200kms of road reclassified motorway except Athlone bypass

BluntGuy · 14-07-2009 10:34pm

Nope, the Waterford Bypass stands almost no chance of being redesignated now, the NRA don't have the balls.

By the way, it must be made clear that no definitive decision has been made on the Athlone Bypass. I bet it will still ultimately get through. Just a pity it has had to be delayed because of useless, unnecesary, selfish whinging. Those people need to realise that the Athlone Bypass is now part of the M6 national route whether or not the signage says so now or not. It is NOT the place for people to drag their tractors around, if they have to go through the town to keep the road safer for the majority of road users, so be it.

Bards · 14-07-2009 10:40pm

BluntGuy wrote: »

Nope, the Waterford Bypass stands almost no chance of being redesignated now, the NRA don't have the balls.

By the way, it must be made clear that no definitive decision has been made on the Athlone Bypass. I bet it will still ultimately get through. Just a pity it has had to be delayed because of useless, unnecesary, selfish whinging. Those people need to realise that the Athlone Bypass is now part of the M6 national route whether or not the signage says so now or not. It is NOT the place for people to drag their tractors around, if they have to go through the town to keep the road safer for the majority of road users, so be it.

Made me laugh to hear the guy from the NRA on newstalk this evening. I'll paraphrase "One of the main reasons we are re-classifying HQDC's is to stop inappropiate development happening along the route and safeguard the investment"

so what is their statement as to why the the N25 (Waterford City Bypass) won't be included - it's not long enough!!!!

anyone care to guess how many retail/business parks will be tacked onto it?

alpha2zulu · 14-07-2009 10:47pm

Blatant evidence it seems!

There should be a public campaign to get the Waterford Bypass reclassified now - developers and speculators have had their time!

That site in question is about a mile from the N25 mainline so even if the M25 did materalise ,this proposed development would probably be unaffected from what I can see anyway. Basically its the bog between the old Auto Boland car showrooms on the now closed section of N9 and the rail line, so on balance if it creates jobs it's probably not a bad thing in my opinion.

BluntGuy · 14-07-2009 10:48pm

Bards wrote: »

anyone care to guess how many retail/business parks will be tacked onto it?

Have you seen in the Grannagh interchange?

A developer's wet dream. A badly designed junction that is just perfect for capturing all Dublin-Waterford, Cork-Waterford traffic and funelling them into a sprawling retail park.

The Celtic Tiger may be over, but the mindset still remains...

I'm not looking forward to seeing how the Waterford Bypass is ruined by development.

mysterious · 15-07-2009 1:37am

BluntGuy wrote: »

Nope, the Waterford Bypass stands almost no chance of being redesignated now, the NRA don't have the balls.

By the way, it must be made clear that no definitive decision has been made on the Athlone Bypass. I bet it will still ultimately get through. Just a pity it has had to be delayed because of useless, unnecesary, selfish whinging. Those people need to realise that the Athlone Bypass is now part of the M6 national route whether or not the signage says so now or not. It is NOT the place for people to drag their tractors around, if they have to go through the town to keep the road safer for the majority of road users, so be it.

The road through the town isn't suitable as an alternative route.

You have 2/3 of the bypass local traffic

Let's be real here.

The only concern is pedestrians and cyclists. It can get special status, to ban cyclists off the road.

It does not have the appropriate measure to be a motorway. There is no justification putting alternative traffic on a congested town centre route. The bypass is the only arterial route for the town. Putting more traffic onto the medieval bridge is not sustainable.

Steviemak · 15-07-2009 2:30am

mysterious wrote: »

Let's be real here.

The only concern is pedestrians and cyclists.

Judging by your form I'm assuming that comment is not a joke. Its all about developers for me. We do not need anymore development along that route that brings slow moving local unnecessary traffic onto the road. Have you driven the south link in cork lately? The road has been destroyed by inappropriate development that no motorway would allow.

You are the same person who wants a future proofed road network:eek:

Confused and not going to get into a debate as its been flogged to death.

mysterious · 15-07-2009 2:48am

The Athlone bypass is surrounded by development on both sides the whole way. There is little land to develop only off the exists which are all urbanised anyway.

Putting blue signs here does not future proof this road.

The road is ito ndequate for motorway status and the alternative is not good enough. END OF STORY.

it is is seved by over 20,000 vehicles that avoid the town. The last thing we want is to put extra traffic on the towns streets.

The other 10,000 N6 cars can put up with local traffic as they have done for 20 years. And any pedestrian walking on the bypass. Read this, you deserve to be killed if you walk on this dual carriageway. You will get this message.

Ban cyclists and pedestrians, and enough of this bull****. I want my blue signs its looks sexy.

Colm R · 15-07-2009 8:50am

The start of the N2 dual carriageway north of Ashbourne had M2 confirmation signs up this morning. No other signs up yet.

noelfirl · 15-07-2009 9:26am

mysterious wrote: »

I want my blue signs its looks sexy.

I'd say one of the number of reasons so few people take you seriously on this site is because you continually harp on as if people have some sort of fetish for blue signs and lines, when the reality is you are the only one continually bringing the colour of the designation into the argument.

Most people are arguing based on their respective opinions on safety, efficiency and restraining development. Kindly cut out your bollocking on as if everyone elses opinion is "blue-motivated".

KevR · 15-07-2009 10:21am

mysterious wrote: »

The Athlone bypass is surrounded by development on both sides the whole way. There is little land to develop only off the exists which are all urbanised anyway.

Putting blue signs here does not future proof this road.

The road is ito ndequate for motorway status and the alternative is not good enough. END OF STORY.

it is is seved by over 20,000 vehicles that avoid the town. The last thing we want is to put extra traffic on the towns streets.

The other 10,000 N6 cars can put up with local traffic as they have done for 20 years. And any pedestrian walking on the bypass. Read this, you deserve to be killed if you walk on this dual carriageway. You will get this message.

Ban cyclists and pedestrians, and enough of this bull****. I want my blue signs its looks sexy.

So what if 20,000 vehicles are local traffic and 10,000 are long distance. 99% of those 20,000 vehicles will still be eligable to use the bypass if it changes to motorway. A very small amount of vehicles (which shouldn't be on the bypass at all) will have to use the town - no big deal.

Putting extra traffic on the towns streets is not something we want obviously but I would put pedestrians/cyclists getting killed or a tractor causing a pile up as things I would like to happen less than a few extra vehicles in the town.

BluntGuy · 15-07-2009 11:10am

Colm R wrote: »

The start of the N2 dual carriageway north of Ashbourne had M2 confirmation signs up this morning. No other signs up yet.

I'm a road enthusiast, so I like to see some pictures.

If you get the chance, take a few snaps.

Also, when those horrible gantry signs are gone make sure to let us know.

EDIT: Anybody have any kinda clue how the M18, M20 and M3 junction numberign schemes will work? Seeing as how few other people are probably gonna do it, I took the liberty of updating some wikipedia pages last night. But I'm not gonna bother trying to do out junction tables and stuff unless I actually know where junctions lead to etc.

This page has been updated with the new info (if that interests you):
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/N20_road_(Ireland)

If somebody can tell me how the junction numbers work, I can fill them in when I have the time.

KevR · 15-07-2009 12:10pm

What will happen with junction lighting on some of the redesignated stretches? The N/M18 for example has some junctions with no lighting..

D.L.R. · 15-07-2009 1:52pm

BluntGuy wrote: »

I'm a road enthusiast, so I like to see some pictures.

If you get the chance, take a few snaps.

Also, when those horrible gantry signs are gone make sure to let us know.

EDIT: Anybody have any kinda clue how the M18, M20 and M3 junction numberign schemes will work? Seeing as how few other people are probably gonna do it, I took the liberty of updating some wikipedia pages last night. But I'm not gonna bother trying to do out junction tables and stuff unless I actually know where junctions lead to etc.

This page has been updated with the new info (if that interests you):
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/N20_road_(Ireland)

If somebody can tell me how the junction numbers work, I can fill them in when I have the time.

Plot the M20 route into google maps and its 9.5km.

BluntGuy · 15-07-2009 2:07pm

The DoT documentation says 5 km so that's what I used.

You're correct though, the overall N21/N20 DC scheme was around 11 km in length.

I would guess the N21 segment of that is around 1 km.

Chris_533976 · 15-07-2009 5:53pm

Do we seriously have three threads full of argument about the Athlone bypass

Bobeagleburger · 15-07-2009 6:08pm

BluntGuy wrote: »

The N6 from Dublin to Galway will be almost a full motorway, apart from the 8km stretch of the Athlone bypass which is still under consideration for motorway designation.

I thought Athlone-Galway was dual carrageway and not motorway ?

L1011 · 15-07-2009 8:32pm

rarnes1 wrote: »

I thought Athlone-Galway was dual carrageway and not motorway ?

Ballinsloe to Galway was always going to be motorway, and the remaining segment (Athlone to Ballinasloe) was redesignated already.

JayeL · 15-07-2009 9:02pm

***Stuck this up on another thread, relevant to this one too, sorry if I'm out of order, mods***

I headed up to the northern end of the soon-to-be-M2 an hour or so ago and found that they pretty much have everything in place today for 28 August, the workmen were just finishing up by the looks of it.

This is the first sign, near Ashbourne Retail Park on the R135 northbound:

Sign just before the junction with the N2:

Confirmation sign, end of motorway restrictions sign and sign for Dublin, just west of the roundabout junction of the N2 and R135:

Little clearer image of the same scene:

M2 route confirmation sign, southbound at the start of the Ashbourne bypass:

Close-up of same M2 sign:

I don't think they've done anything with the much-maligned gantry signs as yet, I'll keep an eye out though.

mysterious · 15-07-2009 9:02pm

KevR wrote: »

So what if 20,000 vehicles are local traffic and 10,000 are long distance. 99% of those 20,000 vehicles will still be eligable to use the bypass if it changes to motorway. A very small amount of vehicles (which shouldn't be on the bypass at all) will have to use the town - no big deal.

Putting extra traffic on the towns streets is not something we want obviously but I would put pedestrians/cyclists getting killed or a tractor causing a pile up as things I would like to happen less than a few extra vehicles in the town.

It cant go ahead until a study is done as to how much it will afftect the town.

The Athlone bypass is NOT a motorway.Deal with it. If you think its so minor why does the alternative traffic have to go through the town of Athlone.

It's not going ahead as motorway I can assure you of that. The alternative route is not up to spec. We are talking of 4 arterial routes that use the town. All tractors and slow vehicles use the bypass bridge to cross over the Shannon.

The speed limit is 100KMH. So its not built to the high speeds of the rest of the inter urban

" I want a blue coloured road on my map, to hell what logics states its abut the looks"

L1011 · 15-07-2009 9:09pm

mysterious wrote: »

" I want a blue coloured road on my map, to hell what logics states its abut the looks"

"I want my green DC! WAAAAAAAAAAAH!!!!!"

Logic states that a strategic route should not have slow moving traffic on it. Logic states that pedestrians, cyclists, animal drawn vehicles and low-CC scooters should not be mixing with high speed traffic on a type of road which is designed for safety.

mysterious · 15-07-2009 9:13pm

MYOB wrote: »

"I want my green DC! WAAAAAAAAAAAH!!!!!"

Logic states that a strategic route should not have slow moving traffic on it. Logic states that pedestrians, cyclists, animal drawn vehicles and low-CC scooters should not be mixing with high speed traffic on a type of road which is designed for safety.

I dont care that its green.

I care that the Athlone bypass is used to cater all types of traffic, as there is no adequate network there to provid alternative traffic.

It is NOT a high speed road.

Stop the horse****e.

L1011 · 15-07-2009 9:15pm

mysterious wrote: »

It is NOT a high speed road.

Stop the horse****e.

In what alternate universe is a 100km/h DC not a high speed road?

Colm R · 15-07-2009 9:20pm

Cheers JayeL for the photos on the M2. That saves me the bother of doing them for Bluntguy

BluntGuy · 15-07-2009 9:25pm

Colm R wrote: »

Cheers JayeL for the photos on the M2. That saves me the bother of doing them for Bluntguy

Indeed it does.

Those are great pictures and it's encouraging to see the NRA aren't wasting time on this.

Next time I'm on the M8 to Cork, I'll take a few snaps myself. There are two signs near Dunkettle that are kinda attached to a solid block structure and are panelled that look like they'll be difficult to replace. I'm betting the NRA will just leave 'em there rather than correctly installing appropiate blue signage with green patches.

L1011 · 15-07-2009 9:27pm

A lot of the signs around Dunkettle are partially automated rotating flap signs cause of the tunnel aren't they? They'll get patches if anything I suspect.

Chris_533976 · 15-07-2009 9:28pm

MYOB wrote: »

Ballinsloe to Galway was always going to be motorway, and the remaining segment (Athlone to Ballinasloe) was redesignated already.

Common misconception

Ballinasloe to Galway was never motorway. Always N

L1011 · 15-07-2009 9:32pm

Chris_533976 wrote: »

Common misconception Ballinasloe to Galway was never motorway. Always N

Tolled N road? While not a first (Waterford... and the East Link is a tolled R road!) its surprising.

Its going to be M now, anyway.

BluntGuy · 15-07-2009 9:39pm

MYOB wrote: »

A lot of the signs around Dunkettle are partially automated rotating flap signs cause of the tunnel aren't they? They'll get patches if anything I suspect.

Patches might work approaching the M8, but on the mainline itself we both know that'd be against the TSM.

I'll wait and see what the NRA do, I'd be very suprised if they correctly replaced the signage, but kudos to them if they do.

Also, I know I've mentioned it before, but there are new poles erected on the N8 going into the city for a large ADS as well as several new poles approaching the Jack Lynch tunnel from Mahon. I'm guessing they're related to the redesignation.

road_high · 15-07-2009 10:02pm

Am I correct in presuming here the N/M9 south of Carlow will not open this year/2010 now as fully fledged M-way with all the restrictions that apply?
I don't see it mentioned here at all and pretty sure it was not redesignated previously?

BluntGuy · 15-07-2009 10:06pm

mfitzy wrote: »

Am I correct in presuming here the N/M9 south of Carlow will not open this year/2010 now as fully fledged M-way with all the restrictions that apply?
I don't see it mentioned here at all and pretty sure it was not redesignated previously?

It was redesignated with this tranche.

Check out the official S.I. statement:

http://www.transport.ie/upload/general/10978-SI_255_OF_2009-0.pdf

road_high · 15-07-2009 10:12pm

BluntGuy wrote: »

It was redesignated with this tranche.

Check out the official S.I. statement:

http://www.transport.ie/upload/general/10978-SI_255_OF_2009-0.pdf

Thanks BluntGuy I should have checked it out fully before posting. That is a relief, because I remember the fiasco with the first bit of M9 i.e Carlow bypass had a ridiculous 100 kmh limit for 3 or 4 months; did not want that again!

15-07-2009 11:11pm

The new signs erected at the Tuam Road junction are BLUE for the athlone bypass!

L1011 · 15-07-2009 11:13pm

Deleted User wrote: »

The new signs erected at the Tuam Road junction are BLUE for the athlone bypass!

Beat you to pointing that out aaaages ago

I'd expect the NRA not to replace any of the signs on the Athlone BP at all now; and 'forget' that its still N on any other new signs.

15-07-2009 11:15pm

MYOB wrote: »

Beat you to pointing that out aaaages ago

I'd expect the NRA not to replace any of the signs on the Athlone BP at all now; and 'forget' that its still N on any other new signs.

Not the ones that were erected in the past two days.

L1011 · 15-07-2009 11:17pm

Touché. There were signs erected months ago which had blue boxes with presumably M6 painted out on them for both directions, though.

BluntGuy · 15-07-2009 11:17pm

When the minister comes to his senses and does redesignate the Athlone Bypass in the future guess what we'll have to do with these new signs?

That's right!

REPLACE THEM WITH BLUE SIGNS WASTING YET MORE MONEY. :mad:

15-07-2009 11:19pm

MYOB wrote: »

Touché. There were signs erected months ago which had blue boxes with presumably M6 painted out on them for both directions, though.

They're still up, could be interesting how they play this one for the eastbound signs at the junction.

billbond4 · 16-07-2009 10:41am

There's just my thoughts:-
The Athlone bypass cant have vehicles on it doing 120kph as it wasnt designed for that, simple. They will keep it as a 100kph zone until ....
They build the southern ring road around Athlone from Kilmartins to the new N/M6 in Monksland as Dolanbaker mentioned in a previous post this will be designed to be a 120kph road, but this is probably years away.
This makes most sense to me.

KevR · 16-07-2009 11:15am

Deleted User wrote: »

Not the ones that were erected in the past two days.

3 days ago?! I never noticed them, can't believe it!!

Saw them this morning though.

glineli · 16-07-2009 11:16am

Will the ennis by pass speed limit be changed at the end of august or do we have to wait until the gort and oranmore sections are finished?

I thought it would be august but clare FM are saying it is not until after the completion of the other sections.

KevR · 16-07-2009 11:26am

I wonder why the M6 was only redesignated as far West as the N18 junction and not the whole way into Doughiska? Seems a bit odd not having restrictions on it.

KevR · 16-07-2009 11:29am

glineli wrote: »

Will the ennis by pass speed limit be changed at the end of august or do we have to wait until the gort and oranmore sections are finished?

I thought it would be august but clare FM are saying it is not until after the completion of the other sections.

I would imagine August. There's no reason to delay the introduction of the higher speed limit any later than August. The Oranmore section could be 3 or 4 years away anyhow so it would be a pretty big delay.

Anyone know if any new signs have been erected on the Shannon-Crusheen section yet?

glineli · 16-07-2009 11:59am

KevR wrote: »

I would imagine August. There's no reason to delay the introduction of the higher speed limit any later than August. The Oranmore section could be 3 or 4 years away anyhow so it would be a pretty big delay.

Anyone know if any new signs have been erected on the Shannon-Crusheen section yet?

I was on it tuesday evening, no new signs, just the poles for the new signs. i will be on it again later, will let you know if they appear

gerkeo · 16-07-2009 12:18pm

Speed limit aside, what physically distinguishes a motorway from a dual-carriageway?
I ask this because there is a very large portion on the M6 that has what amounts to a concrete wall between the two sides. I thought there had to be a more substantial central median on a motorway. This concrete wall design is prominent on the western corridor too.

Don’t get me wrong, I’m delighted to be off the single carriageway crap but it can be a bit daunting driving at 70mph / 120kmph so close to a continuous chunk of concrete.

BluntGuy · 16-07-2009 12:38pm

gerkeo wrote: »

Speed limit aside, what physically distinguishes a motorway from a dual-carriageway?

There are few physical distinctions. "Motorway" is a legal term and nothing more. The only mandantory differences are blue signs, solid hard shoulder and emergency telephones.

It's best not to think of DCs and motorways as two seperate entities. Rather think of them both as DCs where one has a set of restrictions and one doesn't (though technically speaking a motorway doesn't have to be a DC).

Tech3 · 16-07-2009 12:50pm

glineli wrote: »

Will the ennis by pass speed limit be changed at the end of august or do we have to wait until the gort and oranmore sections are finished?

I thought it would be august but clare FM are saying it is not until after the completion of the other sections.

Clare FM? The media dont have a clue when it comes to road infrastructure. It will be changed by August from Shannon-Ennis to motorway 120km/hr limits

Irish and Proud · 16-07-2009 1:08pm

darkman2 wrote: »

New thread for Blunt Guy.

All except N6 Athlone DC will be changed on August 28th. From then blue signs will be up and the usual Motorway rules apply i.e no L plates, tractors etc etc.

Thanks for that mate!

Just one question...

...where is the N11 Arklow to Rathnew on the list - the scheme (now approved) is for a national road - not motorway? On the contrary the M11 Gorey to Enniscorthy and Enniscorthy Bypass Scheme will be submitted as a Motorway Order!

Are the NRA not telling us something?

There was also a mention of Type 2 Dual as opposed to a "full width Dual" on the latest PPP list!

Let's hope the person doing the write-up doesn't know what a Standard Dual or Type 2 Dual is - I suspect he/she thinks that a Wide Dual is the Standard type (or Type 1), while the actual Standard (narrow median) Dual is Type 2.

Let's Hope!!! :eek:

Maybe the real delay to getting the N11 Arklow to Rathew reclassified is the anomaly relating to private accesses at the Southen end of the Rathnew Bypass. Also, there are LILOs at the Rugby Club north of Arklow. IMO, the N11 Arklow to Rathnew should be Wide Dual anyway - consistant with the two adjoining stretches of Dual - stretches which can be upgraded to D3.

Logic??? :mad:

Regards!

glineli · 16-07-2009 1:24pm

tech2 wrote: »

Clare FM? The media dont have a clue when it comes to road infrastructure. It will be changed by August from Shannon-Ennis to motorway 120km/hr limits

Sweet, thats what i was hoping to hear. It would make no sense what so ever having to wait.

Cheers

Tech3 · 16-07-2009 1:28pm

glineli wrote: »

Sweet, thats what i was hoping to hear. It would make no sense what so ever having to wait.

Cheers

Would you let me know when some M18 signs go up as I wont be around to check until next week? Some other blue signs have gone up already on other routes

Tech3 · 16-07-2009 2:37pm

invincibleirish wrote: »

Why are sections of the N25, already at 120km/hr, not being reclassified whilst sections of the N2 & N20 are?

Good question the main reason for the N20 to be redesignated was that the NRA have the rest of the M20 planned(Partickswell-Cork City) to be constructed in the pipeline. Therefore they want to protect the patrickswell-rossbrien section from developments which could cost them upgrading that section again.

200kms of road reclassified motorway except Athlone bypass

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