elected. If he got those kinds of figures in a GE he'd win a seat.

3ndahalfof6 · 28-03-2013 9:32pm

antoobrien wrote: »

1) It was an FG seat. Before the McEntees it was John Bruton's (McEntee won his seat originally in a by-election to replace him) and before him it was Dennis Farelly's (constituency changes not withstanding). It's been an FG seat for at least 50 years. Realistically speaking, all the bad blood aside this was always a politcal mountain to climb - even leaving out the fact that children usually win their father's seat.

2) In 2007 FF polled 43.5% of the vote, in 2011 they polled 19.6, today it was 32.9. Considering the bad feelings towards FF that's a great recovery in 2 years.

3) Byrne polled 32.9 today, actually getting more votes than he did in 2007 when he was elected. If he got those kinds of figures in a GE he'd win a seat.

But he wont, GE the people will turn out, local elections count for the people who are not busy, or try to show they still like being raped.

Silentcorner · 28-03-2013 10:27pm

antoobrien wrote: »

1) It was an FG seat. Before the McEntees it was John Bruton's (McEntee won his seat originally in a by-election to replace him) and before him it was Dennis Farelly's (constituency changes not withstanding). It's been an FG seat for at least 50 years. Realistically speaking, all the bad blood aside this was always a politcal mountain to climb - even leaving out the fact that children usually win their father's seat.

2) In 2007 FF polled 43.5% of the vote, in 2011 they polled 19.6, today it was 32.9. Considering the bad feelings towards FF that's a great recovery in 2 years.

3) Byrne polled 32.9 today, actually getting more votes than he did in 2007 when he was elected. If he got those kinds of figures in a GE he'd win a seat.

I am aware that it has been FG seat but FF have occupied more seats in this constituency than any other political party, which in my book makes it a FF stronghold, and recent polls have suggested that FF are the most popular party in the country, this election has proven that this is not the case, by a distance.

Why, because apart from the last two by elections in the last two years the government of the day ordinarily gets hammered (just like local elections)...but that did not materalise, it is also for that reason I refute the suggestion that this was a political mountain for FF. This was the oppositions seat to lose (if the results of 95% of by elections is anything to go by)...and lose they did.

Considering that FF voters had only 1 candidate to vote for, and that FF vote in 07 was 20,000....they now only stand at 8,000 votes, that in any book is a disaster...the bad feeling toward FF?...have we not been subjected the "The rise of FF" in mainstream media over the last number of months...

Please don't confuse my intolerance for FF spin as bad blood, I have seen enough of FF over the last number of years to know what kind of future this country has in store if it is allowed to return to power...

28-03-2013 10:55pm

So a sympathy vote gets elected and running her close was a man from a party who would no longer exist in any other state only this one after all the damage they done to the country.

You know what, we absolutely deserve everything we get. :mad:

After all that has happened, we havent learned a f*ckin thing. The likes of Michael Lowry (and probably his son when Michael is tired from his skullduggery) have a safe seat for life. I was upset as anyone for the untimely death of Shane McEntee but it would seem there was little or no thought process at all in the electorate coming to their decision barring sympathy.

We now have another Enda minion in the Dail.

KERSPLAT! · 28-03-2013 11:09pm

Deleted User wrote: »

So a sympathy vote gets elected and running her close was a man from a party who would no longer exist in any other state only this one after all the damage they done to the country.

You know what, we absolutely deserve everything we get. :mad:

After all that has happened, we havent learned a f*ckin thing. The likes of Michael Lowry (and probably his son when Michael is tired from his skullduggery) have a safe seat for life. I was upset as anyone for the untimely death of Shane McEntee but it would seem there was little or no thought process at all in the electorate coming to their decision barring sympathy.

We now have another Enda minion in the Dail.

Who should we vote for and why?

the groutch · 28-03-2013 11:21pm

the real winner in this election is DDI.
6.5% of first preferences, and nearly 25% of transfers from independents/greens is very good for a first ever candidate, and will put them in good stead for next year's local elections.

28-03-2013 11:25pm

Princess Petulia Pissy Pants wrote: »

Who should we vote for and why?

Its not so much that they were elected but that FG and FF ran away with these elections. Yes tbf to you, you may be onto something when you say the candidate choice was poor. Fact is there is no real leaders emerging but more cronies and i suppose tbf an electorate is always going to play it safe.

I'm just shocked though that the election was so one sided with the same two parties that always get power running away with it, one candidate which i might add was a crony of Bertie during his term.
I would have thought that there would still be an amount of cynicism amongst the people (and i dont single out Meath East but its the mentality of the nation) and that the election would have been more evenly spread percentage wise

darkhorse · 29-03-2013 12:00am

Sully wrote: »

My thoughts on this election anyway..

Yes, this government stepped into a very tough economic situation they were tasked with sorting out. Yes, they made some very harsh choices that feel like a punch to the stomach of many people. Yes, they didn't hit the top as much as they hit the middle and lower incomes. But this is a party that remains more or less the most popular party in the state, despite peoples anger with their performance (me included). There is no disputing that and this is the second by-election a government party has won since their time in office. I assume the people feel that the choices left to them would be much worse and that they are better sticking with Fine Gael and, god help us, Fianna Fail. Seeing as both have a strong reputation for running the country - one into the ground and the other pulling us out of it.

The people had plenty of time to think about who to vote for. They didn't have to vote for the government, but they did and its only a slight drop on their General Election result. Why? Well that's to be decided, and I doubt any research will be done. But the reception in Meath East was mixed - a lot of people remembered McEntee from working alongside her father (god rest his soul) and a lot of people knew the name and remembered her father as a hard worker and a well respected representative in the area. I don't think sympathy played much part, I think they just voted for a name they could trust and knew seeing as they also gave a huge vote to the Fianna Fail candidate who was well known and was in government before. The rest just picked up the remaining chunk of the vote. Helen didn't poll as strong in her own area as would be expected and did well in strong Fianna Fail ground. So that says something else about why people voted they way they did.

In regards to the low turnout - we have a history of not great turnouts whether it be referendums or elections, which is why I think a DDI approach would be a fiasco. It doesn't matter which party or candidates are running, and Meath East is no exception. Yes the weather may have discouraged people from voting but again considering the numbers of those who voted the way they did, there is nothing to suggest those who didn't vote would have skewed the results significantly either first preferences or transfers. Stopping polling at 9pm shouldn't have stopped huge numbers from voting either - it started at 8am and finished at 9pm. Most workplaces close at 5pm or 6pm. I can't see that being a factor as to why thousands didn't bother to vote. Canvassers were in Meath East around those times canvassing, right up until 9pm in cases, and the area was far from empty.

And finally, this is a huge blow to Sinn Fein. With all their anti-austerity "policies" and ranting, their "we will refund the property tax" auction style politics - people still didn't care much and gave the two austerity parties the majority of the vote. The party that screwed the country picked up 34%+ and the party that is implementing tough policies that everyone apparently hates picked up 38%+. The candidate picked up the scraps and probably a chunk of the Labour and protest voters. Even Mary Lou felt Labour supporters didn't show up, so if they did, that could well topple the Sinn Fein chances for attempting to gain a little more ground if Labour downfall stops and supporters go out and vote. To come third ahead of Fianna Fail is enough of a blow but to think that their not getting the anti-austerity support they think they would get is even more of a blow. DDI sneaking up right behind them yet their "party" isn't even known - their first election and they have done much better!

Congrats to Helen anyway. We need more young fresh and energetic blood and now we have increased the female representation. The last young TD we elected is doing a fantastic job - Fine Gael Wicklow TD Simon Harris. I have no doubt she will represent her constituency well, like her Dad did before her, and continue his hard work representing the constituency.

Great post, Sully, but I'm just a little bit puzzled. Your last paragraph reads like you are saying that TDs have a voice, and that there will no longer be a whip system in operation. Just an observation.

darkhorse · 29-03-2013 12:46am

Princess Petulia Pissy Pants wrote: »

What alternatives will any of them offer?!

There is no point in discussing alternatives at this stage, PPPP. The electorate of ME are clearly happy with FG, and thats democracy.

rpurfield · 29-03-2013 1:11am

darkhorse wrote: »

There is no point in discussing alternatives at this stage, PPPP. The electorate of ME are clearly happy with FG, and thats democracy.

That is indeed democracy darkhorse though reading comments online om various sites it seems a lot of irish peoples idea of democracy is its only right if the vote goes to their preference!!

im not entirely suprised by the result its been a FG held seat for a hell of a long time through shane mcentee and john bruton if not beyond as im too young to remember.the really mad thing is byrne will more than likely take a seat back for ff in the next GE though the likes of my father is staunch ff and hes still seeing the sun shining outta byrnes behind like events of 08 etc never happened

By-Election Confirmed for March 27th

Comments