Off topic discussion about God/Islam/Questions...

dead one · 14-03-2011 07:01AM

Look friends i have all answer to all of your question because once same what you are know. I m only refusing that it will be more insulting for you if i talk more and more about women. So don't blame me for that.

Zillah wrote: »

Step 1: Identify most powerful figure.
Step 2: Mindlessly obey.

Alright as you wish, i am presenting you the truth if you wish to talk about women. Remember about commitment. Don't blame me than.

Dr. Loon wrote: »

I don't know what you're trying to say here, but I feel it's slightly insulting. Don't tell me I'm being dishonest. I've provided a quote to indicate how the Quran sees women. Specifically, in the recommendation of beating them. You tell me how this indicates either a) a peaceful religion or b) one which respects women.It doesn't. End of story. All of your other waffle doesn't even refer to the beating, and you're refusing to answer Zillah on the beating thing also. The truth is in front of our eyes. The Quran recommends beating women for certain things.

I have answer my friend, But the more i talk about women the more it is will be insulting for you. So if you wish to continue than here is detail. You said about peace, Peace is not a kid's game, some time you have to fights war to bring peace, if there are looter, robber in the society.

So here is exact translation.

Men (those who are able to carry out their responsibilities) are the protectors and maintainers of women inasmuch as God has endowed some of people (in some respects) with greater capacity than others, and inasmuch as they (the men) spend of their wealth (for the family's maintenance). Good, righteous women are the devoted ones (to God) and observant (of their husbands' rights), who guard the secrets (family honor and property, their chastity, and their husband's rights, especially where there is none to see them, and in the absence of men,) as God guards and keeps undisclosed (what should be guarded and private). As for those women from whose determined disobedience and breach of their marital obligations you have reason to fear, admonish them (to do what is right); then, (if that proves to be of no avail), remain apart from them in beds; then (if that too proves to be of no avail), beat them lightly (without beating them in their faces). Then, if they obey you (in your directing them to observe God's rights and their marital obligations), do not seek ways against them (to harm them). (Be ever mindful that) God is indeed All-Exalted, All-Great.

12. This verse is highly significant for male–female relationships and family law. It draws attention to the following cardinal points:

God has not created all people exactly the same in all respects, but rather has given each person a form of preferences in some respect to others; this is a requirement of social life and is the origin of the division of labor and the need for variety of occupation. Although it is not true to the same degree with all men and women, He has created men, in some respects, superior to women, while He has also given women superiority over men in other respects.
As a general rule, God has given men greater physical strength than women and endowed them with a greater capacity for management, as the fact that even in the modern world, administrators are usually men proves. He has also charged men with the financial responsibility of the family. Again, this is not true to the same degree for all men and women; there will, of course, be some women who are better managers than some men. This is why He has made men the head of the family. However, this does not mean that men have absolute authority in the family; rather, this authority must be exercised according to the Prophetic principle: The master of a people is he who serves them . But responsibility is proportionate to authority, and authority is proportionate to responsibility.
Men are generally responsible for the well-being and prosperity of the family members. So while the verse directs men as to how they should treat rebellious women who are of bad conduct, it guides them to a gradual means of education: admonish them (to do what is right); then, (if that proves to be of no avail), remain apart from them in beds; then (if that too proves to be of no avail), beat them lightly (without slapping them in their faces). All of the Qur'ānic commentators of the early period, whose opinions Ibn Jarīr at- T abarī mentioned in his Tafsī r interpreted the verb d arb in the verse to mean beating or striking lightly.

It should be noted that these measures are aimed at education and saving the marriage from collapse in case of a wife's rebelliousness. It is not a matter of women being beaten only because they are women, but rather this punishment is only applicable to a truly rebellious person who is of evil conduct, a person who displays obstinacy, not only not doing her duty in the home but also one who does not care about good moral conduct; in short, such a woman is not only wronging her family, she is also wronging herself.
God's Messenger, upon him be peace and blessings, interpreted the verse to mean that the beating should be light and only employed as a last resort in extreme cases such as lewdness committed by the wife; he warned men to refrain from beating as much as possible, and slapping in the faces (at-Tirmidhī, “Kitāb at-Tafsīr, Tawbah,” 1 [3087]; Abū Dāwūd, “Nikāh,” 42). The last part of the verse is also of the same import. Furthermore, the Messenger condemned any unjustifiable beating. He exhorted men to be good to their families, saying: “The best of you is he who is best to his family, and I am the best among you to my family” (Ibn Mājah, “Nikā h ” 50). He advised a Muslim woman, Fātimah bint Qays, not to marry a man known for beating women (Muslim, “Talaq,” 36).
On the other hand, Islam never leaves women unprotected in the face of men's harsh treatment and negligence of their family duties. First, it advises reconciliation: If a woman fears from her husband ill-treatment or (such breach of marital obligations as) his turning away in aversion, then there will be no blame on them to set things right peacefully between them; peaceful settlement is better…. (O husbands) if you do good in consciousness of God and act in reverence for Him and piety (in observing the rights of women), then surely God is fully aware of what you do (4: 128). However, it does not advise women to resort to the two measures of leaving their husbands in bed and beating. This must be because it seeks to protect the wife from a violent physical reaction by her already misbehaving husband. But it recognizes the woman's right to resort to the court and even demand divorce. Muslim scholars suggest that the court can apply the same three measures in question against the husband on the wife's behalf.
No system or religion has a right to ask Islam to apologize for any of its commandments, including this one concerning women. On the contrary, every other system is humiliated before Islam. All surveys conducted show that women have been subjected to abuse in almost all other “religions” and systems, and this still continues in the modern, “civilized” world. In contrast, the periods when Islam was being practiced consciously were a golden age for women. To cite a single example, what foreign travelers and observers wrote during the first quarter of the 18 th century – a time when all the Muslim world, including the Ottoman State, was in decline—is enough to clarify this point:

No one locks their house in the city where about one million people live because no theft has ever been reported. You do not see a vagabond, nor a beggar, nor one who shouts loudly in the streets. Women receive the greatest respect at home and enjoy certain authority. There is nothing more abominable to stare at a woman walking in the street, and especially raising a hand to beat them. It is impossible to describe the beauty of the Turkish women (Djevad, 35-36 [Quoted from Mr. Porter, British Ambassador to Turkey]).

http://www.theholybook.org/component/option,com_frontpage/Itemid,1/

Dr. Loon · 14-03-2011 07:40AM

Thanks for clarifying. Your religion recommends beating women, no matter how "lightly", therefore, game over. I would never be a part of it and I don't see how anyone could. I'm finished arguing now, because I've won.

dead one · 14-03-2011 08:32AM

Dr. Loon wrote: »

Thanks for clarifying. Your religion recommends beating women, no matter how "lightly", therefore, game over. I would never be a part of it and I don't see how anyone could. I'm finished arguing now, because I've won.

Where i said you should become part of it, It is your choice. If any member of family want to destroy the family system whether male or female, He should be guided or punished. You are just putting theories i m talking about facts. That's why west had no perfect family system. Even some of my friends (who are living in west) don't know who is their actual father. A majority of women share beds with many men. That's why many people in west don't care for their parents and leave them on their miserable death. Is this Justice?. To create justice in society you have made some laws. The family is the first institution in human life, in the sense that its effect is felt in every stage of human life, it is within the family the man, is brought up. The running and administration of much inferior institution, such as those engage in financial, industrial and commercial affairs, is normally assigned to those who are most qualified to the family, the institution which looks after the upbringing the the man.

I am hoping you will soon see the reality?

In the western society, today, children do not receive the tender loving care from their parents, and as a result the family system is ruined. The husband and wife both work outside their home at different places. A free and uninhibited atmosphere prevails at both work places. So, at times the views and interests of the couple begin to diverge and the marriage undergoes a strain. Illegitimate extra marital liaisons begin to develop and the marriage breaks down. Divorce drives the final nail into the coffin. The home is destroyed!

14-03-2011 08:45AM

dead one wrote: »

Where i said you should become part of it, It is your choice. If any member of family want to destroy the family system whether male or female, He should be guided or punished. You are just putting theories i m talking about facts. That's why west had no perfect family system. Even some of my friends (who are living in west) don't know who is their actual father. A majority of women share beds with many men. That's why many people in west don't care for their parents and leave them on their miserable death. Is this Justice?. To create justice in society you have made some laws. The family is the first institution in human life, in the sense that its effect is felt in every stage of human life, it is within the family the man, is brought up. The running and administration of much inferior institution, such as those engage in financial, industrial and commercial affairs, is normally assigned to those who are most qualified to the family, the institution which looks after the upbringing the the man.

I am hoping you will soon see the reality?

Yadda yadda, at least we don't advocate beating women

dead one · 14-03-2011 09:23AM

bluewolf wrote: »

Yadda yadda,

Blah Blah Blah!

at least we don't advocate beating women

You advocate a lot things which are worst than beating. :rolleyes:.

robindch · 14-03-2011 09:43AM

dead one wrote: »

Even some of my friends (who are living in west) don't know who is their actual father.

Lying makes baby Mohammad cry.

dead one wrote: »

That, my friend, is a picture of children who are future mothers,sisters, daughters and wives of Muslims, They are not future strip dancer, they are not future pimps, They aren't Hooker,they are not desires of hungry mob, they are not who write abusive language but language of love and peace.

And they are all future potential victims of violence. For their "own good" of course, as you happen decide it.

But I'm interested that you are obsess so much about the sexual habits of "western women". Have you ever met one?

I have. In fact, I have a mum, and two sisters, a missus, a daughter, a sister-in-law, cousins and friends. And while most of them are working, or have worked, in high-paying, responsible jobs in biological research, retail sales, medicine, the airline industry, schools and so on, not a single one has worked as a strip dancer, a prostitute or a "future pimp" (what exactly is a "future daughter", btw?). Though I should say that in their capacities as excellent cooks, I can confirm that my mum and the older of my two younger sisters certainly have catered to the "desires of hungry mob". Yum, yum, yummy!

Ultimately, I think you're frightened by the strength of your own sexual desires which are you unable to control. In this part of the world, most people learn how to deal with these desires and the slowly become responsible adults. Whereas, in your case, you never do, choosing instead to blame women for provoking you -- I'm assuming you're heterosexual, btw -- and that's why you enforce a code that requires women to dress in shapeless sacks, rather than, say, you wear a sack on your head that stops you seeing women. And this ability of women to provoke, well, it insults your ridiculous belief that you are stronger and better than them. Hence your need to control them and threaten them with violence when it suits you.

You're simply terribly frightened of women and their power over you.

14-03-2011 09:45AM

dead one wrote: »

Blah Blah Blah!
You advocate a lot things which are worst than beating. :rolleyes:.

Yeah like what?

The Mad Hatter · 14-03-2011 09:47AM

dead one wrote: »

You advocate a lot things which are worst than beating. :rolleyes:.

Like independence and freedom. How horrible of us.

GO_Bear · 14-03-2011 10:15AM

dead one wrote: »

Doctor Loon, The Mad Hatter, Go Bear

My friends Google isn't solution sometimes google will take you away from destination in desert of Search. So always be honest with yourself in searching the truth. Keep my words in your minds so that it will benefit you in any Search.

For Mr Loon. You don't understand because Google can provide you result but not truth. As i can clearly see how you choose the way of dishonesty and also you aren't even smarter as you are pretending. I have read many atheist and agnostic. So you need not to become smart before me.

At least with Google you can often find the source material if you look hard enough.

I am not interested in your flavor of truth anymore. You claim we find results without truth ?

The "truth" that you come on here and so openly express is impotent and barbarous. You are proud of your stance on women and that tells me its not going to change

I rather living in a world of uncertainty with relative truths and mini skirts than in a world of false absolute truths

dead one · 14-03-2011 10:16AM

bluewolf wrote: »

Yeah like what?

Yeah like Illegitimate extra marital liaisons, also see my old posts i can't repeat them. I am too dead to repeat them again.

The Mad Hatter wrote: »

Like independence and freedom. How horrible of us.

Do you really think it's freedom?. In my view it's slavery.

The society that condemns the exhibition of male physical curves and labels them as "perversion" provides "artificial aides" to under developed areas of the female. Everyone has heard the term, 'unwed mother' but you hardly ever hear about the 'unwed father'. The fashion world, usually controlled by males aims to create instability in the female mind. She is taught that "wearing the least" is something that builds "status".

She is taught to hate her own body. The form of her eye-lashes and brows, the style of her walking and speech, the color of her lips, nails and cheek are all given an artificial look. She also hates the natural trend of her hair. In such a society, "hair fashion designers" make big money. Where men balance themselves on a three inch base heel of the shoes, the woman is expected to balance herself on a half a centimeter heel. This creates a medical abnormality called Lordosis in medicine. Males make big money, displaying female nakedness in their respectable trades like cabarets, strip bars, fashion shows, commercial advertising (Do I want the Mustang or the sexy blonde in the advertisement?), nude paintings and magazines and now internet web pages.

The modern urban culture does not only show the above but it also shows: Alarming statistics with manifold percentage increase every year of single parents, children with no fathers, broken families, sex crimes., divorce, suicide and drug use among teens, asylums for unclaimed children, homes for unwanted parents, clinics for delinquent youth and neurotic adults. Past estimates suggest that up to 80% of U.S society displays some form or the other of psychological symptoms, and that up to 25% have psychological problems serious enough to interfere with their day to day living.

No tell me Where is freedom in the world of psychos.

14-03-2011 10:20AM

dead one wrote: »

Yeah like Illegitimate extra marital liaisons, also see my old posts i can't repeat them. I am too dead to repeat them again.

If you mean married people having affairs, no I don't.
If you mean non-marital relations, yes I do. This is certainly better than beating a woman.

Do you really think it's freedom?. In my view it's slavery.

Forcing women to do and dress and act and marry and speak as you dictate, for their whole lives, with the threat of beatings, is slavery.
It's abhorrent.

Doctor DooM · 14-03-2011 11:28AM

This thread is verging on Poes law. I find it hard to believe someone can believe this stuff.

Dades · 14-03-2011 11:35AM

This is the first time I can recall seeing a Muslim openly defend the "God says it's okay to beat your wife" rule.

Wowser.

liamw · 14-03-2011 02:53PM

deadman, although l depise your opinions on this thread, I think it's a good thing you came to post here. Your are a prime example of how religious indoctrination can successfully pollute the human mind.

It is truly scary to think how many other people out there have opinions like yours ,especially on matters concerning females.

Improbable · 14-03-2011 03:29PM

Dades wrote: »

This is the first time I can recall seeing a Muslim openly defend the "God says it's okay to beat your wife" rule.

Wowser.

Consider yourself lucky. I lived in Turkey for 6 years where 97% of the population is muslim and the amount of horrifying stories I hear to this day of men beating their wives is astonishing. Some of the given reasons have been: she left the house without telling him, dinner wasn't ready when he got home and the house wasn't clean enough.

dead one · 15-03-2011 04:46AM

Improbable wrote: »

Consider yourself lucky. I lived in Turkey for 6 years where 97% of the population is muslim and the amount of horrifying stories I hear to this day of men beating their wives is astonishing. Some of the given reasons have been: she left the house without telling him, dinner wasn't ready when he got home and the house wasn't clean enough.

My friend there is "no Islam" in turkey today. Turkey was once Islamic state when "system of Islam" was implemented there. So you can't relate those injustice to Islam. Don't you!. It means people are bad not Islam. I challenge you, establish Islam in whole world, It is 100% sure you will get rid all injustices

Improbable wrote: »

Consider yourself lucky

Not lucky enough!

Alarming statistics with manifold percentage increase every year of single parents, children with no fathers, broken families, sex crimes., divorce, suicide and drug use among teens, asylums for unclaimed children, homes for unwanted parents, clinics for delinquent youth and neurotic adults.

dead one · 15-03-2011 04:49AM

robindch wrote: »

Lying makes baby Mohammad cry.And they are all future potential victims of violence. For their "own good" of course, as you happen decide it.

But I'm interested that you are obsess so much about the sexual habits of "western women". Have you ever met one?

I have. In fact, I have a mum, and two sisters, a missus, a daughter, a sister-in-law, cousins and friends. And while most of them are working, or have worked, in high-paying, responsible jobs in biological research, retail sales, medicine, the airline industry, schools and so on, not a single one has worked as a strip dancer, a prostitute or a "future pimp" (what exactly is a "future daughter", btw?). Though I should say that in their capacities as excellent cooks, I can confirm that my mum and the older of my two younger sisters certainly have catered to the "desires of hungry mob". Yum, yum, yummy!

Ultimately, I think you're frightened by the strength of your own sexual desires which are you unable to control. In this part of the world, most people learn how to deal with these desires and the slowly become responsible adults. Whereas, in your case, you never do, choosing instead to blame women for provoking you -- I'm assuming you're heterosexual, btw -- and that's why you enforce a code that requires women to dress in shapeless sacks, rather than, say, you wear a sack on your head that stops you seeing women. And this ability of women to provoke, well, it insults your ridiculous belief that you are stronger and better than them. Hence your need to control them and threaten them with violence when it suits you.

You're simply terribly frightened of women and their power over you.

Peace be upon you my friend, Your anger isn't solution. You anger can't remove the facts from white pages of history.Think on it with cool mind.

dead one · 15-03-2011 05:03AM

bluewolf wrote: »

Forcing women to do and dress and act and marry and speak as you dictate, for their whole lives, with the threat of beatings, is slavery.
It's abhorrent.

So why Women don't get rid of this slavery

Males make big money, displaying female nakedness in their respectable trades like cabarets, strip bars, fashion shows, commercial advertising (Do I want the Mustang or the sexy blonde in the advertisement?), nude paintings and magazines and now internet web pages.

Now can i ask one thing, the punishment which is mentioned quran isn't applicable to All women, only to those women who wish to destroy their homes due their rebellious nature.

What is better option
1. Destruction of whole family due to rebellious nature of women
2. guide or punish her to save the family .

Infact Quran teaches us to respect women.

Attitudes towards women
O ye who believe! Ye are forbidden to inherit women against their will. Nor should ye treat them with harshness, that ye may take away part of the dower ye have given them,-except where they have been guilty of open lewdness; on the contrary live with them on a footing of kindness and equity. If ye take a dislike to them it may be that ye dislike a thing, and Allah brings about through it a great deal of good. (An-Nisa 4:19)

Improbable · 15-03-2011 05:06AM

dead one wrote: »

My friend there is "no Islam" in turkey today. Turkey was once Islamic state when "system of Islam" was implemented there. So you can't relate those injustice to Islam. Don't you!. It means people are bad not Islam. I challenge you, establish Islam in whole world, It is 100% sure you will get rid all injustices

Er, I'm Turkish so please don't presume to think that you can tell me what the religious attitudes are like in my own country. I'm pretty sure I have a better handle on it than you do. I've seen and heard of atrocities committed by muslims in the name of islam and because of its teachings against people of other faiths and against other muslims as well.

Do you not even realise what a ridiculous statement your last sentence is?

I challenge you, establish Islam in whole world, It is 100% sure you will get rid all injustices

How about the injustice of not having freedom of religion? How about the fact that people will still have disagreements over various interpretations of the same religion and commit crimes and injustices against all others who don't believe exactly the same thing that they do, the same way in which it happens today? Not to mention the horrendously large number of injustices that go on which have nothing to do with religion? Is it going to solve those too?

I see how convenient you think your argument is. "Oh, it's not islam that's bad, it's people." Sorry to disappoint you but that quite simply is not true. If people are reading the farcical concoction of fairy tales that make up a "holy" text, and are using the instructions within to commit atrocities, then that religion is BAD. Even if every single person on the face of the planet were to somehow come to an absolute understanding of perfect morality and decided not to follow the instructions which were immoral, that doesn't make it any more moral than it was before.

dead one · 15-03-2011 05:23AM

liamw wrote: »

deadman,

Correction please, Dead one

liamw wrote: »

Your are a prime example of how religious indoctrination can successfully pollute the human mind.

well friend, soon you will see what is corruption and what is cure. It is very fact of life, once you are corrupt you can't differentiate between corruption and cure. The thing which you are thinking as "Cure" is infact corruption in my views. The thing which i am thinking as "Cure" is infact corruption in your views. So it is very difficult to change the mind of a corrupt person. You are thinking that i am corrupt. While i am thinking you are corrupt. Now who is actually corrupt. Time will tells you,

liamw wrote: »

It is truly scary to think how many other people out there have opinions like yours ,especially on matters concerning females.

My views about female are living facts in the society of West. You can't swallow these facts with your intelligence. Now why i have views because i don't wish to see a woman as stripper, I don't wish to see as hooker, I don't wish to see a women using "abusive language". I don't wish to see a women as a showpiece. They are people who are using women. Soon women will see why they are being used!

dead one · 15-03-2011 06:48AM

Improbable wrote: »

Er, I'm Turkish so please don't presume to think that you can tell me what the religious attitudes are like in my own country.

Friend you are turkish, I am still firm on my statement. There is no Islamic system in Turkey. Turkey is secular state. You even don't what is Islamic state. Why there is no Islam in turkey. Reason, Ah i suppose you are looking for reason, here is reason to torch your brain.

Today 98% of Turkey’s population is officially Muslim but the proportion of practicing Muslims is as low as 20%. However unlike in Europe where church attendance gradually fell in Turkey it is the result of a systematic attempt to constrain and weaken Islam by successive Kemalist secular governments and the military.
http://1muslimnation.wordpress.com/2006/11/12/islam-to-secularism-how-kemal-ataturk-reformed-ottoman-turkey/

Improbable wrote: »

I'm pretty sure I have a better handle on it than you do. I've seen and heard of atrocities committed by muslims in the name of islam and because of its teachings against people of other faiths and against other muslims as well.

No you don't sure, That's most of people are doing, they see and hear things from other people and than make there mind without researching. In my view it is dishonesty.

Improbable wrote: »

How about the injustice of not having freedom of religion? How about the fact that people will still have disagreements over various interpretations of the same religion and commit crimes and injustices against all others who don't believe exactly the same thing that they do, the same way in which it happens today? Not to mention the horrendously large number of injustices that go on which have nothing to do with religion? Is it going to solve those too?

Can i ask one thing where is religion?. The injustice which you are relating to the religion is infact injustice of people due to lack of the religion. The more people go away from religion, the more they become unjust. Infact the statement of Quran is clearly showing freedom in religion. Quran says "there is no compulsion in Islam". Today if muslim are unjust they aren't unjust because of islam, they are unjust because they aren't practical muslims. I hope you will find the difference soon.

Improbable wrote: »

I see how convenient you think your argument is. "Oh, it's not islam that's bad, it's people." Sorry to disappoint you but that quite simply is not true

can you avoid truth by saying, "that quite simply is not true". It is true people have abandoned Islam. A thing which makes you perfect, if you leave it than you can't relate your imperfectness to that thing.
Isn't it true.
.

Improbable wrote: »

If people are reading the farcical concoction of fairy tales that make up a "holy" text, and are using the instructions within to commit atrocities, then that religion is BAD. Even if every single person on the face of the planet were to somehow come to an absolute understanding of perfect morality and decided not to follow the instructions which were immoral, that doesn't make it any more moral than it was before.

Those aren't fairy tales but shows the power of God. If Jesus gave life to dead by order of Allah. It may be a tale for you but it is sign of power of God. You said religion is bad,
I tell what religion says

On that account We ordained for the Children of Isra`il that if any one slew a person - unless it be for murder or for spreading mischief in the land - it would be as if he slew the whole humanity: and if any one saved a life, it would be as if he saved the whole humanity. Then although there came to them Our messengers with clear (guidance), yet, even after that, many of them continued to commit excesses in the land. (5:32)

The above ayah clearly shows its people who commit excess in the land despite God sent his messenger time and again to warn people. Now you are committing execess in Land by relating injustice to God rather People. What an irony!

robindch · 15-03-2011 10:40PM

dead one wrote: »

There is no Islamic system in Turkey.

And none in Saudi either, apparently. And as for the UAE...!

Out of interest, could you tell us which country does have the very best system of "islamic government"?

dead one wrote: »

Your anger isn't solution. You anger can't remove the facts from white pages of history.

Me not angry

On contrary, me point out that you are a man who is terribly frightened by women and who is prepared to justify and use violence to overcome your fear.

Galvasean · 15-03-2011 11:05PM

dead one wrote: »

Do you really think it's freedom?. In my view it's slavery.

Yes, the slavery that is being allowed do as you wish when you wish...

stevoslice · 15-03-2011 11:15PM

dead one wrote: »

Yeah like Illegitimate extra marital liaisons, also see my old posts i can't repeat them. I am too dead to repeat them again.

Do you really think it's freedom?. In my view it's slavery.

No tell me Where is freedom in the world of psychos.

So women aren't entitled to freedom, or 'slavery' as you like to put it, because they will be taken advantage of, poor wimmins, they may be pretty, but they're dum as hell...

how about the freedom of the young boys in afghanistan used as 'dancers': -link

Ickle Magoo · 15-03-2011 11:16PM

dead one wrote: »

My views about female are living facts in the society of West. You can't swallow these facts with your intelligence. Now why i have views because i don't wish to see a woman as stripper, I don't wish to see as hooker, I don't wish to see a women using "abusive language". I don't wish to see a women as a showpiece. They are people who are using women. Soon women will see why they are being used!

Soon all women will see - and you think they are going to rush to get beaten instead?!

Not all women are strippers, or hookers or whatever - you condone violence towards women and are just trying to hide behind a very small minority of women in order to make such an abhorrent practice sound in any way rational.
What is it with all the shock horror, sex, breasts, language anyway - if you truly believe in freedoms then you'd support people behaving, dressing and speaking in the manner they wish - rather than in the manner you think they should regardless of what they'd like to do...which is clearly oppression.

dead one · 16-03-2011 04:51AM

robindch wrote: »

And none in Saudi either, apparently. And as for the UAE...!

Out of interest, could you tell us which country does have the very best system of "islamic government"?

There no single society on earth with Practical Islam.

robindch wrote: »

Me not angry

Are you sure!

robindch wrote: »

On contrary, me point out that you are a man who is terribly frightened by women and who is prepared to justify and use violence to overcome your fear.

Why i should frightened by women even i am not afraid of death. A best community can't be formed without women. To create a purest society on earth we need pure women and pure men. I am not using women, women are being used by those who are making their business by displaying beauty of women. Yes i am danger to their business.

Qur'an:

"And they (women) have rights similar to those of men over them in a just manner" The noble Qur'an, Al-Baqarah(2):228

dead one · 16-03-2011 05:37AM

Galvasean wrote: »

Yes, the slavery that is being allowed do as you wish when you wish...

out of context answer, slavery under the cloud of freedom

dead one · 16-03-2011 06:01AM

Ickle Magoo wrote: »

Not all women are strippers, or hookers or whatever - you condone violence towards women and are just trying to hide behind a very small minority of women in order to make such an abhorrent practice sound in any way rational.
What is it with all the shock horror, sex, breasts, language anyway -.

Yes i agree not all women but still they are women (The noblest relation). Have you ever wonder Why they are!. What cause them to become whatever they are. That is no perfect family system. Now question arise who will provide them family? Think on it

Ickle Magoo wrote: »

if you truly believe in freedoms then you'd support people behaving, dressing and speaking in the manner they wish - rather than in the manner you think they should regardless of what they'd like to do...which is clearly oppression

We are slaves of God, God knows his children better than any one else. We aren't salve of desires. Today those who believe in freedom are in fact, slaves of their desires. No one is free in this cage of Mortal world because you are going to meet death sooner or later. Those who think they are free to abuse infact they have forgotten death. Those who think they are free to do whatever they wish, infact have forgotten death.

Now can i ask one question in the end, Are you free to live 1000 years in this world.

GO_Bear · 16-03-2011 09:32AM

dead one wrote: »

Qur'an:

"And they (women) have rights similar to those of men over them in a just manner" The noble Qur'an, Al-Baqarah(2):228

Oxymoron ?

Penn · 16-03-2011 09:37AM

GO_Bear wrote: »

Oxymoron ?

You're half right...

Off topic discussion about God/Islam/Questions...

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