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anyone here going to vote sinn féin?

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Comments

  • #1592
    KELTICKNIGHTT
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,781 ✭✭✭KELTICKNIGHTT


    Wolfe Tone wrote: »
    Dev was never a republican socialist. FF where never socialist. I disagree, I think they genuinely believe it, I do not doubt them being genuine about it. Whether that is good or bad is something else. If they were elected they would do it.

    Personally I think they will do well, and be excellent opposition and be in a position to challenge, this country needs core republican values now more than ever, those exposed by the proclamation, SF are genuine about building an Ireland of equals. All the other parties have lost the vision, and the values, of republicanism along the way. SF haven't, despite whatever crap they did in its name(it obviously got out of hand) they are coming out the other side now and have the vision.

    sf political wont work,they 30 years behind in views,they dont have policys that help ireland,sf politics are old and not for this country,they will never see government
    you can put what ever views you like but the majority will never accept sf , specially with there history and they have never come clean with everything and never will


  • #1593
    Wolfe Tone
    Closed Accounts Posts: 14,670 ✭✭✭✭Wolfe Tone


    KELTICKNIGHTT wrote: »
    sf political wont work,they 30 years behind in views,they dont have policys that help ireland,sf politics are old and not for this country,they will never see government
    you can put what ever views you like but the majority will never accept sf , specially with there history and they have never come clean with everything and never will
    Im not gonna address Pauls points now because we will be here all night, to suggest that SF are "old fashioned" or their policies, be they social are otherwise, is frightfully ignorant.


  • #1594
    paul71
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,420 ✭✭✭paul71


    Wolfe Tone wrote: »
    Im not gonna address Pauls points now because we will be here all night, to suggest that SF are "old fashioned" or their policies, be they social are otherwise, is frightfully ignorant.


    Fair enough lets call it a night.


  • #1595
    KELTICKNIGHTT
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,781 ✭✭✭KELTICKNIGHTT


    Wolfe Tone wrote: »
    Im not gonna address Pauls points now because we will be here all night, to suggest that SF are "old fashioned" or their policies, be they social are otherwise, is frightfully ignorant.

    there politics suited north,but ireland different climate and the politics not liked or cared for
    you have your view and i have mine as does paul,night


  • #1596
    newtadis
    Closed Accounts Posts: 36 ✭newtadis


    IM VOTING JOE HIGGINS A REAL POLITICIAN


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  • #1597
    KELTICKNIGHTT
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,781 ✭✭✭KELTICKNIGHTT


    newtadis wrote: »
    IM VOTING JOE HIGGINS A REAL POLITICIAN

    o my god,nite


  • #1598
    Monty Burnz
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,455 ✭✭✭✭Monty Burnz


    SnowY32 wrote: »
    are you for real! Gwan away more hyped up bull, i can tell you fine gaels false election is going to go balls up when the sack 30,000 people from there jobs its going to be a long year of strikes!
    Snow, what do you think will happen when Sinn Fein cut public spending on the dole, old age pensions, the health service, and all public servant salaries by 35%?


  • #1599
    alex32
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2 ✭alex32


    Yip for definate, they are the only ones telling the bodholders to get stuffed, they gambled on bad banks and lost and now they want me and you to cover their losses, feck off!!

    Also they are a party of principle not careerist gombeens in politics for self gain.
    p.s My Ma who always voted FF is voting SF aswell after watching the leaders debate and MM's comment about '..you coming down here..' crap, wtf was that about, from the leader of a supposedly Republican party?

    SF are going to upset the apple cart and ruffle the elitist cosy cartels. Long may it last too.:D


  • #1600
    Monty Burnz
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,455 ✭✭✭✭Monty Burnz


    alex32 wrote: »
    Yip for definate, they are the only ones telling the bodholders to get stuffed, they gambled on bad banks and lost and now they want me and you to cover their losses, feck off!!
    Alex, that's great - but what do you think about the €15 billion deficit that Sinn Fein will have to fill?

    So far the answers I've gotten from SF voters are 'I don't know' and 'I don't care' - but I imagine a lot of other people will care if the dole/old age pensions/the health service see huge cuts in the order of 35% to close the €15,000,000,000 gap.


  • #1601
    danbohan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,914 ✭✭✭danbohan


    Monty Burnz wrote: »
    Snow, what do you think will happen when Sinn Fein cut public spending on the dole, old age pensions, the health service, and all public servant salaries by 35%?


    dole, old age pensions, the health service, and all public servant salaries by 35%?

    that my friend is going to happen no matter who is in government after we default , and not just public service salary's but numbers as well


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  • #1602
    mtv1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1 ✭mtv1


    Hi all am new here so go handy, in my opinion doesn't matter what party you vote for,vote for the guy or gal closest to you at least you will be able to contact them when you need a hand.if you ask me there all the one in it for the money. And hey why not


  • #1603
    punchdrunk
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,356 ✭✭✭punchdrunk


    I will never vote for SF.


  • #1604
    Scofflaw
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,283 ✭✭✭✭Scofflaw


    Wolfe Tone wrote: »
    Indded, cant believe so many are voting for those fascist Irish killers the blueshirts... two can play at your game ya know, pointless

    On the other hand, one of you is already on notice that playing such a game again will result in permanent banning from the forum. We don't care who your tango partner is.

    moderately,
    Scofflaw


  • #1605
    Euroland
    Closed Accounts Posts: 634 ✭✭✭Euroland


    shtemcguire wrote: »
    they have policies that want to help the poor and they are republican which is good

    This time I will vote for SF, but on completely different grounds (purely economic). SF is the only party which is willing to discuss bank debt default/restructuring and also promises to impose public sector salary cap at €100K.


  • #1606
    Monty Burnz
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,455 ✭✭✭✭Monty Burnz


    Euroland wrote: »
    This time I will vote for SF, but on completely different grounds (purely economic). SF is the only party which is willing to discuss bank debt default/restructuring and also promises to impose public sector salary cap at €100K.
    Euroland, do you have an explanation as to how SF will fill the €15 billion euro gap in the public finances? I don't want to see old age pensioners or social welfare recipients starving on the streets when they can't be paid.


  • #1607
    Euroland
    Closed Accounts Posts: 634 ✭✭✭Euroland


    Monty Burnz wrote: »
    Euroland, do you have an explanation as to how SF will fill the €15 billion euro gap in the public finances? I don't want to see old age pensioners or social welfare recipients starving on the streets when they can't be paid.

    As simple as that, reduction in public costs + borrowing directly from IMF or from willing to help countries (China, Russia, etc).


  • #1608
    Pete_Cavan
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,475 ✭✭✭Pete_Cavan


    Euroland wrote: »
    As simple as that, reduction in public costs + borrowing directly from IMF or from willing to help countries (China, Russia, etc).

    You do realise that SF dont want to reduce the cost of the public service, will reject the IMF money and as for borrowing from China or Russia, that is the most ridiculous thing I have ever heard.


  • #1609
    cursai
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,915 ✭✭✭cursai


    .......People have to be taking the piss here....that or the age limit for voting has dropped to 13yrs.
    Joking aside don't go voting for these Sinn Fein lads just for the craic of it!


  • #1610
    Euroland
    Closed Accounts Posts: 634 ✭✭✭Euroland


    Pete_Cavan wrote: »
    You do realise that SF dont want to reduce the cost of the public service, will reject the IMF money and as for borrowing from China or Russia, that is the most ridiculous thing I have ever heard.


    SF is the only party which promises to impose public sector salary cap at €100K and significantly reduce all public salaries, which in turn would lead to reduction in public spending.

    As regards to borrowing, they are planning to spend some money from pension funds (the same way as advised our ECB bullies), but the rest they can borrow anywhere. Considering that the EU wouldn’t lend us in this case, they would have to shop around and would eventually find cheaper financing either directly from IMF or China, Russia, etc.

    Overall, still this (SF) option would be much much better for our country then the current “bailout”.


  • #1611
    Monty Burnz
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,455 ✭✭✭✭Monty Burnz


    Euroland wrote: »
    As simple as that, reduction in public costs + borrowing directly from IMF or from willing to help countries (China, Russia, etc).
    How will the costs be reduced? Cutting the dole and pension? Cutting the wages of nurses and teachers?

    How do you know the IMF will lend to us after we've already scrapped the deal we agreed? What makes you think China or Russia will risk giving us money? Russia themselves defaulted in the 90s! They are not charities!

    As I have stated elsewhere, I think default may be inevitable or necessary, but I want to know what SF are actually proposing - they claim there will be no cuts, even though we are 15 billion short!


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  • #1612
    Euroland
    Closed Accounts Posts: 634 ✭✭✭Euroland


    Monty Burnz wrote: »
    How will the costs be reduced? Cutting the wages of nurses and teachers?

    Yes, and the salaries of all other public sector workers.


  • #1613
    Monty Burnz
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,455 ✭✭✭✭Monty Burnz


    Euroland wrote: »

    SF is the only party which promises to impose public sector salary cap at €100K and significantly reduce all public salaries, which in turn would lead to reduction in public spending.
    The cap will only affect something like 1% of workers. The savings will be peanuts. So how much are they going to cut the salaries of nurses, teachers, civil servants by? Gerry Adams promised no cuts, so you may want to take it up with him. :confused:
    Euroland wrote: »
    As regards to borrowing, they are planning to spend some money from pension funds (the same way as advised our ECB bullies), but the rest they can borrow anywhere. Considering that the EU wouldn’t lend us in this case, they would have to shop around and would eventually find cheaper financing either directly from IMF or China, Russia, etc.
    They can't borrow from anywhere, this is the whole problem. China AND Russia already had the chance to lend to us in the bond markets but the coupon (basically the interest rate) on our bonds went up to 9% or so - a rate which we couldn't afford to borrow at because it would bankrupt us anyway.

    So now that we are in even more trouble, why would they lend to us cheaply, when before they wouldn't lend to us even at 9%??


  • #1614
    Monty Burnz
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,455 ✭✭✭✭Monty Burnz


    Euroland wrote: »
    Yes, and the salaries of all other public sector workers.
    By how much? And why is Gerry Adams saying there will be no cuts? Is he lying to get votes? :confused:


  • #1615
    Euroland
    Closed Accounts Posts: 634 ✭✭✭Euroland


    Monty Burnz wrote: »
    How do you know the IMF will lend to us after we've already scrapped the deal we agreed? What makes you think China or Russia will risk giving us money? Russia themselves defaulted in the 90s! They are not charities!

    As I have stated elsewhere, I think default may be inevitable or necessary, but I want to know what SF are actually proposing - they claim there will be no cuts, even though we are 15 billion short!

    If you look around you would notice that during recent global crisis many (even much poorer and riskier) countries managed to arrange financing directly from IMF at much lower interest rate that was imposed on us by bullies (“our friends”) from ECB (Germany).

    China and Russia in perfect financial shape and would be willing to help us in exchange for reasonable interest rate and befriending us as a nation. And not only they, I believe that even Sweden would be willing to lend us at cheaper rate then ECB (I have some insider info, but won’t disclose the details).


  • #1616
    Euroland
    Closed Accounts Posts: 634 ✭✭✭Euroland


    Monty Burnz wrote: »
    By how much? And why is Gerry Adams saying there will be no cuts? Is he lying to get votes? :confused:

    SF says there would be no cuts in numbers, but definitely there would be cuts in many salaries.


  • #1617
    Euroland
    Closed Accounts Posts: 634 ✭✭✭Euroland


    Monty Burnz wrote: »
    They can't borrow from anywhere, this is the whole problem. China AND Russia already had the chance to lend to us in the bond markets but the coupon (basically the interest rate) on our bonds went up to 9% or so - a rate which we couldn't afford to borrow at because it would bankrupt us anyway.

    So now that we are in even more trouble, why would they lend to us cheaply, when before they wouldn't lend to us even at 9%??


    No matter what interest rates trade on Ireland the speculators, until now all Ireland’s actual borrowings were within 4.5-5.5% range, and all were oversubscribed.


  • #1618
    Pete_Cavan
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,475 ✭✭✭Pete_Cavan


    Euroland wrote: »
    If you look around you would notice that during this recent global crisis many (even much poorer and riskier) countries managed to arrange financing directly from IMF at much lower interest rate that was imposed on us by bullies (“our friends”) from ECB (Germany).

    China and Russia in perfect financial shape and would be willing to help us in exchange for reasonable interest rate and befriending us as a nation. And not only they, I believe that even Sweden would be willing to lend us at cheaper rate then ECB (I have some insider info, but won’t disclose the details).

    First of all, the ECB are buying Irish bank bonds (~€150bn worth), while the EU and the IMF are giving us the bailout money. The only reason the ECB are buying that €150bn worth of bank bonds is so that we do not default on senior bondholder debt (which would cause problems throughout Europe). Were we to default, like SF want to, we would not only lose the bailout money, we would also lose the ECB money which keeps money in the ATMs.

    Defaulting is not an option because without the ECB money going to the banks, all our banks would collapse, everybody in this country would lose their deposits and businesses would not be able to continue trading because they would not be able to access working capital.

    I dont need "insider info" to tell you that there is absolutely no chance that China, Russia or Sweden would give us the €200bn we would need in the absence of the EU, IMF and ECB.


  • #1619
    Euroland
    Closed Accounts Posts: 634 ✭✭✭Euroland


    Pete_Cavan wrote: »
    First of all, the ECB are buying Irish bank bonds (~€150bn worth), while the EU and the IMF are giving us the bailout money. The only reason the ECB are buying that €150bn worth of bank bonds is so that we do not default on senior bondholder debt (which would cause problems throughout Europe). Were we to default, like SF want to, we would not only lose the bailout money, we would also lose the ECB money which keeps money in the ATMs.

    Defaulting is not an option because without the ECB money going to the banks, all our banks would collapse, everybody in this country would lose their deposits and businesses would not be able to continue trading because they would not be able to access working capital.

    I dont need "insider info" to tell you that there is absolutely no chance that China, Russia or Sweden would give us the €200bn we would need in the absence of the EU, IMF and ECB.

    You just use the scary tactics:

    1) We don’t need BEUR 200 for our ATMs, even a few BEUR would be more than enough
    2) We currently have some money and we will not return it, using it as initial WC
    3) We default on all bank debt and bankrupt all our problem banks, protecting only the deposits (at least to some reasonable level)
    4) Based on the above we would need much smaller (than BEUR 200) money to borrow
    5) That smaller money can be easily arranged directly either with IMF or from countries like China, Russia or Sweden
    6) We shouldn’t care about the future of the Euro zone, first of all we should care about the future of Ireland, which would be grim for the next generation if we accept the “bailout”


  • #1620
    Monty Burnz
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,455 ✭✭✭✭Monty Burnz


    Euroland wrote: »
    China and Russia in perfect financial shape and would be willing to help us in exchange for reasonable interest rate and befriending us as a nation. And not only they, I believe that even Sweden would be willing to lend us at cheaper rate then ECB (I have some insider info, but won’t disclose the details).
    Russia and China will lend to us cheaply because they want to be our international friends? :(

    Does anyone actually believe that??


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  • #1621
    Monty Burnz
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,455 ✭✭✭✭Monty Burnz


    Euroland wrote: »
    No matter what interest rates trade on Ireland the speculators, until now all Ireland’s actual borrowings were within 4.5-5.5% range, and all were oversubscribed.
    Who was buying them though? The ECB. They were propping us up, preventing our bond auctions from failing. If they don't buy (and they won't if we default) we are goosed.


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