Ufc 104 predictions? Spoiler warning!

roo1981 · 25-10-2009 4:53pm

I think Rua took it comfortably, I'd like to watch the fight again without commentarty though, I find Rogans commentating can have a bit too much infulence for my liking (edit:was just typing this as gilberto posted

) I'd like to figure out how the THREE of the judges all came to the same decision.

The fight metric stats are very interesting-if anything it highlights how little regard the UFC judges have for leg kicks. Which is odd considering how crucial
a role they played in this fight, turns out Machida isnt as elusive when both his legs are dead

Shoguns overall strategy was perfect, very patient aggression, picking his shots, trying to chop Machidas legs down instead of headhunting so as not to leave too many openings and angles for Machidas counters. I think that if he had finished that takedown just after Machida slipped (in the third?) it would have swung the fight in his favour.

The problem for Shogun is that he'll probably favour a more offensive style in the rematch which would favour Machida...

the_lad · 25-10-2009 5:43pm

gilberto_eire wrote: »

I think people need to take things into consideration...... when we watch the fights we have Rogan telling us ''Great kick by Shogun'', even in exchanges where the other fighter connects too, whether we like it or not we are somewhat influenced by what he says.

I completely agree with this.

really want to watch the fight again with no commentary. I was routing for Lyoto but was still surprised at the decision. dont think Shogun made enough effort to close it out and convince the judges. he eased off in the last round and that cost him.

The irony is that while you can argue that multiple leg-kicks and body-kicks arent enough to take a belt off someone, but its exactly how forrest beat rampage - if i little more comprehensively.

cant wait for the rematch i think someone will be going down.

MisterCadbury · 25-10-2009 9:48pm

absolute disgrace of a decision. Pure joke. Lyoto was decimated and enjoyed no period of dominance in the whole fight. Its obvious in my mind at least that Dana or whoever has already money riding on trying to turn Machida into a more of a crowd puller than he already is, I mean lets be fair, the commentators have been going on about the "Machida Era" and he hadnt even defended his title.

PADRAIC.M · 25-10-2009 9:57pm

absolute disgrace! Im so gutted for shogun, great to see him back to old ways, why is it that feckin cecil peoples is always involved in these really bad decisions, even dana looked shocked when the decision was given, It was at least 4- 1 to shogun at worst 3- 2

Mossy Monk · 25-10-2009 10:13pm

PADRAIC.M wrote: »

why is it that feckin cecil peoples is always involved in these really bad decisions

Reminds me of this whenever I hear his name

strefa walki · 25-10-2009 10:39pm

What a F^£kin disgrace, I just watched the main event half pissed (with no sound of course so the commentary couldn't throw me off, as I do with all boxing matches too) and Shogun was...to put it mildly raped (see deliverance the movie "squeel like a pig")

What the hell were the judges thinking????????????

Sooooooooooooooo Bad! There should be a new champ!

PADRAIC.M · 25-10-2009 11:43pm

Mossy Monk wrote: »

Reminds me of this whenever I hear his name

Ha! Quality!

mailburner · 25-10-2009 11:45pm

just finished watching it
i thought up till now the bisbing decision against
hamill was robbery and this is up there with it
i cant understand it
i hope he gets a rematch
otherwise we'll have to watching machida doing
what he did to reshad with the rest of the lw division

jayteecork · 25-10-2009 11:46pm

Why are all the forums just singling out Cecil Peoples? Cause he's black?

There were 3 judges, all of whom scored the fight the same: 3-2 Machida.

Anyways it wasn't the worst decision in UFC history - that honour goes to the Randy Couture/Pedro Rizzo fight at UFC 31
(which funnily enough had Rizzo destroying Randy's legs in the same manner as Shogun did to Lyoto. Think Randy has metal pins in his legs to this day)

Mellor · 26-10-2009 12:29am

Mellor wrote: »

Betting on these, main card only

*Lyoto Machida Vs. Mauricio Rua* (The Dragon obv)

*Cain Velasquez Vs. Ben Rothwell* (Rothwell will gas, Velasquez will repeated take him down)

*Gleison Tibau Vs. Josh Neer* (close but Tibau by split decision)

*Joe Stevenson Vs. Spencer Fisher* (Joe Daddy for me, has had 3 recent losses, but each were against the current top 3 LW guys)

*Anthony Johnson Vs. Yoshiyuki Yoshida* (Johnson lost recently due to an illegal blow, at least I think i remember that, eye poke, came back to KTFO, will out strike the undersized jap, TKO rd 2)

Ship ship

jayteecork wrote: »

(which funnily enough had Rizzo destroying Randy's legs in the same manner as Shogun did to Lyoto. Think Randy has metal pins in his legs to this day)

Not sure about pins, but there is an indentation in his leg muscle from it I think

johnny_adidas · 26-10-2009 12:46am

black...?? reading a bit too much into it i think, prob cos he's the judge most people know by name

just finished watching it myself. had gotten a text screaming someone was robbed so was counting the rounds as i watched it. at worst i had it 3 rounds to shogun and one round being a draw, but if i was to call it as i saw it, 4-1 shogun. as for whoever up there said shogun eased off in the final round, he did so cos he was 3-1 up in rounds (in everyones minds.... but the refs and a select few obv), why chance silly a KO

felt so sorry for him, how he managed to keep it together during the interview ill never know. cant blame him for breaking down backstage, all that effort only to be robbed. even if he gets a rematch now, his perfect gameplan to beat the 'untouchable' can be planned for.

not a fan of lyoto myself but it looked like he knew himself and said straight away he would fight a rematch, dont get why people are giving out, what else was he supposed to say...nah cant take this belt?? Finally, i had never seen shogun fight in pride but now i get all the hype, to outmatch machida clearly in speed of strikes & counter-strikes, i can see i missed a lot...

pablohoney87 · 26-10-2009 1:13am

Shogun was robbed. Watched the fight twice.
The only valid argument against shogun was that he was never dominant or had machida hurt. Anytime the title changes hands on a decision its always by complete domination. Randy vs sylvia, Forrest vs rampage, even fedor vs nog.

Professey Chin · 26-10-2009 1:26am

pablohoney87 wrote: »

Shogun was robbed. Watched the fight twice.
The only valid argument against shogun was that he was never dominant or had machida hurt. Anytime the title changes hands on a decision its always by complete domination. Randy vs sylvia, Forrest vs rampage, even fedor vs nog.

I think that was a much harder fight to call then this one.

IMO Shogun played the perfect game plan and got screwed.Took away Machidas movement with the leg kicks.Showed aggression when needed and took very little damage.He also controlled the fight much more and pretty much won on everything the judging criteria is supposed to be.

chopperbyrne · 26-10-2009 2:11am

Just saw the Shogun/Machida fight now.

Easily 4-1 to Shogun. How all three judges scored it in Machidas favour I'll never know.

Rematch should definitely happen.

Mellor · 26-10-2009 2:33am

chopperbyrne wrote: »

Just saw the Shogun/Machida fight now.

Easily 4-1 to Shogun. How all three judges scored it in Machidas favour I'll never know.

Rematch should definitely happen.

Dana said there would be a rematch after the fight, he didn't agree with the decision either

chopperbyrne · 26-10-2009 2:43am

It's like those judges just ignore any strike that doesn't land to the head.

Daroxtar · 26-10-2009 11:43am

The worst decision i have seen in any sport since Roy Jones Junior in the olympics. Incredible. When i heard the score i thought they were being extremely generous but when i heard the name i nearly fell off my chair.

Kazooie · 26-10-2009 1:21pm

If you were to base it on Rogan's commentary you would have thought Shogun should have walked away with it. I do think shogun was robbed but I'd like to watch it again with the sound off. I thought it was a technical but pretty boring fight.

Turbo_diesel · 26-10-2009 1:43pm

Joke of a decision Shogun was robbed!

chopperbyrne · 26-10-2009 2:21pm

Kazooie wrote: »

If you were to base it on Rogan's commentary you would have thought Shogun should have walked away with it. I do think shogun was robbed but I'd like to watch it again with the sound off. I thought it was a technical but pretty boring fight.

Watch it and listen to the crowd.

All cheering for Machida at the start.

Still cheering for him in the second round.

Nothing in the third except for the few punches he threw towards the end.

A few Shogun chants in the fourth round.

The whole crowd cheering for Shogun in the fifth.

Boos all round when the decision was announced.

Everyone other than those three judges knew it was Shoguns fight and they don't hear the commentary.

cowzerp · 26-10-2009 2:43pm

Well said Chopper byrne, commentary can affect peoples judgemenst but this was very 1 sided and joe rogan did not sway my decision on it-the judges where just morons.. end of, they should never judge again.

Maynard · 26-10-2009 3:16pm

I'm actually still sick over this.

Had a few quid on Shogun at 11/4, but that's beside the point.

Was so deflated when the call was made, just heartbroken for Shogun. It's just very hard to comprehend exactly how this happened.

All_in_Flynn · 26-10-2009 3:50pm

First and foremost I think Shogun won the fight but I dont agree with the masses in here that it was a robbery!

Have watched it twice since and scored it as so:

Round 1: I think this could of gone either way. Both cagey and landing sporadically. Was very close but I edged to shogun.

Round 2: Fighters were slightly more active with both fighters scoring 1 or 2 big shots to body. Again, extremely close round for me but I actually gave it Macheda!

Round 3: This was the only I clearly gave to Macheda. Troubled Rua with the flurry even tho he got caught at the end with a hook.

Round 4: Wasnt close, gave it to Shogun.

Round 5: Again, for me wasnt close and gave it to Shogun

I can understand why the judges might of edged it to Macheda as in my opinion, they could of gave him the first 3 rounds.

Im also of the same opinion of one or two others here that Rogan's commentary was slightly skewed. Alot of the times I noticed that when Rua was coming in with a leg kick, he was taking a straight right and then a counter leg kick on the way out. Shoguns kick was the more powerful and eyecatching and Rogan was not giving any credit or notice to the fact he was caught coming in and going out.

Rogan said himself in the fight that he thinks the judging system should be revamped so maybe that pays way to the above.

That being said, I really did feel sorry for Shogun. Heart bled for him!

Really enjoyed the fight tho. Thought it was a great battle between two technical masters. It really was thrilling to see Shogun back on tip top form and in a way im glad of the decision cause it means we will get to see these two go at it again. They are both far and away the best in the division!

GSPfan · 26-10-2009 5:14pm

Shogun v Machida is the biggest screw job since Bret Hart v Shawn Michaels.

chopperbyrne · 26-10-2009 7:13pm

Cecil Peoples defends their judging: http://cagereport.net/Cecil-Peoples-I-believe-Lyoto-won-the-fight-clearly.html

Leg kicks don't finish fights. :rolleyes:

dunkamania · 26-10-2009 7:38pm

Yes Yes , Shogun was robbed, but lets not forget the other fighters on the card.

For me this was one of the most enjoyable shows this year.
Cain was impressive, he hits hard but not enough to ko guys with just a couple of shots.

Gleison needs to work on cardio and GnP, but some very GSP like takedowns.

Daddy just keeps getting better since joining Team Jackson

Brutal KO by Johnson, shame bout the weight cut

Bader recovered well after gassing in the second.

Pat Barry fight was insane, his ground game progress was impressive

Best performance I have ever seen from Chael

Still not sure what to make of Struve

Seifer · 26-10-2009 7:44pm

dunkamania wrote: »

Cain was impressive, he hits hard but not enough to ko guys with just a couple of shots.

I can't wait until Cain has to fight another ex-wrestler of similar pedigree or someone with take down defense. He will be shown up.
In my opinion the UFC are over-hyping him to use him break into the latino demographic in the US.

Mossy Monk · 26-10-2009 8:17pm

chopperbyrne wrote: »

Cecil Peoples defends their judging: http://cagereport.net/Cecil-Peoples-I-believe-Lyoto-won-the-fight-clearly.html

Leg kicks don't finish fights. :rolleyes:

Seriously, how can he be allowed to score MMA fights.

26-10-2009 8:28pm

chopperbyrne wrote: »

Watch it and listen to the crowd.

All cheering for Machida at the start.

Still cheering for him in the second round.

Nothing in the third except for the few punches he threw towards the end.

A few Shogun chants in the fourth round.

The whole crowd cheering for Shogun in the fifth.

Boos all round when the decision was announced.

Everyone other than those three judges knew it was Shoguns fight and they don't hear the commentary.

Your more then likely wrong there...... when the UFC came to Dublin, you could purchase an ear piece for E10 that would tune you into the commentary, they were quite popular, i doubt very much this was in Dublin alone.... so yes, the commentary could very well have played a part

cokedrinker · 27-10-2009 1:14am

From that Cecil Peoples interview linked above:

Lyoto made Shogun come after him, he determined where the fight took place which in my opinion constitutes as effective Octagon control.

What sort of bull$hit is this? Octagon control can now be defined as backpeddling, and staying to fcuk clear of your opponent.

Ufc 104 predictions? Spoiler warning!

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