An odd example of lapsed Catholicism and Good Friday

Galvasean · 18-04-2011 9:43pm #1

So as some of you may know, I am one of those people who makes it my business to have a drink or two on Good Friday (damned if I'm sacrificing an enjoyable past time because of an unusual law created for a religion hardly anyone practices properly anymore). A like minded friend of mine has organized a drinking and (weather permitting) barbecue session up at his house, which he is affectionately calling the "F#ck the Catholic Church Party" (if it is a success we will form a political party of the same name).
Anyhoo, he invited a bunch of mates. Most of us are going (one is coming down immediately after singing at the 5 o' clock mass :pac:). However, one friend has taken exception to the event, stating that the very notion is 'offensive to his religion'. Before this none of us had the slightest idea that he was a Catholic, let alone in anyway serious about it. I mean, here is a guy who beds a different woman every week (using contraception one would assume) and hasn't been to mass since his confirmation (mid 20s now, so over a decade), but here he is inexplicably taking the moral high ground....
Suddenly we (the party goers) are the bad guys, and he's pretty ticked off about the whole thing.
I'm absolutely perplexed how someone who can lead a lifestyle so un-Catholic is taking offense to a few beers and a BBBQ* on a Friday.
The mind, she boggles!

*The extra B is for BYOBB.

delta_bravo · 18-04-2011 9:50pm

Would you not be better posting this in the Christianity forum?

mossyc123 · 18-04-2011 9:52pm

Hmmm... party title needs more work.

Should really be called "F*ck the Vintners" or even "F*ck Irish Legislation"

The Church doesn't decide when pubs should and shouldn't be open.

melekalikimaka · 18-04-2011 9:52pm

we'll you are kinda making a mockery of his beliefs, not that i'm religious but can you honestly not see what you did?

liamw · 18-04-2011 9:53pm

It always just comes back to identity. Unfortunately, most people see the religion they were indoctrinated into as some sort of persistant label, like their place of birth. Irrational I know, but thats people for you.

liamw · 18-04-2011 9:54pm

melekalikimaka wrote: »

we'll you are kinda making a mockery of his beliefs, not that i'm religious but can you honestly not see what you did?

It has been pointed out that his beliefs do not align to that of Catholicism.

melekalikimaka · 18-04-2011 9:57pm

liamw wrote: »

It has been pointed out that his beliefs do not align to that of Catholicism.

he took offence, he follows catholicism in the context of good friday. if he is offended by the mocking of the event, he believes in it, its not that hard to grasp or is it???

liamw · 18-04-2011 10:01pm

melekalikimaka wrote: »

he took offence, he follows catholicism in the context of good friday. if he is offended by the mocking of the event, he believes in it, its not that hard to grasp or is it???

'in the context of good friday'.. I'll let Galvasean answer but I bet his friend wouldn't have a problem drinking on Good Friday.

My point was that the offense is at base irrational. He identifies with the Catholic religion, even though he doesn't practice it or really believe in any of it's teachings.

So I don't think it's because of his beliefs, no.

EDIT: Maybe I was wrong.. he's against drinking on Good Friday but sleeps around?!

Galvasean · 18-04-2011 10:02pm

melekalikimaka wrote: »

he took offence, he follows catholicism in the context of good friday. if he is offended by the mocking of the event, he believes in it, its not that hard to grasp or is it???

What perplexes me is the blatant hypocrisy in not adhering to any of the main beliefs of Catholicism, but getting stroppy about one of the minor rules such as eating meat / drinking alcohol on Good Friday.
It would be like the police arresting people for loitering but ignoring murderers / rapists etc.

5uspect · 18-04-2011 10:02pm

So do you have a spare place at this party then or what?

delta_bravo · 18-04-2011 10:05pm

Galvasean wrote: »

What perplexes me is the blatant hypocrisy in not adhering to any of the main beliefs of Catholicism, but getting stroppy about one of the minor rules such as eating meat / drinking alcohol on Good Friday.
It would be like the police arresting people for loitering but ignoring murderers / rapists etc.

Would you not be better asking him this then yourself rather that posting it up on the atheism section of a website?

It seems to me that you have published the story just to get a bit of a giggle from members at the expense of your friend and a pat on the back for having your party on Good Friday.

jhegarty · 18-04-2011 10:07pm

Galvasean wrote: »

"F#ck the Catholic Church Party"

^ I think I can guess why he is offended.

Galvasean · 18-04-2011 10:09pm

delta_bravo wrote: »

Would you not be better asking him this then yourself rather that posting it up on the atheism section of a website?

Tried to. He wont entertain the matter.

delta_bravo wrote:

It seems to me that you have published the story just to get a bit of a giggle from members and a pat on the back for having your party on Good Friday.

Yes, that's exactly it. I want all the people on the internet to think I'm cool. :rolleyes:
While I admit my OP is more akin to an R&R style ramble (religion is a banned topic in R&R before anyone asks), it is really a general musing looking for input - that and I'm a tad bored right now.

mossyc123 · 18-04-2011 10:11pm

I presume like determined and committed atheists none of the party-goers will be taking the Friday off from work?!

Even if the boss says "free day off lads" everyone will insist on staying at there desks and not leaving till the dot of 5, offended even by the thought of taking anytime off work for this recognition of illogical and superstitious religious practice?!

Thought not.

The hypocrisy of "a la carte Catholics" doesn't come close to ye lads on Good Friday :pac:

krudler · 18-04-2011 10:17pm

mossyc123 wrote: »

I presume like determined and committed atheists none of the party-goers will be taking the Friday off from work?!

Even if the boss says "free day off lads" everyone will insist on staying at there desks and not leaving till the dot of 5, offended even by the thought of taking anytime off work for this recognition of illogical and superstitious religious practice?!

Thought not.

The hypocrisy of "a la carte Catholics" doesn't come close to ye lads on Good Friday :pac:

That makes no sense, I wouldnt care if my boss told me it was worship the flying unicorn day, a day off is a day off.

Standman · 18-04-2011 10:18pm

melekalikimaka wrote: »

he took offence, he follows catholicism in the context of good friday. if he is offended by the mocking of the event, he believes in it, its not that hard to grasp or is it???

So non-Catholics are forced to obey a nonsensical rule based on a religion that he doesnt even bother following and he's the one who's offended? Fúcks sake if he's a good mate he should take it in his stride. It'd be like getting all offended because your mates are having a "fúck Fianna Fail party". The lad's a hypocrite imo

Galvasean · 18-04-2011 10:20pm

mossyc123 wrote: »

I presume like determined and committed atheists none of the party-goers will be taking the Friday off from work?!

I am working on Friday (not getting paid any extra FWIW). I plan to do what I do most Fridays - go two work, finish work, meet friends, have some drink, be merry.

mossyc123 wrote: »

Even if the boss says "free day off lads" everyone will insist on staying at there desks and not leaving till the dot of 5, offended even by the thought of taking anytime off work for this recognition of illogical and superstitious religious practice?!

If the boss offered me a free (fully paid) day off work, but on the condition that I refused to eat meat, drink alcohol on the day or go to the party I'd probably have to decline his interesting offer. I hear it's going to be a lovely evening, perfect for a tasty barbecue and a nice cold beer.

krudler · 18-04-2011 10:20pm

its amazing how many Catholics slag off mass, berate the church, break nearly all the rules of being a Catholic on a regular basis and wouldnt dream of going to mass on one of the non "big days" yet someone pokes fun at easter and they lose their collective sh1t.

Galvasean · 18-04-2011 10:22pm

Standman wrote: »

It'd be like getting all offended because your mates are having a "fúck Fianna Fail party". The lad's a hypocrite imo

Ad to that if he was a Fianna Fail voter who disagreed with every on of Fianna Fail's major policies.

krudler · 18-04-2011 10:25pm

Galvasean wrote: »

Ad to that if he was a Fianna Fail voter who disagreed with every on of Fianna Fail's major policies.

or a vegetarian who eats fish.

or a lesbian who loves a bit of cock.

ah you get where I'm going with this.

Dades · 18-04-2011 10:27pm

mossyc123 wrote: »

I presume like determined and committed atheists none of the party-goers will be taking the Friday off from work?!

Even if the boss says "free day off lads" everyone will insist on staying at there desks and not leaving till the dot of 5, offended even by the thought of taking anytime off work for this recognition of illogical and superstitious religious practice?!

Thought not.

The hypocrisy of "a la carte Catholics" doesn't come close to ye lads on Good Friday :pac:

Do you actually think that amounts to hypocrisy? Like, really?

krudler · 18-04-2011 10:29pm

Dades wrote: »

Do you actually think that amounts to hypocrisy? Like, really?

"sure atheists celebrate christmas!"

fffuuuuuuuu

Galvasean · 18-04-2011 10:31pm

Dades wrote: »

Do you actually think that amounts to hypocrisy? Like, really?

Railing against not being allowed do something you like while being happy to accept something you do like = hypocrisy apparently.

dabestman1 · 18-04-2011 10:35pm

jesus christ, its one day ffs

mossyc123 · 18-04-2011 10:36pm

Galvasean wrote: »

I am working on Friday (not getting paid any extra FWIW). I plan to do what I do most Fridays - go two work, finish work, meet friends, have some drink, be merry.

If the boss offered me a free (fully paid) day off work, but on the condition that I refused to eat meat, drink alcohol on the day or go to the party I'd probably have to decline his interesting offer. I hear it's going to be a lovely evening, perfect for a tasty barbecue and a nice cold beer.

I suppose you can't speak for everyone at the party but I'd wager a good portion of them will probably get to enjoy a paid day off that doesn't come out of holiday entitlements.

And then attend the party to bitch and moan about "a la carte Catholics" and the pubs not being open and being oppressed in general.

Or else they could just have the craic.

CiaranMT · 18-04-2011 10:38pm

Galvasean wrote: »

Ad to that if he was a Fianna Fail voter who disagreed with every on of Fianna Fail's major policies.

The lad clearly needs to wake up a bit and realise these disparities in his own head.

But, as you said, he's not open for discussion. I know the type...

mossyc123 · 18-04-2011 10:39pm

krudler wrote: »

"sure atheists celebrate christmas!"

fffuuuuuuuu

Easter is purely a Christian festival.

Christmas is different, taking over from traditional mid-winter festivals, etc, etc.

fffuuuuu right back at ya mate

Mr.Crinklewood · 18-04-2011 10:40pm

Perhaps he doesn't like you, or one of the women he was with is a close relation of yours and he wants to avoid embarrassment.

Zillah · 18-04-2011 10:42pm

mossyc123 wrote: »

Easter is purely a Christian festival.

Yeah, that whole pancake day, chocolate egg hunting, and magical bunny stuff are straight from the catechism.

You're turning into a really annoying poster fyi.

Galvasean · 18-04-2011 10:43pm

dabestman1 wrote: »

jesus christ, its one day ffs

One day too many :P

mossyc123 wrote: »

I suppose you can't speak for everyone at the party but I'd wager a good portion of them will probably get to enjoy a paid day off that doesn't come out of holiday entitlements.

You're right I can't speak for anyone else. All I can offer is my own take on it.

mossyc123 wrote: »

And then attend the party to bitch and moan about "a la carte Catholics" and the pubs not being open and being oppressed in general.

To be honest, despite the party's nickname I can't imagine there will be much talk of religion or lack thereof. It's not really a good party topic.
Besides bitching and moaning about ala carte catholics would be detrimental to the fun when half the revilers are just that.

mossyc123 wrote: »

Or else they could just have the craic.

Agreed

mossyc123 · 18-04-2011 10:43pm

Dades wrote: »

Do you actually think that amounts to hypocrisy? Like, really?

Quite a lot of people on here espouse a view of completely wiping Christian influence from Irish life.

If you do this then you should follow through, practice what you preach, etc and refuse to take anytime off for Good Friday.

If you really are committed to it and not just an "a la carte Atheist" :pac:

Galvasean · 18-04-2011 10:44pm

Mr.Crinklewood wrote: »

Perhaps he doesn't like you, or one of the women he was with is a close relation of yours and he wants to avoid embarrassment.

O..............................kay?

Galvasean · 18-04-2011 10:46pm

mossyc123 wrote: »

Quite a lot of people on here espouse a view of completely wiping Christian influence from Irish life.

If you do this then you should follow through, practice what you preach, etc and refuse to take anytime off for Good Friday.

So, since I'm working on Friday am I off your hook?

mossyc123 wrote: »

If you really are committed to it and not just an "a la carte Atheist" :pac:

Ah yes, the fabled a la carte atheist, they only believe in some Gods some of the time.

SparKing · 18-04-2011 10:47pm

Who has Friday off?
It's a religious holiday not a public one.

Zillah · 18-04-2011 10:49pm

Galvasean wrote: »

*The extra B is for BYOBB.

What's that extra B for?

Undergod · 18-04-2011 10:50pm

I'm probably not working Good Friday because my job follows the school calendar, and we're closed for a few weeks around Easter.

...

I'll be back with more fascinating tales from the life of Undergod.

Wolfe Tone · 18-04-2011 10:51pm

Sounds like he doesnt wanna go to your party!

Improbable · 18-04-2011 10:51pm

mossyc123 wrote: »

Easter is purely a Christian festival.

Christmas is different, taking over from traditional mid-winter festivals, etc, etc.

fffuuuuu right back at ya mate

http://www.religioustolerance.org/easter1.htm

Kxiii · 18-04-2011 10:53pm

Zillah wrote: »

What's that extra B for?

Blasphemous?

Galvasean · 18-04-2011 10:53pm

Zillah wrote: »

What's that extra B for?

That's a typo

mossyc123 · 18-04-2011 10:53pm

Galvasean wrote: »

So, since I'm working on Friday am I off your hook?

Can you accept the premise of my point.

It is hypocritical to espouse these views while enjoying the benefits of the day off?

Ah yes, the fabled a la carte atheist, they only believe in some Gods some of the time.

Knew i'd be caught on that, Should have typed "anti-theist"

CiaranMT · 18-04-2011 10:57pm

mossyc123 wrote: »

Easter is purely a Christian festival.

Christmas is different, taking over from traditional mid-winter festivals, etc, etc.

fffuuuuu right back at ya mate

Wrong. The Christian Easter has also borrowed from earlier Pagan rituals, which were dedicated to fertility.

mossyc123 · 18-04-2011 10:58pm

Improbable wrote: »

http://www.religioustolerance.org/easter1.htm

Fair 'nuff.

Thought Mid-Winter and Summer Solstice were the only widespread pre-Christian festivals.

Your learn somethin' new everyday.

robindch · 18-04-2011 10:59pm

mossyc123 wrote: »

Your learn somethin' new everyday.

"The Forum That's Here to help"(tm)

Galvasean · 18-04-2011 11:01pm

mossyc123 wrote: »

Can you accept the premise of my point.

It is hypocritical to espouse these views while enjoying the benefits of the day off?

While I do understand your point (I read threads about it here every Christmas) I do not accept that it is a particularly good point.
If one was given a mandatory day off work (ie: the office is closed) there is not much one can do about that. Should an atheist feel guilty or hypocritical if they used said forced day off to do something fun just because the day off has origins of a religious nature? I don't believe so.
However, since I don't get the day off on Good Friday it's a bit beside the point of the topic anyhow.

Zillah · 18-04-2011 11:03pm

Galvasean wrote: »

That's a typo

I can't believe they left you hanging for three pages.

Galvasean · 18-04-2011 11:06pm

Zillah wrote: »

I can't believe they left you hanging for three pages.

There is no party. This was all an elaborate scheme to make Simpsons references.

mossyc123 · 18-04-2011 11:16pm

Galvasean wrote: »

While I do understand your point (I read threads about it here every Christmas) I do not accept that it is a particularly good point.
If one was given a mandatory day off work (ie: the office is closed) there is not much one can do about that. Should an atheist feel guilty or hypocritical if they used said forced day off to do something fun just because the day off has origins of a religious nature? I don't believe so.
However, since I don't get the day off on Good Friday it's a bit beside the point of the topic anyhow.

Well it seems strange to me to have a party entitled "F*** the Church" on a day when many would have got the day off precisely because of its religious origins.

The restrictions regarding Good Friday and the sale of alcohol are in the hands of legislators and the Vintners rather then some Bishop in the Vatican sitting on a Gold throne dictating when and where people can buy drink.

If your worried about personal freedom and the right to buy booze on Good Friday call it "F*** the Vintners"

Pygmalion · 18-04-2011 11:17pm

mossyc123 wrote: »

Can you accept the premise of my point.

It is hypocritical to espouse these views while enjoying the benefits of the day off?

A day off is a day off.
People here don't enjoy it because of its religious connections, they just take any excuse to have a free holiday (and not everywhere gives it).

If we had our way I'm sure we wouldn't eliminate it (I wouldn't anyway), because it's an excuse to not work.

If, hypothetically, we moved it to the week beforehand, which AFAIK has no major religious connections, would you have a problem with us enjoying it then, or are we allowed to enjoy days off if they don't happen to fall on religious events?

PyeContinental · 18-04-2011 11:33pm

Your story is a good example of cognitive dissonance - the unwillingness to recognise a hypocrisy in one's beliefs. I would see the scale of this unwillingness as an indicator of someone's intelligence, or maturity and self-awareness.

Some people grow up and develop emotionally by resolving these inner conflicts logically and honestly. Others, like your friend are the type who metaphorically stick their fingers in their ears and go "la la la la la, I can't hear you" all throughout their lives.

I'm not sure if people like this can change, but hopefully it's possible for them to experience a "Road to Damascus" event that will change their mental outlook. (I'm going to say I deliberately chose a biblical term for the irony

)

dvpower · 18-04-2011 11:35pm

mossyc123 wrote: »

It is hypocritical to espouse these views while enjoying the benefits of the day off?

Should atheists try to not enjoy the day off?
Sounds like a catholic idea.

An odd example of lapsed Catholicism and Good Friday

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