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The Status Of Irish.
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SkepticOne wrote: »I will address some of the points in the article but first, please address my point about misallocation of resources, i.e. that resources should be concentrated on the early years.
From Conradh Na Gaeilge's Education policy. I did link to this in the OP.One subject, as well as Irish, should be through the medium of Irish to all primary pupils, initially on a pilot basis with the necessary support and training;The truth is that, yes you can raise the "status" of something by making it compulsory, but that is simply status within a very narrow context. It has nothing to do with status in the real world, but you know, I suspect for people who want compulsory Irish lessons for everyone, the real status of the language is unimportant. The sort of status they want is the status of something forced. It is not a case of the Irish language being a great language and therefore needs to be compulsory, it is great because it is compulsory and any retreat from compulsion is to be resisted even if it is a good thing for the language in the real world.
No, Irish language enthusiasts do everything possible to raise the status of the language.
This can be seen very clearly in NI,
Naisc
That project and projects like it else where are designed to raise the status of Irish in their communities and do so very well.
As a result in Belfast, where there is also a Cultúrlann, The Irish language has seen significant growth to the stage that they are now trying to establish a 'Gaelthacht Quarter' In the city.0 -
I'd favour making it optional. I fail to see the point in forcing people with poor aptitudes for leaning foreign languages to learn Irish. And yes is it a foreign language to them.
Let it be something that only those interested in it pick to learn and quality of teaching and the level of Irish taught in the classroom can rise accordingly resulting in people with LC Irish having something better for their time spent at the subject.
I don't think that is a problem as is, There are exemptions for people with learning Difficulties. One of the failings of the system now is that to many get out of Irish through the exemptions. 50% of those exempt from Irish learn other languages.You persistantly ignore the possibility that the children do not wish to speak Irish and are callously determined that they can be forced to speak Irish through 'better teaching'.
The Children? I would certainly ignore the Idea that all of them are not open to learning Irish, A small proportion possibly are not open to it but until it is tried there is no real way to see what kind of proportion that is, I doubt it is a very significant proportion in any case.
You consistently ignore the possibility that the vast majority are open to learning Irish if it is tought correctly.Indicating a limit to their commitment to maintaining Irish as a spoken language in the community. Commitment to a cause requires effort and sacrifice.
You can be as commited as you like, if there isent a community to speak it with then it is hardly possible to speak it with them every day:rolleyes:Other than the cold fact that the majority of Irish people don't speak Irish and make no active effort to learn it?
You are confusing active commitment to being open to something.;)So, by your logic, anyone who does not speak Irish, is simply an Irish speaker who does not speak Irish? That's one way to keep your numbers up.
No, My logic is that if someone fails to become fluent in Irish in an education System that is incapable if teaching them to be fluent in Irish it is not an indication that they reject Irish but rather the inevitable consequence of a poor system.Why not flip this whole debate on its head ..
Lets campaign for all teaching, for all subjects, in all schools, to be in Irish.
Why ?
1. At 4 years of age, no child knows what they want to be taught and has no boundaries in what they are willing to learn. It will make no difference to the kids what language they are taught in. At that age it will simply be the norm and they will all be fluent in a matter of months.
2. If a child learns a language at this age, it will not be a burden or a hinderance to learning of any other subject in later life. In fact is likely to make learning 3rd and 4th languages considerably easier.
3. We will no longer have to pay any extra money to any teacher to teach through Irish, because they all will have too.
4. We can merge all the Gael schools back into the main stream schools, making much better use out of our very limited resources. This will reduce the class size average throughout the country.
5. It is my understanding that all our primary school teachers are already trained to teach in Irish, so there is no retraining to do.
6. It is our national language and we should all be able to speak it.
This could be instigated in the next school year for junior infants and rolled up year after year. This allows time to work on the syllabus for the later years now.
For the record;
I dont speak Irish.
The problem there is that the pool of teachers that would be competent to teach entirely through Irish is too small, That is why I support the natural growth of Gaelscoileanna in line with demand, that will allow the pool of competent teachers to grow over time.0 -
deise go deo wrote: »The problem there is that the pool of teachers that would be competent to teach entirely through Irish is too small, That is why I support the natural growth of Gaelscoileanna in line with demand, that will allow the pool of competent teachers to grow over time.
Perhaps I am totally out of touch here, but is it not the case that all our primary teachers are trained to teach in the Irish language ?
Is this not a pre-requisite of their training ?
What you are suggesting is a "Two tier school system" ?
A two tier school system is simply not acceptable in either social or financial terms.
This will mean the constant split of resources that are already in very short supply and over the coming 5 years will continue to shrink.
We need one good school system.
If it is all through Irish than this debate simply disappears.
We can start training our teachers to teach through irish now and in 5 years we can start the system.0 -
Perhaps I am totally out of touch here, but is it not the case that all our primary teachers are trained to teach in the Irish language ?
Is this not a pre-requisite of their training ?
What you are suggesting is a "Two tier school system" ?
A two tier school system is simply not acceptable in either social or financial terms.
This will mean the constant split of resources that are already in very short supply and over the coming 5 years will continue to shrink.
We need one good school system.
If it is all through Irish than this debate simply disappears.
We can start training our teachers to teach through irish now and in 5 years we can start the system.
All teachers are required to have a decent standard of Irish but that dosent mean they are at a level to teach Entirly through Irish, There are subject specific tecnical terms and phrases that they would not know etc.
Gaelscoileanna dont cause a two teir system and dont split resourses in Effect, they are the same as any other school, they just teach through Irish instead of English.0 -
deise go deo wrote: »All teachers are required to have a decent standard of Irish but that dosent mean they are at a level to teach Entirly through Irish, There are subject specific tecnical terms and phrases that they would not know etc.
Gaelscoileanna dont cause a two teir system and dont split resourses in Effect, they are the same as any other school, they just teach through Irish instead of English.
Gaelscoileanna more often than not exist in the same geographical (catchment) area, on seperate grounds with seperate buildings as other national schools.
If the Gaelscoileanna did not exist, these children would attend the traditional national school.
You can not begin to tell me that there is no increase in running costs for a seperate school.
This is a clear and simple duplification of services.
Additional Ground rent
additional Building Costs
Additional Staffing costs
Additional Insurance costs
The duplication of resource materials and equipment
etc, etc
However, that is not my point, nor do I wish to argue this point incessantly.
You are an advocate of the Irish language.
I will assume the following;
You wish to see all people in Ireland speak Irish as their Mother tongue.
You wish to see all children educated through the Irish Language.
To achieve this do you not agree that we need to have all teachers in all schools teach all subject through Irish ?
Why beat around the bush with Gaelscoileanna and other peripheral schemes ?
Can you not agree that the complete conversion of the school system to the Irish language will achieve your goals in the shortest time and most economical way ?0 -
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deise go deo wrote: »I don't think that is a problem as is, There are exemptions for people with learning Difficulties. One of the failings of the system now is that to many get out of Irish through the exemptions. 50% of those exempt from Irish learn other languages.
You don't need a learning difficulty to have a poor aptitude for language learning. What point is there in forcing these people to learn? Really? They come out with an extremely low level of the language, so low as to being fairly pointless.0 -
Gaelscoileanna more often than not exist in the same geographical (catchment) area, on seperate grounds with seperate buildings as other national schools.
If the Gaelscoileanna did not exist, these children would attend the traditional national school.
You can not begin to tell me that there is no increase in running costs for a seperate school.
This is a clear and simple duplification of services.
Additional Ground rent
additional Building Costs
Additional Staffing costs
Additional Insurance costs
The duplication of resource materials and equipment
etc, etc
However, that is not my point, nor do I wish to argue this point incessantly.
Gaelscoileanna were set up by parents and are only recognised if they have the numbers to justify them.You are an advocate of the Irish language.
I will assume the following;
You wish to see all people in Ireland speak Irish as their Mother tongue.
You wish to see all children eductated through the Irish Language.
To achieve this do you not agree that we need to have all teachers in all schools teach all subject through Irish ?
Why beat around the bush with Gaelscoileanna and other peripheral schemes ?
Can you not agree that the complete conversion of the school system to the Irish language will achieve your goals in the shortest time and most economical way ?
I wish to see Irish grow as a spoken Language, I dont nessarily believe that Everyone should have Irish as their First language, I would prefer true Bi-Lingualism as the Ideal.
Yes, compleat conversion of the system to Irish Medium education would be the fastest way to do it, But I dont think it is the best way to do it as you would have a suatation where teachers are teaching through a language they are not Entirely comfortable with, That would lead to a drop in standards in education and would not be in the Countries Interest.
That is why I support the growth Of the Gaelscoileanna. I believe that they will gradually replace English medium Education in many areas Over time while allowing the pool of teachers who can teach through Irish to grow Natuarly. As it is there are Ten Gaelscoil Campaghains waiting for State recognition. The growth of the Gaelscoil movement is Increadable over the past 30 years And there is no indication that it is slacking off.0 -
You don't need a learning difficulty to have a poor aptitude for language learning. What point is there in forcing these people to learn? Really? They come out with an extremely low level of the language, so low as to being fairly pointless.
As it is everyone must in effect learn a language anyway, even if it isent Irish, You get to choose which language, Usually French or German but learning a languages is not something you can in practice choose not to do.0 -
All children learn thier own language as they grow.
Some learn slower than others but in the end we all have enough of our mother tongue to get by.
In multilingual homes they often learn two or more languages.
These same children can have learning disabilities in reading, writing in any or all of these languages or even in math.
Have you ever heard of any child being allowed not to take math because of a learning difficulty ?
We need to stop thinking of Irish as a school subject and start thinking of it as simply our language.0 -
deise go deo wrote: »Never mind that this is not what was being aimed for, it ended up in teachers becoming unemployed, Languages are considered an important part of education and for good reason, The Collapse of language learning in Britain was nothing short of a disaster.
Yeah, real world languages that are used by millions of people all over the world, not a language that is ony used by a few thousand people on the west of ireland.
I'll tell you what, why dont we make Irish students take compulsory Ancient Greek or Babylonian....? Because they are redundant languages hardly spoken by anyone these days and are of no use in the real world. They will not lead to anyone getting a job and contributing to society. Sound familiar? The only difference with the Irish language is we have a sentimental cultural attachment to it, so of course we don't want to see it go extinct. But as this is the only reason for learning it, way too much money and time is wasted on it which could be better spent learning stuff that is actually important and will enable students to contribute back to society.
The reason students are uninterested in Irish is because they know it is irrelevant and worthless when it comes to getting a job. For feck sake myself and my classmates had that figured out before we even left primary school twenty years ago.
You never addressed my other point - why should Irish be compulsory while other, more important, subjects are optional. So here it is again -
It's the same here in Ireland. The Irish language has basically no value in the real world as opposed to subjects like I.T., engineering, science, etc... Why should subjects like these be optional, when they are waay wayy more useful to students when it comes to finding a job and putting food on the table than Irish which is compulsory? We have hundreds of thousands students wasting millions of hours every year learning something that +99% of them will never even use when they leave school and that has no practical value in the real world. If students choose to study Irish, thats fair enough, but it shouldn't be rammed down their throats.0 -
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gimme5minutes wrote: »Yeah, real world languages that are used by millions of people all over the world, not a language that is ony used by a few thousand people on the west of ireland.
I'll tell you what, why dont we make Irish students take compulsory Ancient Greek or Babylonian....? Because they are redundant languages hardly spoken by anyone these days and are of no use in the real world. They will not lead to anyone getting a job and contributing to society. Sound familiar? The only difference with the Irish language is we have a sentimental cultural attachment to it, so of course we don't want to see it go extinct. But as this is the only reason for learning it, way too much money and time is wasted on it which could be better spent learning stuff that is actually important and will enable students to contribute back to society.
The reason students are uninterested in Irish is because they know it is irrelevant and worthless when it comes to getting a job. For feck sake myself and my classmates had that figured out before we even left primary school twenty years ago.
You never addressed my other point - why should Irish be compulsory while other, more important, subjects are optional. So here it is again -
It's the same here in Ireland. The Irish language has basically no value in the real world as opposed to subjects like I.T., engineering, science, etc... Why should subjects like these be optional, when they are waay wayy more useful to students when it comes to finding a job and putting food on the table than Irish which is compulsory? We have hundreds of thousands students wasting millions of hours every year learning something that +99% of them will never even use when they leave school and that has no practical value in the real world. If students choose to study Irish, thats fair enough, but it shouldn't be rammed down their throats.
There are, and this is fact. More Jobs and oppertunities to use Irish than there are for any other second language in this Country. Ignore it if you want but that is reality.
I have already addressed your second point.
There is no benifit to having all students learn a subject like Geography or Engineering over some students learning those subjects.0 -
How many of these job opportunities do not depend directly or indirectly on state funding?deise go deo wrote: »There are, and this is fact. More Jobs and oppertunities to use Irish than there are for any other second language in this Country. Ignore it if you want but that is reality.
For example, that TV production company, if TG4 loses its rather generous state subsidy, will it have a customer for its Irish-language programming?
The bulk of the jobs that you refer to art part of the massive 'make-work' scheme that the Irish lobby defends through forcing children to learn Irish and by demanding needless translation services.
We can save a lot of money by stopping this madness and allowing the true Irish language enthusiasts to show real personal commitment to preserving their language.0 -
cyclopath2001 wrote: »We can save a lot of money by stopping this madness and allowing the true Irish language enthusiasts to show real personal commitment to preserving their language.
Like this? Gaelscoil Rath Tó0 -
I take it, by your silence, that the 'More Jobs and oppertunities to use Irish than there are for any other second language in this Country' are all makey-up jobs that depend on state funding? Jobs that do not contribute to the economy?
Nice effort, but why is the school not recognised?deise go deo wrote: »Like this? Gaelscoil Rath Tó0 -
cyclopath2001 wrote: »Nice effort, but why is the school not recognised?
The state decided to bactrack on their own predictions on the need for a new school in the area. The parents decided to go ahead and prove them wrong.0 -
deise go deo wrote: »As it is everyone must in effect learn a language anyway, even if it isent Irish, You get to choose which language, Usually French or German but learning a languages is not something you can in practice choose not to do.
Only because of a silly system that requires a foreign language and Irish to enter most colleges in this country. But for those not going to 3rd level there is very little point in forcing them to do any language against their will.0 -
deise go deo,
You made two points that I want to correct. First of all an Cheathrú Gaeltachta/the Gaeltacht Quarter in Belfast is there now.
Secondly there are 16 campaigns for new gaelscoileanna in Ireland, not ten, and there is an immediate interest in setting up new gaelscoileanna at primary level in six other areas. I think that the eight for the second-level are more important in the short-term in terms of which ones should be given recognition as a priority.
http://www.gaelscoileanna.ie/schools/scoileanna-nua/?lang=iecyclopath2001 wrote: »
We can save a lot of money by stopping this madness and allowing the true Irish language enthusiasts to show real personal commitment to preserving their language.
Hopefully the next FG/LP Govt. will audit the money spent on Irish so that we get better value for money. The money spent on TG4 and the effect of that on independent television companies is already money well spent though I think. I mean that I think that it is audited well.
Those civil service Irish exams are hard. I wouldn't pass one of them. There would be a lot of people working in the Department of Education and Skills I would say who have good Irish but not the level to pass the exams in it. You need to have excellent Irish to pass those exams.0 -
deise go deo wrote: »Gaelscoileanna were set up by parents and are only recognised if they have the numbers to justify them.
I wish to see Irish grow as a spoken Language, I dont nessarily believe that Everyone should have Irish as their First language, I would prefer true Bi-Lingualism as the Ideal.
Yes, compleat conversion of the system to Irish Medium education would be the fastest way to do it, But I dont think it is the best way to do it as you would have a suatation where teachers are teaching through a language they are not Entirely comfortable with, That would lead to a drop in standards in education and would not be in the Countries Interest.
That is why I support the growth Of the Gaelscoileanna. I believe that they will gradually replace English medium Education in many areas Over time while allowing the pool of teachers who can teach through Irish to grow Natuarly. As it is there are Ten Gaelscoil Campaghains waiting for State recognition. The growth of the Gaelscoil movement is Increadable over the past 30 years And there is no indication that it is slacking off.
True Bi-lingualism will be a by-product of an all Irish speaking education system. Which language an individual chooses to speak in his or her daily life is a free choice.
I repeat that my understanding that, All primary school teachers in Ireland, are already meant to be trained to teach all subjects through Irish.
They are being trained to teach in the Irish state.
This is a reasonable request and one that I am sure you will agree with.
In this last paragraph you are advocating the continous slow growth of Gaelscoileanna which will lead to a continous slow decline of English speaking schools.
This is in effect a dual school, or two tier system.
One in growth and one in decline.
Will this in effect mean that in the end the currently small school buildings of the Gaelscoileanna will continue to expand until they are the same size as todays traditional schools buildings. And the country will be left with twice as many schools as we need ?
Or do you mean that in the end you would like to see half our schools teaching in Irish and half in English ? Forcing parents to decide which language they choose for their children.0 -
Has it ever crossed your mind that parents may not want their children educated in Irish?True Bi-lingualism will be a by-product of an all Irish speaking education system. Which language an individual chooses to speak in his or her daily life is a free choice.
I repeat that my understanding that, All primary school teachers in Ireland, are already meant to be trained to teach all subjects through Irish.
They are being trained to teach in the Irish state.
This is a reasonable request and one that I am sure you will agree with.
In this last paragraph you are advocating the continous slow growth of Gaelscoileanna which will lead to a continous slow decline of English speaking schools.
This is in effect a dual school, or two tier system.
One in growth and one in decline.
Will this in effect mean that in the end the currently small school buildings of the Gaelscoileanna will continue to expand until they are the same size as todays traditional schools buildings. And the country will be left with twice as many schools as we need ?
Or do you mean that in the end you would like to see half our schools teaching in Irish and half in English ? Forcing parents to decide which language they choose for their children.0 -
Is this the whole story and is there an independent source for this explanation?deise go deo wrote: »The state decided to bactrack on their own predictions on the need for a new school in the area. The parents decided to go ahead and prove them wrong.
Would it be correct to say that these were not funded by the Irish language community?Darren J. Prior wrote:You made two points that I want to correct. First of all an Cheathrú Gaeltachta/the Gaeltacht Quarter in Belfast is there now.0 -
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cyclopath2001 wrote: »Would it be correct to say that these were not funded by the Irish language community?
Well it came about by three reasons and funding was essential for two of them. Firstly the Bóthar Seoighe/the Shaws Road Gaeltacht was set up, in the early 70's I think. No funding was needed.
The gaelscoileanna were set up. State funding was needed.
Forbairt Feirste worked with the business sector in the area to help them have Irish/bilingual signage and I believe sometimes to have Irish-speaking staff on request. Funding was needed for Forbairt Feirste.
I do decry the amount of waffle though in relation to the Irish language. People seem to think that groups or funded groups are necessary to do all work whereas in fact individual activists can do a lot of the work e.g. putting up Irish or bilingual signs. I have myself put up Irish/bilingual signs in around 40 places in Dublin.0 -
Darren J. Prior wrote: »deise go deo,
You made two points that I want to correct. First of all an Cheathrú Gaeltachta/the Gaeltacht Quarter in Belfast is there now.
Secondly there are 16 campaigns for new gaelscoileanna in Ireland, not ten, and there is an immediate interest in setting up new gaelscoileanna at primary level in six other areas. I think that the eight for the second-level are more important in the short-term in terms of which ones should be given recognition as a priority.
http://www.gaelscoileanna.ie/schools/scoileanna-nua/?lang=ie
Hopefully the next FG/LP Govt. will audit the money spent on Irish so that we get better value for money. The money spent on TG4 and the effect of that on independent television companies is already money well spent though I think. I mean that I think that it is audited well.
Those civil service Irish exams are hard. I wouldn't pass one of them. There would be a lot of people working in the Department of Education and Skills I would say who have good Irish but not the level to pass the exams in it. You need to have excellent Irish to pass those exams.
When I said there are plans to establish a Gaelthacht Quarter in Belfast what I meant was that there is an on going project in Belfast to create a Gaelthacht Quarter. Not that is only being planed.
Thanks for the correction on the number of new gaelscoileanna awaiting state support.True Bi-lingualism will be a by-product of an all Irish speaking education system. Which language an individual chooses to speak in his or her daily life is a free choice.
I repeat that my understanding that, All primary school teachers in Ireland, are already meant to be trained to teach all subjects through Irish.
They are being trained to teach in the Irish state.
This is a reasonable request and one that I am sure you will agree with.
In this last paragraph you are advocating the continous slow growth of Gaelscoileanna which will lead to a continous slow decline of English speaking schools.
This is in effect a dual school, or two tier system.
One in growth and one in decline.
Will this in effect mean that in the end the currently small school buildings of the Gaelscoileanna will continue to expand until they are the same size as todays traditional schools buildings. And the country will be left with twice as many schools as we need ?
Or do you mean that in the end you would like to see half our schools teaching in Irish and half in English ? Forcing parents to decide which language they choose for their children.
Teachers in primary schools are expected to be able to teach Irish, not to be able to teach all subjects through Irish.
I dont see it as a two tier system as there would be no difference in the quality of education recieved.
I dont think there will end up with twice as many schools as we need, as it is now Gaelscoileanna are only recognized if they have the numbers to justify them, Ultimately I would like to see, when the gaelscoil movement reaches critical mass, existing English Medium Schools change to Irish medium Schools voluntarily.
I dont set any target for the proportion of gaelscoileanna in relation to English medium education, Let them grow to satisfy the level of the demand.Has it ever crossed your mind that parents may not want their children educated in Irish?
Indeed it has, thats one reason I support the growth of gaelscoileanna in line with the demand for them rather than a widespread conversion in the short term.0 -
cyclopath2001 wrote: »Is this the whole story and is there an independent source for this explanation?
Nothing is ever good enough for you is it? Would you be this skeptical of something that supported your point of view?
The story is, as I have heard it that the state in its plans decided that due to projected population increase there would be need for a new school in that area. Local parents decided that if there was to be a new school, they wanted it to be a Gaelscoil and set about campaigning for it accordingly. When the time came instead of recognizing the new Gaelscoil the state decided that there was not a need for a new school after all, The Parents decided to go ahead with the new gaelscoil anyway, The school dose not receive any funding from the state and is instead funded by donations from parents, fundraising and Irish language organisations like Conradh na Gaeilge.
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deise go deo wrote: »When I said there are plans to establish a Gaelthacht Quarter in Belfast what I meant was that there is an on going project in Belfast to create a Gaelthacht Quarter. Not that is only being planed.
The area needs to be rejuvenated. The Cultúrlann there is getting rejuvenated but the housing estates (that I have seen) need to be knocked down like the flats in Ballymun are. Otherwise the area will not be attractive for most people to live in. I would say that the growth in Irish in the area goes in tandem with the rejuvenation of the area. The area- along the Falls Road- is an official Gaeltacht Quarter now but I can't see the area developing more until the whole area is developed.0 -
FGs plans to drop compulsory Irish in the last two years of secondary school has to be welcomed in this respect. It will open the door for further value for money measures. This is the most important aspect of it: it breaks the taboo that you mustn't touch Irish. The beneficiaries of this will be both those who want to see the language flourish and those who think the options should be there for the studying of other subjects in the place of compulsory Irish at leaving cert level.Darren J. Prior wrote: »Hopefully the next FG/LP Govt. will audit the money spent on Irish so that we get better value for money. The money spent on TG4 and the effect of that on independent television companies is already money well spent though I think. I mean that I think that it is audited well.0 -
deise go deo wrote: »Teachers in primary schools are expected to be able to teach Irish, not to be able to teach all subjects through Irish.
I dont see it as a two tier system as there would be no difference in the quality of education recieved.
I dont think there will end up with twice as many schools as we need, as it is now Gaelscoileanna are only recognized if they have the numbers to justify them, Ultimately I would like to see, when the gaelscoil movement reaches critical mass, existing English Medium Schools change to Irish medium Schools voluntarily.
I dont set any target for the proportion of gaelscoileanna in relation to English medium education, Let them grow to satisfy the level of the demand.
I agree that the Gaelscoileanna programme has been successful.
However, the logical conclusion of your idea means as a nation we are forced to choose the language our children are educated in.
This is both divisive and wrong.
We will end up with a dual school system.
It appears that we are failing to run one school system effectively, what chance have we at running two of them.
We need a shift in our thinking in our overall education system that recognises the fact that teaching everyone through Irish will create an all inclusive and simpler education system.0 -
SkepticOne wrote: »It will open the door for further value for money measures. This is the most important aspect of it: it breaks the taboo that you mustn't touch Irish. The beneficiaries of this will be both those who want to see the language flourish
I agree. And Labour are in favour of making it optional also so it looks like the change may happen for next September!!!0 -
Again, has it ever crossed your mind that some parents may not want their children educated in Irish?I agree that the Gaelscoileanna programme has been successful.
However, the logical conclusion of your idea means as a nation we are forced to choose the language our children are educated in.
This is both divisive and wrong.
We will end up with a dual school system.
It appears that we are failing to run one school system effectively, what chance have we at running two of them.
We need a shift in our thinking in our overall education system that recognises the fact that teaching everyone through Irish will create an all inclusive and simpler education system.
As for simplicity it is much simpler to teach everyone through english like we do now.0 -
Was this all local parents or just those who wanted their children to be taught through the medium of Irish?deise go deo wrote: »Local parents decided that if there was to be a new school, they wanted it to be a Gaelscoil0 -
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cyclopath2001 wrote: »I take it, by your silence, that the 'More Jobs and oppertunities to use Irish than there are for any other second language in this Country' are all makey-up jobs that depend on state funding? Jobs that do not contribute to the economy?
Yep, and he remained silent after this post too....because you are dead right. The only jobs in Irish are all 'makey-up' jobs as you called them. Jobs that are made up purely for the sake of having something to use Irish for. Ridiculous forcing people to learn this redundant language. If the government wants to force people to learn a language it should be something link Spanish, Portuguese, Mandarin or French, languages that are spoken by hundreds of millions of people...each.0
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