Western Rail Corridor (all disused sections)

wild handlin · 31-01-2011 10:39pm

Westtip: Yes, I do understand where you are coming from, and I'm not opposed to the idea of greenways, as I think they are an ideal way to promote tourism to a region; however I believe an "area" which is nominated for a greenway should be maximised to it's full potential by choosing the most scenic route to maximise appeal to as wide amount of potential users as possable. Hence my reason for possible investment In the NW then maybe a more 'attractive' route should be explored first before a final decision is made.
Regarding purchasing of land/installment of fencing & the actual right of way I'm not sure the likes of a Strandhill-Sligo-Glencar greenway would cost anymore than the clearence/track removal/replacement of bridges/stabilation of embankments/provision of a right of way between Collooney and Claremorris. However, I do agree that one positive of the Collooney-Claremorris proposed greenway would be the retention of the 'right of way' over the current alignment.

Victor: apologies for going OT, however I'm sure that you appriecate that I'm simply offering alternatives to the proposed greenway project which may provide more tourism for the region-which after all is one of the main reasons for this proposal.

westtip · 01-02-2011 10:46am

wild handlin wrote: »

Westtip: Yes, I do understand where you are coming from, and I'm not opposed to the idea of greenways, as I think they are an ideal way to promote tourism to a region; however I believe an "area" which is nominated for a greenway should be maximised to it's full potential by choosing the most scenic route to maximise appeal to as wide amount of potential users as possable. Hence my reason for possible investment In the NW then maybe a more 'attractive' route should be explored first before a final decision is made.
Regarding purchasing of land/installment of fencing & the actual right of way I'm not sure the likes of a Strandhill-Sligo-Glencar greenway would cost anymore than the clearence/track removal/replacement of bridges/stabilation of embankments/provision of a right of way between Collooney and Claremorris. However, I do agree that one positive of the Collooney-Claremorris proposed greenway would be the retention of the 'right of way' over the current alignment.

Victor: apologies for going OT, however I'm sure that you appriecate that I'm simply offering alternatives to the proposed greenway project which may provide more tourism for the region-which after all is one of the main reasons for this proposal.

WH - please take a look at the national cycle network draft document in particualr the vision it sees:

Vision for the National Cycle Network
One of the first steps in this work was agreement on the “vision” of the National
Cycle Network. At the first meeting of the advisory group, the following was agreed
upon:
“In response to the Government’s National Cycle Policy Framework we will develop
a National Cycle Network that will allow users to cycle between the main urban areas
throughout the country. The network will be built to best practice standard, follow
routes that maximise the number of potential users and its attractiveness to users,
facilitate access for all, and ensure that short and long trips can be engaged in. The
National Cycle Network Scoping Study
5
routes will, where possible, avail of existing routes and State-owned lands, share use
with walking and form the basis for linkages to more comprehensive rural and urban
local networks.”

Its my emboldenment - but download the .pdf from the DOT website, you will see the route I have banged on about for so long is clearly identified as a potential greenway and it fits in with all the strategic aims of the NCN, I won't knock your idea but I feel its a distraction, the WRC north of Collooney is a perfect fit for the NCN, but even if it does happen it does not preclude the idea of a railway in ten fifteen 20 30 40 50 60 ........years. The land will remain in public ownership as a strategic communications strip of land.

Victor · 01-02-2011 11:16am

wild handlin wrote: »

I'm not opposed to the idea of greenways, as I think they are an ideal way to promote tourism to a region; however I believe an "area" which is nominated for a greenway should be maximised to it's full potential by choosing the most scenic route ... I'm simply offering alternatives to the proposed greenway project which may provide more tourism for the region-which after all is one of the main reasons for this proposal.

This isn't about greenways as such, its about preserving an alignment and putting it to some use and indeed, the comments by corktina, westtip and I have been picked up by others.

Transportuser09 · 01-02-2011 7:31pm

I agree with westtip that investment in the mainlines to Dublin would go a long way, Mullingar-Dublin could also be redoubled. The Sligo line is an example of how Intercity rail travel can prosper if the right service is put on, not long ago there were only 3 trains from Sligo to Dublin each way on weekdays. Now there is sufficient demand to justify a service every two hours. If it is to compete with the various bus routes Galway-Dublin must surely be a top priority for infrastructure improvement were it not for the recession.

However, with proper timetableing the Limerick-Galway and Tuam-Galway services have potential too, Tuam-Athenry might even be a more worthy candidate than phase 1 from a commuter perspective. I can't say the same for Tuam-Claremorris though, so perhaps it is that line which should be 'reserved' for potential future use. As for turning Coolooney-Claremorris into a cycleway, lets face it, the numbers are never going to be there to justify it reopening as a rail line. That said, can we be sure that the level of usage would be enough to justify it as a greenway over that length?

Victor · 02-02-2011 2:02am

Transportuser09 wrote: »

That said, can we be sure that the level of usage would be enough to justify it as a greenway over that length?

A greenway costs something like €100,000/km (assuming no major structures are required) with modest running costs, whereas a (basic) railway costs €2m/km-€10m/km with potentially high running costs.

Therefore, it is a lot easier for a greenway to justify itself economically.

westtip · 02-02-2011 12:26pm

Transportuser09 wrote: »

I agree with westtip that investment in the mainlines to Dublin would go a long way, Mullingar-Dublin could also be redoubled. The Sligo line is an example of how Intercity rail travel can prosper if the right service is put on, not long ago there were only 3 trains from Sligo to Dublin each way on weekdays. Now there is sufficient demand to justify a service every two hours. If it is to compete with the various bus routes Galway-Dublin must surely be a top priority for infrastructure improvement were it not for the recession.

However, with proper timetableing the Limerick-Galway and Tuam-Galway services have potential too, Tuam-Athenry might even be a more worthy candidate than phase 1 from a commuter perspective. I can't say the same for Tuam-Claremorris though, so perhaps it is that line which should be 'reserved' for potential future use. As for turning Coolooney-Claremorris into a cycleway, lets face it, the numbers are never going to be there to justify it reopening as a rail line. That said, can we be sure that the level of usage would be enough to justify it as a greenway over that length?

the numbers on the Great Western Greenway speak for themselves. Failte Ireland have carried out extensive market research on cycling in ireland and found out that people aren't coming because they don't feel safe on our roads, the greenway capital cost and maintenance is negligble as victor has pointe out - but this particular greenway has to be seen in terms of its potential as part of the national cycle network and what is on offer to holiday makers for say a weeks cycling in the West. As said before- look at the old rail map of donegal - think of the greenway potential there, link that to Mayo with the Sligo Mayo greenway and why not make a parallel greenway from day one when the WRC northern branch line happens (if it happens), its about mapping out the connecitivity of a network of safe cycling and walking routes across the country - the contribution to the tourist economy will be exponential.

I won't comment on the potential for the ~WRC my views are well known on the whole concept - I would reiterate what would serve the Whesht better is to continue to focus on the mainline services to Dublin. double tracking is far greater priority than the very limited demand for "commuter" services from Tuam to Galway or Claremorris to Galway, if it happens it happens - but I would now argue that the Greenway treatment shoudl not only be given immediately to Claremorris/Collooney but parallel greenway should also be given to the WRC northern branch line - to maximise use of the alignment.

wild handlin · 02-02-2011 12:27pm

Westtip: Yes I agree with what you are saying about the national cycle network RE: the inclusion of Claremorris-Collooney however I'm afraid (at the moment) I fail to see how this would really promote tourism for the region-and let's be honest, isn't this the main persuader for the cycle greenways? Look at the Kerry and Achill cycleways for example.
I fully agree that the preservation of the alignment is a positive thing, however I'm still sceptical of how much of a success this will be as opposed to somewhere else which is of more scenic beauty.

Victor: €100,000 per Km for the greenway, does this include embankment reinforcement, track removal, land stabilation, drainage and the approiate fencing/bollards per KM, or is it simply for the provision of the path? Remember, there could well be H&S issues over the use of 'non enclosed' barbed wire fencing on what is seen as a "public path-way", anythings possible in this mad world of H&S....!!

westtip · 02-02-2011 1:22pm

wild handlin wrote: »

Westtip: Yes I agree with what you are saying about the national cycle network RE: the inclusion of Claremorris-Collooney however I'm afraid (at the moment) I fail to see how this would really promote tourism for the region-and let's be honest, isn't this the main persuader for the cycle greenways? Look at the Kerry and Achill cycleways for example.
....!!

Its not just about tourism its about the quality of life for people in the towns along the way, this cycle walking route woudl be used by the good citizens living in Collooney/Ballisodare, Collaney, Tubercurry, Curry, Charlestown, Swinford, Kiltimagh and Claremorris, as a local amenity to take their daily walk cycle. AS for your comments about not being scenic, it may not be the ring of kerry or twelve pins of connemara but it is still very scenic and its about the greater good for the greater number of people. Is walking along the Royal canal in west Dublin very "scenic" and how many people take their daily walk along that route? Its about having safe places to walk and cycle and not just the overwhelming scenery. As for the 100k per Km this is the generally banded around cost of the Great western greenway - it favours very well with the cost of reinstating the railway.

One of the great things about our railway alignments which makes them so atractive is the fact that unlike our roads they have not been linear develeped with bungalow blitz - cycling along through open counrtyside looking at cows in the field in open countryside - isn't that scenic? It would be for me.

Re tourism - the concept of long distance walking cycling trails is proven successful formula all over the globe - why shouldn't a trail that runs from Sligo to Achill if the sligo mayo greenway were connected to the GWG, work as well any other long distance trail? It would be lovely 2/3 days cycling walking break.

CIE · 02-02-2011 1:56pm

Victor wrote: »

A greenway costs something like €100,000/km (assuming no major structures are required) with modest running costs, whereas a (basic) railway costs €2m/km-€10m/km with potentially high running costs.

Therefore, it is a lot easier for a greenway to justify itself economically

By comparison, a fully privatised railway running freight and actually not being hobbled by the state in its ability to compete with the roads network does not need to "justify" itself economically, since it would be a profitable venture capable of self-funding its infrastructure. The overly socialised transport policy of the country does not allow people to see that, it seems.

Unless you charge admission to a greenway, it will always require state subvention. The higher the use, the more attractive it would become to unsavoury elements as well.

corktina · 02-02-2011 2:04pm

WHAT freight? There s loads of tourists and cyclists around and they all SPEND MONEY here....a greenway would pay for itself many times over in tourist revenue.Oh and the more people attracted to it, the LESS unsavoury elements would be there...

westtip · 02-02-2011 3:07pm

CIE wrote: »

By comparison, a fully privatised railway running freight and actually not being hobbled by the state in its ability to compete with the roads network does not need to "justify" itself economically, since it would be a profitable venture capable of self-funding its infrastructure. The overly socialised transport policy of the country does not allow people to see that, it seems.

Unless you charge admission to a greenway, it will always require state subvention. The higher the use, the more attractive it would become to unsavoury elements as well.

Ok so let me ask would you really invest in the WRC as an economic venture??

Charge admission to a footpath - well pardon me but there have been some rather bizarre posts on this thread (some from me BTW), but this one is right up there. And what's with all this negativity about anti-social behaviour on a greenway. I have not heard of anything of the kind on the GWG or any other greenway for that matter - are the marauding hun just sitting waiting there for this opportunity for vandalism and anti social behaviour in places like Kiltimagh. For goodness sake, are you suggesting we abandon the idea of any civic amenity lest "unsavoury elements" turn up on our doorstep - In a civilised society the better the amenities you provide the better the citizens respect them. And pray tell me what level of "subvention" will a frigging greenway need - this one really baffles me - lets compare it to say the subvention required on the Ennis - Athenry lrail line.

I am sorry CIE but your arguments this time have completely baffled me - Cop on as my eight year old would say.

corktina · 02-02-2011 3:33pm

CIE would go to any lengths to try and drum up a pro-rail arguement. I can see where he's coming from in doing this, as its obviously his hobby and he's fighting a (lone) rearguard action to defend it, but its time he saw the writing on the wall and , as you say, copped on

Put your efforts, my friend, into supporting the sarea where IE could well do better (better than the mways even) ie commuter and InterCity.You are flogging a dead horse with the WRC (even the open bit isnt going to last too long id guess

westtip · 02-02-2011 4:54pm

Corky do you ever get the feeling you are banging your head against a brick wall?

corktina · 02-02-2011 5:32pm

hurtz dunnit!

Victor · 02-02-2011 6:36pm

wild handlin wrote: »

Victor: €100,000 per Km for the greenway, does this include embankment reinforcement, track removal, land stabilation, drainage and the approiate fencing/bollards per KM, or is it simply for the provision of the path? Remember, there could well be H&S issues over the use of 'non enclosed' barbed wire fencing on what is seen as a "public path-way", anythings possible in this mad world of H&S....!!

I'm basing it on the cost of Mulrany. Remember a person on a bike weighs all of 50kg per wheel (luggage included), not several tonnes - embankment reinforcement would be rather modest. And even the largest group of cyclists on such an operation is not going to weigh hundreds of tonnes.

Admittedly there may be a track removal cost that wasn't there for Mulrany.

CIE wrote: »

By comparison, a fully privatised railway running freight and actually not being hobbled by the state in its ability to compete with the roads network does not need to "justify" itself economically, since it would be a profitable venture capable of self-funding its infrastructure. The overly socialised transport policy of the country does not allow people to see that, it seems.

How many km would it have?

Unless you charge admission to a greenway, it will always require state subvention.

You need to consider the economic case (cost v income, across the whole economy), not just the financial one (cost v income, for the operation only).

The higher the use, the more attractive it would become to unsavoury elements as well.

What type of second rate gurrier heads 5km outside town to down some grafitti?

dowlingm · 02-02-2011 7:12pm

The Fenit greenway looks like it's going to be a tear out, so that should give some guidelines as to what the Claremorris-Collooney one would cost.

wild handlin · 02-02-2011 7:26pm

Victor: You are indeed correct about the weight of bikes/people using the path, but remember you are going to have to firm up the embankments/bridges before excavators can come along to clear track/level off embankments/lay foundations for the path.
Also regarding what Westtip said about the fencing already being installed; this was only boundry fencing which was simply barbed wire and sheep wire. New fencing would probably have to be erected in any case.

Regarding the case of railfreight, CIE is right regarding the return investment, railfreight has more than proved profitable. Corktina-there is PLENTY of railfreight if there was a will then there's always a way.

corktina · 02-02-2011 8:10pm

wild handlin wrote: »

. Corktina-there is PLENTY of railfreight if there was a will then there's always a way.

no there isnt....not VIABLE railfrieght anyway. Name one flow that could be instigated where trucks wouldnt be quicker and/or cheaper. This country is too small, the longest possible railhaul from port to customer would be about 100 miles.

wild handlin · 02-02-2011 9:32pm

I can name several...

Bulk timber from Mayo/Donegal - Waterford,

Bulk Timber from Galway/Clare/Kerry - Waterford,

Bulk Cement from Limerick - Waterford,

Bulk container trains from Dublin - Cork/Mayo,

If railfreight is so unviable then how come in the 70's, 80's, and 90's there were container trains from Dublin to Belfast, Sligo, Ballina, Galway, Limerick, Mallow, Tralee, Cork, Waterford? Then there were bulk cement trains to many locations too (including through the recession of the 80's), not to mention bitumen, oil, coal, steel, fertilizer and many other comodities which virtually stopped being carried over night. It has been proven in the UK that distance is not an issue, with several flows operating no more than 30 miles.

goingnowhere · 02-02-2011 10:17pm

wild handlin wrote: »

If railfreight is so unviable then how come in the 70's, 80's, and 90's there were container trains from Dublin to Belfast, Sligo, Ballina, Galway, Limerick, Mallow, Tralee, Cork, Waterford? Then there were bulk cement trains to many locations too (including through the recession of the 80's), not to mention bitumen, oil, coal, steel, fertilizer and many other comodities which virtually stopped being carried over night.

Bell Lines, IFI, Asahi and so on (its a very long list) either closed down, left Ireland for a cheaper location, or went to the wall

I'll give you one guess as to why the cement trains have stopped, hint it begins with r

corktina · 02-02-2011 10:36pm

wild handlin wrote: »

I can name several...

Bulk timber from Mayo/Donegal - Waterford,

Bulk Timber from Galway/Clare/Kerry - Waterford,

Bulk Cement from Limerick - Waterford,

Bulk container trains from Dublin - Cork/Mayo,

If railfreight is so unviable then how come in the 70's, 80's, and 90's there were container trains from Dublin to Belfast, Sligo, Ballina, Galway, Limerick, Mallow, Tralee, Cork, Waterford? Then there were bulk cement trains to many locations too (including through the recession of the 80's), not to mention bitumen, oil, coal, steel, fertilizer and many other comodities which virtually stopped being carried over night. It has been proven in the UK that distance is not an issue, with several flows operating no more than 30 miles.

theyve been done, theyve stopped....theyd still be there if they were VIABLE.
rail does not go from and to where the freight is needed and transhippng to road for perhaps the start AND end of a journey is EXPENSIVE and TIME-CONDSUMING.

The system firms work on nowadays is "just in time" Rail cannot do this as it has to deliver a train load all at once rather than a truck once an hour 24/7

Judgement Day · 02-02-2011 10:40pm

goingnowhere wrote: »

Bell Lines, IFI, Asahi and so on (its a very long list) either closed down, left Ireland for a cheaper location, or went to the wall

I'll give you one guess as to why the cement trains have stopped, hint it begins with r

Yeah,yeah we know all about companies like Bell, IFI etc but what about the removal of freight facilities such as at Killarney where they were in use - to faciliate a retail development? There was a rush to dismantle, disconnect and sell off freight yards across the country. It's all been said before but until such time as private interests are allowed access to the network nothing is going to change.

wild handlin · 02-02-2011 11:09pm

Judgement Day has summed up why there is so little freight left here by rail, the potential flows are there, it just appears that the railway company/government doesn't have the interest to run the services currently.

Going no-where; you mentioned the reason that the cement trains had stopped. During the 80's (when the recession was arguably worse than what it is today) there were still cement trains by the dozen! Also, from 2000 onwards when the Celtic Tiger took off why did cement going by rail tail off? The demand was there, just not the interest to run the services. You also mentioned the closure of several industries as the reason for the drop in railfreight, and yes whilst the likes of Bell and Ashai shutting down meant that the flows were no more, but for the likes of Bell these services have been taken over by other operators. Also, it's worth noting that bulk fertilizer had ceased to go by rail before the announced closure of IFI.

Corktina; if what your sayingbis correct then how come practically every other country in the EU can manage it, but not Ireland? And like I pointed out in my previous posts a number of short distance flows in the Uk continue to flourish.

mgmt · 03-02-2011 1:15am

wild handlin wrote: »

Judgement Day has summed up why there is so little freight left here by rail, the potential flows are there, it just appears that the railway company/government doesn't have the interest to run the services currently.

Going no-where; you mentioned the reason that the cement trains had stopped. During the 80's (when the recession was arguably worse than what it is today) there were still cement trains by the dozen! Also, from 2000 onwards when the Celtic Tiger took off why did cement going by rail tail off? The demand was there, just not the interest to run the services. You also mentioned the closure of several industries as the reason for the drop in railfreight, and yes whilst the likes of Bell and Ashai shutting down meant that the flows were no more, but for the likes of Bell these services have been taken over by other operators. Also, it's worth noting that bulk fertilizer had ceased to go by rail before the announced closure of IFI.

Corktina; if what your sayingbis correct then how come practically every other country in the EU can manage it, but not Ireland? And like I pointed out in my previous posts a number of short distance flows in the Uk continue to flourish.

Corktina mentioned this, but companies operate nowadays on "Just in Time" supply purchasing i.e only ordering stock when it is needed, thereby eliminating storage costs. This is not compatible with rail freight.

foggy_lad · 03-02-2011 1:31am

railfreight died when general operatives went all posh and started looking for more than £200/week gross wages. it became just too darn expensive to pay several men to transfer timber containers etc from truck to train at point A then from train back to truck at point B C D etc. and most times because of union rules these same men would be sitting around for several hours doing nothing except going into overtime because a train broke down or was delayed by some other CIE/IE incompetance.

back in the day twenty men could empty a cement train in a very short time but then several unions, health and safety and wanting a decent wage took over and it became cheaper to do freight by road!

the western fail corridor is never going to pay its way or become anything more than a greenway when lines like it and waterford-limerick jctn are shut down due to losses and low passenger numbers as well as shortages in rolling stock and the cost of gatekeepers and cost of running crews around the country in taxis.

CIE · 03-02-2011 2:58am

wild handlin wrote: »

Judgement Day has summed up why there is so little freight left here by rail, the potential flows are there, it just appears that the railway company/government doesn't have the interest to run the services currently

That's basically it. It has to be gotten out of government hands altogether.

wild handlin wrote: »

Going no-where; you mentioned the reason that the cement trains had stopped. During the 80's (when the recession was arguably worse than what it is today) there were still cement trains by the dozen! Also, from 2000 onwards when the Celtic Tiger took off why did cement going by rail tail off? The demand was there, just not the interest to run the services. You also mentioned the closure of several industries as the reason for the drop in railfreight, and yes whilst the likes of Bell and Ashai shutting down meant that the flows were no more, but for the likes of Bell these services have been taken over by other operators. Also, it's worth noting that bulk fertilizer had ceased to go by rail before the announced closure of IFI.

Corktina; if what you're saying is correct then how come practically every other country in the EU can manage it, but not Ireland? And like I pointed out in my previous posts a number of short distance flows in the UK continue to flourish.

It seems to be the "small country" thinking. Great what the EU did to the Celtic Tiger, right? If anyone ever has a read of the Acquis Communautaire, you'll see how slanted it is towards the bigger countries in the EU, and one in particular (the one that's having its second Wirtschaftwunder, incidentally).

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jjVnWQi62Y4

I'm also just a tiny bit tired of hearing about curves in the track being blamed for slowing down operating speeds. Try one of these tilting Class 221s out on the curviest of alignments and see how fast you can go.

corktina · 03-02-2011 5:37am

have you any idea what the track maintenace costs would be to run one of those? or the capital costs to buy one? or how you are going to fill one?

CIE · 03-02-2011 8:11am

corktina wrote: »

have you any idea what the track maintenace costs would be to run one of those? or the capital costs to buy one? or how you are going to fill one?

WADR, it looks like you're asking empty questions. You saying that Ireland is so poor as to not be able to afford normal track maintenance for the kind of railway service that has existed since the latter 20th century? Ireland's apparently not so poor as to be able to afford new motorways that cost multiple times more in continuous maintenance costs aside from initial capital costs, never mind acres upon acres of land that was previously arable on top of other environmental costs. Is Ireland a modern nation or not?

corktina · 03-02-2011 8:56am

Ireland certainly is too poor to run empty tilting trains!
also too poor to run subsidised freight trains come to that!
New record please

westtip · 03-02-2011 10:33am

corktina wrote: »

Ireland certainly is too poor to run empty tilting trains!
also too poor to run subsidised freight trains come to that!
New record please

Especially up and down a branch line in the west of Ireland - upon which there is no proven demand for any rail services, and on a section of line on that route where there was deemed to be sufficient demand - that demand is not apperently their (read the anecdotal evidence a few posts back about WRC south to Ennis). It would be wonderful to have tilting trains trundlign around every backwater, but it ain't going to happen.

We have all debated this bloody WRC long and hard I think all our views are well established, however Let me ask the likes of CIE this scenario:

My greenway idea for Claremorris/Collooney could be achieved for about 7 million, within two years with the will. Accept one thing please a rail line cannot happen on this line until the bit in the middle between Athenry and Claremorris is done. What kind of response do you think there is going to be in the country if this capital project (~WRC phase 2 and 3) is given the go ahead in the current climate? In other words WRC phase 2/3 will not happen in the lifetime of the next Dail - conjecture I know but it will be long fingered by any government, and in any event it may yet be kyboshed by the change in circumstances and apparent lack of demand that has come from the WRC south of Athenry to Ennis - which by all counts is not being utilised to the extent WOT claimed it would be,t he West on Track arguments about the corridor have it seems been discredited - believe me if numbers were big on this line - we would be hearing about it all the time from WOT. Remember all the statements about - now this is open we have to see it used before we progress with phases 2 and 3 (why do you think NOTHING has really happened on phase 2 apart from on going studies - about which we know nothing). Many of us here want to see good train services on the existing lines - believe me I REALLY DO want to see Sligo - Dublin (or at least Longford) double tracked - I REALLY DO want to see Dublin Galway double tracked. The WRC is such a side show - the train lobbyists I think have been hoodwinked about. I am not going to even enter debates about interconnectors and metro north etc, Dublin is our primary economic driver - and living in the west I want to see Dublins connectivities improved, I want to see Dublin succeed economically - because Dublin drives the national economy, Dublin does well the west does well.

Arguments about the WRC are futile, Cos the rail line is not going to happen north of Athenry not in my lifetime nor many others writing on these boards, face facts the world has changed, for the better? I really don't know, but it has changed and all over Europe, lines like the WRC have laid idle for yeas and have been re-invented as trails for tourists. This trend you are not going to change.

Face facts, like it or not the days of breaking goods down in a goods yard for redistrituion in small retail shops in town centres has gone. We now shop in Superwarehouses on the edge of towns - we get there like it or not in cars. In our local shops and pubs every item we purchase is bought to us by road - this is not going to change, and re-opening the WRC is not going to mean all of a sudden Spar, Londis and Supervalu are going to change their supply chains, Tesco are not going to have 40 foot containers coming into Ballina to be redistributed to Foxford, Ballina and Castlebar stores.

My genuine advise to any train lobbyist for the WRC is go expend your energy on something worthwhile for the future of trains in Ireland - because the future of rail in Ireland is not to be found in Tuam, Claremorris, or Kilitmagh. If the rail line does get re-opened congratulations - it will be an empty victory cos it will make not one jot of difference to 99% of the population in the west. Whats more lets be realistic - there will be what a max of 4 trains a day on the line - which wil not suit flexible working hours, will not compete with the bus, and will lead to less and less use of the line - so why bother - My ultimate question for a train lobbyist is just where does the WRC fit in terms of national rail development project priorities - Lets be honest on this folk - it is somewhere between diddly and squat, which is why it is not going to happen, which is why West on Track are completely and utterly in the wilderness.

BTW - West on Track in riposte to the Irish Times Article went on the airways out west on Monday getting onto the Midwest radio at lunchtime denying the report that Enda is now against the WRC. For once they were very defensive - but the good news is they said on air they have no problem with parallel greenways where they can be achieved so now we need to ask West on Track - why not put a parallel greenway all the way along the WRC from Athenry to Tuam/Claremorris from day one of laying the new track.

Ah -- now thats good I needed to get that off my chest!!!!

Western Rail Corridor (all disused sections)

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