Report on attitudes to travellers published.

Mrmoe · 09-07-2010 12:39AM

I can't understand the level to which people will defend the traveller community. I understand someone honestly trying to defend people that are innocent or certain sections of the traveller community that are peaceful and law abiding. However, I think these are a minority amongst travellers. It is very difficult to obtain cast iron statistics about criminality among the traveller community due primarily to the lifestyle that they lead i.e. often dealing in cash and moving quite often from place to place. The only metric we have are the experiences of people towards travellers and they are generally not held in high regard. There is a higher percentage of the traveller community in our prisons in addition to this:

http://www.drugsandalcohol.ie/6984/

Objectives: To determine whether Irish Travellers are over-represented amongst transfers from prison to psychiatric hospital. If so, to determine whether this represents an excess over the proportion of Irish Travellers committed to prison.

Method: Irish Travellers admitted to the National Forensic Psychiatry service were identified from a case register over three years 1997-1999. New prison committals were sampled and interviewed as part of the routine committal screening to identify ethnicity.

Results: Irish Travellers accounted for 3.4% of forensic psychiatric admissions compared to 0.38% of the adult population. Travellers transferred from prison to psychiatric hospital had more learning disability and less severe mental illness than other groups, while black and other ethnic minorities had a higher proportion of severe mental illness. Travellers accounted for 6% (95% CI 3-11) of 154 male committals and 4% (95% CI 2-12) of 70 female committals. The estimated annualised prison committal rate was 2.8% (95% CI 2.4-3.3) of all adult male Travellers in Ireland and 1% for female Travellers (95% CI 0.8-1.3). Male Travellers had a relative risk of imprisonment compared to the settled community of 17.4 (95% CI 2.3-131.4), the relative risk for female Travellers was 12.9 (95% CI 1.7-96.7). Imprisoned Travellers had greater rates of drugs and alcohol problems than other prisoners (Relative risk 1.46, 95% CI 1.11-1.90).

Conclusion: There is gross over-representation of Travellers in forensic psychiatric admissions. This reflects the excess of Travellers amongst prison committals.

Do people who defend the travelling community really think that the rest of the population bad mouth them for fun or for some sadistic pleasure? A lot of the animosity that people show towards the traveller community is based on bad experiences with them. While the exact figures for criminality among the traveller community are hard to pin down but the sheer malevolence shown towards provides an idea of the type of community that they are.

09-07-2010 02:41AM

Overheal wrote: »

Literally have no education or manners?

So they entered your bar naked and uttering in Primal grunting and this is why you "had" to refuse them a gentlemen's service?

Well, if that is how bad your manners have to be in the states to not be served? Maybe ye can take our travellers then. Although I must say, their comprehension of the english language is not significant apart from the words "9-bar","boss" or "Let's target vulnerable citizens in the countryside in order to rob and terrorise them".;)

Overheal · 09-07-2010 03:15AM

Deleted User wrote: »

It was a 10 Range Rover I seen in the halting site. Range Rover is not a colloqial term for a 4WD here.

You might not see much jeeps if you were only over for a holiday etc.

I lived there for 10 years.

Maybe I just dont recall. /shrug

It was a 10 Range Rover I seen in the halting site.

Did it have seating for 90% of Travellers?

storm2811 wrote: »

Travellers aren't a race no matter how much they say it.

Neither are the Yanks but it's still racist by definition when we discuss half the yank bashing threads that occur from time to time

Well, if that is how bad your manners have to be in the states to not be served? Maybe ye can take our travellers then. Although I must say, their comprehension of the english language is not significant apart from the words "9-bar","boss" or "Let's target vulnerable citizens in the countryside in order to rob and terrorise them".

On the contrary while the average traveller in my experience had a unique accent they were nothing if not crafty. You make them sound unintelligent when in fact, a traveller could very easilly outsmart you and in turn are difficult to outsmart. Particularly when it comes to business.

This is of course why I think you're being dismissive when assuming they must be criminals to operate new vehicles. No acknowledgement of the fact that they know their **** and just because they dont spend their money getting tied up in mortgages and West-Brit fashion and mannerisms, its a terrible thing to both discriminate against, and underestimate them.

I'll bet you saw a traveller in a 2010 range rover. I'll even bet he paid it in full with cash. It doesnt make him a crook.

09-07-2010 03:45AM

Overheal wrote: »

I lived there for 10 years.

Maybe I just dont recall. /shrug

Did it have seating for 90% of Travellers?
Neither are the Yanks but it's still racist by definition when we discuss half the yank bashing threads that occur from time to timeOn the contrary while the average traveller in my experience had a unique accent they were nothing if not crafty. You make them sound unintelligent when in fact, a traveller could very easilly outsmart you and in turn are difficult to outsmart. Particularly when it comes to business.

This is of course why I think you're being dismissive when assuming they must be criminals to operate new vehicles. No acknowledgement of the fact that they know their **** and just because they dont spend their money getting tied up in mortgages and West-Brit fashion and mannerisms, its a terrible thing to both discriminate against, and underestimate them.

I'll bet you saw a traveller in a 2010 range rover. I'll even bet he paid it in full with cash. It doesnt make him a crook.

Who has circa 100000 euros hanging around in cash and is legitimate?

therokerroar · 09-07-2010 03:49AM

Deleted User wrote: »

Who has circa 100000 euros hanging around in cash and is legitimate?

Many, many footballers and other professional sportsmen.

09-07-2010 04:11AM

therokerroar wrote: »

Many, many footballers and other professional sportsmen.

Traceable money, my dear friend.;)

imme · 09-07-2010 04:22AM

I'm not sure what makes this topic/post After Hours.

high horse · 09-07-2010 04:24AM

Overheal wrote: »

I'll bet you saw a traveller in a 2010 range rover. I'll even bet he paid it in full with cash. It doesnt make him a crook.

Whose cash is he paying for it with?

FlawedGenius · 09-07-2010 04:52AM

Travellers are scum of the earth and should be whiped out like the jews were in Germany. At least the knackers would deserve it!

gurramok · 09-07-2010 08:50AM

Just have a look at all the giant boulders on the side of many roads to stop caravans making their home there.

It must be unique to this country as I have not seen such boulders in such numbers on the continent.

thebaz · 09-07-2010 09:16AM

FlawedGenius wrote: »

Travellers are scum of the earth and should be whiped out like the jews were in Germany. At least the knackers would deserve it!

if i made the same comment/ generalisation about Eastern Europeans people would be up in arms , but because it is travellers its ok ...

i have met some really sound travellers much more genuine than our supposed law abiding or corrupt settled community .... I now remember why i stopped using AH

Oink · 09-07-2010 09:28AM

The_Minister wrote: »

culture of poverty and depravation

Noun1.depravation - moral perversion; impairment of virtue and moral principles

:eek:

AudreyHepburn · 09-07-2010 09:31AM

FlawedGenius wrote: »

Travellers are scum of the earth and should be whiped out like the jews were in Germany. At least the knackers would deserve it!

I really hope you're joking :eek:

AudreyHepburn · 09-07-2010 09:56AM

Poor Uncle Tom wrote: »

/so we shouldn't generalise....

/but, it's ok for you....

:rolleyes:

What I should have said was that I hate how A LOT of people in this country have a tendancy to assume that if one person in a group is dirty, they all are (though I think you knew what I meant, be honest

).

Just look at all the threads here that say every priest is paedophile or condones paedophilia.

Minstrel27 · 09-07-2010 10:05AM

I used to live two doors away from a house of travellers. I moved. It was an absolutely horrible few months that I had in that house.

prinz · 09-07-2010 10:05AM

Overheal wrote: »

I'll bet you saw a traveller in a 2010 range rover. I'll even bet he paid it in full with cash. It doesnt make him a crook.

From legitimate, taxed employment or business dealings no doubt.

Like you said it IS a terrible thing to underestimate them, I never do, no matter how low they go I know they can go lower given half the chance.

AudreyHepburn · 09-07-2010 10:18AM

prinz wrote: »

From legitimate, taxed employment or business dealings no doubt.

Like you said it IS a terrible thing to underestimate them, I never do, no matter how low they go I know they can go lower given half the chance.

You never underestimate them? Have you read what you just posted?:rolleyes:

Naomh · 09-07-2010 10:32AM

I used to work in a hardware store when I was a student.
One day before christmas years ago this old fella from the country came in buying glass for a window and new locks for his back door.

He seemed fairly rattled so I knew something was up, he went on to explain to me that travellers had broken into his house when he was out on the farm and had taken tv, video other valuables etc. When they were loading up his sister came and called the guards. They laughed at her as they were driving off and told her that theyd be back for the rest after christmas.
This fella, to hear him now folks he was a wreck after it, old farmer living on his own, crying to me, a complete stranger asking me what was he going to do, was as sad as you could get.

This and similar incidents are the the only contribution travellers make to society imo.....

prinz · 09-07-2010 10:35AM

AudreyHepburn wrote: »

You never underestimate them? Have you read what you just posted?:rolleyes:

Yes.

Nodin · 09-07-2010 10:44AM

Mrmoe wrote: »

I can't understand the level to which people will defend the traveller community.

When the alternative is to let this kind of thing go unanswered....

Flawedgenius wrote:

Travellers are scum of the earth and should be whiped out like the jews were in Germany. At least the knackers would deserve it! .

Dyr · 09-07-2010 10:53AM

The estate that my sister lives on had a family of travellers moved in by the council..all the residents started up petitions to have them moved out and my sister refused to sign any of them on principle. Being a group of people who will never let a good deed go unpunished the knackers, when they moved in, made her life a f***ng misery. Her kids were being beaten up constantly by their offspring and the gardai didn’t want to know anything about it. She used to tell her kids to come in whenever the little smokeys started trouble and the one time she had a go at their parents over their kids behaviour an entire tribe of knackers showed up the next day and hung around outside her house just to let her know who she was dealing it.

Anyway, one her lads eventually got sick of it and decked a knacker kid who started a fight with him. The knackers called the gardai (lol) and a copper showed up at her front door threatening to press charges against her kid. Unsurprisingly she told the windy bastard of a civil servant to go f**k himself more or less.

Lessons here are as follows: coppers are windy.

Travellers hang together no matter what, so they thoroughly deserve the rep that “some” of them have earned their "community".

--Kaiser-- · 09-07-2010 10:55AM

I find that people who defend travelers are generally those who have had next to no experience of dealing with them

smash · 09-07-2010 10:58AM

It doesn't matter what the report says, most of them wont be able to read it.

Dyr · 09-07-2010 10:58AM

--Kaiser-- wrote: »

I find that people who defend travelers are generally those who have had next to no experience of dealing with them

not true, i knew quite a few trahvellers who, while complete criminals, were decent sorts, but they were still dodgy as f**k.

Stercus Accidit · 09-07-2010 11:00AM

Bambi wrote: »

not true, i knew quite a few trahvellers who, while complete criminals, were decent sorts, but they were still dodgy as f**k.

:rolleyes:

javaboy · 09-07-2010 11:18AM

FlawedGenius wrote: »

Travellers are scum of the earth and should be whiped out like the jews were in Germany. At least the knackers would deserve it!

Banned for genocidal hate speech.

Stercus Accidit · 09-07-2010 11:27AM

javaboy wrote: »

Banned for genocidal hate speech.

Nazi :rolleyes:

:pac:

Nijmegen · 09-07-2010 11:28AM

Nodin wrote: »

When the alternative is to let this kind of thing go unanswered....

I think 1 person has advocated some sort of crazy nutjob final solution.

I think the rest of us would be happy if they paid taxes and obeyed the law.

markesmith · 09-07-2010 11:33AM

Discrimination is usually wrong, but in the case of Travellers, there seems to be no positive outcomes to any interaction ever reported on these boards.

I've met a few of them, had small dealings with a few of them. They don't like settled people, and they don't like government. They don't like to pay taxes (who does?), and they're always looking for the angle.

As a previous poster says, the fact that they always hang together no matter what makes most of them equally culpable.

I hate to say it, but Ireland would be a better place without Travellers. They really don't seem to be of any benefit to society.

smokingman · 09-07-2010 11:37AM

I'll have respect for them when:

I pass the side of a motorway/anywhere they camp and find that there's not a load of rubbish being dumped...
I find that they do pay taxes...
I find that if they are indeed a seperate race apart from settled peeps, they start policing their own, properly...

...might be waiting a while though.

Report on attitudes to travellers published.

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