Galway Airport - mega merge

Rob A. Bank · 04-06-2012 8:56pm #1

Very sad to see this...

Last ditch efforts to save Galway Airport by sourcing a new airline have failed and it is expected that the operation will shut down permanently next month.

It’s understood that the IDA and Enterprise Ireland will be approached over the coming weeks with a view to locating an industry at the 115 acre site.

See tmorrow's Connacht Sentinel for the full story

http://www.facebook.com/ConnachtTribune

ted2767 · 04-06-2012 10:06pm

Rob A. Bank wrote: »

Very sad to see this...

Last ditch efforts to save Galway Airport by sourcing a new airline have failed and it is expected that the operation will shut down permanently next month.

It’s understood that the IDA and Enterprise Ireland will be approached over the coming weeks with a view to locating an industry at the 115 acre site.

See tmorrow's Connacht Sentinel for the full story

http://www.facebook.com/ConnachtTribune

Did you really believe that another airline would fly in there.

Shannon, Knock and Dublin are all very accessable and have better facilaties so really there are no reasons to keep it open.

xflyer · 05-06-2012 12:08am

No way that's rubbish. Someone is playing games here. It can easily continue as an airfield. There is no industry moving in there. It's not as if Galway is short of industrial estates.

This is some sort of ploy.

galwayrush · 05-06-2012 8:32am

xflyer wrote: »

No way that's rubbish. Someone is playing games here. It can easily continue as an airfield. There is no industry moving in there. It's not as if Galway is short of industrial estates.

This is some sort of ploy.

Plenty of small private planes as well as the flying club are still using it.

dloob · 05-06-2012 10:01am

I assume the Chamber of Commerce owns the site and wants someone to buy it off them or to make money out of it some other way as a park and ride location.

Now that they are reaping the rewards of not moving to a new site with a bigger runway to protect Aer Arran from competition, they are trying to squeeze the last bit of money out of it, and continuing as an air field isn't going to make them much money.

ted2767 · 05-06-2012 10:48am

dloob wrote: »

I assume the Chamber of Commerce owns the site and wants someone to buy it off them or to make money out of it some other way as a park and ride location.

Now that they are reaping the rewards of not moving to a new site with a bigger runway to protect Aer Arran from competition, they are trying to squeeze the last bit of money out of it, and continuing as an air field isn't going to make them much money.

Protecting Aer Arran would have been illegal.

With the new motorway, quicker train times and accesability of Dublin, Knock and Shannon there is no commercial need for Galway airport.

Shakti · 05-06-2012 11:13am

Motorsport maybe?

Seaneh · 05-06-2012 11:19am

dloob wrote: »

I assume the Chamber of Commerce owns the site and wants someone to buy it off them or to make money out of it some other way as a park and ride location.

Now that they are reaping the rewards of not moving to a new site with a bigger runway to protect Aer Arran from competition, they are trying to squeeze the last bit of money out of it, and continuing as an air field isn't going to make them much money.

This. If they had have moved to Oranmore like planned and had use of a larger runway they could have attracted more airlines and bigger Passenger and cargo jets. Instead they stayed in Carnmore to suit a few vested interests and have made a balls of it.

If Galway had a proper international airport it would have been much more attractive than either Knock or Shannon for large airlines.

Idiocy finally wins.

snubbleste · 05-06-2012 11:23am

I still have my fingers crossed for a car park.

Sappa · 05-06-2012 12:07pm

No harm,
We never needed an airport and it is good to see a new venture moving in there.

05-06-2012 1:25pm

Rob A. Bank wrote: »

Very sad to see this...

http://www.facebook.com/ConnachtTribune

You should be delighted if it brings jobs, Two airports beside you. I think the vast majority would prefer the jobs...

tfitzgerald · 05-06-2012 1:27pm

Shakti wrote: »

Motorsport maybe?

I think that's a good idea

Mrs OBumble · 05-06-2012 1:28pm

xflyer wrote: »

No way that's rubbish. Someone is playing games here. It can easily continue as an airfield. There is no industry moving in there. It's not as if Galway is short of industrial estates.

This is some sort of ploy.

What s/he said.

With the Volvo coming, there's been lots of paint and "to let" signs applied all over town.

This is just a slightly large version, making use of the media to go fishing for interest.

xflyer · 05-06-2012 1:31pm

It's highly unlikely there'll be much interest from industry in building there. So the idea is quite fanciful. Although it would be rather ironic because the actual site of the old previous Oranmore airfield was transformed into a possible 'Pharma complex' by the IDA complete with a road and ponds. It's sits there empty and rather sad although it's a good spot to walk the dog. It would be really ironic for both of Galway's airfields to be turned into empty industrial estates.

There is no reason the airport cannot continue as a small General aviation airfield at very little cost.

Sponge Bob · 05-06-2012 1:55pm

A 'green' cycling park Mountain Bike and BMX course during the day and somewhere to smoke up tyres at night. For everything else there is Connemara International out in Minna!

Storm 10 · 05-06-2012 2:06pm

Would this spell the end of Galway Flying Club.:mad:

Sponge Bob · 05-06-2012 2:21pm

Dunno. Here is the latest NOTAM .

I think the GFC would need to get the controlled airspace declassified and they can then move about with no control tower in charge but I don't know the specifics.

EICM - GALWAY
+ GALWAY AIRPORT FIRE CAT 1 AND UP TO CAT 6 AVAILABLE ON REQUEST
MINIMUM NOTICE OF 48 HRS REQUIRED. REF AIP PUBLICATION NO6-12
EFFECTIVE DATE 28TH JUNE 2012
FROM: 01 JUN 2012 08:00 TO: 30 JUN 2012 16:00 A0876/12
+ GALWAY DME CRN 110.0MHZ CH37X OUT OF SERVICE
FROM: 01 JUN 2012 08:00 TO: 30 JUN 2012 16:00 A0875/12
+ GALWAY CTR HOURS OF OPS/SERVICE
MON-FRI 0800-1600
FROM: 01 JUN 2012 08:00 TO: 30 JUN 2012 16:00 A0874/12
+ GALWAY AERODROME HOURS OF OPS/SERVICE
MON-FRI 0800-1600
FROM: 01 JUN 2012 08:00 TO: 30 JUN 2012 16:00 A0873/12

xflyer · 05-06-2012 3:04pm

There is no controlled airspace around the airport outside of operating hours. The flying club already operate there at weekends without any controller. But some of them had to be trained to use the fire appliance to comply with the rules applying to a licensed airfield.

You don't need a tower or a controller to operate an airfield. Most airfields in this country and all around the world simply operate with the pilots calling out on the radio, their position and intentions. Even quite large ones with multiple runways.

There is absolutely no reason Galway airport cannot operate like that other than sheer bloodymindeness on the part of the owners.

Also look at Sligo airport, no airline traffic either but they keep going by welcoming small aircraft, they open at weekends, still keep the terminal open and have a control tower. There is no talk of them turning it into a car park or industrial estate. Galway is a bigger town than Sligo as well.

There is no good reason to permanently shut Galway airport. In the long run some form of airport will be needed. But they really need to get over the idea that an airport must have a scheduled service to justify it's existence.

Storm 10 · 05-06-2012 3:19pm

Sligo is the base for the Coastguard Rescue helicopter so they would be getting funding from the Goverment to maintain the Airport, the helicopter is 24/7 so they have to have staff available to man it.

Its amazing how Galway has fallen out of favour with the Goverment and airlines given its a City with a large number of multi-national companies here. I just cant figure out what went wrong at that airport it beggars belief that it could go so fast.

xflyer · 05-06-2012 3:41pm

The Coastguard can come and go with or without a controller. They don't need the airport to be open 24/7. I doubt the money they get from the Coastguard is keeping Sligo open. But they also have flying schools, a maintenance base, private aircraft based there, all paying rent and fees and they are very welcoming of visitors. Not big money to be sure but a steady income.

That's the model to be thinking of. There is untapped potential in Galway right now mainly because of the shortsighted concentration on making it into a mini international airport which failed spectacularly.

ARGINITE · 05-06-2012 3:46pm

Shakti wrote: »

Motorsport maybe?

+1

BeardySi · 05-06-2012 6:22pm

Storm 10 wrote: »

I just cant figure out what went wrong at that airport it beggars belief that it could go so fast.

They deliberately chose to keep it at a location which precluded any future expansion of runway or capacity, despite having had the opportunity to move to a much more suitable site. It was just too small for anything but the smaller commercial aircraft, which made it completely unfeasible as a commercial airport...

An airport with a reasonably sized runway capable of landing large jets would most likely do quite well in Galway as it'd be a short hop from a mainline trainline and the motorways, along with being on the doorstep of a city which is a large tourist draw in itself. Of course that would have an impact on both Shannon and Knock...

The west can't support three airports (the tumbleweed blowing down the runways in Shannon suggest that two aren't feasible either!), particularly now with better access to dublin airport and it's increased capacity...

05-06-2012 6:54pm

Sponge Bob wrote: »

A 'green' cycling park Mountain Bike and BMX course during the day and somewhere to smoke up tyres at night. For everything else there is Connemara International out in Minna!

Is there anything like Mondello in the West of Ireland ??

Rob A. Bank · 05-06-2012 8:28pm

Every city needs modern infrastructure, if it not to stagnate, and looking to the future Galway needs an airport.

It seems the banks had a hand in it's demise too.

More from the Sentinal:

Currently the airport is being used by the air corps, some small commercial carriers and the local flying club.

At its peak in the early 2000s, 300,000 passengers annually passed through Galway Airport with up to 200 scheduled flights per week.

Last January, Bank of Ireland controversially seized €1.1m from the Airport’s deposit account but subsequently an agreement was reached involving the return of some that money which helped to pay out statutory redundancies to about 40 employees.

http://www.galwaynews.ie/26134-last-gasp-effort-keep-galway-airport-open-fails

ben.schlomo · 05-06-2012 8:53pm

Rob A. Bank wrote: »

Every city needs modern infrastructure, if it not to stagnate, and looking to the future Galway needs an airport.

It seems the banks had a hand in it's demise too.

More from the Sentinal:

http://www.galwaynews.ie/26134-last-gasp-effort-keep-galway-airport-open-fails

It has 2, Shannon and Knock, thats more than enough.

dloob · 05-06-2012 10:35pm

ted2767 wrote: »

Protecting Aer Arran would have been illegal.

With the new motorway, quicker train times and accesability of Dublin, Knock and Shannon there is no commercial need for Galway airport.

Direct protection would have been illegal of course, but there is nothing illegal about turning down chance to move to a new site with runways that would have allowed competing jet traffic.

Does anyone know how the chamber came by the land in the first place?
It was originally a private airport built by Steiner wasn't it?

ratracer · 05-06-2012 10:36pm

ben.schlomo wrote: »

It has 2, Shannon and Knock, thats more than enough.

Galway airport was never going to succeed without lengthening the runway. Now that it is finally closed, on a commercial basis at least, the focus of the elected representatives should be on ensuring the western corridor is completed. With motorway access both Shannon and Knock are less than an hour away from either side of the city.

Shakti · 05-06-2012 11:22pm

The Wests answer to the Nürburgring, The Claddagh Ring,
or the worlds largest guitar neck.
http://maps.google.com/maps?client=safari&rls=en&q=galway+airport&oe=UTF-8&um=1&ie=UTF-8&hl=en&sa=N&tab=wl

xflyer · 06-06-2012 10:44am

dloob wrote: »

Does anyone know how the chamber came by the land in the first place?
It was originally a private airport built by Steiner wasn't it?

Yes Steiner built a runway because he was fed up Oranmore airfield being constantly waterlogged and unusable. His aircraft was damaged there on one occasion. Aer Arann moved there too and it was later sold on to another businessman who then sold it to a consortium of interests including the Chamber. Who then developed it to it to it's current state. In doing so they made it too expensive for the original Aer Arann who went off and built their own airstrip in Connemara.

The problem with was that it was never originally intended as an airport at all and it in the wrong place really. Oranmore which is still actually state owned was the best place for an airport which is the actual reason the RAF built an airfield there in the first place.

This isn't hindsight either, all this was well known at the time. This current result is almost inevitable.

scholar007 · 06-06-2012 3:34pm

ted2767 wrote: »

so really there are no reasons to keep it open.

There is! - The Air Corps use it. I wonder do they use it to refuel in their vitally important mission, which is paramount to the security of the nation, which keeps us all safe in our beds at night, which keeps the dark forces at bay, without which the country would descend into anarchy - Indeed the Government have deemed their mission to be of such strategic importance that no expense is spared so that the PC-9s are kept in constant readiness should they have to be ordered aloft at a moments notice, when when when when, Paddy in Ballydehob hitches the trailer to the car and heads in the direction of his local bog.

ToyotaMad94 · 07-06-2012 10:54am

I would only love to set up a Motorsport event this Summer here for all locals and people who would be willing to travel! The only thing I'm worried about is insurance would cost an awful lot and that Galway Airport will reject my idea.
Does anybody know of any companies who would insure events and also it would be great if somebody has an email for the owner of Galway Airport or somebody that will reply back to me. Thanks

Scruff · 07-06-2012 11:56am

xflyer wrote: »

Oranmore which is still actually state owned was the best place for an airport which is the actual reason the RAF built an airfield there in the first place.

Where in Oranmore is this located? google maps location? wouldnt mind a gander.

/Edit
Found it: http://www.ronaldv.nl/abandoned/airfields/EI/west.html
looking at google maps I recognise it now, its that unused IDA park near the motorway.

xflyer · 07-06-2012 11:04pm

Pay a visit scruff, it's interesting. Climb the hill and see the potential all around. Lots of land, near a train station. Lament the lost opportunity.

This is a town that should have an international airport alongside Cork, Dublin and Limerick.

Brad768 · 07-06-2012 11:54pm

Another for motorsport. I'd be more than happy than to help out as a marshal

Jules de Their designed Spa racetrack, but, what does he know? Ladies and Gentleman,
"The Tribe's Ring(just sounds wrong)

Sponge Bob · 07-06-2012 11:57pm

Lovely spin with the crayons there Brad.

There is no business case for a commercial airport in Galway, end of story.

We lost that argument in 1936, as I recall, the thing that existed in the past 20 years was subsidy driven not commercially driven.

xflyer · 08-06-2012 9:59am

There is no reason it can't be used as motoracing track and an airfield, not neccessarily simultaneously:eek: This is not uncommon. The Top Gear track is at an operational airfield.

The only problem is whether there is a demand for this. I think Mondello has it pretty much sewn up. But maybe a couple of times a year. Another race week only this time with different sorts of horsepower. It's not really a viable year round idea though. Maybe track days where you can bring your Polo and overturn it at 'Carnmore corner' or 'Corrib curve'.:cool:

Seaneh · 08-06-2012 1:50pm

Sponge Bob wrote: »

Lovely spin with the crayons there Brad.

There is no business case for a commercial airport in Galway, end of story.

We lost that argument in 1936, as I recall, the thing that existed in the past 20 years was subsidy driven not commercially driven.

If Galway had an airport with a full sized runway it would be extremely attractive for passengers and airlines, it's more accessable than shannon or knock, has a bigger catchment, etc, etc, etc.

The reason Carnmore wasn't profitable was because larger jets couldn't land there, which meant no major airlines were interested.

Had they moved to Oranmore when they were meant to, it woul have thrived.
Granted, knock would be screwed and Shannon would be even more of a ghost town, but over all, it would have suited the infrastructure of the country better.

Rob A. Bank · 08-06-2012 4:39pm

If that road at the western end of the runway, which runs south towards the motorway, was removed... surely an extension of the runway is possible ?

There seems to be plenty of reasonably flat land extending towards Ballybrit.

galwayrush · 08-06-2012 7:41pm

Rob A. Bank wrote: »

If that road at the western end of the runway, which runs south towards the motorway, was removed... surely an extension of the runway is possible ?

There seems to be plenty of reasonably flat land extending towards Ballybrit.

The biggest obstacle to extending the runway was AerArann . Longer runway would mean larger planes, at least small jets ,potentially leading to other airlines operating out of Galway which would have been competition for them. They wanted it all for themselves.

Sponge Bob · 08-06-2012 10:54pm

Problem with a landowner somewhere too, allegedly a relative was hired once and fired for being utterly useless so they would not sell.

Rob A. Bank · 09-06-2012 12:51am

Isn't that what compulsory purchase orders were designed for ?

Seaneh · 09-06-2012 1:14am

it's not as easy as COP'ing the land and moving the junction down the road a bit, it crosses too many different owners lands, it would be a nightmare.

They had an easy option, they turned it down and stuck with a dead end to protect a local business.

Dan_Solo · 09-06-2012 1:33am

As a taxpayer, I'm delighted.
If anybody wants an airport I don't see what business it is of mine to pay for it.

galwayrush · 09-06-2012 8:43am

Dan_Solo wrote: »

As a taxpayer, I'm delighted.
If anybody wants an airport I don't see what business it is of mine to pay for it.

Better close down Shannon, Knock, Dublin, and the biggest cost to you as a taxpayer Dublin...:rolleyes:

gordongekko · 09-06-2012 9:21am

galwayrush wrote: »

Better close down Shannon, Knock, Dublin, and the biggest cost to you as a taxpayer Dublin...:rolleyes:

Cant speak for Knock but DAA (Dublin,Cork, Shannon) made ebitda of 160 million and group profit of 30 million.

Dan_Solo · 09-06-2012 9:37am

Why close them? Sell them. If they can manage without handouts then good luck to them.
Couldn't give a monkey's really if they can't, but it's still none of taxpayer's business.

galwayrush · 09-06-2012 8:25pm

gordongekko wrote: »

Cant speak for Knock but DAA (Dublin,Cork, Shannon) made ebitda of 160 million and group profit of 30 million.

Should knock a little bit off the astronomical cost of Cork's new terminal and T2 in Dublin.

GekkePrutser · 12-06-2012 10:51am

Deleted User wrote: »

You should be delighted if it brings jobs, Two airports beside you. I think the vast majority would prefer the jobs...

It won't bring any additional jobs that couldn't come here now.

Even if they manage to sell it and it gets used as an industrial estate, it only means that another hole in the ground somewhere else in Galway gets left unfilled. Those jobs would have come anyway. It's not as if there's a shortage of building sites.

Where I currently work I'm surrounded by empty office buildings and several large holes that were meant to contain one. We have many abandoned perfectly good industrial estates.

We have just one airport. And the many light airfields in the world can attest to small airports being viable without any scheduled services. Selling it off will only remove another thing that makes Galway stand out.

magnumbud · 14-06-2012 9:35am

i was hoping it would start up again cause it had some good flights to the uk ideal for matches around september. shame

snubbleste · 19-11-2012 10:48am

snubbleste wrote: »

I still have my fingers crossed for a car park.

They stole my idea!
Minister of State Alan Kelly is to make contact with city officials to relook at proposals for a city park and ride at Galway Airport. http://www.galwaynews.ie/28862-minister-state-address-city-officials-merits-park-n-ride-galway-airport

ratracer · 19-11-2012 11:14am

Apart from having a big empty car park, I don't see any advantage of having a P&R out at the airport. There are no bus lanes any where near it, a long straight road with a ridiculously low speed limit and it is on the road of least traffic, i.e. it is between the much busier Tuam and Dublin Roads.
I believe putting in a P&R here would be a knee jerk reaction just to fill a need of getting money into a disused place and try to save face for public representatives. There is a need for a decent P&R service, but it needs to be properly located on routes with dependable bus services on dedicated bus lanes and secure car parking. If this happened I think people would avail of other incentives like tax saver bus tickets and avail of the service.

Galway Airport - mega merge

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