Off topic discussion about God/Islam/Questions...

Beruthiel · 10-03-2011 02:48PM

dead one wrote: »

You can't differentiate between humiliation unless you know what is real humiliation. Woman isn't for advertisement if u advertise woman than it is humiliation for women. Women isn't for decoration of film industries., Woman isn't for Nakedness, Women isn't for desires for Some Fool Men, Women aren't for Decoration of Casinos or Strip of Club, Women aren't for decoration of TV programs. Women aren't for Dancing with Men.

You make women sound like they are some sort of weak willed, subservient, unintelligent pet that needs a man to show them the way. It's so unbelievably insulting.

If a woman wants to do any of the above things, distasteful as you may find any of them, then it's her choice.
A woman doesn't need a man to dictate to her how she should live her life.

CerebralCortex · 10-03-2011 03:18PM

Beruthiel wrote: »

A woman doesn't need a man to dictate to her how she should live her life.

A person full stop.

dead one · 11-03-2011 06:26AM

robindch wrote: »

Tell me, would a woman be allowed to stand in front of a car like that in Saudi?

Or be allowed to drive it?

robindch wrote: »

Tell me, would a woman be allowed to stand in front of a car like that in Saudi?

No because True Muslims don't use Women to advertise Car. Women are not for advertising or decoration pieces which you people have made them, Western women will soon think on it. Muslim women can drive cars or go wherever they wish but following commandment of Allah. They can also stand before cars but not for the purpose of advertising the cars.

BTW: i am not Talking about Saudis, I m talking about Islam. Don't use Saudis to label Islam. It is dishonesty. If saudis are wrong in certain matters. It doesn't mean Islam is wrong. If you want to label Islam than use Quran and show me single statement in whole quran which is against women or Humanity.

Below picture is showing respect of greatest relation i.e Woman.

Or be allowed to drive it?

like i said Saudis are no excuse.
The below picture is showing disrespect of greatest relation on earth in the hand of those who don't follow Book of Allah but their vain desires. This is destruction of whole human kind in the hand of liberalism. I can see the End which you can't see. Soon your next generation will see if you don't follow word of God. You can't give protection to women unless you want to protect them.
28231-Clipart-Illustration-Of-A-Crowd-Of-Hands-Surrounding-A-Sexy-Stripper-Pole-Dancing-Under-Spot-Lights-On-A-Stage-In-A-Strip-Club.jpg

28231-Clipart-Illustration-Of-A-Crowd-Of-Hands-Surrounding-A-Sexy-Stripper-Pole-Dancing-Under-Spot-Lights-On-A-Stage-In-A-Strip-Club.jpg

i m very sorry i can't find any better picture than above,

Like i already presented

O Western world's inhabitants, God's world is not a shop!
What you are considering genuine, will be regarded counterfeit

Your civilization will commit suicide with its own dagger
The nest built on the frail branch will not be durable

dead one · 11-03-2011 06:45AM

CerebralCortex wrote: »

A person full stop.

I can't see boldness in your words, Let me tell you, Men aren't to dictate woman but Men are to protect Women, Women can't protect themselves against the Man or evil. So you have to protect. Why Western society failed to protect woman, because Western Men themselves want Open Women**** This is greatest truth if Man can't protect Women than no one can Protect them.

****The term open women means those women who dance in strip clubs in casinos, Those who are pimps etc those who had illegal affairs with many men. Those who want to become decoration piece in the hand of liberalism etc.

By God the Women isn't for This. Why this is happening because you don't follow words of God. What God knows you don't. Don't Ya think?

dead one · 11-03-2011 07:29AM

Beruthiel wrote: »

You make women sound like they are some sort of weak willed, subservient, unintelligent pet that needs a man to show them the way. It's so unbelievably insulting.

If a woman wants to do any of the above things, distasteful as you may find any of them, then it's her choice.
A woman doesn't need a man to dictate to her how she should live her life.

Nah! Sister, You don't realize what you r saying, you can become intelligent or whatever you wish by following commandment of God. If you don't than you are nothing but a showpiece. I am pretty much sure those liberals don't consider you as "intelligent" because they aren't to see your intelligence but your beauty and your figures. I mean how you decorate yourself for them. If you decorate yourself for God than I am 100% sure those liberal will consider more intelligent than they are. Because intelligence of man revolve around the beauty of Women. I am honest with you. I wish u will see the real respect for women is not in her beauty but in her modesty.

How you can decorate yourself for God this picture shows

If you wish to become a showpiece, or just desire of liberal men than what i can do for you kind sister. It's your choice, soon you will see or had seen consequence of it.

If you don't choose respect for yourself Liberal Men won't respect you

Beruthiel wrote: »

A woman doesn't need a man to dictate to her how she should live her life

It's not what man dictate, it's what God dictate. God also dictate Men to follows rules, God also made some rules for Women to follow. So you need not to follow men, you need to follow God. M i right.!. That's the freedom which God gives to Women against Men. This is how you can secure yourself against the injustices of Men.

Reason is simple God created both women and Men, What he knows you don't, don't you!

Can i ask one thing Why Women are insecure in West under hands of liberalism? What is purpose of those women who are dancing in Strip Club to feed the Hungers of Liberal. Why West is selling Women? Why pimps are so high in West?

dead one · 11-03-2011 07:47AM

Dades wrote: »

One generalisation deserves another.

What this picture has to do with Islam. Can i ask Is this honesty?.
If some people are ignorant about Islam than it is there fault, you can't relate it to Islam. Islam never ask people to treat Women like that.
This is pure childish thinking. The above picture clearly shows how some are trying to misguide people about Islam by Posting out of context pictures. If you want to learn something about Islam don't look it in ignorance but Look it in the Light i.e Quran. Be honest with youself

Reason is simple ignorance always lead to ignorance. Light always lead to light

dead one · 11-03-2011 08:00AM

robindch wrote: »

In the religious world, "respect" is the acceptance of, and submission to, the political power of others, power which is typically acquired by force or assertion of seniority in place of choice or merit.In the sense I've defined above, yes, you're quite correct.

I don't believe in religious world, kind friend, I believe in only one way of life which is originated with Allah ie. Islam. All other religion are interpretations of people. Out of Islam it is sure "respect" which you are looking is only "illusion of respect". Soon your eyes will see that illusion.
It's like a wanderer who lost in the desert of desires to find water of cure. It's like illusion of Cure.

The West seeks to make life a perpetual feast;
A wish in vain, in vain, in vain!

dead one · 11-03-2011 08:13AM

bluewolf wrote: »

edit: beruthiel is right, you're being incredibly insulting

I m not insulting, I m insulting those who are insulting this greatest relation on earth with their desires. Isn't it insult for women to dance in strip clubs in front of men who are too ignorant. So why i shouldn't protect those women who are pious?

BTW: I didn't see any pious women around! Why i don't know? Don't you. Oh my head:eek:

Please keep your arrogance away while answering above question.

I m not saying anything on my behalf but the book which gives me wisdom to understand. You are talking on behalf of your desires, You even don't what is real respect. Respect isn't dancing before thousand of Men or wandering before people! or advertising themselves. Isn't it

These Western nymphs
A challenge to the eye and the heart,
Are bold of glance,
In a paradise of instant bliss.

Thy heart is a wavering ship,
Tossed by beauty’s assault
These moons and stars that glisten,
Are whirlpools in thy sea .

11-03-2011 08:56AM

dead one wrote: »

I can't see boldness in your words, Let me tell you, Men aren't to dictate woman but Men are to protect Women, Women can't protect themselves against the Man or evil. So you have to protect. Why Western society failed to protect woman, because Western Men themselves want Open Women**** This is greatest truth if Man can't protect Women than no one can Protect them.

This is absolute condesending insulting NONSENSE.
You want to step outside here I'll show you how well I can "protect myself" :mad::mad:

dead one wrote: »

Nah! Sister, You don't realize what you r saying, you can become intelligent or whatever you wish by following commandment of God.

She doesn't realise what she's saying just because she's not parroting your nonsense? And you have the nerve to talk about intelligence?

If you don't than you are nothing but a showpiece. I am pretty much sure those liberals don't consider you as "intelligent" because they aren't to see your intelligence but your beauty and your figures.
...
What this picture has to do with Islam. Can i ask Is this honesty?.

It has more to do with islam than your stupid picture has to do with liberalism :rolleyes:

If some people are ignorant about Islam than it is there fault, you can't relate it to Islam. Islam never ask people to treat Women like that.

Well apparently it does judging by what you're saying.

Goodness, you're way more infuriating than JC.
Stop talking about "respect", you are trying to control and insult women :mad::mad::mad:

virmilitaris · 11-03-2011 09:39AM

And this is why, above all the other major religions I find islam to be the worst. I know that there are many muslims who wouldn't hold the above view but in comparison to other major religions islamd has far more fanatics per adherent. The way muslms 'protect' women should disgust all decent human beings.

And all becaise of the epilepticly induced rantings of an illiterate pedophile.

Dades · 11-03-2011 09:52AM

dead one wrote: »

The above picture clearly shows how some are trying to misguide people about Islam by Posting out of context pictures.

dead one wrote: »

Isn't it insult for women to dance in strip clubs in front of men who are too ignorant.... Respect isn't dancing before thousand of Men or wandering before people! or advertising themselves. Isn't it

So let me get this straight - I'm misrepresenting Islam by posting a picture of some Islamic women in a car boot - and yet you seek to represent non-Muslim women by posting pictures of strippers?

I only posted the picture to point out how it was ridiculous to generalise on the morality or an entire gender - a point that was clearly lost on you.

You post about 'respect' as if Islam has a monopoly on it, and yet you are the only person in this thread showing a complete lack of respect to the female posters here. I suggest you've done your religion no favours here, and that you change the tone of your posts before a more formal warning is required.

CerebralCortex · 11-03-2011 10:20AM

dead one wrote: »

...Women can't protect themselves against the Man or evil...

You'd be in for a shock if you were to meet the women where I'm from. Let me tell you, you're taking your life into your own hands if you were to suggest they need protection and I wouldn't have it any other way.

Larsist · 11-03-2011 10:40AM

dead one wrote: »

What this picture has to do with Islam. Can i ask Is this honesty?.
If some people are ignorant about Islam than it is there fault, you can't relate it to Islam. Islam never ask people to treat Women like that.
This is pure childish thinking. The above picture clearly shows how some are trying to misguide people about Islam by Posting out of context pictures. If you want to learn something about Islam don't look it in ignorance but Look it in the Light i.e Quran. Be honest with youself

Reason is simple ignorance always lead to ignorance. Light always lead to light

You are being very hypocritical. You post a picture of a women in front of a car to represent western societies treatment of women, yet when the picture above was posted to depicted Islam's treatment of women you call it dishonesty.

What ever your view you cannot deny the Islam is used all over the world as an excuse to discriminate against women.

robindch · 11-03-2011 10:50AM

dead one wrote: »

I m not insulting, I m insulting those who are insulting this greatest relation on earth with their desires.

Your religion is an idea and it is therefore impossible to insult it. Ideas, unlike people, do not have feelings.

Also, as moderator of this forum, I would like to point out that insulting people -- religious or irreligious, male or female -- is a violation of the forum charter and will not be tolerated.

dead one wrote: »

Respect isn't dancing

Well, perhaps you haven't seen any good dancing?

I'm not sure where you're posting from but if you're ever passing by Dubai, I can certainly recommend the shows at the York Hotel just on the main junction on Khalid Bin Al Waleed street, if you know it. Any night of the week. And it's full of locals enjoying all kinds of dancing -- vertical as well as horizontal!

robindch · 11-03-2011 11:02AM

dead one wrote: »

Below picture is showing respect of greatest relation i.e Woman.

That, my friend, is a picture of children being indoctrinated -- their freedom and innocence stolen from them by religious people. That is not a picture of "respect" for individuals and their right to their own independent thoughts and feelings. Respect without independence is worthless.

On the contrary, that is a picture of abuse.

Dr. Loon · 11-03-2011 11:53AM

dead one wrote: »

If you want to label Islam than use Quran and show me single statement in whole quran which is against women or Humanity.

"Men are the protectors and maintainers of women, because Allah has given the one more (strength) than the other, and because they support them from their means. Therefore the righteous women are devoutly obedient, and guard in (the husband's) absence what Allah would have them guard. As to those women on whose part ye fear disloyalty and ill-conduct, admonish them (first), (Next), refuse to share their beds, (And last) beat them (lightly); but if they return to obedience, seek not against them Means (of annoyance): For Allah is Most High, great (above you all)," (4:34).

I find that entire quote against women, and therefore humanity. You really don't have a clue what you're on about.

The Mad Hatter · 11-03-2011 11:58AM

dead one wrote: »

If you want to label Islam than use Quran and show me single statement in whole quran which is against women or Humanity.

Not exactly hard to find.

GO_Bear · 11-03-2011 01:09PM

The Mad Hatter wrote: »

Not exactly hard to find.

Love that google search tool XD

dead one · 13-03-2011 04:06AM

robindch wrote: »

That, my friend, is a picture of children being indoctrinated -- their freedom and innocence stolen from them by religious people. That is not a picture of "respect" for individuals and their right to their own independent thoughts and feelings. Respect without independence is worthless.

On the contrary, that is a picture of abuse.

don't see this picture with evil eyes, as evil lead to evil,

I clear you in your own words

That, my friend, is a picture of children who are future mothers,sisters, daughters and wives of Muslims, They are not future strip dancer, they are not future pimps, They aren't Hooker,they are not desires of hungry mob, they are not who write abusive language but language of love and peace. They aren't illegal mothers of illegal child. This is a picture of young teenage Muslim girls, but in general, this is a what a typical Muslim woman looks like: Pure, innocent, virgin (until marriage) and non-sexual. A true man would be willing to die for a true and blessed Angel of that kind, because if she's faithful to her GOD Almighty, then she will definitely be faithful and honorable to her family. They are free to become doctors,engineers etc or whatever they wish by following commandments of Allah and hence creating puriest society on earth.

Now compare it with your words you will get the difference

dead one · 13-03-2011 04:15AM

Dr. Loon wrote: »

"Men are the protectors and maintainers of women, because Allah has given the one more (strength) than the other, and because they support them from their means. Therefore the righteous women are devoutly obedient, and guard in (the husband's) absence what Allah would have them guard. As to those women on whose part ye fear disloyalty and ill-conduct, admonish them (first), (Next), refuse to share their beds, (And last) beat them (lightly); but if they return to obedience, seek not against them Means (of annoyance): For Allah is Most High, great (above you all)," (4:34).

I find that entire quote against women, and therefore humanity. You really don't have a clue what you're on about.

The Mad Hatter wrote: »

Not exactly hard to find.

GO_Bear wrote: »

Love that google search tool XD

Doctor Loon, The Mad Hatter, Go Bear

My friends Google isn't solution sometimes google will take you away from destination in desert of Search. So always be honest with yourself in searching the truth. Keep my words in your minds so that it will benefit you in any Search.

For Mr Loon. You don't understand because Google can provide you result but not truth. As i can clearly see how you choose the way of dishonesty and also you aren't even smarter as you are pretending. I have read many atheist and agnostic. So you need not to become smart before me.

Sorah 4:34 is one of the most misquoted quranic verses by both muslims and non-muslims. In the response you shall see all the misconceptions and misinterpretation of this ayah. The scholars of the European Council explain.

Quran4:34

Men are the protectors and maintainers (Qawama) of women, because Allah has give each preference over the other, and because they support "them from their means................

The beauty of the Quranic expression is illustrated in the statement that, "Allah has given each preference over the other" and not merely that Allah gave preference to men over women. This is because men are preferred in some aspects and women are preferred in others: particular the emotional aspect of life, whilst man is obliged to pay martial gift to establish martial house and support it Therefore, if a man ever attempts to harm this family, he will be the very first victim of this act of destruction

NOTE

The verse intends to establish a responsibility of men for the protection and maintenance of women in a restricted social context. Biologically, only women can bear the future generations. The Quran creates a harmonious balace in society by establishing a function responsibility for males to facilitate this biological function of females.

This verse doesn't give men inherent superiority or authority over women. It establishes mutual responsibility in society. Responsibility is no superiority. Even though men are responsibly for women in this restricted context, the verse is not intended to mean that women can't handle their own affairs, control themselves or become whatever they wish.

http://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&q=cache:p8aRIcrTpeMJ:www.answering-christianity.com/karim/part_3_j.pdf+no+superiority.+Even+though+men+are+responsibly&hl=en&gl=pk&pid=bl&srcid=ADGEEShcZMCRF8qusguNH6t0u7lFEjbRsAzgujbiwPxUjnC6aRrgYI0ZRuARJzCZEHNk0cNni15-32EzT49YqNfwqmVDsfFkLm0Z8A2hkqZb5aEgedA2OVd3XQG_FqML3FE7FETzX5mo&sig=AHIEtbRRx7HnES50-0oFmxa0pWjkorAjcQ

Zillah · 13-03-2011 04:29AM

What about the rest of them? Men being allowed to beat their wives, for example.

dead one · 13-03-2011 04:33AM

Dades wrote: »

So let me get this straight - I'm misrepresenting Islam by posting a picture of some Islamic women in a car boot - and yet you seek to represent non-Muslim women by posting pictures of strippers?
I only posted the picture to point out how it was ridiculous to generalize on the morality or an entire gender - a point that was clearly lost on you.

Look my friend dades i present the picture of stripper not to generalize but i wish to see how many of you condemn it. It is very clear that i am greater stupid if i generalize the picture of stripper to all women. I can't even imagine that. But i have not seen anyone who condemned stripper rather they defended it, and about your picture with two women in car which you posted to generalize islam, I have condemned that picture with my heart, It is act of ignorance, Islam never allowed that.

Dades wrote: »

You post about 'respect' as if Islam has a monopoly on it, and yet you are the only person in this thread showing a complete lack of respect to the female posters here. I suggest you've done your religion no favours here, and that you change the tone of your posts before a more formal warning is required.

Thanks i read post your late as i started looking from last page, I didn't started the debate its Mr. White, You can see his post, but i won't post here again on this Matter.

Thanks and peace.

dead one · 13-03-2011 04:37AM

Zillah wrote: »

What about the rest of them? Men being allowed to beat their wives, for example.

If Dades allow me, Because i am not going to break my commitment. Sorry friend you r late i am in commitment. Now it's all about Dades if he gives me permission to clear it.

Zillah · 13-03-2011 04:46AM

You're allowed to answer my question. You won't get in trouble, I promise. I know people.

It's Dades

dead one · 13-03-2011 05:10AM

Zillah wrote: »

You're allowed to answer my question. You won't get in trouble, I promise. I know people.

Sorry friend you clearly don't know what is commitment. It's not about trouble, it's about my words. I am not afraid of trouble. Even if you r owner of this foram or you gives me 1000000$$$ for this commitment. It's all about dades, if he allow me. Because your post is related to women

you have to wait! and i am dead in waiting

If you have question other than women than i am happy to answer them

oceanclub · 13-03-2011 05:14AM

dead one wrote: »

If some people are ignorant about Islam than it is there fault, you can't relate it to Islam. Islam never ask people to treat Women like that.

Ah diddums. So, you come into this group, call all women from the Western whores and men pimps, and then get upset when someone posts a photo of what the extremes of your religion produces?

Boohoo.

If you are so upset by women being oppressed incorrectly under the name of Islam in certain countries, then I presume you have condemned it? I presume you can point us to a post on boards where you've discussed it previously?

P.

Zillah · 13-03-2011 05:51AM

dead one wrote: »

It's all about dades, if he allow me.

Step 1: Identify most powerful figure.
Step 2: Mindlessly obey.

strobe · 13-03-2011 03:56PM

dead one wrote: »

don't see this picture with evil eyes, as evil lead to evil,

I clear you in your own words

That, my friend, is a picture of children who are future mothers,sisters, daughters and wives of Muslims, They are not future strip dancer, they are not future pimps, They aren't Hooker,they are not desires of hungry mob, they are not who write abusive language but language of love and peace. They aren't illegal mothers of illegal child. This is a picture of young teenage Muslim girls, but in general, this is a what a typical Muslim woman looks like: Pure, innocent, virgin (until marriage) and non-sexual. A true man would be willing to die for a true and blessed Angel of that kind, because if she's faithful to her GOD Almighty, then she will definitely be faithful and honorable to her family. They are free to become doctors,engineers etc or whatever they wish by following commandments of Allah and hence creating puriest society on earth.

Now compare it with your words you will get the difference

Dr. Loon · 14-03-2011 12:22AM

dead one wrote: »

Doctor Loon, The Mad Hatter, Go Bear

For Mr Loon. You don't understand because Google can provide you result but not truth. As i can clearly see how you choose the way of dishonesty and also you aren't even smarter as you are pretending. I have read many atheist and agnostic. So you need not to become smart before me.

I don't know what you're trying to say here, but I feel it's slightly insulting. Don't tell me I'm being dishonest. I've provided a quote to indicate how the Quran sees women. Specifically, in the recommendation of beating them. You tell me how this indicates either a) a peaceful religion or b) one which respects women.It doesn't. End of story. All of your other waffle doesn't even refer to the beating, and you're refusing to answer Zillah on the beating thing also. The truth is in front of our eyes. The Quran recommends beating women for certain things.

AhSureTisGrand · 14-03-2011 12:26AM

Dr. Loon wrote: »

I don't know what you're trying to say here, but I feel it's slightly insulting. Don't tell me I'm being dishonest. I've provided a quote to indicate how the Quran sees women. Specifically, in the recommendation of beating them. You tell me how this indicates either a) a peaceful religion or b) one which respects women.It doesn't. End of story. All of your other waffle doesn't even refer to the beating, and you're refusing to answer Zillah on the beating thing also. The truth is in front of our eyes. The Quran recommends beating women for certain things.

For their own protection, I'm sure

Off topic discussion about God/Islam/Questions...

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