Galway Airport - mega merge

Dan_Solo

boboldpilot wrote: »

You are still thinking big airport. Look get it into your head! An airport can make money without airline flights or subsidy.

How often does it have to be said to you?

It only has to be said once if it has the slightest hint of logic or evidence in it.
So far your plan is: sponge off the taxpayer and hope for the best, but sure me and me mates who love a bit of flying at the weekend get what we want so who cares.
You are saying small airports can survive. Sure they can. They can also close too when nobody wants them.
I think a far more familiar meme to everybody here than the "typical Irish naysayer" is the "typical Irish backhander", where a supposedly private business has a list of mates on the local council only too eager to assemble a mound of public money and torch it so long as they get their cut and a few jollies.

Dan_Solo

boboldpilot wrote: »

Maybe the only difference is the old Irish/Galway mentality of knocking everything and being negative about anything close to a money making idea.

I really can't stop guffawing at this. It'll keep me awake tonight.
In what way is Galway Airport "close to a money making idea"? It's a turkey. Has been for years. It lived off the begging bowl during the boom years and now you expect them turn a profit in the middle of the deepest recession in living memory?:rolleyes:

ben.schlomo

boboldpilot wrote: »

It's not my business plan. I don't know what their business plan is. I'm merely suggesting a potential business plan. Somehow or other I don't think I'm a genius for suggesting the same business plan that keeps many small airports in profit all over the world.

All I know is that from my experience, there is an untapped demand for charity parachute drops and flight schools and all the rest in similar cities all over the place. Is Galway weirdly different than other similar size towns in other countries?

I doubt it.

Maybe the only difference is the old Irish/Galway mentality of knocking everything and being negative about anything close to a money making idea.

Look at Ryanair, it's money making machine. But everyone in Ireland hates them. If they were French or British no one would think twice?

Sure close the place. Turn it into a sheep farm. Shure begorrah isn't that the Galway way of things, eff everything up. Look at what happened to the Ocean race event.

What kind of town allows that to happen?

Dont take it upon yourself to lump us all in with those imbeciles who cant see Ryanair's plus points.

Sponge Bob

If it can survive as a private airport that is fine with me. I don't propose digging it up and putting sheeps on it.

It has no future as a scheduled flight airport. Bizjets and Cessnas can come and go 24/7 and any collywopter needing a splash of diesel is entirely welcome.

ted2767

Wow really can't believe that people are still debating this.
For years people were pushing for better road and rail links from Galway and justifiably so.
However now that these are in place there are no commercial grounds for an airport in Galway.
The place barely broke even in the boom years when it was easy to make money.
Get over it and move on.

Iwannahurl

ted2767 wrote: »

The place barely broke even in the boom years when it was easy to make money.

Get over it and move on.

I used to like the Aer Arann connection to Lorient, but that's just nostalgia admittedly.

http://www.galwayairport.com/about/Media_Archive/23/Galway_Airport_welcomes_Aer_Aranns_expansion_into_Continental_Europe_38

Laviski

boboldpilot wrote: »

First off the old managment is gone. New management is more pragmatic, not only that they are not even being paid. Expect changes.

spoken like a like a TD or councilman.
fact is galway airport is rated very badly amongst pilots in terms of their rediculous charges and avoid the galway zone at all costs. alot of that damage in their image needs to be repaired if they stand a chance.

Joe 90

boboldpilot wrote: »

You're still thinking big airport rather than local airport. It is possible for Carnmore to sustain itself with little or no subsidy and still be an asset to the area. The mistake the previous management made was to try and compete with bigger airports and provide scheduled and charter traffic. It could never succeed in the long run without a longer runway. Again I refer to the American and Canadian model, not the airpark thing. That's just a bit of fun. But it's very common for towns smaller than Galway to have small local airports run on a shoestring. It works for them why not here in Ireland?

Again you're thinking big airport rather than local. Already the flying club is there. Why not a flying school or one of many other small aviation companies. All over Europe and the world there are small airports which host lots of small businesses. Weston airport ran into problem with the locals when they tried to encourage business jets. No such problems in Galway is there? That business is very lucrative. You don't need very many flights for it to pay for itself.

I've no insight into the plans they might try. But if they have any sense that's the road they'll go down.

Indeed. The trouble is that in Ireland when people think airport they think airlines and lots of public service type jobs.

They don't think airstrip where the guy who talks on the radio sells the fuel and takes the landing fee. Airstrip, wher you don't need baggage handlers because you don't care about scheduled flights. You don't care about scheduled flights so it need not be licensed.

If Galway looses it's airstrip it will be come a helluva lot less attractive to outside investment.

Joe 90

Laviski wrote: »

spoken like a like a TD or councilman.
fact is galway airport is rated very badly amongst pilots in terms of their rediculous charges and avoid the galway zone at all costs. alot of that damage in their image needs to be repaired if they stand a chance.

That in fact has to be Galway's biggest problem if it is to have a future as a GA field.

boboldpilot

We'll soon see who gets the last guffaw!:p

boboldpilot

boboldpilot wrote: »

An airport can make money without airline flights or subsidy.

OK I agree with you on that but then why are we being asked to cough up €200k to them?

Let the airport cut its cloth to suit its purse.

boboldpilot

According to the papers, it's mostly for the park and ride. Which I think is a mistake.

I've been trying to make the point that the airport can pay for itself and should. If the taxpayer puts money into it then a return should be expected. 200k is peanuts in the scheme of things. The tax on the fuel they sell every year would probably exceed that. Not to mention any other business brought in.

It's a bit of a no brainer.

Dan_Solo

Joe 90 wrote: »

Indeed. The trouble is that in Ireland when people think airport they think airlines and lots of public service type jobs.

Indeed, what they should really be thinking is private airports with lots of public service style funding...

bombs away

So what is the story nowadays with regard to GA into Galway anyway. They still charging extraorbitant amounts or have they reduced their prices? They just open at the weekends or weekdays aswell? And is avgas available?

Last time I was there the place was pretty much a ghost terminal, not a soul in sight. Real pity to see it but they basically have no one to blame but themselves the way they treated the GA community

Might be interested in taking a flight there though in the near future if they've changed their outlook

yer man!

What was the most popular route from the airport when it was open? I remember getting the London Luton one before and to be fair I thought it was very handy as I live in Oranmore I was home in 5 minutes compared to nearly 3 hours with a bus and taxi (DUB), it also worked out the same price as from Dublin but that could have been the subsidy, I dunno. From the one time I've ever used the place I thought it was very handy and reasonable in my experience, I could be an isolated case though.

boboldpilot

bombs away wrote: »

So what is the story nowadays with regard to GA into Galway anyway. They still charging extraorbitant amounts or have they reduced their prices? They just open at the weekends or weekdays aswell? And is avgas available?

Last time I was there the place was pretty much a ghost terminal, not a soul in sight. Real pity to see it but they basically have no one to blame but themselves the way they treated the GA community

Might be interested in taking a flight there though in the near future if they've changed their outlook

Word is that GA will be encouraged, weekends and all. Different regime in place. Long overdue.:cool:

yer man!

How come flights were never run from this airport to the Aran islands? It's a bit frustrating to see the govt building a €5million airstrip in Clifden a few years ago for Inisbofin and not utilising current infrastructure better. Many of the locals already complain that the Inverin airstrip is a bit annoying as after a flight you stil need to travel quite a bit into Galway city. Would be interesting to see if Galway airport would work for a hub for onward travel to the islands?

There were flights to the Aran Islands 20 odd years ago as far as I can remember.

Carnmore to Innisboffin is the guts of 100km passing over mountains. It isn't an obvious route.

Edit: In a straight line it is 91km from Innisboffin to Carnmore, 66km to Knock.

Dan_Solo

yer man! wrote: »

How come flights were never run from this airport to the Aran islands?

Because, like most flights from Galway Airport and just about anything to do with the Aran Islands, the flights would have to be massively subsidised with taxpayer money and nobody really wants to do that any more?

Iwannahurl

yer man! wrote: »

How come flights were never run from this airport to the Aran islands? It's a bit frustrating to see the govt building a €5million airstrip in Clifden a few years ago for Inisbofin and not utilising current infrastructure better. Many of the locals already complain that the Inverin airstrip is a bit annoying as after a flight you stil need to travel quite a bit into Galway city. Would be interesting to see if Galway airport would work for a hub for onward travel to the islands?

Aer Arann commenced services to Inishmore in 1970, flying out from Oranmore Aerodrome.

"A more permanent base was required and this was to materialise in the form of Carnmore. Mr. Ernest Steiner, a former Luftwaffe pilot and local factory owner, decided to finance a new airstrip and hangar. Aer Arann based themselves at the new facility and commenced flights from Carnmore in March 1974. The following month, the fleet was increased to two with the delivery of another [Britten-Norman] Islander, EI-AYN. In July, both aircraft were chartered by Senator Edward Kennedy to bring [sic] him and his family to the islands.

[...]

1991 was another dramatic year for Aer Arann. Following wranglings with the company running Carnmore, Aer Arann decided to move its base to a new airfield at Minna, near Inverin, ten miles west of Galway city."

Source: http://www.galway.net/pages/aerarann/history.html

I well remember the Britten-Norman Islanders flying back and forth between Carnmore and the Aran Islands when I was a kid.

Mrs OBumble

Park and ride starts next Monday.

Official website: http://galwayparkandride.com/

My more concise writeup: http://news.galwaytransport.info/2013/05/galway-airport-park-and-ride-pilot-2013.html

snubbleste

e4 return to park outside city limits! Sure I can park at the Dyke Rd for that

connemara man

snubbleste wrote: »

e4 return to park outside city limits! Sure I can park at the Dyke Rd for that

But can someone entering Galway from the east or that area guarantee themselves a parking spot in dyke rd without getting to Galway by 9:30, I doubt it also they are saving the feul cost of travelling in further

biko

20 working days in a month = 80 euro at Dyke Rd.
Bus pass is 68 and no circling around looking for a spot.
Seems pretty good deal if you work close to Eyre Sq.

Dan_Solo

Mrs OBumble wrote: »

Park and ride starts next Monday.

Official website: http://galwayparkandride.com/

My more concise writeup: http://news.galwaytransport.info/2013/05/galway-airport-park-and-ride-pilot-2013.html

Struggling to see how this will have any impact on the airport, unless there's going to be an attempt to say the "airport" is busy even though it's just a car park?

Robbo

Dan_Solo wrote: »

Struggling to see how this will have any impact on the airport, unless there's going to be an attempt to say the "airport" is busy even though it's just a car park?

All part of the eventual plan to have it renamed Potemkin International Airport complete with cardboard planes and inflatable passengers.

Joe 90

Robbo wrote: »

All part of the eventual plan to have it renamed Potemkin International Airport complete with cardboard planes and inflatable passengers.

Dan_Solo

"This is your captain speaking, we are shortly to take off from Galway airport..."

Mrs OBumble

Dan_Solo wrote: »

Struggling to see how this will have any impact on the airport, unless there's going to be an attempt to say the "airport" is busy even though it's just a car park?

Presumably the ultimate plan is that the bus-operator who has the contract to run the service will pay a rights-fee to the airport for the use of the bus-stop space.

For now it's just a pilot, to see what's viable.

Mr_A

Mrs OBumble wrote: »

For now it's just a pilot, to see what's viable.

Ha. I see what you did there. :P

They'll certainly be hoping this service takes off.