Report on attitudes to travellers published.

fonecrusher1

This is my 2 cents.

I am not someone who likes to join the mob, grab a pitchfork & have a go at minorities. Thats not what im about. Im sure us irish have been at the recieving end of such intolerance in other countries in the past.

But, I find it harder & harder to ignore (as i usually do) the PC brigade trying to make out that travellers are demonised & that its only a small percentage of them who are trouble makers. Im also sick of hearing oh its not their fault, its their culture. That is bullsh!t, all cultures must conform somewhat to common law & what is & is not acceptable public conduct or else they will become justifiably hated. Simple fact.

As someone else has said, if they can't be policed, they need to do the job themselves & enforce some sort of internal control of the rampant thuggery that prevails in their community.

Everyone deserves a chance but how many chances can be afforded to them?

pablomakaveli

fonecrusher1 wrote: »

As someone else has said, if they can't be policed, they need to do the job themselves & enforce some sort of internal control of the rampant thuggery that prevails in their community.

I fully agree with this but unfortunately when any criticism is directed at travellers the likes of Pavee point start crying racism instead of acknowledging that there's a problem and trying to address that problem.

ananas

I've had to deal with them many times over the years at work and on the whole my experience has been 90% negative. I've been roared abuse at, called thick, stupid, I've been threatened by a traveller because I "gave a dirty look" to her runt of a brother. I've also had stuff thrown at me. They have always tried to pull the wool over our eyes and get stuff for free by complaining and shouting "I know my rights!" And if you even dare to tell them to get out its "discrimination".

Their whole philosophy is to yell and cause havoc and then people will cave and give them what they want.

Would somebody pass on a message to travellers to have regular showers?

Mike 1972

Mike 1972 wrote: »

Why would anyone be bothered that much about travellers living net door to them when if they are what their name suggests they arent going to be around for very long.


Eh



Given that this is AH should the statement above be regarded as defamatory or complimentary :pac:

It's a question.

Paparazzo

To be honest, if travellers moved in next door there's no way I'd ge against it before they moved in, or would I judge them till they were there a while. I expect no medal for this, it's just the normal thing I'd do. I had a few people move in beside me in my old neighbourhood that people would consider "undesirable" and they were the soundest people ever!

However, one question for the "travellers are victimised" brigade. If you were getting your driveway paved, would you get a proper builder to do it, or would you be happy to let a group of travellers do it?

billy the squid

Paparazzo wrote: »

To be honest, if travellers moved in next door there's no way I'd ge against it before they moved in, or would I judge them till they were there a while. I expect no medal for this, it's just the normal thing I'd do. I had a few people move in beside me in my old neighbourhood that people would consider "undesirable" and they were the soundest people ever!

However, one question for the "travellers are victimised" brigade. If you were getting your driveway paved, would you get a proper builder to do it, or would you be happy to let a group of travellers do it?

For work like that I would look for certification to do such work before enquiring after their ethnic background.

what is your point?

Overheal

Deleted User wrote: »

Who has circa 100000 euros hanging around in cash and is legitimate?

Closer to €50,000 surely. For that matter are you even sure it didn't have dealer plates?

http://www.kbb.com/new-cars/land-rover/range-rover/2010/pricing-report

this still doesnt deflect from the assertion that one man's range rover is criminal evidence against 90% of Travellers.

billy the squid

billy the squid wrote: »

For work like that I would look for certification to do such work before enquiring after their ethnic background.

what is your point?

Since when are travellers an "ethnic background"?

Overheal

bluewolf wrote: »

Since when are travellers an "ethnic background"?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethnic_group

An ethnic group is a group of people whose members identify with each other, through a common heritage that is real or assumed.[1][2] This shared heritage may be based upon putative common ancestry, history, Culture, Traditions, kinship, religion, language, shared territory, nationality or/and physical appearance. Members of an ethnic group are conscious of belonging to an ethnic group; moreover ethnic identity is further marked by the recognition from others of a group's distinctiveness.[3][4]


So yes, Travellers would be an Ethnic Group.

Overheal

Overheal wrote: »

So yes, Travellers would be an Ethnic Group.

Fair enough I thought we were heading into this "race" discussion again ;s

Paparazzo

billy the squid wrote: »

For work like that I would look for certification to do such work before enquiring after their ethnic background.

what is your point?

Isn't it obvious? They do terrible building work.

billy the squid

bluewolf wrote: »

Fair enough I thought we were heading into this "race" discussion again ;s

Race is a social construct. ethnicity is somewhat different.

billy the squid

Paparazzo wrote: »

Isn't it obvious? They do terrible building work.

Who does terrible building work?
contractors who do not have certification?

If you hired builders who did not have certification then I have no sympathy for you.

dvpower

fonecrusher1 wrote: »

But, I find it harder & harder to ignore (as i usually do) the PC brigade trying to make out that travellers are demonised & that its only a small percentage of them who are trouble makers. Im also sick of hearing oh its not their fault, its their culture. That is bullsh!t, all cultures must conform somewhat to common law & what is & is not acceptable public conduct or else they will become justifiably hated. Simple fact.

I've just scanned through the thread and I dont see these claims being made here. A few people have said that they've never had any personal difficulties with travellers and some people have taken issue with some of the ott abuse posted in the thread.

Personally, I find it quite easy to ignore stuff that doesn't exist.

Overheal

Overheal wrote: »

Closer to €50,000 surely. For that matter are you even sure it didn't have dealer plates?

http://www.kbb.com/new-cars/land-rover/range-rover/2010/pricing-report

this still doesnt deflect from the assertion that one man's range rover is criminal evidence against 90% of Travellers.

Why are you quoting American prices? The price on a range rover is totally different in Ireland than America.

Nodin

Nodin wrote: »

...and others have just compared them to animals and made other massive generalisations....

You are making a massive leap there.What animals did I compare them to?
Sure. humans are animals. You can even have a pack of cards.:)

high horse

Overheal wrote: »

Closer to €50,000 surely. For that matter are you even sure it didn't have dealer plates?

http://www.kbb.com/new-cars/land-rover/range-rover/2010/pricing-report

this still doesnt deflect from the assertion that one man's range rover is criminal evidence against 90% of Travellers.

Try again with your pricing

http://www.driving.ie/usedcars/index.cfm?fuseaction=car&carID=201017197809786

Also, travellers are very unlikely to have dealer plates as nobody in their right mind would buy a car from them

Overheal

Overheal wrote: »

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethnic_group

An ethnic group is a group of people whose members identify with each other, through a common heritage that is real or assumed.[1][2] This shared heritage may be based upon putative common ancestry, history, Culture, Traditions, kinship, religion, language, shared territory, nationality or/and physical appearance. Members of an ethnic group are conscious of belonging to an ethnic group; moreover ethnic identity is further marked by the recognition from others of a group's distinctiveness.[3][4]


So yes, Travellers would be an Ethnic Group.

It's true. They have a lot of common ancestry.

AckwelFoley

Overheal wrote: »

Closer to €50,000 surely. For that matter are you even sure it didn't have dealer plates?

http://www.kbb.com/new-cars/land-rover/range-rover/2010/pricing-report

this still doesnt deflect from the assertion that one man's range rover is criminal evidence against 90% of Travellers.

Nice arguement on TV.

Sadly in reality travellers have the highest % of their commnity in prison than any other.

It wasnt a roma, black or china man that robbed the generator out of the back of my van - it was a traveller..

It wasnt roma black or china that trawls the country side robbing builders vans and selling them in markets across the border or in other counties for tight arse "look the other way" bargin hunters to buy - they're travellers.

Its not the Roma, blacks or china man that smells because they dont wash or shave their pits... its the french :pac:





Jadore La france, vraiment

pablomakaveli

Overheal wrote: »

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethnic_group

An ethnic group is a group of people whose members identify with each other, through a common heritage that is real or assumed.[1][2] This shared heritage may be based upon putative common ancestry, history, Culture, Traditions, kinship, religion, language, shared territory, nationality or/and physical appearance. Members of an ethnic group are conscious of belonging to an ethnic group; moreover ethnic identity is further marked by the recognition from others of a group's distinctiveness.[3][4]


So yes, Travellers would be an Ethnic Group.

Travellers can't really claim to be ethnically different to other Irish under those conditions. They share the same religion, language, territory, nationality and physical appearance as other Irish people.

Common ancestry and history would be shared with Irish people as well.

That leaves culture and traditions which alone would'nt merit ethnic minority status.

bonzos

P.Nally had the right idea....they have no fear of the law,the shotgun is the only law they respect!

AckwelFoley

Deleted User wrote: »

It's true. They have a lot of common ancestry.

billy the squid

pablomakaveli wrote: »

Travellers can't really claim to be ethnically different to other Irish under those conditions. They share the same religion, language, territory, nationality and physical appearance as other Irish people.

Common ancestry and history would be shared with Irish people as well.

That leaves culture and traditions which alone would'nt merit ethnic minority status.

If they are impossible to tell from other Irish people then how do you discriminate against the?

Also the language of Cant is shared by Travellers.

Travellers also see themselves as separate ethnically from "buffers."

billy the squid

billy the squid wrote: »

If they are impossible to tell from other Irish people then how do you discriminate against the?

Also the language of Cant is shared by Travellers.

Travellers also see themselves as separate ethnically from "buffers."

What is a buffer?

billy the squid

snyper wrote: »

Nice arguement on TV.

Sadly in reality travellers have the highest % of their commnity in prison than any other.

The same could be said for the black community in the United States. what is your point?

It wasnt a roma, black or china man that robbed the generator out of the back of my van - it was a traveller..

One anecdote does not constitute a verdict on an entire ethnic group.

It wasnt roma black or china that trawls the country side robbing builders vans and selling them in markets across the border or in other counties for tight arse "look the other way" bargin hunters to buy - they're travellers.

Again, you are assuming that travellers have a monopoly on thievery, hate to burst your bubble here, but they don't.

Its not the Roma, blacks or china man that smells because they dont wash or shave their pits... its the french :pac:

See my comment above.

Give it a week or two and there will be a thread in here about the Roma.

billy the squid

Deleted User wrote: »

What is a buffer?

Buffer is Cant for settled person.

Evolution Enter

They should survey bartenders, see what the results are! I know a few travellers that are alright to deal with (still criminals) but the vast majority cause trouble, and if you call them on it you're called racist!

Hard to embrace a different culture when all they seem to do is take advantage of a system that settled people pay for and if we complain we're called racist!

billy the squid

Evolution Enter wrote: »

They should survey bartenders, see what the results are! I know a few travellers that are alright to deal with (still criminals) but the vast majority cause trouble, and if you call them on it you're called racist!

Hard to embrace a different culture when all they seem to do is take advantage of a system that settled people pay for and if we complain we're called racist!

I would be interested in surveying the same publicans to see how many have staff being paid !under the table! to avoid PAYE and whatnot.

billy the squid

billy the squid wrote: »

I would be interested in surveying the same publicans to see how many have staff being paid !under the table! to avoid PAYE and whatnot.

If you have an issue with this. Bring it to the attention of VFI. They are a lot more accomodating than Pavee point.